We had real butter for tea.....
By
Blue Rabbit,
Posted on: 2009-05-02 24:24 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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If these threads and posts upset you, then don't read them?
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I love hearing this. It makes me all warm and fuzzy when I tell someone what I think of them, their thoughts, their face, their religion, their very existence, etc, and get this in return.
Technically I could then respond with the exact same phrase and cause a universal divide by zero paradox as the two opposing sides become locked into a say/read/respond loop that tears open reality as we know it, and replaces the whole lot with fire and cream.
I don't do it because I don't like warm cream.
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*sputters warm cream all over the monitor*
Well, that's the last time I'll try and swallow that. It's vile, it is.
Rabbits & Hares:Blue (Mind/Emp Controller)Maroon (Rad/Thermal Corruptor)and one of each AT all at 50
MA Arcs: Apples of Contention - 3184; Zen & Relaxation - 35392; Tears of Leviathan - 121733 | All posts are rated "R" for "R-r-rrrrr, baby!"|Now, and this is very important... do you want a hug? COH Faces @Blue Rabbit
There's a thought that made me chuckle the other day.
Yeah somethings in this game aren't great...
...but it could be a lot worse...you could be playing Age of Conan...they're only just getting stuff that should have been in the game since launch along with servers shutting down...now THAT looks bad and an MMO can never shake the reputation it gains at launch. Age of Conan isn't bad now BUT because it's launch was horrendously crappy (I know, I was there) it's forever going to be 'that crappy Conan MMO' unless they somehow pull a miracle.
Badge Earned: Wing Clipper
A real showstopper!
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<--- is getting slightly fed up listening to people moan now 
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It's falling on deaf ears here..
Fury
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<--- is getting slightly fed up listening to people moan now
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It's falling on deaf ears here..
Fury
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Clearly it isn't, or you wouldn't be posting in this thread.
If you're happy with the state of the game development, then fine - I'm happy for you.
Proud member of FOXBASE ALPHA and coalition associates.
Hero 50's - 25
Villain 50's - 1
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*sputters warm cream all over the monitor*
Well, that's the last time I'll try and swallow that. It's vile, it is.
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Oh my Gods, you bukkake'd your monitor! 
Chairman of the Charity of Pain; accepting donations of blood and guts.
Prophet of the Creamy Truth; "If it's empty, fill it with cream."
I don't know what that is, but it sounds vile...
Rabbits & Hares:Blue (Mind/Emp Controller)Maroon (Rad/Thermal Corruptor)and one of each AT all at 50
MA Arcs: Apples of Contention - 3184; Zen & Relaxation - 35392; Tears of Leviathan - 121733 | All posts are rated "R" for "R-r-rrrrr, baby!"|Now, and this is very important... do you want a hug? COH Faces @Blue Rabbit
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I don't know what that is, but it sounds vile...
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Google is your friend. On second thoughts don't go near google step away from the computer and run. 
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...now THAT looks bad and an MMO can never shake the reputation it gains at launch.
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That could of been what Jack Emmert meant by "You are what you are at launch" and then onto something about looking after the customers you've got. Either way without a better poot poot I couldn't touch AoC.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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i want to play a widow, i should be able from the start.
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But that's the whole point of an Epic Archetype. It's supposed to be unlocked. As a treat so to say.
I want, doesn't get. 
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if you didn't cut the post, you did not post this.
i said it should be from the beginning later on, before that i said players should not be limited on enjoyment, which is exactly this.
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I don't know what that is, but it sounds vile...
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJBeC4TUNpo
...
What?
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i want to play a widow, i should be able from the start.
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But that's the whole point of an Epic Archetype. It's supposed to be unlocked. As a treat so to say.
I want, doesn't get.
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if you didn't cut the post, you did not post this.
i said it should be from the beginning later on, before that i said players should not be limited on enjoyment, which is exactly this.
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Look. I can tell you're not very old, so you might have not noticed yet that the more effort it takes to get things, the more value they usually have to people.
CoH/V is supposed to be a game, and games have these things called rules, which you have to follow to progress. If you remove the rules, the game becomes a sandbox instead of a game. And this will drive away all players except those who are looking for a completely effortless sandbox.
For example, leveling up being so easy now makes all the effort people made in the early issues worth considerably less to many of them, and clearly some people have been wondering if it was worth it.
Obviously since you now can get all your new shiny powers in a day, you can't appreciate how this might offend the people who spent 6 months getting their chars to the level cap.
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Obviously since you now can get all your new shiny powers in a day, you can't appreciate how this might offend the people who spent 6 months getting their chars to the level cap.
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It's not about offending i don't think. it's just... shortchanging the game.
I think the devs had the Power building side of the game pretty much right (in one sense) on day one. I never agreed with global nerfs or Ed firstly commercially speaking and secondly because they took away somethin that made this game unique, yet eminently playable.
They could have balanced up not down and in fact, given the power levels you can now attain, i question if balance was ever the reason for Ed and GN.
My point is, I think, that to fully power up was (barring fairly rare at the time power leveling)you played the game.
You went through the arcs, you developed your character as your on line persona as opposed to a model you are playing to get to 50 as fast as you can.
It was just purer then.
The overall nature seemed to be calmer and more friendly.
Farming was rare because the necessity to farm was much less so.
If you play that way now, look how far behind another player who joined the same day as you you are.
Or someone in your SG.
And you dont want that so you join the bandwagon too.
I can't believe that many standard MMO players thinks that's desirable, and I'm sorry the developers encouraged these kind of "long ball" tactics.
It was just, in my view, a much better gaming experience.
I know it's just my view but I dont see how they can expect longevity in this game when you can get your alts to 50 in a few days and using what is the most labourious and repetitous methods I can imagine.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
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I don't know what that is, but it sounds vile...
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJBeC4TUNpo
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What?
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Oh, it's noodles... that's nice.
Rabbits & Hares:Blue (Mind/Emp Controller)Maroon (Rad/Thermal Corruptor)and one of each AT all at 50
MA Arcs: Apples of Contention - 3184; Zen & Relaxation - 35392; Tears of Leviathan - 121733 | All posts are rated "R" for "R-r-rrrrr, baby!"|Now, and this is very important... do you want a hug? COH Faces @Blue Rabbit
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Oh, it's noodles... that's nice.
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Yeah. Noodles. It's definitely noodles.
*stroke the bunny*
Awwwww, isn't he so cute.
Noodles.
Chairman of the Charity of Pain; accepting donations of blood and guts.
Prophet of the Creamy Truth; "If it's empty, fill it with cream."
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i said it should be from the beginning later on
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For a start, that doesn't make sense to me.
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before that i said players should not be limited on enjoyment, which is exactly this.
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So because an AT isn't unlocked from the beginning, you're limited? There's ten to choose from. How limited can you be?
Contact Information!
Twitter: @TonyParkeze
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Email: anthonyjp91@gmail.com
I was just thinking about 50 actually...
With PvP broken.
No real end game (looking at other MMOs that do).
Why on earth does anyone want to get to 50 anyway. Its not like there is a great deal to do with one when you get there.
Me I've been farming its true, mainly using my free subbed account (reactivation thing) to boost some of my main accounts lowbies to realms where the game is fun again (if such a thing is possible TBH).
But with the exception of duoing, which I can't do as my 2nd PC is broken (crashes when the game loads) I hardly ever play my 50s, my main who I still love is logged in for badges and little else. My only 50 villain is only used for boosting, and badly at that. My blaster... I forget the last time I played her. In fact only my fire/kins get a showing and even then not everyday.
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i said it should be from the beginning later on
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For a start, that doesn't make sense to me.
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before that i said players should not be limited on enjoyment, which is exactly this.
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So because an AT isn't unlocked from the beginning, you're limited? There's ten to choose from. How limited can you be?
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Rapthorn, Sorudo's been complaining about the inequity of unlockable VEATs since they were out (or slightly before, IIRC). He seems to be utterly sure that they should be available to everyone from the very start.
The irony is that he's surely had enough time to level a villain to 50 pre-I14, and given that MA farming can (by many accounts) get a villain from 1 up to 50 inside of 12 hours has certainly had chance to do the unlocking now.
Go into the light Sorudo, go into the light!
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Obviously since you now can get all your new shiny powers in a day, you can't appreciate how this might offend the people who spent 6 months getting their chars to the level cap.
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It's not about offending i don't think. it's just... shortchanging the game.
I think the devs had the Power building side of the game pretty much right (in one sense) on day one. I never agreed with global nerfs or Ed firstly commercially speaking and secondly because they took away somethin that made this game unique, yet eminently playable.
They could have balanced up not down and in fact, given the power levels you can now attain, i question if balance was ever the reason for Ed and GN.
My point is, I think, that to fully power up was (barring fairly rare at the time power leveling)you played the game.
You went through the arcs, you developed your character as your on line persona as opposed to a model you are playing to get to 50 as fast as you can.
It was just purer then.
The overall nature seemed to be calmer and more friendly.
Farming was rare because the necessity to farm was much less so.
If you play that way now, look how far behind another player who joined the same day as you you are.
Or someone in your SG.
And you dont want that so you join the bandwagon too.
I can't believe that many standard MMO players thinks that's desirable, and I'm sorry the developers encouraged these kind of "long ball" tactics.
It was just, in my view, a much better gaming experience.
I know it's just my view but I dont see how they can expect longevity in this game when you can get your alts to 50 in a few days and using what is the most labourious and repetitous methods I can imagine.
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Why play through the pretty boring early level stuff?
The arcs that send you through umpteen loading screens, just to talk to some guy the opposite end of the city?
It's not like you could even use the learning to play excuse any way, as post SO's most power set combos play quite differently than when on DOs and TOs
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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Why play through the pretty boring early level stuff?
The arcs that send you through umpteen loading screens, just to talk to some guy the opposite end of the city?
It's not like you could even use the learning to play excuse any way, as post SO's most power set combos play quite differently than when on DOs and TOs
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I don't agree with either point to be honest. I think some of the early arcs have some great (and often underused) stories, Dr Vazhilok & the Hollows for example.
As for the 2nd point it's quite strange. I've never experienced this nor heard anyone else complain about it.
Certainly a lot of toons play better once you've slotted Stamina because end use isn't so critical but that's not the point you're making.
Thelonious Monk
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Why play through the pretty boring early level stuff?
The arcs that send you through umpteen loading screens, just to talk to some guy the opposite end of the city?
It's not like you could even use the learning to play excuse any way, as post SO's most power set combos play quite differently than when on DOs and TOs
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This is a fair point. The first 20 levels of CoX are really badly dated now; MMOs have moved on from the slow start model. People expect to be entertained right from the word go now, and that's entirely fair enough.
Most of my RL gamer friends have never got a character to level 20 before quitting because those first levels can be so soul-crushingly slow. I'm currently levelling a BS/Shield Scrapper and up until dinging 20 and Stamina last night he literally didn't have enough endurance to use his primary and secondary powersets at the same time in a fight that had adds or ambushes. That's got to be wrong.
Maybe the best thing for CoX would be to revamp the whole first 20 levels. Allow travel powers earlier, lower the levels for DOs and SOs, rebalance Endurance costs (something players have been clamouring for for years), reduce the number of "utility" powers that leading to Stamina and a Travel power. Revamp some of the creakier early mission arcs to make them feel a bit more 2009. Basically let new players feel like they are super-heroes.
For longer term players, give advanced starts as vet rewards. They don't need to do all that early stuff again, it's just a time sink after having done it on a few alts already. A lot of people are going to PL their way into the interesting levels anyway, if they don't get tired of the early stuff altogether and quit, so let them make new alts at higher levels. What possible harm can it do?
Give better rewards for doing non-MA content. Maybe more temp powers and unlockable costume pieces that are tied to specific arcs. Maybe give special recipes that can't be sold or traded, and that can be collected to create unique IO sets depending on the path the player takes through the standard content - all locked to arcs and not buyable with yet another interchangeable currency.
Leave the MA as it is, just give a better search and categorisation system, and perhaps move AE buildings out of the starter zones. Obviously, just from reading the forums lately, a lot of people enjoy farming and all that metagaming stuff so leave them to it. If it's unbalancing the game then balance the rest of it accomodate.
Basically, if players are farming instead of playing the game as it was no doubt intended to be played then look at why that is. Then fix whatever's wrong with the "normal" game that drives them to farm and PL.
And remember that new players are what's going to keep this game going. Impress them. Make them feel like superheroes. That's something that CoX doesn't do at the moment. I think anyone who's played for even a short time can agree with that.
A very fine post.
I've noticed that doing normal content, level 1-10 come thick and fast, it takes about half an hour to hit level five, hour and a half to hit 10...then there's this massive slowdown period even with the XP smoothing.
10-20 just seems to grind solo espescially when compared with the pace that you've just had at levelling. Once you hit 20 with stamina and 22 with SOs the game picks up once again and the levels become quicker up until you hit 40, when they slow down again but by then you've got most of your funky powers and playing that particular character is a lot more fun anyway.
The early levels do need an endurance rebalance, you shouldn't have to rest after every two fights, four or five yes but after every two? Even with DOs?
The content needs a massive (and here's the word the devs seem to hate) revamp, especially heroside, all but three of the arcs and both taskforces are duller than dishwater (Synapse is fun but just plain too long for what it is), you get sent hither and dither all about the place by your contacts if you decided not to stay in the hollows, how many people drop the 'talk to wincott' mission at the first opportunity.
As said, the jump from DOs to SOs is a massive change, staggeringly massive infact, with Stamina as well you're endurance problems unless you're a particularly endurance heavy set, seem to ease off substantially, it shouldn't go from struggling every two fights with endurance to roflstomping your merry way though without worrying.
And for the love of all that's holy PLEASE make the 'talk to wincott' 'talk to security chief' 'talk to Herocorp rep' 'talk to PvP rep of [insert zone here]' optional.
Badge Earned: Wing Clipper
A real showstopper!
I agree with everything Burning Fist says here. The first 20 levels really do need revamping. Ok, the Midnighter arc is nice and I'm glad it's available to low level toons but the rest of the material needs looking at. Even though there are some fine low level arcs in the MA (there are, I've played them!) the lack of power, the endurance issues and all the other things already mentioned make that grind (especially between 10 and 22 as stated) a pain in the posterior.
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Me I've been farming its true, mainly using my free subbed account (reactivation thing) to boost some of my main accounts lowbies to realms where the game is fun again (if such a thing is possible TBH).
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If I have been guilty of doing anything in the MA it's this. Some of my toons just get stuck at certain levels and dragging them up to a point when they're fun again helps a lot. People want to feel heroic or villainous and the early levels do not lend themselves to that, not anymore.
The real impact of the MA is that it means that the Devs now need to raise their game even further than before. Some player created arcs put the early level stuff to shame. What's needed is more Dev led innovation in missions by doing stuff that we simply cannot. Look at the fires in Steel Canyon for example. We cannot code that in the MA. We need more events like that. Not just more monsters stomping around but things that gather the community together, that present a new challenge. What if there was a Gang War between the Skulls and Hellions in Perez that needed breaking up? Or the Trolls marching on the police encampment in the Hollows?
In short, the old levels do need a new look, not only to give new players (and us old timers!) something new to do, but also to present a fresh image to anyone coming to the game for the first time. What presents a better image: a vibrant, active Atlas Park with various events going on or broadcast filled with 'LFF' messages? I know which I'd prefer.
@Dante EU - Union Roleplayer and Altisis Victim
The Militia: Union RP Supergroup - www.themilitia.org.uk
Personally, I've been farming the hell out of some of my toons. God bless Rikti Communications Officers.
I want the stuff in the Rikti War Zone, and oh man I'm not doing it the slow way anymore. 35 freaking levels of slow solo anticipation just isn't fair anymore. And that's just getting there, if I could find a better way of farming Vanguard Merits than nonstop Borea missions because I'm busy on Sundays, I'd be all over it like a fat kid on a cream cake.
Chairman of the Charity of Pain; accepting donations of blood and guts.
Prophet of the Creamy Truth; "If it's empty, fill it with cream."
I agree with the above posters who say ...
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Maybe the best thing for CoX would be to revamp the whole first 20 levels.
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... but I'd go further and say that the power system needs to be looked at more broadly. While it's fun to get new powers, at about level 38 I tend to be have most of the core powers. While it's really fun to level from 38 upwards, depending on the AT/powersets I tend to find the lower levels to be a little dull, and the mid-30s to be quite frustrating, and it often feels like I'm playing in order to get a power. What superheroes do that? Where does that fit into the superhero mythos? Oh I remember now, it's on the bad side - it's where the villains are.. trying to become more powerful. It's not how I envision regular heroes.
What might be an interesting concept is to give players their most raw, unrefined, but very powerful abilities first, and then less powerful ones but which have good secondary effects as they level and learn to refine their abilities. CoX2 ideas, I guess.
Please fight My Brute: http://2hero.mybrute.com
Mission Architect 54161 - Michael Mundano, Megan Malloney and the Secret Senate.
Mission Architect 91838 - Constantinople Jones' Family Secret. A One Mission Story arc.
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The Coming Storm's been hanging over our heads for years
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Only 18 months, actually
[/ QUOTE ]Depends if you count whole years.
18 months ago would put us back in 2007 which means it's spanned 3 in all
Tyger (50), Mutation-Controller Mind/FF - oldest Mind/FF on Union