Things that are more difficult redside, and hence more fun.

There's a little bit of a difference though - Praetoria exports tyranny, Primal Earth exports freedom

There's a very good Godwin example that could be used too

Regardless of what you think of the situation, your motives for invading Praetorian Earth are identical to Emperor Cole's motives for invading Primal Earth. You both want to impose your values on another dimension.

And yes, I know you're going to claim that your values are better than his. But he thinks the same thing about you.

So there would be nothing wrong, for instance, with a bunch of people from one country invading another based on the moral beliefs of their leader vs. the other country's leader, despite the fact that most people who live there are either ignorant of the trouble or living quite happily?

So it's perfectly fine for group A to start a war that has the potential to cause serious harm to innocent people just to get at group B because they disagree with how they run their country? (And yes, I'm aware that this is two different realities, and not countries, I'm simplifying the debate somewhat)

He, of course, is totally wrong

Now don't make be Godwin this

If the cause is bringing freedom in place of tyranny, then yes - it is justified - freedom is a basic right for everyone.

Is it still freedom to the people who's lives you are making worse by attacking where they live? Is it still freedom for the people who get caught in the crossfire and die because you were unwilling to find another solution?

No matter how 'noble', the ends do not always justify the means.

It's up to Tyrant to prevent a war by stepping down

Is that your way of saying that it's up to the good people to incite a war in the first place?

If Emperor Cole steps down, then the world gets overrun by the Devouring Earth, and everyone dies.

If you launch a full scale war to force Emperor Cole to step down, many innocents will die in the crossfire which you started, and unless you quickly supply an immense force of protective supers in their dimension, everyone will die due to the DE. And if you do supply such a force, then our own dimension will be at the mercy of the myriad of other threats we face.

Edit: And, proof positive that people will die in the crossfire: Siren's Call

If you do nothing, the people of Praetoria continue to live happily in a utopia.

Okay... That doesn't mean they don't hit any softer than I said.

Hm. That certainly seems like a lot, there. Though the Riders "flee" from battle, they don't resurrect. My point with that example is that the challenges in Redside are a near-constant uphill climb. You never get a chance to really feel powerful on your own. It's jsut "Ope, I beat this EB, now I have to move on to the next grind to another one..." Storywise, you're actually doing MORE GOOD for the Isles by wiping these monsters out than any evil you as a character can do.

Actually, they attacked us first, and tried to steal our stuff. They most certainly hurt our innocent citizens long before we set our sights on them.

No, we'd be there to protect Praetoria until the numbers of Praetorian superpowered people recovered from Tyrant's mass-murder program.

I think the idea is to be more surgical with the attacks - for example, I doubt it'll invovle throwing Rikti motherships at Nova Praetoria

Except for the thousands being murdered?


Seriously, defending Tyrant is like those people who try and argue that the Empire was right, and the Rebels were wrong

I'm defending the innocents that get killed and the people who are merely protecting their homes because they know what's at stake if they lose and the Devouring Earth cannot be contained.

Cole is also, arguably, doing what he thinks is right by trying to protect people from this very thing, even if his methods might be wrong. And in what dictionary does 'disappear' mean killed? Your logic of "Well, some people died so clearly we should risk the death of an entire reality and possibly our own even though the large majority of people are perfectly safe and happy" is just as disconcerting.

The willingness to risk the death of billions because of the possible deaths of thousands is in no way heroic or just.

www.dictionary.com?

"To cause (someone) to disappear, especially by kidnapping or murder."


The DE threat is being overestimated - which strangely enough really suits Tyrant - a lot

How do you figure? We know Hamidon Pasalima is much more powerful in ϒ β 9-6 than he is here. We also know that the DE have overrun most of Praetorian Earth due to the much earlier use of nuclear weaponry on their world.

Just a hunch - there's something about Tyrant and the Hamidon that doesn't quite add up

Useful against the Seers

EDIT: Go read Tyrant's bio again - there's something there that's not quite right

I said Anarchism

from Dictionary.com

1. a doctrine urging the abolition of government or governmental restraint as the indispensable condition for full social and political liberty.

2. the methods or practices of anarchists, as the use of violence to undermine government

specifically definition 2 which I bolded.

use of violence to undermine government, whether you like it or not Emperor Cole has established a government for Praetoria. By working with the Resistance you will be attempting to undermine that government. Making you an Anarchist.

I truly hope that the going rogue missions aren't clealry labeled as to which actions will cause shifts in which direction.

No, because fighting Tyrant is about changing the government of Praetoria, not removing all government from Praetoria.

I guess them being refered to "clearly marked missions" won't make you too happy?

Based on the description for this mission, the continuity seems to be that we investigate a signal first, then they come to Primal Earth. Those missions aren't given out in any specific order, but Tina should know the designation of Praetorian Earth if you had already done the Praetorian War arc.

Where in that definition was the word "all" used, exactly?

The Devs have already explicitly stated that the Resistance and Loyalist factions are to morality what Pichu is to Pikachu: A retconned "Pre" stage.

A Resistance member will eventually become a Hero. A Loyalist will eventually become a Villain. Personally, I speculate this change will happen once your Praetorian finds out about Primal Earth.

It's disappointing for me, but more than one person feels this is fair and how it should be, so I'm just accepting it.

Still, it feels like the Devs answering their own rhetorical question. :/

The bit where the word "anarchy" means "without rule/government"

According to Positron at Hero Con, you can start making your moral choice in the tutorial, and then have a final choice just before you leave Praetoria - so even though the end of the 1-20 content will show Tyrant = evil, Resistance = good, that won't be obvious at the start.
For example, the Syndicate works very well as a game mechanic to disguise the reality of Tyrant's rule - so it's possible that your first few missions once you join the Praetorian Police would be against genuine criminals, so you'd get a false impression that you were on the "right" side.
But as you level up and rise through the ranks, you'd start getting more neutral missions - like after you'd proved yourself against the Syndicate, you might get a mission against the Resistance, althought they wouldn't be flagged as the Resistance - you'd go into it thinking it was just another operation against real criminals, but in-mission text or clues would show you that there was more to it than that - like you'd hear or find somehting that put your role in the Praetorian Police into a less perfect light, and make you wonder about what your superiors were telling you and so on.

So I'm pretty sure the early levels are going to be quite fluid when it comes to choosing a side - like you could have a mission to capture a Resistance member, but with the option to let them escape too - so you could either carry out your orders without question, or try and balance your duty with your conscience.

And for the final choice, when you have to leave Praetoria, you'd make it based on what you'd learnt - you'd have found out the turth about the horror of Tyrant's dictatorship, but you can still decide that it's a "good" thing, and that extending his rule to Primal Earth is the "right" thing to do - or you could deicde to do the real right thing, and desert from the Praetorian Police, and show up on Primal Earth as a Vigilante.

It shoudln't be - CoH is a comicbook game, so when you're sent to investigate an altenative world ruled by a guy called Tyrant, you shouldn't really expect him to be a good guy

If it was rhetorical, then it's ok to provide the answer