Yes and no.
Basically, it just raises the soft-cap for this content. However, Defense-based sets will have a much easier time getting to the new soft-cap (and some sets won't be able to get there at all).
However, Defense-based sets still have very little else to build for, so they're still the same level of screwed there that they have been.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
You have nothing to worry about, your mandatory teammates will easily cover the gap with buffs.
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
Ice Armor can get its defenses far beyond the softcap, if Energy Absorption has high amounts of recharge and mobs to work off of.
Mains (Freedom) @Auroxis
Auroxis - Emp/Rad/Power Defender Pylon Video Soloing an AV
Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster
Ah, good to know, that actually is pretty encouraging as, at the moment defense sets are seeming a little less special from that aspect (actually, their trick is being able to focus elsewhere while others build for defense it seems like).
My Ice has only just hit 22 and SO's, at about 30% defense I wasn't sure how much EA does (though it looks like a great power) and I can tell with combat jump and maneuvers it's going to cap pretty easily.
"Fascinating. I'm not bored at all, I swear." -Kikuchiyo
It is funny how we (I know I do all the time) look at our builds and powers all on their own.
With the inherent teaming nature of this new content, applying the other teammates' powers really does cancel these worries, doesn't it...
Last night, I'm on an ITF and my SD/SS was around 78% defense and 300% damage buff... And it was glorious.
Of course, some of us do love to solo, but whatever... as relevant to I20 content... teamage is an inherent part of it.
Good to keep that in mind (again, I'm speaking to myself here, as well, hehe).
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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You hit the nail on the head about Defense sets. They can softcap with very little effort, so they have all their set bonus opportunities available for other things, where other sets are spending their bonus opportunities on Defense instead. A surprising number of people haven't grasped this yet.|
Originally Posted by Katten
(actually, their trick is being able to focus elsewhere while others build for defense it seems like).
My Ice has only just hit 22 and SO's, at about 30% defense I wasn't sure how much EA does (though it looks like a great power) and I can tell with combat jump and maneuvers it's going to cap pretty easily. |
My initial impression of Energy Absorption both from an Endurance gain and Defense gain standpoint was "That's it?" I'm sure once I have it six-slotted, it'll feel like a completely different power. Or at least I hope.
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Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
It is funny how we (I know I do all the time) look at our builds and powers all on their own.
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The best comics are still 10�!
My City of Heroes Blog Freedom Feature Article: "Going Rageless?"
If you only read one guide this year, make it this one.
Super Reflexes: the Golden Fox of power sets!
WARNING: I bold names.
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If you're on a team with buffs and debuffs, things will be just wonderful. The more, the merrier!|
Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
It is funny how we (I know I do all the time) look at our builds and powers all on their own. With the inherent teaming nature of this new content, applying the other teammates' powers really does cancel these worries, doesn't it...
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However, we've all gotten used to running content without a care in the world who we're teamed with, because it hasn't mattered much. Players locked into that self-sufficient mindset will still be great in pre-i19 material, but they'll find themselves a little further behind the curve with each new release. They'll still be able to farm away happily or run ITFs til they go blind, but the new content is going to require a degree of teamwork some players just won't be comfortable with.
To the OP, yes, defense-focused characters are primed to take a beating without additional support, either from their own powersets or from teammates. It became too easy to softcap and the new content is the reaction to that state of affairs.
I also think that building around the idea that you will get buffs and debuffs will sometimes get you in trouble. Basically, if you're thinking that the team will get you up to that 60% Defense, and you get on a team with no Def Buffs or -ToHit debuffs, then what do you do? I mean, what if your support teammates are a Kin, Sonic, or Thermal? Then you're still 15% shy of the new softcap.
So I don't think that trying to get part of the way there is a bad idea. Do you need to get to 60%? No. But 52% or so isn't bad.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
On the baf trial I took my soft capped fire tank...popped 7 lucks and was well over what I should have needed to be invincible...sad thing was the robots dropped me in less then 20 seconds
So will defense tanks have any issues?..yes...yes they will.
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Sounds like all Tankers will, then. Since you had decent resistance numbers to back that up.
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Originally Posted by Severe
On the baf trial I took my soft capped fire tank...popped 7 lucks and was well over what I should have needed to be invincible...sad thing was the robots dropped me in less then 20 seconds
So will defense tanks have any issues?..yes...yes they will. |
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
IMO the new mobs are horribly over powered if you arent rolling out with a high buff team. They seem gears to negate IO set bonuses for defense, regen and recharge, which also makes them instantly worse for SO based toons.
I am an ebil markeeter and will steal your moneiz ...correction stole your moneiz. I support keeping the poor down because it is impossible to make moneiz in this game.
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like you wont believe...the guards for the avs are very tohit capable.i said something to posi and the rest when i popped all those lucks and got no response to the incredible tohit value of these things..and literally there was only like 11 of them.|
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
Sounds like all Tankers will, then. Since you had decent resistance numbers to back that up.
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11 robots cut through over 200% defense..not to mention i had over 84% resistance
if ya aint done it then you'll be surprised on how little posi has made the tankers feel helpful in these trials. frankly it wasnt very fun at all.
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Are you referring to the Victoria's? |
Originally Posted by Severe
like you wont believe...the guards for the avs are very tohit capable.i said something to posi and the rest when i popped all those lucks and got no response to the incredible tohit value of these things..and literally there was only like 11 of them.
11 robots cut through over 200% defense..not to mention i had over 84% resistance if ya aint done it then you'll be surprised on how little posi has made the tankers feel helpful in these trials. frankly it wasnt very fun at all. |
If so, the defense debuffing power of those things is HUGE. One of them can debuff defense about as well as a whole SPAWN of Cimmy's. It's no surprise to me a crowd of them could tear you down, they can cascade fail you super fast.
Hold them, slow them, kite them, only slug it out if you really have to.
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Kill the bots quicker so they don't build up.
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Originally Posted by Severe
like you wont believe...the guards for the avs are very tohit capable.i said something to posi and the rest when i popped all those lucks and got no response to the incredible tohit value of these things..and literally there was only like 11 of them.
11 robots cut through over 200% defense..not to mention i had over 84% resistance if ya aint done it then you'll be surprised on how little posi has made the tankers feel helpful in these trials. frankly it wasnt very fun at all. |
yes..another issue
team make up!....without the right team its utter failure
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Originally Posted by Severe
yes..another issue
team make up!....without the right team its utter failure |
I always try to shoot for pentads:
1 scrapper
1 tanker
1 defender
1 blaster
1 controller
Season well with Epics (widows/crabs/khelds) I have seen no content to date that cannot be handled by balanced sets of the core five archetypes.
Looking hard att hings, I feel that some of the less-played arch's are going to be considerably more attractive: A Defender with damage procs in all attacks AND a hefty nuke?
Yes, please!
All the above applies equally to villain archetypes, as well.
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Go out of town for a week, and I come back to hear about this! So where has this been announced, and what is the new soft-cap? Number-wise, what would happen to something like an SO Ice tank?|
Originally Posted by Katten
I heard that the tohit values have been raised significantly in the newest incarnate content, does this basically mean Ice armor (and Super reflexes for that matter) are simply screwed, or is it no worse than anyone else?
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[edit] Read Fail: Didn't notice the OP say it was incarnate content. Nevermind, the odds of SO only tanks at that point are pretty small.
@Rylas
Kill 'em all. Let XP sort 'em out.
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No announcement, just an observation that some high-end opponents (mostly Praetorian types) have a base 64% to-hit, making the softcap against them 59%.
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Originally Posted by Rylas
Go out of town for a week, and I come back to hear about this! So where has this been announced, and what is the new soft-cap? Number-wise, what would happen to something like an SO Ice tank?
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So the toons that were previously rediculously overkilled for defense now become the "viable" guys (I have a DM/INV scrapper that hits ~62% S/L when Invince is saturated...sounds like I can now go from uncaring to "hey we got a fight").|
Originally Posted by Katie V
No announcement, just an observation that some high-end opponents (mostly Praetorian types) have a base 64% to-hit, making the softcap against them 59%.
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Overall, I'm a but bummed. I have tons of toons but had never made a Tanker to 50. I was just doing that now and the wind is out of my sails.
End Game- LVL 50 Scrapper-DM/INV
Ripjak- LVL 50 Defender-Rad/Rad
Extruder- LVL 50 Scrapper-DM/REG
Juicie- LVL 50 Blaster-ELEC/ELEC
Mind Sync- LVL 50 Controller-MIND/FF
I am challenged by it. I have committed to one Toon for 99% of my gaming in 2011, just to see how it goes. A Will/SS tank. I softcapped him to all but Psi, that at 35%+, and have been very nicely tanking for every team I run with.
I was already thinking about doing a second "damage" build on him. looks like this high end content might make a 3rd buildout specifically for i20 content a possibility as well. Since we will be dependent on each other so much more than before. Only on Master runs do I have to do anything besides get to a group, taunt, pull, FS, etc now. On Master runs, of course, it all changes. Sounds like most i20 content will be based around well built/run teams more than any one individual uber-buildout. What that means as far as how to build for that content, especially on a Willpower Tank, is yet to be seen. But it is great to see challenging stuff being thrown out. Even if I go from running the bestest shiniest happy taunt bot to becoming the semi-squishy better know what my team is doing by the second and watch how I do stuff guy.
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Exactly. It's the story behind the Avengers too, to face threats no single hero can handle alone.
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Originally Posted by Daemodand
Our characters are supposed to be superheroes and supervillains, so we expect them to be powerhouses all on their own (and they should be!) But Batman did make a good point when he said, "There are some challenges even we can't handle individually."
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Given all the VEATs, Shielders, Maneuvers, Dark Miasma, Steamy Mist, Force Fielders, and Empaths that are out there I'm not terribly concerned.
My Empath built for recharge with no defense bonuses whatsoever was running in the 30ish range at least. Anyone with actual defenses and a receiver of buffs will be higher.
Tanks aren't supposed to be unkillable, just a butload harder to kill than everyone else. And I'm pretty sure they still will be in i20.
I heard that the tohit values have been raised significantly in the newest incarnate content, does this basically mean Ice armor (and Super reflexes for that matter) are simply screwed, or is it no worse than anyone else?
"Fascinating. I'm not bored at all, I swear." -Kikuchiyo