If you really don't care which, what powersets are you going with?
If you were going FM/FA for instance, I'd suggest Brutes with your current criteria.
Id you were going to say anything/Shield, I'd suggest Scrapper.
If it's not a matter of playstyle (and I personally prefere the Scrapper playstyle...and there is a difference) I'd base it strictly on which AT benefits the most with the powersets chosen.
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Brute Pro: Gets SS
Scrapper Pro: Gets Spines.
I think the default answer is brute unless there is something specific about the build on a scrapper that makes it worth rolling. The higher damage cap of a brute to me doesn't really come into play for normal play since it's so high and you need 100% fury with other buffs to reach it. For normal content, a brute isn't going to out damage a scrapper given the same sets. There's a reason scrappers can't go SS/shield yet.
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This is good advice.
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Originally Posted by Organica
Both.
Several of each! |
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I would not consider this a Con for Scrappers. Shedding aggro like water off a duck's back may be bad if teammates are expecting you to do something you're not designed to do, but it's great when it lets you focus on your job, which is to flip out and kill ****.
| = No taunt effect in damage aura |
"Null is as much an argument "for removing the cottage rule" as the moon being round is for buying tennis shoes." -Memphis Bill
It's true that Scrappers have a lower damage cap, but the fact that they do on average 1.6x more base damage means that they have more consistent damage, more potential maximum damage, and benefit much more from damage buffs.
Also, note that Scrappers have a higher modifier on self-damage buffs. This among other reasons is why the devs have been reluctant to proliferate super-strength as is.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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Precisely. It's an empty question. There are no "better" ATs here, only ATs some people like more than others. If you like 'em both, play 'em both. There's no need to choose.|
Originally Posted by Organica
Both.
Several of each! |
Unless you're asking about a specific character and need to choose for that one (which I don't think you are), in which case let's hear about the character first and we'll figure out what's appropriate then.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I'm going with the "try several" crowd.
I came up with a concept and decided that KM/WP would fit the best. I got a brute, redside, up to lvl 17 and decided that I wanted to go with a KM/WP scrapper instead. Delete, restart. Kind of good not to watch the Fury bar, but I missed the growing level of damage, and I was kind of squishy by comparison. I rerolled him today as a Preatorian brute and got MANY levels thanks to Double XP. Anyway, I tried a couple of things and decided on what I liked the best.
I think the best way to explore the game and different ATs is just to try them and the different powersets for yourself.
@Joshua.
Trust me, once the Fury gets going, that lower base damage is irrelevant for Broots.
It's spelled Brute. Just saying.
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I know, what's this thing all about? Seen it several times in channels today? Is this some sort of new CoX-LOLcat hybrid thing? Yuck.
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Originally Posted by Scythus
It's spelled Brute. Just saying.
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Fixed.
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Originally Posted by Scythus
It's spelled Broot. Just SMASHin'.
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@Roderick
Brootters
lol Hmm I guess I could have been a little more detailed with my post but I wanted to judge reaction first.
In reality I have a main stream toon setup, I have a name, I Bio written up somewhere, and a defensive set selected... (Electric Armor) But I have yet to find a Primary that fits or rather looks good on him. So I was wondering how the primaries fared on each AT. So really I guess now I'm wondering how, at this point, most of the primaries are on each AT.
I've got a ss/fa brute IO'd so no Super Strength needed here.
My main toon now has War Mace and I'm not really liking it (IO'd and 50).
Got an Electric Melee/ Electric Armor Brute. Don't really care for Electric Melee.
Been toying around with Duel Blades on broot.
And I have tried Katana / Regeneration Scrapper.
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Originally Posted by Broken Voltage
lol Hmm I guess I could have been a little more detailed with my post but I wanted to judge reaction first.
In reality I have a main stream toon setup, I have a name, I Bio written up somewhere, and a defensive set selected... (Electric Armor) But I have yet to find a Primary that fits or rather looks good on him. So I was wondering how the primaries fared on each AT. So really I guess now I'm wondering how, at this point, most of the primaries are on each AT. I've got a ss/fa brute IO'd so no Super Strength needed here. My main toon now has War Mace and I'm not really liking it (IO'd and 50). Got an Electric Melee/ Electric Armor Brute. Don't really care for Electric Melee. Been toying around with Duel Blades on broot. And I have tried Katana / Regeneration Scrapper. |
My suggestion, because I love my Scrapper version so much, that I know it can do even better on a Brute...
Fire Melee/Electric Armor. Im at like 40-41% S/L Defense right now (few IOs and a couple HOs to go before I hit 45%), I chain Incenerate - Scorch - Cremate - Scorch really easy, with no End Issues, and have Fire Sword Circle for AOE.
I believe Brutes make out better with Fire Melee, due to Fury effecting the DoT, Brutes for sure make out better with Electric Armor, and really, I'm just loving the combo.
I just happen to love the Scrapper AT more, but I know a Brute version would be so much better.
Mines basically a homage to Supergirl/Powergirl/Firestar rolled into one! KD Procs in the 3 attacks just give that SMASH/SUPER STRENGTH feeling I wanted.
Already unlocked the Alpha Slot, going with Cardiac, purely for more resists numbers. Going Barrier Destiny so I can always have at minimum +5% Resist/Defense (which puts me really close to 75% S/L Resist in the final build).
Cardiac will also likely give the benefit of not relying on Power Sink as an END Recovery tool, and more as a defense tool (which I basically use it for now and it just happens to keep you going).
Highly suggest FM/ELA.
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No.
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Originally Posted by Roderick
Fixed.
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Claws. Elec. Brutes. Rule.
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Rularuu.
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Originally Posted by Amy_Amp
Claws. Elec. Brutes. Rule.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Brute:
Pros
= Taunt in aura powers (Only a pro if you need enemies surrounding you for beneficial powers.)
= Highest damage cap (Virtually impossible to reach unassisted, you need 14 large red inspirations to hit it by yourself)
= 90% to resistances for a cap. (Again, for most sets this is impossible to reach unassisted)
= Fury (This can be a Con if you have to drop a target NOW, without having to build up damage bonuses first)
= Hp cap higher (Legitimate Pro)
= Has Super Strength (Depends on how much you like Super Strength)
Cons
= Less base damage than scrapper (This is the big one, you are required to be in a fight for some time before you hit your full damage, a scrapper hits at full strength right away)
Scrapper-
Pros
= Higher base damage
= Chance to crit
= Has Spines (Again, depends on how much you like the set)
Cons
= Lower resistance cap (Only relevant on sets that depend on resistance, does not matter at all for Shield Defense, SR, or Energy Aura)
= Lower Hp cap (Legitimate Con)
Others
= No taunt effect in damage aura (Not always a bad thing, the ability to disengage without dragging 17 enemies with you comes in handy)
Really, it's just a playstyle difference. There isn't anything, mechanically speaking, that makes one definitively better than the other. At their respective damage caps, a brute will outdamage a scrapper by maybe 80-100 points, and that advantage disappears instantly if the scrapper happens to crit on that attack.
Brutes get a slight survivability advantage, but in reality, the kill speed of both ATs makes that much less of a factor than it appears to be. A scrapper or a brute generally only needs to survive for 10-15 seconds to get through a spawn, which both ATs are equally capable of. Tanks get more survivability, but their purpose requires it, and they kill slightly slower.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
I'm going to throw Scrapper in there.
As much as I like my Brutes, I dislike the build up (pun intended) of Fury and LOVE the randomness of critical hits. I guess I just like seeing those words "CRITICAL" and "DOMINATION" above my character, it lets me feel as if something is happening in the game that I can witness. Same with Corrs for "SCOURGE" and so on or "ASSASSIN'S STRIKE" for my Stalker.
I love those visual cues and outside the big orange numbers, Brutes have none. 
Questions about the game, either side? /t @Neuronia or @Neuronium, with your queries!
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Tribute to an obscure Omega Men support character?|
Originally Posted by Feycat
I know, what's this thing all about? Seen it several times in channels today? Is this some sort of new CoX-LOLcat hybrid thing? Yuck.
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But back to the Brute vs. Scrapper discussion:
Brute:
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Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Cons
= Less base damage than scrapper (This is the big one, you are required to be in a fight for some time before you hit your full damage, a scrapper hits at full strength right away) |
As for Scrappers' ostensible shortcomings:
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Others = No taunt effect in damage aura (Not always a bad thing, the ability to disengage without dragging 17 enemies with you comes in handy) |
Be that as it may, I have several of each AT, and those chars are ultimately all enjoyable in their own ways.
I adore my br00ts. I have scrappahs, but they're kinda boring. I only made them in the past when I wanted sets br00ts didn't have. The Fury bar is fun, and I like the tankier survivability and the ability to use taunts. Most br00ts can, built well, make very respectable tanks on a team, and that's always fun to do.
I'm only ladylike when compared to my sister.
More on Fury: At lowbie levels, half a fury bar unslotted for damage will give you slightly less damage than a scrapper with three training damage IOs. It might not seem much, but at low levels its damn nice to have.
Oh, and War Mace and Super Strength hand you Extreme Damage attacks along with pretty much all the single target attacks you'll need at level 8. (Mental note: Check WM on scraps once Beta Server returns from napping. Katana on broots too.)
But basically, if you like jumping right into mobs, flailing away madly, and shouting with laughter like Heavy Weapons Guy, brute is your class. Or a shield scrapper. If you like a bit more finesse and high-performance but still want to get in and get dirty, that's the other scrappers.
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Originally Posted by Broken Voltage
I'm been thinkin for a long time and have finally decided to ask you guys, which to you think is better, The attack focused Scrapper or the Sturdiness of the Brute?
I don't want this to turn into a flame war, just want what people think, to them, is better of the two. I got some pros and cons So I'll list them. Broot- Pros = Taunt in aura powers = Highest damage cap = 90% to resistances for a cap. = Fury = Hp cap higher = Has Super Strength Cons = Less base damage than scrapper Scrapper- Pros = Higher base damage = Chance to crit = Has Spines Cons = Lower resistance cap = Lower Hp cap Others = No taunt effect in damage aura If anyone can think of more valid ones, please say so. That's about all I can think of at this time. Now convince me!  (Thanks Amy I know I forgot something.) |
Depends on the character.
Tender Bar is based around the concept of a female version of Shizuo Heiwajima which is basically the same as a moderately less insane version of the Incredible Hulk with no super-science origin. Check the vid and see what I mean.
Castle Rat is based on the idea of speed, accuracy and skill. The concept being a wererat assassin.
Blood Rose could go either way, as well as tank, since she's basically an "undevoured" - she attempted suicide with a proto DE culture about twenty-thirty years ago, the result is her current self. Dark/Regen scrapper and Dark/Dark tank...she's pretty much a progressive, dangerous killing machine (though she's gotten less lethal upon realizing that she's part DE)
if I do Amaterasu's Eclipse (which I almost can't do unless we get a pistol and blade skirmish set in a dominator class) I'd probably do her as a scrapper, skill and precision again
Wyrmling is totally a tank, godzilla-girl for the win, but she could do brute if I wanted
Lady Velia was a scrapper, skill precision, martial arts, she could have been tank, we got that now
Grayskin's attitude doesn't fit brute at all...possibly tank or scrapper, might make a Kin-Melee version. She's a Invuln/SS tank right now...but Kin/Energy might fit her better...depending...(she was in HERO system a desolid-based fast-brick...meaning super strength based on desolidifying stuff around her to make it weigh less until it left her hands...and physical/energy resistances based on being only partially solid)
Soda has to be a brute...despite the fact that she is supposed to be just a GOOD fighter, a big thing about her is the thing that gave her her name: "Soda goes Pop"
If we get interesting enough swords in Titan Weapons, I think I'll try to redo the Little-Girl Big Sword thing again....not sure what concept yet...been trying to satisfactorily do that since I saw the Order of the Ebon Hand card from a magic expansion back when I still played
if I were to pull Lu from my Bystander novel.........well.......despite having high levels of superstrength (reference the earthquake and bridge incident).....she's a pathetic fighter, absolutely pathetic.....I'd probably make her an MC troller or mastermind based on the fact that she has lots of skilled friends and is a highly manipulative speaker
Now, Genevive Robles aka Tlazoltoetl ex-goddess agent for NAMA (North-American Military Alliance) hard to do...goddess fighting style is basically a single-heavy pistol, reinforced for blocking and striking and containing a hidden blade with one free hand for loading and grappling and assorted tricks....Genevive would probably be best as a DB/Devices blaster...though how to represent the fact that her ammo clips are rigged to double as mini-grenades, if they ever do a pistol scrapper...that would be perfect
Couldn't do Runya from the Greenwater books, we don't have the snake-skeleton available to us, and Runya, being a lygiel, is sort of serpent from the waist down.....also...Runya's big thing is SPEARS
Tennel would be an axe scrapper now that it will be possible and Dobrek just HAS to be an Kat/SR Scrapper if I were to play him
Morriga is the Archer to end all archers, though she's only really shown much of potential only once in the books
going to the Zodiacs setting....
Jun/Toshiko - kin or SJ for that juijitsu look....staves if they come out because she's another spear user...despite being a samurai, she would not get the Katana set because well, Zodiacs aren't allowed to use Katana, samurai or commoner....definitely scrapper, her emotional attitude doesn't fit brute
Sigurd - Tank, all the way, doesn't like to hurt people if he can avoid it, big friendly guy, likes a friendly fight, and willing to fight to the death, but doesn't like to
Enkil - scrapper or brute, he has enough anger to represent a brute, but he's also a master martial artist, probably a kin scrapper
Divine Blood setting -
Naiki - going with her end up result as Demoness of Torrent, she'd probably end up a kin brute...she's not one for anger much...but she is one that gets more powerful the longer a fight goes by virtue of her demonic Realm
Eija - Goddess of Blood....would probably end up a corruptor or defender...she tends to end up a combat medic on the side of the allied Demons, Gods and Humans against the various evil groups in the world...if I did her as melee (she's capable)...probably Dark scrapper or stalker because dim mak and stealth are her specialties
Deimosu - Ainur of Lightning....probably a scrapper elec melee, he tends to hit hard and fast and leave...he doesn't do the prolonged fight that Naiki and brutes prefer....despite this his attitude fits more the Brute while Naiki is more the stereotypical swashbuckling scrapper type
Damir - in all honesty...he's a blaster...AR or DB....but if I did him as a melee, probably a DB scrapper, he doesn't go for the prolonged deal either and doesn't have a strong temper
Sanya San, Pillar of Strength of the San Batch....Kin melee....probably either a brute or scrapper...brute would simulate her extreme level of recklessness by the encouragement of fury, but I think the massive amounts of damage she's able to pull off is probably more appropriate to scrapper and criticals
Okay....hmm...let's see, covered characters from my current crop of CoH characters and all three of my published world settings and one of the world settings I'm working on.....
oh...well, one more
Ryoko....if I did her would be good either as a brute or scrapper...the more scared she gets the more focused and dangerous she gets...but she's not really scared of fighting...so for the brute to work, I'd have to imagine that a) she's gotten control of the Kishu and can turn it on and off at will without losing sanity....or b) there's constantly a loved one threatened in close proximity to her....as such, she's most likely a scrapper....
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"Notice at the end, there: Arcanaville did the math and KICKED IT INTO EXISTENCE." - Ironik on the power of Arcanaville's math
I'm been thinkin for a long time and have finally decided to ask you guys, which to you think is better, The attack focused Scrapper or the Sturdiness of the Brute?
I don't want this to turn into a flame war, just want what people think, to them, is better of the two. I got some pros and cons So I'll list them.
Broot-
Pros
= Taunt in aura powers
= Highest damage cap
= 90% to resistances for a cap.
= Fury
= Hp cap higher
= Has Super Strength
Cons
= Less base damage than scrapper
Scrapper-
Pros
= Higher base damage
= Chance to crit
= Has Spines
= No taunt effect in damage aura ( I guess I may have grown addicted to taunt effects on toons. )
Cons
= Lower resistance cap
= Lower Hp cap
If anyone can think of more valid ones, please say so.
That's about all I can think of at this time.
Now convince me!
(Thanks Amy I know I forgot something.)
Broken Voltage (War Mace / Electric Armor Brute) Main Toon