Player Summit Ustream Highlights: Keynote and opening Q and A

Originally Posted by Turgenev

You're right. He's not a paid employee or required to do anything. The next time, I agree he really should just say "something about pvp"

Originally Posted by Aura_Familia

I'd argue that last part is not true at all, since pvp existed in a fine state before I13. There are parts they can reasonably take out and fix without breaking the entire system. (heal decay for example) From what I've read in other threads on the devs comments at this pummet that's NOT the case at all for bases.

Originally Posted by Aura_Familia

I also find it funny that all the other times that VK has done reporting this is the ONLY time he's been called out for his opinion, when in fact he ALWAYS gives his opinion.

As I said he is not a reporter and shouldn't be expected to function like one.

Originally Posted by Turgenev

I'll amend that with, "a fine state for what it was". When they discussed (in answering a question of how to combine both "Ouroborii") how COV was originally introduced, they basically summed it up as, "heroes of another type, with different colors". The nature of the two sides was one where player A could only go to sides that supported "A", but not "B". The ABILITY to modify that mechanic is where I compared them to bases; it was a baked-in process that made it very rigid to modify vs other elements in the game, just like bases (which are rigid to the point of stress fractures).

Originally Posted by Ardrea

Four pages of PvP angst? Sheesh. PvP had a chance here and it failed. There's no business case left to waste more resources on it. All you'll get from the Devs at this point is lip service. It's dead in this game, get over it, move on.

Originally Posted by Aura_Familia

I personally don't think he was being a jerk.

Originally Posted by Turgenev

Everyone else: I have a stack of pix of the various slides and what-not of the breakout sessions. Once I've uploaded them to a common image host, I'll post the link somewhere appropriate.

Originally Posted by Turgenev

Re: Von Kreiger's summation of my Q/A mic time with the Devs as "lolpvp":

To the OP:

I'd be grateful if you try to report the questions, even in brief. FYI, I'm not a 'PVP Guy' by any stretch of the definition - in fact, I almost excessively PVE these days. I stopped back about 8 issues ago from my casual dalliances, but as a fan of the comic book genre I always felt it was a mechanic that could be grown better than the original (and current) design. My suggestion to the Devs and to the players present was to evolve the integration in a way that revived PVP interest while respecting PVE preference. I don't "represent" anyone, except myself. I'm just a player with an idea.

Originally Posted by Xanatos

Guys i'm so sorry. Looking back I was being quite rude. I'd completely forgotten that OP was a carebear. I'm sure you'll all agree that the translated version is fine and didn't warrant my snarkiness.

My apologies OP.

Here's the translated version for anyone interested:

Originally Posted by eth_Nargy

Being good at something horrible isn't really an accomplishment.

That's like being proud that you just fell down a flight of stairs.

Originally Posted by Aura_Familia

heh. I think we can all at least agree that coh pvp is horrible.

Which is what I always thought was the point of the lolpvp joke.

Originally Posted by Turgenev

With my suggested mechanic, all you'd have to do then is avert your eyes.

Originally Posted by Von Krieger

You had an idea, it was too complex to summarize, you took a great deal of time longer than any other audience speaker in delivering your... idea, I think? I don't recall if you actually asked a question or not.

So by the time it got around to the dev's answer portion I still wasn't sure what you were asking, just that it involved PvP, I heard dueling mentioned, and you took what was, in my mind, a rather long time to deliver it. I found it a bit odd at first, then annoying, and then amusing the longer you went on.

So by the time you finished I'd kind of forgotten where you'd started and couldn't really discern any content other than "I have this great big idea about PVP, let me tell you about it..."

And the answers the devs gave were the same ones they always give with regards to PvP.

I apologize for zoning out while you were giving your idea. But I feel that a Q and A session is not the best forum for proposing in-depth ideas about the game.

I would expect equal treatment if I arrived at the Pummit with an old fashion ream of computer paper trailing out behind me as I happily recite to the dev panel my Hellfire EAT in detail.

While your idea is well thought out and you've put some effort into it, the format of the session was ill-suited to presenting it in the detail that you did.

It's taken you approximately 480 words to convey what you said at the Pummit. From my experience last week recording written text for the multimedia contest I found it impossible to fit that many words into a span of 3 minutes. I had to cut it down to be closer to 400 and even then I had to do a bit of creative editing to get it under the 3:00 mark.

So what I ended up with was:

"There is this guy talking about doing stuff with PvP, involving duels. He's talking for an awfully long time to the point where it's kind of annoying. Okay now he's gone on so long that it seems kind of funny."

So I went with the wording I did because I was trying to convey my amusement at the whole thing as well as tie that in to the answers that the dev team gave. They were the ones that had been used on previous Ustreams.

Thus "lolpvp" and "lolduels" used essentially as a kind of comedic juxtaposition, using two teeny tiny statements to essentially encapsulate a concept that took several minutes to deliver.

As I said, not particularly meant as disrespectful to you or anything. But a long winded speech, that I assumed was a rant, just seemed really REALLY out of place to me, and I treated it accordingly.

I have issues with verbal inflection at times, as I'm somewhat hard of hearing. So it's likely that I interpreted some of your vocal mannerisms or a loudness in tone as angry-sounding. Coupling that with the length of time you spoke, I assumed you were on some sort of PvP rant along the lines of "Why didn't you do this and this and this and so on and so forth?"

It seems that was not the case, and I apologize.

As I said, in text it sounds like a nice idea, but the suggestions forum or one of the player surveys would be a better method of delivery, and listening to it live and having it come from nowhere it felt really out of place, and I commented as such.

*looks left*

*looks right*

But still...

lolpvp.

Originally Posted by Turgenev

*shrugs* I fart in paragraphs. What can I say?

Originally Posted by UberGuy

Sorry, but "just avert your eyes if you don't like it" sounds incredibly dismissive. Which I suppose I can understand, coming from someone around here who has interest in PvP - they have to be used to being dismissed themselves. Still, I don't think it's going to get you much backing among PvErs, though.

Originally Posted by Turgenev

For me, PVE and PVP are two facets of the larger whole. The way my mechanic is built, it would have the same degree of intrusion as, say, a zone event, except on a much more localized and (imo) less invasive scale.

Originally Posted by Golden Girl

They could still let the consumables duplicate, as they'd still be useful even if you got them more than once.

Originally Posted by Melancton

Question: Are they going to clarify the Astoria lore with this makeover? How many times has Astoria gone dark? And what about that bad piece of writing that has the authorities sealing Astoria up and allowing the inhabitants to all be butchered because they cannot escape? Hopefully that gets 86'd.

Astoria has such potential. An Incarnate makeover is a severe disappointment if that is what all of this means.

Originally Posted by Turgenev

Re: Von Kreiger's summation of my Q/A mic time with the Devs as "lolpvp":





The point I brought up during the keynote was revisiting PVP as a viable and accessible feature in a game built around the core of "heroes vs villains". Since PVP's initial shoehorn insertion into what is essentially a PVE environment, the direction of it always took a back seat to existing PVE experiences; that is to say, you could PVE anywhere you wanted, but for PVP combat opportunities, it was only in restricted zones, or in arenas where like-minded players would necessarily aggregate. The result: An insular community by design, where opportunity for exposure was always cordoned off by "it's too hard, it's too narrow, it doesn't add to my experience."

The design element I suggested was, "knock down the walls" and allow heroes and villains to have the option to run missions in each other's territories. For my question, I gave the classic example: Villains robbing a bank in Paragon City, which is a fairly iconic experience in the genre. Once having robbed the bank... they'd exit into the city zone, and would have to traverse their way to their exfil point.

All the while, alarms would blare for heroes in that zone that a superpowers crime was being committed (say, a hotspot flashie on your map). Heroes would have the option of chasing down and defeating the running villains, and villains would focus on evasion or simple brute tactics to survive the gauntlet. Either way, rewards from this additional experience would be higher due to the degree of interaction.

The second element I outlined was "PVP flags" and "PVP duels": To make this zone combat accessible to willing players, but to protect those unwilling to participate, any player unflagged for PVP would be able to watch the heroes and villains fight, but otherwise do nothing to impact the outcome (no damaging attacks, no buffs, etc). The "Duel" mode would LOCK one group of each side into combat with each other until one side or the other met their objectives.

The net result: Elements of zone PVP combat would be integrated into normal day to day gameplay, in a way that made sense with the genre, without forcing the combat requirement on unwilling players. The goal is to blur the barriers between PVE and PVP without directly mixing them irrevocably. However, being able to watch the fight happen realtime, in your zone, would frankly be a hell of a thing. Who DOESN'T want to watch the Justice League and the Legion of Doom duke it out on the steps of City Hall?

General response to my question afterwards seemed fairly positive, from the players with whom I chatted. They suggested that the new Phasing combat mechanic might go a long way in fleshing out this idea, along with other cool scenarios that could be done (someone mentioned a tech heist from Crey or Portal Corp, that sort of thing).


To the OP:

I'd be grateful if you try to report the questions, even in brief. FYI, I'm not a 'PVP Guy' by any stretch of the definition - in fact, I almost excessively PVE these days. I stopped back about 8 issues ago from my casual dalliances, but as a fan of the comic book genre I always felt it was a mechanic that could be grown better than the original (and current) design. My suggestion to the Devs and to the players present was to evolve the integration in a way that revived PVP interest while respecting PVE preference. I don't "represent" anyone, except myself. I'm just a player with an idea.

Originally Posted by Dispari

The representatives of the PvP community that waste time asking the devs about PvP and derail threads to talk about PvP are devs?

Originally Posted by MAD UMLAUTS

When i asked Castle a year ago he said pvp is supported in this game. Why are we wasting our time if that is true?