Buying common salvage with tickets
1) I don't speak for the market forums or anyone else for that matter. I speak for myself. I think it is a badly thought out idea that would adversely affect the game. My detailed reasons stated previously. I believe that random drops (or common rolls for AE tickets) are better for the game as a whole.
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- Random drops are always more desirable than chosen purchases.
- Even though the drops might never make it to the market due to being "minor value", players should continue to get them even if it is a frustrating waste of time to some because the market might get the unused pieces.
The first point is entirely subjective. We disagree.
The whole point of the original suggestion is to eliminate the frustration of the second. The second point represents a needless grind to those that do not use the market and brings me back to being forced to Market PVP if I want a specific piece of common salvage.
If the market doesn't see the results of the random rolls, then the market hasn't lost anything. At that point, why oppose the suggestion? Either those rolls are making their way to the market, being used crafting, or being sold to the vendors. We disagree as to what degree that the commons are getting to the market. I personally don't think a lot of the more usable common salvage is getting to the market. While the less used just sits there or gets sold to the stores.
2) I don't care about your rep one way or the other. I haven't added or subtracted from it. It is turned off. if the rep points were signed you would know who did them,. if not then why suggest it is an orchestrated effort, apart from to further the next point ?
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That post was made in hopes that people would start discussing the suggestion rather than make attacks. I am also trying to understand why people are raising such a fuss over what they consider "not valuable".
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
You might as well forget objections to the ways you can store your drops since the new email system will give you your own private account wide storage space. I imagine it'll be limited but if you know what you need you won't have to fill it with bloat.
20 pieces E-mailed to yourself is limited but certainly not insignificant.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
You might as well forget objections to the ways you can store your drops since the new email system will give you your own private account wide storage space. I imagine it'll be limited but if you know what you need you won't have to fill it with bloat.
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Unless I know what I'm getting as a recipe drop, how am I supposed to store it ahead of time?
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
It kind of boggles my mind that some people are so opposed to the market that they won't even place an overnight bid on some common salvage. At the end of the day, though, I highly doubt that allowing the purchase of common salvage with AE tickets is going to cause the playerbase-at-large to suddenly start behaving rationally and obtaining salvage at the lowest possible cost.
A couple of hypothetical reasons for the devs' decision not to allow specific purchases of commons:
1. Like PvP, the market isn't compulsory - but I bet the devs would like you to use it, just as they'd like you to PvP.
2. The ability for lowbies to make a good bit of inf out of a lucky salvage drop is a bonus for casual players and people who don't have access to outside inf reserves.
3. 20 AE tickets is such a trivial amount that it paints common salvage as being essentially worthless. If you can obtain exactly what you need in about 2 minutes of game time, then is there really any point in requiring it in the first place?
The problem stems from a phrase that often gets thrown at people that suggest changes like this: Random means random.
Unless I know what I'm getting as a recipe drop, how am I supposed to store it ahead of time? |
The IO system seems to be partially designed to be dependent upon a larger pool of resources then most people get on one character. If you feel the need to IO out you use the provided resources.
1. Like PvP, the market isn't compulsory - but I bet the devs would like you to use it, just as they'd like you to PvP.
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2. The ability for lowbies to make a good bit of inf out of a lucky salvage drop is a bonus for casual players and people who don't have access to outside inf reserves.
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Given that the current situation is 8 times N rolls where N is an unknown number, it could be had for as little as 8 tickets. Over time that number is higher though. Only the developers have the stats of what is rolled vs what gets sold on the market.
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
The IO system seems to be partially designed to be dependent upon a larger pool of resources then most people get on one character. If you feel the need to IO out you use the provided resources.
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Additional suggestions were to keep the random rolls in addition to the fixed price suggestion, and to add options to also have random rolls of uncommon and rare salvage.
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
Sure the market isn't compulsory and the devs would like us to use it. However they have given the player base several "outs" already in terms of both PVP and the market.
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Again, you are bringing the market into the equation. Again, the original suggestion has to do with AE Tickets, not the market. On the flip side, a player could use the suggestion in this thread to buy a luck charm to sell on the market if they choose to do so. At that point it would be a win for the market as activity occurs. |
Given that the current situation is 8 times N rolls where N is an unknown number, it could be had for as little as 8 tickets. Over time that number is higher though. Only the developers have the stats of what is rolled vs what gets sold on the market. |
20 pieces E-mailed to yourself is limited but certainly not insignificant.
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'Most' people seem to play predominantly on one or two servers. For the US folks there are 11, each with 12 slots.
Even using just half of those that is 60 'bank' characters at level that can be rolled and parked.
Assuming level 1 for these 60 bank characters.
That's 600 enhancements
180 salvage
60 recipes
plus 60 spots on the Auction house that could be used
For 66 month plus vets these become
480 salvage
360 recipes
plus 120 spots on the AH.
If you play on only a single server, and have 10 servers available for this trick, then double the above.
I would say that is easily enough inventory for most individuals need, and it takes only minor work to get it.
(Though book keeping would be required to keep things straight for sure)
Sorry EU folks, you don't get to use this trick anywhere near as much.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
I don't believe somebody needs to be anti-market, or anti-marketeering, to be behind the OP's idea.
This is about reducing hassle costs associated with IOing out characters. Redoubtable's concerns about making it "too easy" reflect a concern about pricing. Pricing issues are fixable, and not a reason to jettison the idea of allowing players to pick a specific common salvage item, when buying them with AE tickets.
I wouldn't care if the price of common salvage ended up being relatively high when you got to pick what you were purchasing, as long as it wasn't astronomical. And, I know I'd IO up earlier in my characters' careers if it was less of a pain in the a## to do it.
Speaking of hassle costs, I have no desire to use the email system as a kind of storage system. I'm guessing a lot of players would feel the same way. Why would somebody voluntarily choose such a tedious and annoyingly complex way of organizing their gear, if there was a less tedious and complex choice available?
What it boils down to, for me, is that I'd rather have the option to play longer to earn tickets to purchase specific common salvage items than get a cheaper price on random rolls for common salvage, and then carry excess salvage to the market and/or use the email system to store items. Playing is fun. Setting up and running a kind of warehouse, or Fed Exing items between locations and dropping items into the market screen is boring.
Worrying about an item being trivial doesn't necessitate a market concern. There come a point where something is so easy to obtain it serves no purpose and should probably be removed to reduce bloat. There may be a market concern with this request but it's not part of every point of disinterest.
I don't like this idea for one reason:
1. It gives players an even greater incentive to use AE.
I'm one of those players that feel AE should be secondary to the regular PvE game, and giving players the ability to obtain the exact salvage they require from AE would be a step against this design.
Ack forgot one key factor, personal storage with E-mailing becomes very significant and limited mainly by how much you wish to fiddle with it.
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'Most' people seem to play predominantly on one or two servers. For the US folks there are 11, each with 12 slots.
I would say that is easily enough inventory for most individuals need, and it takes only minor work to get it. (Though book keeping would be required to keep things straight for sure) |
What it boils down to, for me, is that I'd rather have the option to play longer to earn tickets to purchase specific common salvage items than get a cheaper price on random rolls for common salvage, and then carry excess salvage to the market and/or use the email system to store items. Playing is fun. Setting up and running a kind of warehouse, or Fed Exing items between locations and dropping items into the market screen is boring.
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I don't like this idea for one reason:
1. It gives players an even greater incentive to use AE. I'm one of those players that feel AE should be secondary to the regular PvE game, and giving players the ability to obtain the exact salvage they require from AE would be a step against this design. |
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
Not really. All it does is gives more options to those that do run AE missions.
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With your suggestion, I no longer have to guess at a price by using the market or place a bid and wait or pay the IWANTNAO price. Instead I just get all my salvage from tickets which are generated from AE.
Players find the path of least resistance, and AE/Tickets would be that path for salvage.
Yes, painfully. You are so blinded by your market bias that you are failing to understand a basic premise here: I could care less what happens at the market. Marketers like yourself have so poisoned the well that I don't care what happens to anyone's niche market. I've turned to other places to get what I need when it comes to uncommon or rare salvage.
You fail in logic. I can't buy what isn't for sale. A fact that I'm aware of. However you fail to understand that I could care less about the market and the fact that I am not talking about the market. I am talking about the AE Vending system alone. The market can proceed on its merry way in peace. I have a solution to what I've said I feel is a problem: common salvage costs more than uncommon salvage within the AE vending system. Why, yes, I did know that. You are avoiding the point: multiple rolls raises the cost of common salvage. |
Tempstra 50 Rad/Dark Defender/War'nt 50 Warshade/Heliosa 50 Fire/Rad Controller//Captain Blue Balls 50 Fire/Ice Blaster/Pinky Swear 50 Dark/Dark ScrapperMind Dreamer 50 Mind/Kinetics Controller/Rex Bubbles 50 Illusion/Forcefield Controller/Cool Wind 50 Ice/Storm Controller/Lil' Miss Dangerous 50 Gravity/Kinetics Controller/Observationist 50 Illusion/Empathy Controller/Kansas City Brawler 50 Stone/Fire Tank/Hades Exhibit One 50 Dark/Robots MM
I honestly think Snowies plan would help alot to buy common salvage does take around 80 tix to do, and the random rolls are really pointless because you don't know which one to roll to which salvage you want since its from 10-25 30-35 and 40-50 i believe and its pointless to do that.. 8 tics for that.. i don't like that, i completely support Snowies suggestion.. He does have a very good arguement.. btw guys read before you post it does seem that you are losing because you are not understanding it.
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So, even though I WANT something I know that getting the WANT might not in the best interest of the game.
I honestly think Snowies plan would help alot to buy common salvage does take around 80 tix to do, and the random rolls are really pointless because you don't know which one to roll to which salvage you want since its from 10-25 30-35 and 40-50 i believe and its pointless to do that.. 8 tics for that.. i don't like that, i completely support Snowies suggestion.. He does have a very good arguement.. btw guys read before you post it does seem that you are losing because you are not understanding it.
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and it is pretty easy to distinguish which type of salvage you need to roll.
Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
you've been playing for how long and don't know what level ranges the salvage is in?
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this is info that anyone can find out. it even gets easier if you have the recipe you want to make. that tells you what level range to roll in. as far as type of salvage, it's pretty self explanatory.
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and honestly, if you think that 8 tickets per random roll is to much then you have some serious issues.
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in one AE mission you can make enough tickets to fill your salvage at least 2 times. thats 100-like 140(at least) pieces depending on how much salvage your 50 can hold. you do not get that running a regular mission. even at low levels you can hold a good amount of salvage.
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Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters
Hi:
I like the idea of being able to get recipes through merits, which allows me to avoid the hideous over-pricing of some recipes; of course as some would say, as long as someone will pay that much for them, they will be priced as such..way to go Ebay and ******!
Just as recipes are being hideously priced and manipulated, salvage is no different and subject to price gauging, of course as long as folks are willing to pay such amounts for them, the practice will continue.
I had always hoped for a game alternate to control or limit how bad the gauging can get to be, for us players who play casually, have not so good luck, or do not buy influence from busineses such as ******* or Ebay. I feel the merit award system does limit som eof this, after all just do a few TFs and you can have any recipe you want wit the exception of purples; would be nice if you could buy purples as well.
With regards to random rolls at AE for recipes, its a waste for me, I always get some lame status effect recipe, and of course of a level I do not want. I would really like to see AE have tickets exchanged for specific recipes and salvage, any type common, rare or what not. Obviously the amount of tickets one could store would have to be more 9999, so reasonable exchange rates could be set.
But anyway, I am for allowing commons to be acquired through AE tickets.
Hugs
Stormfront
Hi:
I like the idea of being able to get recipes through merits, which allows me to avoid the hideous over-pricing of some recipes; of course as some would say, as long as someone will pay that much for them, they will be priced as such..way to go Ebay and ******! Just as recipes are being hideously priced and manipulated, salvage is no different and subject to price gauging, of course as long as folks are willing to pay such amounts for them, the practice will continue. I had always hoped for a game alternate to control or limit how bad the gauging can get to be, for us players who play casually, have not so good luck, or do not buy influence from busineses such as ****** or Ebay. I feel the merit award system does limit som eof this, after all just do a few TFs and you can have any recipe you want wit the exception of purples; would be nice if you could buy purples as well. With regards to random rolls at AE for recipes, its a waste for me, I always get some lame status effect recipe, and of course of a level I do not want. I would really like to see AE have tickets exchanged for specific recipes and salvage, any type common, rare or what not. Obviously the amount of tickets one could store would have to be more 9999, so reasonable exchange rates could be set. But anyway, I am for allowing commons to be acquired through AE tickets. Hugs Stormfront |
here is the thing, if you(generic) are paying high prices for anything at the market you(generic) are STUPID for either not placing a bid and waiting a few mins or not taking advantage of a good thing and selling your(generic) unwanted anythings at the market. place it up for 10-15, or more if you(generic don't want to chance it, and collect. sometimes it may take a few mins, but oh well. go do something else and come back when you're(generic) ready.
I've been getting a ton of negative rep (-200) with comments that amount to "ahahaha", collectively the market supporters in this thread have shown an abysmal reaction (you'd think I asked for the market to be eliminated given the reactions), and I've basically been told to use the system that I've repeatedly said I didn't want any part of.
Tell me is that the reaction you want to foster, Cat? Or do the market supporters just want to bully a suggestion because it deals with "minor inf"?
2) I don't care about your rep one way or the other. I haven't added or subtracted from it. It is turned off. if the rep points were signed you would know who did them,. if not then why suggest it is an orchestrated effort, apart from to further the next point ?
There has been clear attempts at 'Poisoning the Well' (in terms of the logical fallacy) and they have entirely emanated from you. This last post contains further examples.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617