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You know, we've heard this story many times before and we managed to all get along and do our thing. They moaned about this about people asking for Power leveling teams in PI, we got along, then many missions that were bugged giving large amounts of XP, people were forming Power Leveling teams, and yet we managed to get along. Then came the AE and we've been Power leveling since day 1 and yet we all still managed to get along and play the game.|
Originally Posted by Mega_Jamie
But that is the prime concern.
level 50s running around with no clue how to play their characters well will be excluded by the playerbase when ti comes to end-game content, especially the harder stuff. People that get excluded will become frustrated with the game and stop playing, so the Devs get less money. Now it won't just be individuals that have paid for this aswell that get excluded, but new players whos general game knowledge was quite low will also get excluded if they underperform because people will think they have paid for this. |
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| Eventually a level of elitism evolves whereby people only trust playing with people they have been playing with a while. The playerbase and endgame become stagnant, more people leave and the game deterioates. |
If not for some of these so called Elitism Groups a lot of the end game would be stagnant. I hate to pat my group on the back, but if not for y group Pinnacle wouldn't be doing Hami Raids every 2 weeks. We set the pace for how the Lambda and BAF trials our run on our server. So in a sense group such as mine are very liked and welcomed to many servers, and other people appreciate tight close groups like ours.
The point is I see power leveling on a daily basis and yet none of this comes to mind at all. It may be true to an extent, but it's not the main reason why this wouldn't happen, far from it to be honest. And besides, if this feature was only available to subbed players on characters that are only level 50 is would solve the little problem you mentioned.
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I don't see the point for myself, but as a paid option I have no problem with this idea.
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Originally Posted by Beef_Cake
This is called a Super Group, they've been here for many years. We still have them to this day and they do exactly what you mentioned, yet not all SGs are considered elitism. Even small niches of people play together on a daily basis everyday and they aren't in the same SG, but yet they do exactly what you mention, but people still get along.
If not for some of these so called Elitism Groups a lot of the end game would be stagnant. I hate to pat my group on the back, but if not for y group Pinnacle wouldn't be doing Hami Raids every 2 weeks. We set the pace for how the Lambda and BAF trials our run on our server. So in a sense group such as mine are very liked and welcomed to many servers, and other people appreciate tight close groups like ours. The point is I see power leveling on a daily basis and yet none of this comes to mind at all. It may be true to an extent, but it's not the main reason why this wouldn't happen, far from it to be honest. And besides, if this feature was only available to subbed players on characters that are only level 50 is would solve the little problem you mentioned. |
You forgot about Global Channels Beef. "Elitism" evolved past SG's and expanded into Global Channel communities.
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Damn those people and their "Making friends!"|
Originally Posted by Mega_Jamie
Eventually a level of elitism evolves whereby people only trust playing with people they have been playing with a while.
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Elitist friend-havers!
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i know a few players like that, but most i team with in game welcome inviting or teaming with random players. They tend to invite or join with friends first (i know, odd, right?), but otherwise anyone will do. It helps that most of us could easily finish any given mission with half the team or more doing nothing but dance emotes through the whole mission. |
Originally Posted by Mega_Jamie
Eventually a level of elitism evolves whereby people only trust playing with people they have been playing with a while. The playerbase and endgame become stagnant, more people leave and the game deterioates.
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Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
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With the 40+ minute waits forming trials, you could do nothing but slam your face repeatedly into the keyboard and you wouldn't get excluded from end-game content so long as you can press the "Yes" button when invited.
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Originally Posted by Mega_Jamie
level 50s running around with no clue how to play their characters well will be excluded by the playerbase when ti comes to end-game content, especially the harder stuff.
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I know it read like I was saying teaming with friends is bad, I didn't mean it like that, I do have more fun teaming with friends and people I know, but equally i'm quite happy, if not alot quieter when I team up with anybody, I still have fun, and will happily play with anyone, regardless of the number of vet badges etc.
Globals I see more of a way of making this more inclusive a game to play in, before I joined the ones on Union I knew nobody, wasn't really having a good time playing the game, and then suddenly I was running TFs and enjoying the game.
As far as What Beef said about his SG doing alot for the Hami raids on Pinnacle, great! I think you should toot you're own horn about that, but isn't it more a player or group of players going out of their way to set stuff up they don't have too... which is totally what the community is about, wouldn't that type of person use any means, be it Broadcast, Globals or SGs to arrange that.
Does it also look like I came across as supporting elitist picking? because I don't, and maybe I should clarify that too, maybe i'm just too much of a pessimist and have seen too many "Speed runs must be experienced" advertising more than normal runs these days, and like I said, it was a pretty extreme scenario.
Hey i'm probably really a person that would take advantage of this, since it takes me like a million years to actually get to 50... seriously, did someone sneak in and change XP just for me? I'm an altaholic that wants all his characters to experience all of their powers - I've always wanted a stormy up to try their powers, but never managed it before getting bored with the set, maybe respecing into it would be good... now i think im rambling... see this is why i lurk...
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Originally Posted by VoodooGirl
[*]Watching out for the Spinning Disco Portal of D00M!*
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Is it possible to buy rename tokens for your characters? You could use one to "free up" the name you want, and then another regive that name to a character with the powerset that you want. Nothing carries over, obviously, but at least you get the name/powerset you want. All of the important stuff can be regained/transferred over via email, minus some of the time-sensitive badges.
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This is literally the only reason I would support powerset respecs. Being able to keep badges that a new character would be locked out of. The anniversary badges should have been account wide badges.|
Originally Posted by BlueBattler
This is one of the reasons I wish anniversary badges were universally unlocked. I have toons that I would just hate to lose the badge on but I just don't want to play with the powersets they have.
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But if you really want to build a new version of a character on a specific server without losing all the work you put into the old one I have two suggestions.
1. Buy a rename token and make the old character a whole new person. Then you can create your new version with the old name.
2. Use the VIP transfer to move the old character to another server. Create new version of the old character. Then when you transfer him back you get a free name change since you already have that name taken.
Neither is perfect, but it's probably the best we can expect for a while.
I know we're not allowed to compare to other games, so will leave it anonymous, I currently play another MMO that has effectively powerset respecs and multiple builds that can use different powersets within the ATs.
The problem ?
Why would I want more than one (or maybe two if all builds had to be the same two powersets) max level of each AT ? Kills alting stone dead and reduces the time you spend playing the game and hence NCSoft's cash take, commercial suicide. I'd certainly have moved on if I'd been able to do this and wouldn't have the 13 level 50 tanks I have now.
This is without some of the other reasons stated above. In the other game I can create a build at level 50 with which I'm a complete n00b, then inflict it on a PuG ...
It's true. This game is NOT rocket surgery. - BillZBubba
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Because it would be HIGHLY gameable. |
Originally Posted by Grae Knight
It is not a suggestion but a gauge on what the rest of the player population thinks about the idea. I think it holds merit but would be open to hearing why it would not. Don't completely agree with the quote you posted.
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Example:
A Stone tank is one of the hardest things in the game to kill after it hits level 32 and gets Granite Armor. The price the powerset as a whole pays for that is being relatively weak until it gets to that point.
Now, if you could level that tank as a WP/DM, which levels very quickly, you could skip past the weak levels of Stone Armor and jump right in at level 34, when you can have fully slotted Granite Armor.
You've just bypassed the weaker early levels, which is that powerset's price for being so powerful later.
Or you could solo level a Mind/Kin controller (which solos fairly well), and then respec into Fire/Kin after Fulcrum Shift becomes available.
Or level a /Regen scrapper (which is strong in the early game) and respec into SR or Shield (which are endgame powerhouses)
Or a Claws/WP brute being respecced into an SS/Fire brute for level 50 fire ambush farming.
Basically, it comes down to the fact that all of the powersets in the game are balanced that way. If that set is extremely powerful in the late game, it struggles in the early game. If you could switch your powersets after leveling, you could get the good (late game power) without the bad (early game weakness).
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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It's no different then someone power leveling a character. Someone such as myself who power levels my next alt, doesn't play the low weaker levels anyway. Honestly, I could care less if this feature was added, no matter how I look at things, I will just power level my specific AT and powersets I want, no need for paying to do a power respec for "me"|
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Because it would be HIGHLY gameable.
Example: A Stone tank is one of the hardest things in the game to kill after it hits level 32 and gets Granite Armor. The price the powerset as a whole pays for that is being relatively weak until it gets to that point. Now, if you could level that tank as a WP/DM, which levels very quickly, you could skip past the weak levels of Stone Armor and jump right in at level 34, when you can have fully slotted Granite Armor. You've just bypassed the weaker early levels, which is that powerset's price for being so powerful later. Or you could solo level a Mind/Kin controller (which solos fairly well), and then respec into Fire/Kin after Fulcrum Shift becomes available. Or level a /Regen scrapper (which is strong in the early game) and respec into SR or Shield (which are endgame powerhouses) Or a Claws/WP brute being respecced into an SS/Fire brute for level 50 fire ambush farming. Basically, it comes down to the fact that all of the powersets in the game are balanced that way. If that set is extremely powerful in the late game, it struggles in the early game. If you could switch your powersets after leveling, you could get the good (late game power) without the bad (early game weakness). |
So what's the difference if I play a weaker set up to 50 and then do the power respec? I've still played it up. And like I said previously, only allow the power respec at level 50 and to VIPs only.
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I don't think powerset respecs will ever happen because it will require a ton of developer work and not enough payoff. The limited number of folks who really want this option and is willing to pay a significant sum of money to justify the development costs is very niche and small.|
Originally Posted by Ssyrie
This is literally the only reason I would support powerset respecs. Being able to keep badges that a new character would be locked out of. The anniversary badges should have been account wide badges.
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I do wish there is a way to transfer your badges to a new alt though. I think that might be a much easier way to cut development time down as a feature.
Now that I think about it, if the Devs can put in a mechanism that transfer your badges and create some very unique story arc for changing powersets it would be justifiable. Like Father Time reverses your experience and you are forced to go through unique challenges earning new powers along the way. You could tie it into a very original storyline. Or Crey stole your memories and mutated your powers. Something like that.
But, Red Name statement is "Unlikely." It's a step up from No, but hey. Not by much.
level 50s running around with no clue how to play their characters well will be excluded by the playerbase when ti comes to end-game content, especially the harder stuff.
People that get excluded will become frustrated with the game and stop playing, so the Devs get less money.
Now it won't just be individuals that have paid for this aswell that get excluded, but new players whos general game knowledge was quite low will also get excluded if they underperform because people will think they have paid for this.
Eventually a level of elitism evolves whereby people only trust playing with people they have been playing with a while. The playerbase and endgame become stagnant, more people leave and the game deterioates.
OK, so a fairly pessimistic and doom filled possibility, but one I can totally see happening, and just one of the many things they have to consider when thinking abou this.