Dark Control ? reality or myth!
By
Biospark,
Posted on: 2011-01-09 23:31 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
Not presently it's not. The future may or may not add such a set, but presently the safe money's on "Don't count on it."
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sounds like it could be nice
lots of troller-like powers in the defender set of dark though
Not true at this time. It is, however, suggested (with various mixes of powers) with some regularity.
Yes, I want to see it (with a Dark Assault pairing for Doms.)
Oh well looks like there will be no Dark/psy perma dom in my future 
If I recall correctly, I seem to remember this coming up at a Dev Q&A. The reason why it was so tricky was because most Dark sets already have controlling powers in them and they wanted to make something more that just Dark Miasma with a few more holds. Can't check for links at work though.
I'd love to see such sets in the future though.
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There was a dev post a while (like, a year or so?) back, I wanna say it was from BAB... If I remember correctly, it amounted to something along the lines of "Not going to happen. Ever.".
But with any luck, they'll change their mind, because I'd love to have it, myself. Of course, Dark Blast for Blasters would be nice, too. >.>
I doubt it's really "rumors," but there's always been wishful thinking on this topic.
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Just my two cents on this. While it would open up a few possible combos, Dark Miasma is already so control oriented that I'm not sure its worth the rehash. Personally I'd rather they spend time on control (and any other) sets that head into totally new territory, the way Shields and Dual Pistols did. Especially since we just got Elec Control, which by my count is the 6th time we've received that particular element in a set--Blast, Manipulation, Armor, Melee, Assault, and now Control. That's just my opinion though. Now if it was Water, Insect, Time, Planar, Luck, or really anything else I'd be all over it.
I don't think a dark control set would ever happen. However, I really want a fire/dark miasma troller and a fire/dark assault dom 
I would like to see more proliferation of what they already have as opposed to giving us something new, especially considering we have side switching.
thermal for defenders
fire blast for defenders
pain for defenders
emp for corrupters
dark blast for blasters
poison for controllers, corrupters, and defenders
energy aura for tankers and scrappers
super strength for scrappers
etc...
1) Get the devs to proliferate Dark Miasma to Controllers
2) Color Mind Control black
3) ???
4) FEAR ME!
I wanna pull a Terrorize/Fearsome Stare/Invoke Panic combo just for the lulz.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Heck, at this point they can simply port Dark Miasma Buff to Dark Miasma Control, add a damage component to some attacks and call it done. Then all they need to do is to lock out Controllers from choosing Dark Miasma/Dark Miasma.
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But... fear... |
Originally Posted by Zombie Man
Heck, at this point they can simply port Dark Miasma Buff to Dark Miasma Control, add a damage component to some attacks and call it done. Then all they need to do is to lock out Controllers from choosing Dark Miasma/Dark Miasma.
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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I read that post, and will try to dig it up for reference, but HE (BaBs/Castle/Posi ??) did not say that it would not happen. He explained why it was more difficult than just making one set for Dark Control. The post explained how they needed to work out the logistics not just of one set but of FOUR sets ; Dark Assault, Dark Control, Dark Blast and Dark Manipulation.|
Originally Posted by Scirion
There was a dev post a while (like, a year or so?) back, I wanna say it was from BAB... If I remember correctly, it amounted to something along the lines of "Not going to happen. Ever.".
But with any luck, they'll change their mind, because I'd love to have it, myself. Of course, Dark Blast for Blasters would be nice, too. >.> |
Whatever they are planning in the future is still unkown, but IF they do it, you can count on Blasters, Dominators, and Controllers all getting a taste of Darkness.
Honestly the biggest stumbling block is going to be Dark Miasma for controllers since it already feels very much like a control set, it may be an issue to port it over. My opinion is to just do it. Sets like Gravity will just love it. Fire/Darks will be the "NEW" tanks of the decade.
DO IT !!!!
And here you go:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showt...ration&page=11
SUNSTORM said on page 11 of the linked thread;
Actually Synapse and I have been puzzling over the dark sets. Just for fun, I'll shed some light on the subject.
So, lets start this with a riddle, since the explanation is just as incomprehensible. Why does Dark Miasma overlapping Dark Control powers make a straight port of Dark Manipulation problematic?
The explanation is, there are a couple powersets that would be sharing an interesting combination of powers. For example, Controllers want Dark Control and Dark Miasma, except Dark Miasma is already a very control heavy set which would supply a lot of Dark Control's powers. Combining Dark/Dark this way could lead to a lot of overlap.
Dominators would want Dark Control and Dark Assault, so Dark Assault would have to be careful not to include control powers from Dark Blast or Dark melee.
Blasters are easier, however the powers that go to blasters would likely be included in Dark Assault, which goes opposite dark control.
Then there are the general AT wide no-no's. Such as: giving armor powers to non-armored classes, or overlapping powers already in patron pools.
So in the end, it's not designing one powerset. It's designing 3 different powersets:
Dark Control/Dark Miasma for Controllers
Dark Control/Dark Assault for Dominators
Dark Blast/Dark Manipulation for Blasters
Well, that's enough "dark" for several posts. And no, nothing is in the works yet.
BIOSPARK :: DARKTHORN :: SKYGUARD :: WILDMAGE
HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF
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This is what I don't agree with. Controllers already have secondaries as control heavy as dark, they just do not come with a pet. Dark has 6 control powers, HT, TP, FS, PG, BH, and it's pet DS. Storm has 7 control powers with gale, SS, FR, Hurr, TC, Tor, and lightning storm, though most are based around knockback. Trick arrow is also control base with 6, or 7 if compare flash arrow to smoke.
| Honestly the biggest stumbling block is going to be Dark Miasma for controllers since it already feels very much like a control set, it may be an issue to port it over. My opinion is to just do it. Sets like Gravity will just love it. Fire/Darks will be the "NEW" tanks of the decade. |
Dirges
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Which is why I say to just port it over, Pet and All.|
Originally Posted by Dirges
This is what I don't agree with. Controllers already have secondaries as control heavy as dark, they just do not come with a pet. Dark has 6 control powers, HT, TP, FS, PG, BH, and it's pet DS. Storm has 7 control powers with gale, SS, FR, Hurr, TC, Tor, and lightning storm, though most are based around knockback. Trick arrow is also control base with 6, or 7 if compare flash arrow to smoke.
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But to be fair, Storm summoning is more about soft-control than Dark Miasma (which has a Hold, AoE Fear AND a pet that spams Holds and Heals). Dark Miasma (in its current form) would be the #1 controlling secondary. I would bet Money that Dark Miasma for Controllers comes over sans Pet.
Probably changed to something like DARKSTORM : A Pseudo pet like Lightning Cloud that does damage and some kind of debuff.
BIOSPARK :: DARKTHORN :: SKYGUARD :: WILDMAGE
HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF
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I can agree with this. I'm currently leveling an Earth/Storm controller and the amount of control available to that combination is rather silly at times. Just a few examples of the overlap in the two sets:|
Originally Posted by Dirges
This is what I don't agree with. Controllers already have secondaries as control heavy as dark, they just do not come with a pet. Dark has 6 control powers, HT, TP, FS, PG, BH, and it's pet DS. Storm has 7 control powers with gale, SS, FR, Hurr, TC, Tor, and lightning storm, though most are based around knockback. Trick arrow is also control base with 6, or 7 if compare flash arrow to smoke.
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Earthquake: AoE Knockdown, -Defense, -Accuracy
Freezing Rain: AoE Knockdown, -Defense, -Resist
Stalagmites: AoE Stun
Thunder Clap: AoE Stun
Quicksand: AoE slow
Snow Storm: AoE slow
I've found that when I (just for giggles) sling everything I've got at a spawn, nothing can do anything. Even bosses are wandering around stunned (for the brief time they're able to stand). So yeah, I don't buy the excuse of Dark Miasma being too much control for Controllers. I could maybe get behind not porting over the pet for Controllers, but the rest I think would be fine.
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If they ditched the pet it would probably be replaced with Chill of the Night, ie the PBAOE -tohit -dmg debuff that the dark servant has, and originally what the dark servant was before it became a pet.
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Originally Posted by Biospark
I would bet Money that Dark Miasma for Controllers comes over sans Pet.
Probably changed to something like DARKSTORM : A Pseudo pet like Lightning Cloud that does damage and some kind of debuff. |
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That, combined with shadow fall would create a HUGE amount of psuedo defense for them. I realize that dark already has a bit of that, but since fluffy can't be told where to go, controlling who gets that debuff isn't as easy as a chill of the night port would be. Fire/darks could afk in melee with TG on auto on boss and come back with everything dead and the player at full.
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Originally Posted by DreadShinobi
If they ditched the pet it would probably be replaced with Chill of the Night, ie the PBAOE -tohit -dmg debuff that the dark servant has, and originally what the dark servant was before it became a pet.
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But I still want a fire/dark with current fluffy |
Originally Posted by Pyro_Master_NA
That, combined with shadow fall would create a HUGE amount of psuedo defense for them. I realize that dark already has a bit of that, but since fluffy can't be told where to go, controlling who gets that debuff isn't as easy as a chill of the night port would be. Fire/darks could afk in melee with TG on auto on boss and come back with everything dead and the player at full.
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Take him villain and be some sort of demonic....thing.
First, Dark Miasma is already control heavy.
Second, the Developers have chosen (rightfully so) to work on introducing sets that offer some new type of mechanic for the given AT. Electric Control emphasized -endurance soft control and introduced chain-mez powers. Dual Blades introduced combos. Dual Pistols has the ammo swap mechanic and very unique animations. What would Dark Control do that was completely new to control sets and wasn't just control/ToHit debuff versus ToHit debuff/control-- which is exactly what Dark Miasma is?
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Just some numbers to think about:|
Originally Posted by Pyro_Master_NA
That, combined with shadow fall would create a HUGE amount of psuedo defense for them. I realize that dark already has a bit of that, but since fluffy can't be told where to go, controlling who gets that debuff isn't as easy as a chill of the night port would be. Fire/darks could afk in melee with TG on auto on boss and come back with everything dead and the player at full.
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Hurricane provides -30% to hit
Earthquake is -10% to hit
Steamy Mist is 3.75% defense
The above numbers are all base values assuming no slotting at all. You see where I'm going with this?
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Originally Posted by JuliusSeizure
First, Dark Miasma is already control heavy.
Second, the Developers have chosen (rightfully so) to work on introducing sets that offer some new type of mechanic for the given AT. Electric Control emphasized -endurance soft control and introduced chain-mez powers. Dual Blades introduced combos. Dual Pistols has the ammo swap mechanic and very unique animations. What would Dark Control do that was completely new to control sets and wasn't just control/ToHit debuff versus ToHit debuff/control-- which is exactly what Dark Miasma is? |
As to your second point, it's not always about flashy new mechanics. Sometimes players want something because it allows them to do something new with an AT in terms of concept. Right now Controller and Dom players have zero options for Dark-oriented characters unless they pick a powerset, color it black, and just say it's dark energy. But everyone they team with will just think they're a [insert control set here] with customized coloring because after all, that's exactly what they are. Not quite the same thing and nowhere near as satisfying to play.
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Can you name a powerset that's been released since issue 5 that doesn't have some unique mechanic attached to it?|
Originally Posted by Steel_Shaman
As to your second point, it's not always about flashy new mechanics.
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Originally Posted by Steel_Shaman
In reference to Dark Miasma being control heavy, see my earlier post about Earth/Storm controllers and the amount of overlap they have.
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Originally Posted by JuliusSeizure
Can you name a powerset that's been released since issue 5 that doesn't have some unique mechanic attached to it?
Well, given that those are both Legacy sets developed in Beta, you have pretty much reinforced my point. |
I think you missed my point, which was "Powersets don't have to introduce new mechanics to be interesting to players." The Devs may feel differently, but they aren't the ones making the request.
And why do Earth and Storm being powersets the game started with reinforce your point at all? You said "Dark Miasma is already control heavy," which I took to mean you thought that was the main reason it shouldn't be ported over to Controllers. I gave an example of a powerset combination Controllers have right now that has a great deal of overlap and is also pretty control heavy. When in the game's life cycle the powersets were introduced has no bearing on the discussion.
I keep hearing rumors of a dark control set for Doms and Trollers is this true ?