I just wanna make sure this is okay with everyone.
By
Aggelakis,
Posted on: 2011-08-22 12:34 in Suggestions and Ideas
It doesn't really bother me. But then, I generally clear the whole map anyway, so I usually find everything along the way.
What does bother me is when that last glowy/mob you missed doesn't show up on the map even when you've cleared everything else.
If you do go on to suggest it, I'd suggest you suggest it as an option.
However, it turned out that Smith was not a time-travelling Terminator
Welcome to City of Repetition. Have you done the Synapse and other TFs for the lower levels (not the new Posi)?? They are the same thing over and over and over and over....I haven't played those in years...
It doesn't bother me anymore. Before they added the feature to make the last few on a map appear it would occasionally annoy me but that was only due to backtracking up and down floors.
In fact, I kind of appreciate the 'Find and seek' parts of some missions. Otherwise they'd be really monotonous after 7 years. As it stands I have 90% of the maps fairly well memorized and it's only the abstract placement of objectives that break it up.
That said,
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I wouldn't bother making this suggestion. The entire 1st paragraph of your post lets me know you already have an idea what would happen if you did. Hopefully you'll find with the replies in this one (and I fully expect I'll be the only one to use your --- idea) that your in the minority on being bothered by the hunt and seek. As an aside, the drawn out warning and insistence that everyone 'Play by your rules or else' never ends well. You might as well be giving everyone an invitation to flame you long before they even get to the suggestion. Suggestions around these parts are always going to be heated, trying to do an endrun around the trolls only alerts them to your fear.
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I removed the lines because the contents didn't match the criteria-- You weren't condescending, roleplaying my thread as a petition (/unsigned |
Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
It doesn't bother me anymore. Before they added the feature to make the last few on a map appear it would occasionally annoy me but that was only due to backtracking up and down floors.
In fact, I kind of appreciate the 'Find and seek' parts of some missions. Otherwise they'd be really monotonous after 7 years. As it stands I have 90% of the maps fairly well memorized and it's only the abstract placement of objectives that break it up. That said, I wouldn't bother making this suggestion. The entire 1st paragraph of your post lets me know you already have an idea what would happen if you did. Hopefully you'll find with the replies in this one (and I fully expect I'll be the only one to use your --- idea) that your in the minority on being bothered by the hunt and seek. As an aside, the drawn out warning and insistence that everyone 'Play by your rules or else' never ends well. You might as well be giving everyone an invitation to flame you long before they even get to the suggestion. Suggestions around these parts are always going to be heated, trying to do an endrun around the trolls only alerts them to your fear. |
) or trying to come off as superior. Those were the only responses I was planning on weeding out. 
Now to actually respond to your post (and the other ones.)
I would be okay for my suggestion of having all objectives visible on the map at all times to be added as an "option."
I have no doubts that I'm in the minority of people on the forums bothered by the hunt-and-seek, but from my experience, the majority of regular posters on the forums are the types who have everything memorized anyways, a class which I am not personally a part of (though I do get a lot of use out of the forums..) but not a class that constitutes the majority of the game-- And definitely not one that will come close after Freedom launches.
And to address the post I quoted again, it isn't a matter of fear as much as a matter of wanting to avoid any portion of this thread being hijacked with another member trying to drive home the point of how stupid my suggestion was--- I was probably a little abrasive in my approach; If it weren't for my past experiences in this part of the board I would have said "A simple yes or no will do."
Noted. I'll add, I wouldn't be oppossed to the option to show them, more options are always a plus. Would also be helpful for those occasions when the last few on map glitches and still don't show up.
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Capt. Biohazrd - PCSAR
Talsor Tech - Talsorian Guard
Keep Calm & Chive On!
I've been playing for six years total (including lapsed time, almost seven years) and I still don't have everything memorized. I love seeking. Having everything on the map at all times takes the seeking part out of it. If you end up making this suggestion, I will definitely voice my disagreement with it.
If you don't want seeking missions, you can do radio missions, where everything is always in the same place (the last room). And, let's be honest, there's not actually that much seeking in City...the vast majority of seeking is "go to the last room on the map". If I have no idea where something is, chances are pretty high that if I keep running away from the mission entrance, I'll get to the end and it'll be there.
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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I personally would love the ability to turn on/off enemies, clickable objects, etc on the map. The tech already exists ( to some extent anyway ).
oh, and...
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I just wish the 'Show last objective/last enemies' feature which SHOULD be working WAS working; currently, it isn't. And hasn't been working as it should for a while now. Which is very annoying.
I also have no objection to it, really. I mean, barring Stalkers (who have an easy time of objectives most of the time anyhow) you still have to fight mobs to get to the objectives. Since they tend to be evenly spaced anyway, it's not too much an issue to me. I still have to GET there, right?
Also, the only actual 'puzzle' in the game I know of is the Midnighters stuff in the...oh, Ex-Legacy Chain guy, added recently. Where you DO actually have to stop and think about which is the right portal...which was actually fun and cool, because it was genuinely different. Not 'Hunt X glowy that we've stuffed in some far flung corner for the lulz'.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Echoing the "As an option" qualifier to not minding.
I wouldn't really call things much of a puzzle, though. I mean, to me, Portal is running puzzles to get to objectives. Even Defense Grid, a tower defense game if your'e not familiar with it, is more of a "puzzle" game than COH. There's the occasional timed challenge ("Get info and get out before reinforcements arrive, 5 minutes!") but that's about it.
And about the only downside to the suggestion is that with everything up - especially with four or more people - that's going to be an *awfully* crowded map if you have all NPCs - and sometimes even all glowies, including "decoys" - showing.
I don't really have a strong opinion on this, so here's about a dozen copy-pastes of the word "goldfish". Per your instructions, I put them between dash lines so you know not to read them.
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goldfish
goldfish
goldfish
goldfish
goldfish
goldfish
goldfish
goldfish
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Character index
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Sorry but I'm gonna have to go ahead and /unsign this part. |
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Okay let me just make this clear. I don't want anyone to "</sign>" or "snarky mark and then </unsign.>"
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I will be placing my potential suggestion in between lines, just in case it annoys anyone. Here's the deal: If you plan on being condescending and asserting your benevolance, that's cool. Just please place your comment between lines (--------------) so I can be sure not to read it. Fair is fair, right? Anywho... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I think that the "puzzle" aspect should be removed from mission maps. I've been playing for just shy of nine months now... I guess when I first started and all I did was solo, it was interesting. Here's the thing, though--- I'm at a point where the maps all feel redundant and tedious, but I'm not yet at a point where I have every single turn and object placement possibility memorized. Honestly, sometimes it's so annoying I feel like I'm doing a 2,000 piece puzzle or something. (Pro tip: If I wanted to do a puzzle, I'd do a puzzle. I would rather play a FAST PACED Super Hero video game, though.) Long story short: Make all Objects, NPC's, and mission goals viewable on the map at all times. It's not "challenging" to have to waste way too much time scurrying all around looking for things. It's just tedious and annoying. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ |
I actually kind of like this suggestion. Hunting down objectives gets to be a major hassle sometimes. Sure, the devs put a feature in to make this less annoying, problem is as others have said it rarely works right. At the same time I wouldn't want to say "no puzzles EVER", but "look around until you see/hear the glowie" does not a puzzle make, the sooner the devs realize this the better off the game will be. More action would be awesome, though, stuff more along the lines of the Incarnate Trials.
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I would also like to vote for "make it an option" and to suggest another possible option; have the glowie show up on the map only for parts of the map that you've cleared.
I know it seems a bit redundant, but there are several times (especially in that big 3 leveled chamber on Council maps) when I've nearly gone crazy because I hear the glowie but I'm one floor too high/low, or it's on the other side of a wall, or something. It would really help if it would show up on the map so that I could click on it and use the handy-dandy yellow arrow to find its exact location.
At the same time, I enjoy the hide-and-seek bit sometimes, and this halfway option seems like a good compromise (at least for me). Of course, I'd probably just leave it on and then use the Reveal veteran power when I want to find everything quickly. 
If it's optional sure.
/signed
Making it mandatory on every map, hell no.
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I fixed this part for you. |
Originally Posted by DarkGob
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Sorry but I'm gonna have to go ahead and /unsign this part. Also going to /unsign you very rudely telling me how to post. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
The point of implementing the line policy wasn't to tell anyone how to post--- I'm against that, but at the same time I am against people roleplaying suggestions as petitions. I thought the line system was a good workaround (granted, a bit abrasive, for which I apologize) to allow people to say what they please in their preferred demeanor whilst not subjecting me to reading it.Now then..
As for the idea of "making it optional" idea, well I feel the tech for that is already in place. The map allows you to pick and choose what is visible to you... I just want "show mission objectives" to well... Show the mission objectives. All the time.
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You make a suggestion. It's ridiculous to expect that people won't say that they agree or disagree. Whether they say "/sign," "I agree," "This!" or elaborate over the span of a paragraph. You're still telling people how to post, and this is nothing but disruptive to your thread. Please avoid doing this in the future.|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
I fixed this part for you.
The point of implementing the line policy wasn't to tell anyone how to post--- I'm against that, but at the same time I am against people roleplaying suggestions as petitions. I thought the line system was a good workaround (granted, a bit abrasive, for which I apologize) to allow people to say what they please in their preferred demeanor whilst not subjecting me to reading it. |
Personally, I disagree with calling anything in City of Heroes a puzzle or a maze. Almost all instanced maps are incredibly simple and straightforward. I'm more or less opposed to making them even more simple and straightforward, and shudder to think that the ungodly linear maps of Praetoria may well be the way of the future. I love maps with intersections, loops and a complex floor plan.
You cite repetition, yet you suggest a system which makes the game even more repetitive. Ask any person who's driven a vehicle while tired when they most doze off - it's not on complex fast corners, it's on the monotonous straightaway. Complex maps that you have to give a bit of a thought to in order to help break the monotony more than most things in this game. Figuring out where you've been, where the current path is going, where it might re-merge with the rest of the map and how to sweep larger instances for clickies and enemies is part of the fun of the game.
I feel that having all objectives highlighted on the map as soon as you walk in won't at all help make the game less monotonous. It will just make us have to be less involved, which just makes the game feel that much more repetitive. The most that needs to happen is for the system we already have which shows the last few enemies and objectives to actually work. That one's good enough.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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To even make it as an option to turn off/on at will, I feel that this would be basically poking players in the face and telling them to just ghost their missions. Sure, most players know the maps by now anyways, but that's through experience, and not the game telling you "Don't bother killing those guys, they don't matter."|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Long story short: Make all Objects, NPC's, and mission goals viewable on the map at all times. It's not "challenging" to have to waste way too much time scurrying all around looking for things. It's just tedious and annoying. |
The Dev's randomized placement for glowies/hostages for a reason, after all.
Finding glowies are annoying to me because I tend to play with no sound. On glowie missions I have to either get my headphones or jack my sound way up and hope I hear it over my power animations and other background noise.
Even though it is not consistent, I do like the map location icon when you have one objective left to find.
Who do I have to *&^% around here to get more Targeted AoE recipes added?
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Originally Posted by Silver Gale
I don't really have a strong opinion on this, so here's about a dozen copy-pastes of the word "goldfish". Per your instructions, I put them between dash lines so you know not to read them.
---------------------------------------------------------------------- goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish goldfish ---------------------------------------------------------------------- |
pancake
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
English does not borrow from other languages. English follows other languages down dark alleys, hits them over the head, and rifles through their pockets for loose grammar.
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People are going to ghost their missions anyways, there's no right our wrong way to play the game. While other people are going to continue to enjoy the hunt and seek aspect (as has been shown here) and continue to play the game that way.|
Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
To even make it as an option to turn off/on at will, I feel that this would be basically poking players in the face and telling them to just ghost their missions. Sure, most players know the maps by now anyways, but that's through experience, and not the game telling you "Don't bother killing those guys, they don't matter."
The Dev's randomized placement for glowies/hostages for a reason, after all. |
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
You make a suggestion. It's ridiculous to expect that people won't say that they agree or disagree. Whether they say "/sign," "I agree," "This!" or elaborate over the span of a paragraph. You're still telling people how to post, and this is nothing but disruptive to your thread. Please avoid doing this in the future.
Personally, I disagree with calling anything in City of Heroes a puzzle or a maze. Almost all instanced maps are incredibly simple and straightforward. I'm more or less opposed to making them even more simple and straightforward, and shudder to think that the ungodly linear maps of Praetoria may well be the way of the future. I love maps with intersections, loops and a complex floor plan. You cite repetition, yet you suggest a system which makes the game even more repetitive. Ask any person who's driven a vehicle while tired when they most doze off - it's not on complex fast corners, it's on the monotonous straightaway. Complex maps that you have to give a bit of a thought to in order to help break the monotony more than most things in this game. Figuring out where you've been, where the current path is going, where it might re-merge with the rest of the map and how to sweep larger instances for clickies and enemies is part of the fun of the game. I feel that having all objectives highlighted on the map as soon as you walk in won't at all help make the game less monotonous. It will just make us have to be less involved, which just makes the game feel that much more repetitive. The most that needs to happen is for the system we already have which shows the last few enemies and objectives to actually work. That one's good enough. |
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Yes, but that will be cause they choose to ghost it, not because the Dev's shoved the options in their face and have their teammates point out that it'd be stupid/inefficient not to.|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
People are going to ghost their missions anyways, there's no right our wrong way to play the game. While other people are going to continue to enjoy the hunt and seek aspect (as has been shown here) and continue to play the game that way.
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Don't get me wrong, I hate kill all's, quite a bit. But I wouldn't look forward to the day when, on a PUG, I'm trying to kill some baddies while on a mission and have the leader go "WTF you doing? The (glowie/hostage/boss) isn't that way." And that WOULD happen. People already exist that object to venturing into a room on the second mission of the ITF that doesn't have a Cyst in it.
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Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
Yes, but that will be cause they choose to ghost it, not because the Dev's shoved the options in their face and have their teammates point out that it'd be stupid/inefficient not to.
Don't get me wrong, I hate kill all's, quite a bit. But I wouldn't look forward to the day when, on a PUG, I'm trying to kill some baddies while on a mission and have the leader go "WTF you doing? The (glowie/hostage/boss) isn't that way." And that WOULD happen. People already exist that object to venturing into a room on the second mission of the ITF that doesn't have a Cyst in it. |
Like you say, it's a problem that already exists anyways. If you are not the type who wants to run missions as efficiently as possible, just make that clear when you start up your team/TF. As you know, I often do not like speeding through TF's and I make it pretty clear when that's how I feel.
Granting people the option to see objectives at all times, like people have suggested here, shouldn't interfere with how you or anyone else plays the game.
I enjoy beating the crap out of everything I see on the ITF as much as the next guy or gal, but what I don't enjoy is when I'm soloing a mission and I spend 10 extra minutes roaming around the map because A.) I can't find a glowie, B.) I can't find a Destructible Object, C.) The objective is "defeat boss," which I did already, but one of the bosses minions ran off and I can't find him.... Countless other examples exist.
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How about a compromise, then? The objectives reveal themselves on the map AS you get to them. That way you can't accidently pass them by. It would make more sense that way, too--It's plausible that your character would have seen it as you went by, thus you know where it is (as opposed to somehow automagically knowing where it was the second you step inside the mission).
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Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
Like you say, it's a problem that already exists anyways. If you are not the type who wants to run missions as efficiently as possible, just make that clear when you start up your team/TF. As you know, I often do not like speeding through TF's and I make it pretty clear when that's how I feel.
Granting people the option to see objectives at all times, like people have suggested here, shouldn't interfere with how you or anyone else plays the game. I enjoy beating the crap out of everything I see on the ITF as much as the next guy or gal, but what I don't enjoy is when I'm soloing a mission and I spend 10 extra minutes roaming around the map because A.) I can't find a glowie, B.) I can't find a Destructible Object, C.) The objective is "defeat boss," which I did already, but one of the bosses minions ran off and I can't find him.... Countless other examples exist. |
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Do you enjoy dying?
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Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
I enjoy beating the crap out of everything I see on the ITF as much as the next guy or gal, but what I don't enjoy is when I'm soloing a mission and I spend 10 extra minutes roaming around the map because A.) I can't find a glowie, B.) I can't find a Destructible Object, C.) The objective is "defeat boss," which I did already, but one of the bosses minions ran off and I can't find him.... Countless other examples exist.
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Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
How about a compromise, then? The objectives reveal themselves on the map AS you get to them. That way you can't accidently pass them by. It would make more sense that way, too--It's plausible that your character would have seen it as you went by, thus you know where it is (as opposed to somehow automagically knowing where it was the second you step inside the mission).
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I would be totally okay with this too. It's a good idea.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Do you enjoy dying?
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I don't think anyone enjoys the dying part, but I do like to put my characters into situations that are challenging... That thrill is a big part of where the fun comes in for me.
Okay let me just make this clear. I don't want anyone to "</sign>" or "snarky mark and then </unsign.>" I just want to see if I'm the only person who gets annoyed with this, and then I'll decide if I want to formally suggest it or not after that, so that you guys can feel free to Roleplay this thread as a petition of some sort at your own discretion..
I will be placing my potential suggestion in between lines, just in case it annoys anyone. Here's the deal: If you plan on being condescending and asserting your benevolance, that's cool. Just please place your comment between lines (--------------) so I can be sure not to read it. Fair is fair, right?
Anywho...
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I think that the "puzzle" aspect should be removed from mission maps. I've been playing for just shy of nine months now... I guess when I first started and all I did was solo, it was interesting. Here's the thing, though---
I'm at a point where the maps all feel redundant and tedious, but I'm not yet at a point where I have every single turn and object placement possibility memorized. Honestly, sometimes it's so annoying I feel like I'm doing a 2,000 piece puzzle or something. (Pro tip: If I wanted to do a puzzle, I'd do a puzzle. I would rather play a FAST PACED Super Hero video game, though.)
Long story short: Make all Objects, NPC's, and mission goals viewable on the map at all times. It's not "challenging" to have to waste way too much time scurrying all around looking for things. It's just tedious and annoying.
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