City of Heroes: Live Forum Archive

A premium feature I'm surprised no one has asked for yet with the new F2P system

Arcanaville

By Arcanaville,
Posted on: 2011-07-29 11:33 in Suggestions and Ideas

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
Dude I've been playing for 7 years and I have never gotten a Melee AT over level 40. Mainly because I don't enjoy playing melee alts. So despite my level of veterancy I have no idea how to properly play any of the melee powersets.
Nor have I. So I wouldn't use a one-time respec to get a melee set; what on earth would possess someone who doesn't enjoy melee to respec into a melee set?

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahliah View Post
That still doesn't make any sense to me. We can't red flag 50s on people who've been playing a week and pl'd in AE and have no idea what their powers are or how to use them, so what would be the benefit of red flagging a 2+ year vet (by your criteria, with which I agree) on a respec to a different primary and/or secondary set on an old toon? I wouldn't waste my one-time "total" respec on a power set I didn't know how to play (I guess some would, but again, the red flag is a bit over the top to me given the A-D requirements you laid out).
Well, the nice thing about your above example: Veteran status. The AE PL'd lvl 50 toon wouldn't even have the 3 month vet badge. And I'm sure they'd have lots of AE badges to go with that.

Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....

Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Tahliah View Post
Nor have I. So I wouldn't use a one-time respec to get a melee set; what on earth would possess someone who doesn't enjoy melee to respec into a melee set?
Simple. As the devs themselves explained it, there are powersets that are easy to level up at low levels and powersets that are easier to play at high levels. Not allowing powerset respecs prevents players from abusing the system and starting off with an easy set then switching to a set that's easy at high levels

 

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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
... Then you would hardly be likely to respec one of your existing characters into those power sets, would you?

Do pay attention, 007.
I wouldn't but other people would if they could. How do I know this you ask? Because people keep asking for total powerset and AT respecs every few months.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
I wouldn't but other people would if they could.
I'm having - as I do every time this comes up - a hard time believing that this would be any skin off my back (or yours, or anyone's who isn't that player who did that silly thing) even in the worst-case scenario where people are doing it. I mean, it isn't as if there aren't plenty of players who don't know what the buttons do anyway, and the Earth has not yet fallen into the Sun.

It just ends up being another one of those CoH standard foot-stompy "Because I don't want you to!" things. Like Inherent Fitness.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down View Post
Well, the nice thing about your above example: Veteran status. The AE PL'd lvl 50 toon wouldn't even have the 3 month vet badge. And I'm sure they'd have lots of AE badges to go with that.
Sure, but you're suggesting making vet's names red to clue the world into the fact that we did a "total" respec, that makes no sense. So we have to go to the trouble of looking at newbie's badges to find out that they don't have a 3 month badge, but . . . . Still makes no sense.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
Simple. As the devs themselves explained it, there are powersets that are easy to level up at low levels and powersets that are easier to play at high levels. Not allowing powerset respecs prevents players from abusing the system and starting off with an easy set then switching to a set that's easy at high levels
The thread is discussing respecing the same archtype, just changing primary or secondary sets. A blaster is a blaster, no one would be able to make it a tank just to try it out at 50. And no one is suggesting that even be possible. What are you talking about?

 

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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
I wouldn't but other people would if they could. How do I know this you ask? Because people keep asking for total powerset and AT respecs every few months.
But so what? What do you care if someone else does this terrible terrible thing of taking a powerset in the same archtype that they've never played before? I still don't see that happening much, but even if everyone (except you. And me.) did it . . . so what? Would that really be any different than new players power leveling to 50 in AE in their first week? Oh, wait, yes, it would because the total respec would be tied to vet status in some way. So let's see, someone who's played the game for seven years (say), hates melee, but for some unknown reason decides to take one of his (or her) lvl 50 blasters, defenders, trolls, whatever and turn it into a tank (again, no one is suggesting this be possible, but let's pretend). What horrors do you expect to befall the game because of that?

 

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Originally Posted by Tahliah View Post
Sure, but you're suggesting making vet's names red to clue the world into the fact that we did a "total" respec, that makes no sense. So we have to go to the trouble of looking at newbie's badges to find out that they don't have a 3 month badge, but . . . . Still makes no sense.
Sorry if you don't understand it. And yes, I was suggesting making Vet names red, for a limited time, to clue the world into the fact you did do a "total respec". Why does that bother you so much?

As I originally stated, I'm not endorsing the idea of power set respecs, but I threw out the one idea as a possible means to stop the endless tide of "full power respec" threads. And for anyone who wishes to go down that road, even myself should I ever "decide" to do so, I don't think it should be an easy, painless process. Since I'm not really endorsing the idea, I'll let you try and sort it out on your own.

Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....

Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.

 

Posted

Oh, and FYI, the original poster was advocating being able to change your primary, secondary, and AT at "a cost".

My idea was a different take on things.

Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....

Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahliah View Post
The thread is discussing respecing the same archtype, just changing primary or secondary sets. A blaster is a blaster, no one would be able to make it a tank just to try it out at 50. And no one is suggesting that even be possible. What are you talking about?
Actually this thread has no such restriction in respec type, just tiers of cost, if you go from nrg/dev blaster to Kat/Fire scrapper you pay the highest price of all

 

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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
I'm having - as I do every time this comes up - a hard time believing that this would be any skin off my back (or yours, or anyone's who isn't that player who did that silly thing) even in the worst-case scenario where people are doing it. I mean, it isn't as if there aren't plenty of players who don't know what the buttons do anyway, and the Earth has not yet fallen into the Sun.

It just ends up being another one of those CoH standard foot-stompy "Because I don't want you to!" things. Like Inherent Fitness.

Hey Cap Please don't confuse the message with the messenger here. I've only repeated what the devs themselves have told us, and confirmed what others have said the devs told us.

If you reread my posts I openly admitted that I have at least one character that I would use a powerset/AT respec on, and the only thing I wouldn't use it for would be to respec into one of the powerset/AT's that I'm unfamiliar with.

Oh and this issue isn't the first time the devs have told us they aren't going to do something because they don't want us to do it. They make those unilateral decisions all the time.

And Inherent Fitness was not one of those issues. What was actually said by Castle was if he could he'd prefer to remove Stamina entirely from the game rather than give us Inherent Fitness. That doesn't even come close to meaning the same thing as "Because I don't want you to!"

 

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Originally Posted by Tahliah View Post
But so what? What do you care if someone else does this terrible terrible thing of taking a powerset in the same archtype that they've never played before?
As I already explained to Captain Photon, I don't care. However the devs do and every single time this gets brought up, which is every couple of months they tell us the same thing.

No.

So we simply have to deal with the fact that this is their game and their rules. They want the game to evolve into a certain direction and total respecs isn't in that direction.

 

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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
Rerolling wipes all the character's badges, mission arc souvenirs, etc., some of which are difficult to recover, a few of which can't be recovered at all, and all of which are part of the character's history - along with the M-civilians' total time estimates and whatnot - about which there are still a few of us left who care. Having to start over, but keeping that stuff, may be an attempt at compromise with the "No. Despite being a veteran player, you somehow wouldn't know how to play any more if you changed power sets, and that would make the Baby New Year* cry. Reroll" crowd. At least, that's how I perceive it.
That was exactly what I was saying. Keeping all the badges (especially accolades and accolade powers) and other unlocks (unlockable weapon models, Roman costume parts, Vanguard stuff if you missed the Vanguard Pack, etc) would be the benefit, while avoiding the complaints of having to re-learn how the character plays as well as avoiding the "use 'easy' powerset to get through low-levels, then switch to the one you actually want at high levels" issue.

I'm not saying they could, should, or would do this, just that it's the only way I could possibly see a "total respec" working from a gameplay perspective.

 

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Originally Posted by Thunder Knight View Post
That was exactly what I was saying. Keeping all the badges (especially accolades and accolade powers) and other unlocks (unlockable weapon models, Roman costume parts, Vanguard stuff if you missed the Vanguard Pack, etc) would be the benefit, while avoiding the complaints of having to re-learn how the character plays as well as avoiding the "use 'easy' powerset to get through low-levels, then switch to the one you actually want at high levels" issue.

I'm not saying they could, should, or would do this, but that it's an alternative idea.
It's a compromise that players have been offering the devs for years, so far no luck.

 

Posted

I am totally against total power respecs but I have to address one recurring argument against it that just makes me LOL.. literally.

This game is not hard at all. If you cannot figure out new powersets within 15-30 minutes... you will never figure them out. The argument against PLers/Total respecs because people won't know how to play is absurd. People like to point to Player A who was PL'd in AE and "made our TF fail" - "causes soo many team wipes" etc etc... That person is an idiot. It wouldn't matter if they spent 1,000 hours on a toon they will still be a bad player LOL!. I have seen people with 1000+ badges who are simply put; HORRIBLE players. I have seen PL'd toon rock in a TF.

Back on topic.....

/No

 

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Originally Posted by Fixxer View Post
I am totally against total power respecs but I have to address one recurring argument against it that just makes me LOL.. literally.

This game is not hard at all. If you cannot figure out new powersets within 15-30 minutes... you will never figure them out. The argument against PLers/Total respecs because people won't know how to play is absurd. People like to point to Player A who was PL'd in AE and "made our TF fail" - "causes soo many team wipes" etc etc... That person is an idiot. It wouldn't matter if they spent 1,000 hours on a toon they will still be a bad player LOL!. I have seen people with 1000+ badges who are simply put; HORRIBLE players. I have seen PL'd toon rock in a TF.

Back on topic.....

/No
Sorry Fixxer but that's total BS. You can't figure out how all the powers in a powerset works in 15-30 minutes because you can't get a character to level 50 in that length of time. There actually are tactics required that consist of more than simply mashing buttons.

Yes PL'd toons can rock but that's simply because the player has previous experience with the game and is drawing on that experience.

 

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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
Hey Cap Please don't confuse the message with the messenger here. I've only repeated what the devs themselves have told us, and confirmed what others have said the devs told us.

If you reread my posts I openly admitted that I have at least one character that I would use a powerset/AT respec on, and the only thing I wouldn't use it for would be to respec into one of the powerset/AT's that I'm unfamiliar with.

Oh and this issue isn't the first time the devs have told us they aren't going to do something because they don't want us to do it. They make those unilateral decisions all the time.

And Inherent Fitness was not one of those issues. What was actually said by Castle was if he could he'd prefer to remove Stamina entirely from the game rather than give us Inherent Fitness. That doesn't even come close to meaning the same thing as "Because I don't want you to!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
As I already explained to Captain Photon, I don't care. However the devs do and every single time this gets brought up, which is every couple of months they tell us the same thing.

No.

So we simply have to deal with the fact that this is their game and their rules. They want the game to evolve into a certain direction and total respecs isn't in that direction.
I still think it's worth it to keep bringing it up, because circumstances change. With Freedom, anything that players are likely to pay for is probably getting re-considered.



Character index

 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Silver Gale View Post
I still think it's worth it to keep bringing it up, because circumstances change. With Freedom, anything that players are likely to pay for is probably getting re-considered.
You do realize that sometimes the squeaky wheel does NOT get oil.

It gets dismantled.

Quit Bringing it up.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Gale View Post
I still think it's worth it to keep bringing it up, because circumstances change. With Freedom, anything that players are likely to pay for is probably getting re-considered.
Wrong. I can think of many things players would pay for that will never be re-considered, but don't let that stop you from making suggestions.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
Hey Cap Please don't confuse the message with the messenger here. I've only repeated what the devs themselves have told us, and confirmed what others have said the devs told us.
Yeah, well, I didn't say you were stomping your foot, only that one was getting stomped. Relax, Colossus.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
It's a compromise that players have been offering the devs for years, so far no luck.
True but a lot of things are changing everything is being gated by micro transactions i'm sure play nc pressure might get P studios to re-examine all the money making avenues to keep this game a float and so long as there is demand not having an option like this is a missed opportunity

 

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Originally Posted by Cheetatron View Post
True but a lot of things are changing everything is being gated by micro transactions i'm sure play nc pressure might get P studios to re-examine all the money making avenues to keep this game a float and so long as there is demand not having an option like this is a missed opportunity
No. It is not a missed opportunity.

http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...0&postcount=28

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
I'm going to ignore absolutely everything else and focus on this, because if anything it takes the idea of powerset respecs - that the devs have already said a flat out "No" to, not because of tech, but because *they don't like the idea,* - and slaps it down, curbstomps it a few times, grinds broken glass into its skin and sprinkles it with lemon juice.

Look at what you said above. Then think about the limits put in with Free and Premium... *specifically* the limits on the number of characters.

A powerset respec? One time fee. Respec powerset. *No extra slots.*

Do you think PS wants simply that one time fee - or would it make *far* more sense to say "Well, you want more characters, we've got this awesome VIP plan that gives you 12 slots on every server... *plus a whole new server!" Plus more powersets! Come, give us a subscription fee!"

If anything, Freedom should be seen as not the nail in the coffin of powerset respecs, but the steel-reinforced zombieproof able-to-withstand-a-nuclear-blast concrete sarcophagus around the coffin that's been buried extra deep.
Important part bolded.

Implementing Power set respecs, even as a Purchase option, would immediately, and irrevocably, remove one of the MAJOR INCENTIVES of a subscribers account over a F2P account.

 

Posted

Like I said... Does not require a genius to learn to play any AT. Sorry if this hurts your feelings but it is very true. The "skill" you speak of is knowing the game and powers and how to use them... Never had a grav controller.... but I'm betting I could PL one to 50 and do just fine...because I have played controllers..understand how the game works..and am not illiterate and can read what a power does. This game requires very little skill... which in NO way means I support total power respecs. But to use the "OH NOES It will make noobs out of people" argument... is BS. Those people who can't figure out how to play a toon after 30 minutes...have severe learning deficiencies.

I have brought 4-5 people into this game by showing them the game...and then sitting there for a few minutes explaining things to them... and then let them play one of my 50's..NONE of them has ever said anything like "OMG this is soo confusing."

So again... baseless and pointless argument..unless of course you are comparing all players to brain dead monkeys. Which I will admit in my 6 years...I have come across a few players..noob and veteran alike; that fit that category quite well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project View Post
Sorry Fixxer but that's total BS. You can't figure out how all the powers in a powerset works in 15-30 minutes because you can't get a character to level 50 in that length of time. There actually are tactics required that consist of more than simply mashing buttons.

Yes PL'd toons can rock but that's simply because the player has previous experience with the game and is drawing on that experience.