Shadow Shards for Villains?
By
Aneko,
Posted on: 2011-12-23 05:53 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Chill out a sec, man. Way to over react.|
Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
I can confirm that you are coming off in rather poor light here. You seem deeply invested in some bizarre concept of "zone fairness," heroes have more zones therefore they must PAY for what they have done to you!
That is insane. It's also not how the game has ever worked, including now. Guess what? The shard is going to be coop zones, this has been foreshadowed for several actual years now, and no quantity of tears can reverse the inevitable at this point. |
First, when's this been foreshadowed by the devs or in game? I'm honestly curious.
Second, what tears? I'm not raging, only was having a quick discussion with one poster and asked someone else an honest question.
Third, I'm not totally against co-op. In fact, I even suggested making one of the four Shard zones co-op. I never said anything stupid like "zone fairness". What I do expect, though, is for the Shard to continue telling a good story that can incorporate villains without the rehashed "Let's team the heroes and the villains up again, and make the villains into good guys the entire time" plot. Best way to do that, take one of four zones that aren't being used, give it to the villains so they have something special to call their own. I still don't see how anyone's being punished if no content is being removed, and we're all going to get more content overall if the devs decide to focus some time on the Shard.
A big priority regarding suggestions for me has always been this:
More zones, strike forces, Giant monsters, and generally more content for redside.
Even though I like redside a lot, it is kind of boring how I will always end up going through Mercy - Port Oaks - Cap Au - Nerva - sometimes St. Martial - Grandeville. All 40+ content is in Grandeville, or it is in a Co-Op zone. Blueside seems to have two zones for each level span, and has so many more task forces it makes me sad. The scarcity of contacts forces me to run paper missions, whereas in blueside it seems like you never run out of people to do things for. I remember getting that badge for catching ghosts just so I can have a contact on my very first playthrough redside.
So, I would like anything to help that along.
What I would prefer is for redside to get access to the shadow shard, but not the Hero's shadow shard. Villains would get access to different areas with different SFs for different aspects of Rularuu.
What I would be content with is another co-op zone. This eases the pain a bit for choosing to be a straight up villain.
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Xzero45 - you are most definitely angry and overreacting yourself, as you post so much I felt compelled to log on just so I could put you on ignore rather than have to deal with manually skipping your too many posts. Try to take a deep breath before posting and remember most of us around here are beyond the age of when those cool kids websites you seem to love to take mannerisms from are considered cool. It just makes you look stupid to everyone else, and the "I'm just trolling/conducting a social experiment" defense was already old on the Internet/BBS since (likely) before you were born so, don't even try.
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wut
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Originally Posted by Nihilii
Xzero45 - you are most definitely angry and overreacting yourself, as you post so much I felt compelled to log on just so I could put you on ignore rather than have to deal with manually skipping your too many posts. Try to take a deep breath before posting and remember most of us around here are beyond the age of when those cool kids websites you seem to love to take mannerisms from are considered cool. It just makes you look stupid to everyone else, and the "I'm just trolling/conducting a social experiment" defense was already old on the Internet/BBS since (likely) before you were born so, don't even try.
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Apparently GG bashing is no longer cool. Who knew?
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Originally Posted by Xzero45
wut
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This. Seriously. Blue can keep their zones, or heck one goes iZone. Red gets a couple new SS zones based on the two above, one normal one iZone. PvP zone optional, but sure why not. No need for any of it to be co-op.
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Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel
Now, to be honest, given how vast the Shard is both in lore and in the actual game, part of me opposes making the Shadow Shard coop just because there's so many other places that could be explored that hasn't been. Like the Garden of Memories of Uuralur the Mirror, the Cube Factories of the What's-His-Name the Slave Master, and so on.
And instead of a regular firebase, whatever organization lets villains into the Shard should TOTALLY have an enormous Airborne Aircraft Carrier, with Lambda sector turrets that fire awesome death beams at approaching swarms of natterlings, wisps, and observers. Plus, we could have not one, but TWO side exclusive Incarnate content areas, possibly coming to a head with a special PVP zone that discards all semblance of balance and lets players fight with their full incarnate shifts and powers. |
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Originally Posted by Scythus
Apparently GG bashing is no longer cool. Who knew?
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It's never out of style
In all honesty, I REALLY do not want another idiotic reason for Villains to play side-lackey to the heroes once again. If it is going to be "Co-Op" we are going to need some rather nafarious, villainous content. It would severely disappoint me to see such a rich zone fall victim to the usual "Oh no, you must help us save the world or we will all be destroyed" line. I mean, why not truly make the Shard a route to 'god-like' status aside from the Well? Rularuu basically has infinite and unusual power to draw from (I vaguely remember Mother Mayhem and Malaise attempting such a thing, but it might have been actual control of Rularuu), so what's to stop our Villains from taking a little bit (decided not to use hyperbole there) from the sleeping giant?
CoX isnt a comic by Marvel or DC, but heroes and vills there team up pretty regularly when faced with some sort of cosmic threat, global alien takeover etc.
Im not a RPer and I guess I can usually see their point of view (not on this one though). I play both blue and red and I dont see why co-op play is such a big deal.
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A good compromise I'd sees to make the zone nominally co op, but with separate contact lines and separate culminating tfs that are heroic for one quest line and malevolent for the other. Its unlikely we will get a full zone for only one side, and based on populations at any given time, villains would not win out if such a decision were made. so I think the shared but with separate contacts would be a way to go.
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Add a new shard villainous strike force that heroes can join if they want. |
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
A good compromise I'd sees to make the zone nominally co op, but with separate contact lines and separate culminating tfs that are heroic for one quest line and malevolent for the other. Its unlikely we will get a full zone for only one side, and based on populations at any given time, villains would not win out if such a decision were made. so I think the shared but with separate contacts would be a way to go.
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my lil RWZ Challenge vid
heh, well, in my ideal situation, the shards would be fully revamped with the more up to date technology and the current 4 tfs would be drastically improved or removed to oroboros for the masochists to deal with. The shard is very dated looking so new content would demand some sort of retouch, but not sure if they want o mess with the tfs that some people seem to enjoy.
If it is co-op, they could just continue the plot from Tin Mage II and have Arbiter Daos and Captain Dietrich along with their relative groups and Vanguard all in one base as an excuse for heroes and villains to be working together. Could have NPC chatter about how they can't believe they're all working together, and have it tie into vigilante and rogue stuff too. :3
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Arc: 60092 - Supa Rumble in the Park
"Keep living the dream, and never let any jerk tell you what to do."
-- High-Roller
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If blueside is going to lose any part of the Shadow Shard I'd rather see the parts the villains get be villain only with villain only missions of epic villain-ness. Let them get even more villain only buffs and benefits. That'd be the price of not having the villains whining about "having" to help the heroes again. Anyways, it's blueside's job to take the body blows and losses
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Originally Posted by Ideon
If it is co-op, they could just continue the plot from Tin Mage II and have Arbiter Daos and Captain Dietrich along with their relative groups and Vanguard all in one base as an excuse for heroes and villains to be working together. Could have NPC chatter about how they can't believe they're all working together, and have it tie into vigilante and rogue stuff too. :3
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What I was thinking of, basically it's a co-op zone, but heroes and villains could have their own missions which the opposite sides can join on. Kind of like how Sister Airlia and Daedalus have their own missions despite it being a co-op zone. Plus with the uneasy alliance between Arachnos and Longbow forced onto them by their respective leaders could add some plot too. Heck, bring in Crey too with their Paragon Protectors 'aiding' the fight, and Crey Industries funding the base and stuff!
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Originally Posted by Ogi
If blueside is going to lose any part of the Shadow Shard I'd rather see the parts the villains get be villain only with villain only missions of epic villain-ness. Let them get even more villain only buffs and benefits. That'd be the price of not having the villains whining about "having" to help the heroes again. Anyways, it's blueside's job to take the body blows and losses
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Ideon's Paragonwiki page
Member of Paragon/Rogue Knights
Arc: 60092 - Supa Rumble in the Park
"Keep living the dream, and never let any jerk tell you what to do."
-- High-Roller
Is it just me do the midnighters or magic have a hand in every zone that is co-op or soon to be.
Maybe I'm over focusing on it but.
Midnighters helped take down the Rikti ship (but then again so did everyone) and thus the Rikti war zone came to be.
The Midnighters made the Shadow Shard or at least made it how it is by seeing away Rully.
Cimeoria, The Midnighters own the portal to it or helped focus it or sumin.
The midnighters club is a co-op zone!
DA, magic killed everyone there and awoke Mot.
Okay, Here's one way I could see things pan out:
Zulu: Heroic zone only. Sorry, bros.
Villains (And possibly Praetorians) would get their own base Zones:
Widow's Peak An enormous synthetic landmass built from Grandville-style cables tying together hunks of floating rock.
Neuron City: A giant metal Colony of Praetorian Citizens, run by Neuron under Cole's Authority, this base was designed to gain a foothold in the Shadow Shard against Primal forces.
Cascade, Chantry, Storm Palace: They Become Co-Op...But the missions are widely different from alignment, and Rogues and vigilantes get their own specific contacts...Perhaps by then if Praets can get high enough, they could have their own "Imperial Investigation Team" Arcs where they either try to claim the Shard for Cole, or try to help the denizens of Primal Earth protect it from Praetorian Control. There could even be Moral choice arcs!
New PVP Zones: The Factory & The Repository: Heroes, Villains, and (if they can reach that level by then) Praetorians fight a four-sided battle (along with Chularn the Slave Lord and Kuularth the Scavenger) to gain control of the mighty Factory cubes and their powers, with separate Villainous, Heroic, and Praetorian iTask Forces to fight against Chularn the Slave Lord and Kuularth the Scavenger, respectively. Would be a zone that is intended for 45-50, but geared more toward Incarnates, as the monsters in the orange and red map areas are all at least 50. This would also give a place for Incarnates to smite each-other while the non-icarnates continue to wail on each other in RV.
New Co-Op Zone: Garden of Mirrors: Really only a Co-Op zone in name, Phasing will mostly separate alignments except for special circumstances (An Uuralur Zone Event/GM Fight), and is centered around characters trying to understand the origins and harness the powers of the mirrors, without being absorbed into Uuralur's power.
Possibly a new iTrial where the players must face all of the aspects of Rularuu, and maybe Rularuu himself! Would offer all slots experience, and Probably a guaranteed VR. Gods be crazy strong.
Open Archetype Suggestion thread!, Kirsten's Epic Weapon Pools, Feudal Japan, Etc., Alignment specific Rularuu iTrials!
If Masterminds didn't suck, they'd be the most powerful AT in the game.
...and here I was accusing some of the other suggestions of requiring a lot of development time.
What you're talking about sounds cool... but it sounds like a revamp as huge as the rollout of Praetoria itself.
my lil RWZ Challenge vid
I get that "we have to work together" happens a bit in comics...but we've more then covered that ground by now. It's getting to the point villains should start waiting for up front payouts before assisting heroes more.
"It's in eveyrones best interest to work together on this."
"Yeah...you know I think we could handle this without you capes...so you go ahead and go first and if you all die we'll clean up."
"The whole of our reality is at stake here!"
"The whole of my financial well being is as well."
"...I'v er....well I have some inf..salvage..."
"keep going"
*sigh* "We've saved up some Empyrean Merits..."
That is insane. It's also not how the game has ever worked, including now. Guess what? The shard is going to be coop zones, this has been foreshadowed for several actual years now, and no quantity of tears can reverse the inevitable at this point.