Martial Arts - Pros/Cons

Hi guys,

I'm looking to make a new melee toon and although I have yet to decide on whether it will be a scrapper or a brute, I've decided to go with martial arts. I've never tried that melee set so I'd like to give it a go.

Just curious to get some feedback from those who are experienced with martial arts on how it does in terms of performance (single target, any aoe, etc) and what to be aware of in my journey to 50.

Oh, also not sure on the secondary but maybe thinking of pairing it with Invuln, WP, or maybe even electric.

The positives on MA are probably how it looks and feels to be doing martial arts. But I think numrically it is low down in the damage scales on both single target and AoE, and the secondary effects don't mesh well from power to power so although you can do a variety of them, they have nothing to stack with unlike most other sets.

Generally if you are after concept it is ok (You can't go far wrong with any melee set) but if you want a strong character there are lots of better sets.

Secondary wise it goes well with anything, Invuln and WP would be good because they fit the natural theme, are strong and let you get on with admiring the way your toon looks

I like elec, but without lots of IO investment I don't think it compares to the other two.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aggelakis PrincessDarkstar: "RAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHH SOMEONE IS *WRONG* ON THE INTERNET!"

Ive played it to 50 on a Stalker and Tanker, and to the 40s on a Scrapper.

Cons:
You get a single radial AoE that doesnt come until level 26/35 (or never if you're a Stalker)

The mixed bag of secondary effects: Knockback, unreliable stuns and an immobilise don't gel that well.

Pros:
Good fast single target attacks. Storm Kick is one of the best damage-per-animation attacks going.

The AoE does knockdown, providing extra mitigation and a good place to slot a Force Feedback +Recharge proc.

+10 Defence from Storm Kick on a Tanker

Its not a bad Tanker set due to the bonus Defence. It pairs very nicely with the +resistance/damage aura sets like Electrical and Dark, which provide extra AoE and provide layered defence with the resistance. The Stuns from your attacks also stack nicely with oppressive Gloom from Dark Armour. These sets also balance the lack of AoE in Martial Arts. Its a good defensive set, best paired with a more offensive primary.

On a Stalker it's not so great. You cannot leverage all the single target attacks and Assassins Strike due to animation time no matter how good your recharge is, and you have no area attacks.

Since the last set of buffs MA is a very competitive set for single target, especially for scrappers and stalkers. Clearly. Dragon's tail is its only aoe, and stalkers don't even get it, but it's one of the best pbaoes that scrappers get. The lack of redraw is nifty and the high speed attack chains you can put together are great for proc application. Storm kick is the jewel of the set and is up there with dual blades' sweeping strike in contention for the "most ridiculous scrapper attack" award.

It hasn't been proliferated to brutes yet so that sort of limits your options, but it's actually a pretty stellar set for tankers too. Storm kick trades in some of its crazy damage for a crazy defense-to-all buff. I wouldn't recommend it in stalker form. For scrappers and tankers, though, it pretty much pairs well with any armor you'd like.

I'm giving it a go on a /Dark Stalker.

*MA lots of Stuns and KD/KB (FF procs ) for mitigation and it goes well with /Dark's Oppressive Gloom and Cloak of Fear (could proc it to be a dmg aura).

(Thinking of looking into /Energy for similar effect [stun stacking])


*70% of MA's attacks (for Stalker) have really high base damage (I don't know if this is because its pure Smashing or not) - Get Call to Justice (or even Frenzy) to go with your Focus Chi - Almost your entire attack chain is a good follow up to the ATO proc activation or Placate.


*Soul Transfer allows you to play 'Return of the Living Dead' with mobs (slot for recharge and stun primarily); you die, so what, make a comeback with a high mag stun and use that time to start picking targets off

I have a WP/MA tank. Has all the incarnate whatever. Despite it being a willpower tank with both quick Recovery, 4 performance shifters, and stamina with 3 efficacy adaptor, generating 4.5 end/sec, I have to manage the endurance usage like no other character I have including my DA tank running 10 toggles. The MA set burns through endurance like nothing else.

About the MA set. General comment, despite the set supposedly having increased base accuracy set, I did not see, and had to change the build to include a Kismet Accuracy unique, big help. Still needed to Tactics thou.
Thunder Kick, tanker #1 power, works well, just not a lot of damage. Storm Kick rocks, great power. Cobra Strike has a stun, %80 chance. Crippling Axe Kick does what it says, doesn't stack with anything else you have. Do not have Crane Kick. Dragon's Tail has a knockdown, %80 chance. Eagles Claw misses so much considering dropping it.

MA is a solid middle of the pack performer. A few things to consider-
MA "feels" like it takes a lot of endurance to use. I think It really isnt unbalanced, but the set lends itself to non stop attacking, the moves all really blend together well. A few powers are real shiners, like storm kick, but really the whole set is pretty well rounded and you can pretty much pick the attacks you like and you will succeed.

The general consensus is MA is not a set to be IO'd into a crazy farm build or the like. This hardly means it sucks, it just doesnt have that x factor a few other sets have that allow for crazyness. This is not a bad thing if you are just playing the character for fun, and not with a goal of l33t ub3rzst in mind.


A few things you shoud decide when considering build direction-

Solo, or lots of teams? Solo, I would say you really should lean towards an armor set that can either help with recovery, or isnt endo intensive. Willpower works, regen works really well(quick recovery, and only one toggle, plus no redraw) I have seen good builds for dark armor, and SR even, but those will require more attention to the blue bar. I have an old MA/regen I like to get out once in a while, and IMO that character isnt super powerful, but he is non stop and really a hoot.

IO slotting if you go that route should also consider teaming or solo. Recovery really is that important- if you dont have enough blue bar to be a non stop rampaging bruce lee, then you are missing out on a good bit of the fun of the set. Teaming can many times alleviate endo issues. A few interesting things IO's can do-

Thunder kick- a lot of players feel this is one power to skip, and if you team a lot you probably would want to unless you really like the animation as it isnt needed for a chain later on. However, it is fast, and I personally love the animation of kick to face. Pro tip- if you solo, and knockback doesnt bother you, slot a stupefy chance of KB in it. i did, and love it. Kicking a guy in the face with a snap kick, and then seeing him flying backwards ragdoll over the top of his pal behind him is priceless. Crane kick a guy into a wall, and then thunderkick him in the guts as he gets up, and see him ragdoll end over end into the wall again. it really is a hoot. Cobra strike can be amusing too with this- bruce lee punch the guy in the gut and he flies backwards.

crane kick- another oft skipped power do to longer animation and some people hate the KB. I love it. Kick guys into walls, use it as a finisher- I grin every time I send a defeated ragdoll across the room. Oh, and even if you decide to skip it anyway, make an alternate build with it. Wanna know the best thing in the game? Use crane kick to finish off a devouring earth rock monster. LOL, you kick it right in the chest and it EXPLODES into rubble. Now that is a super power FINISH HIM move in a game about super powers.

I think Arcana has a good pic there of the tier 9. In the Pretty and Strong spectrum, Eagles Claw ranks up there pretty close to the top.


Really slotting wise, thats the jist of it. If you solo, I recomend embracing the KB and slotting procs and just kick guys faces in all directions. Teaming, you might want to skip those powers and procs like a lot of people do so you dont scatter spawns with every kick for your team.

I recomend a MA/regen scrapper. Non stop face kickery. Willpower if you hate regen. Invuln, dark- good if you are a pro at the recovery/endo reduction stuff, probably a bit easier to work in a team as they are a tad more stable in a fight and tend to work nicely with the reactive nature of team support.

I played a MA/SR scrapper up to the mid-40's before the improvements to MA, and I found it to be lots of fun. Once CoV came out, I realized the Brute AT was a much better fit for the character, conceptually, so I have been patiently waiting for MA to be proliferated to brutes ever since. The closest we've gotten has been Street Justice, but since my character in question is focused on having especially powerful legs, the primarily punch-focused animations just don't do it for me. If only they'd allow me to use the MA kick animations as alternates in the StJ set...

For those curious, my concept is a feral beat-person, with large claws for feet (hence the kick-focus). Their race was enslaved for generations by psychics who used them for manual labor, until one of them escaped and met a traveling monk who taught him esoteric martial arts. He returned to his people, and developed a style of fighting in which one totally clears one's mind, allowing your primal instincts to take over, thereby avoiding the threat of mind-control. Personally, I feel that a Martial Arts / Willpower brute would be perfect for this, and so I continue to wait and hope.

I like the set. Most pros and cons have all already been mentioned, except for one..

It has alternate animations.

I, for one, much prefer most of the alternates (including the one that most people apparently didn't like).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Void_Huntress Caveat: You can't have accidentally taken the alternate animation for yon amazing attack. (srsly what were they thinking)

I am pretty sure they thought some people (well, at least 1 person) thought that specific attack looked pretty goofy, and wished for anything a bit toned down.


But, the fact that this set has almost 2 full sets of animations is a nice thing. Can't go wrong with more choices. And, the alternate animations here are all a bit more interesting than the alternates that most blast sets get.

Now, which you prefer will obviously be a matter of personal preference, but I've gotta support a set that has the option there.




As a scrapper, I feel like it really puts out the ST damage, and the one AOEs KD is quite reliably up your survival when facing large groups..

As a tank, it's less damaging, obviously, but even tougher. The AOE comes later, but when it comes the KD is still just as effective on defense. But the +def is very nice. Should be easily up all the time (as I recall, tho, it doesn't stack,and isn't enhanceable). But, unlike Parry (and it's numerous clones) it's +Def to everything.

Personally, never tried it on a stalker, so I'll withhold comment there.

Pros for MA: You look awesome.



Cons for MA: You will face hate crime allegations from your end bar.

everything's been covered already, but just adding my voice to the choir of PURE SEXINESS.

For my money there's still nothing in the game to rival the glory of how cool you look throwing out a string of MA attacks.