Is proliferation=God mode

Alphane · 09-11-2008 01:09 AM

My two GOMOD alts are Cold/Ice Plant/Emp both prolifirated sets.... Discuss

BrightEyes_EU · 09-11-2008 06:29 AM

I'm not even going to touch the Cold/Ice, but Plant/ Emp, why in dogs name do you think Plant is more powerful then other controller sets? I mean it's a fine set, but it's not largely different from what controllers have already in other primaries.

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Judgement_Dave · 09-11-2008 06:36 AM

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I'm not even going to touch the Cold/Ice, but Plant/ Emp, why in dogs name do you think Plant is more powerful then other controller sets? I mean it's a fine set, but it's not largely different from what controllers have already in other primaries.

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But it is alphane's pick of the month.

Frankly I don't consider any single players choice of sets as making the combination particularly notable for discussion, but that's how the OP strikes me.

Rather than proliferated sets being overpowered it's just as possible that the new-shiny-factor of proliferated powers has made Alphane enjoy the sets more and so play them more and so see them as better than his old characters.

Also it's likely that the proliferated-set characters Alphane has are his newer characters and so he may be playing them better (purely due to getting better as time/experience goes on).

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PRAF68_EU · 09-11-2008 06:44 AM

Power sets that would be unreasonably strong if copied over without change are modified before they are proliferated. See Psi Blast for example. This is also why we havent seen regen tanks or butes yet.

The combinations mentioned by the OP aren't especially strong, and are certainly no stronger than combos that have existed since the year dot (e.g. Ill/Rad, Fire/Kin).

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Dr_MechanoEU · 09-11-2008 06:48 AM

Hmm for single target damage wise isn't Rad/sonic fairly godly as well due to the mahoosive -res that get's applied (it's known as an AV killer set...and this is on defenders!).

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Carnifax · 09-11-2008 06:48 AM

Aye, I haven't seen any proliferation combos which give god mode at the moment.

Give Masterminds Kinetics / Radiation or Controllers Dark Miasma / Traps and you'd have a case for God mode now (Illusion/Dark... drools)

MaXimillion_Zero · 09-11-2008 06:52 AM

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My two GOMOD alts are Cold/Ice Plant/Emp both prolifirated sets.... Discuss

[/ QUOTE ]I think we have very different definitions of God Mode...What exactly can those characters do that others can't?

BrightEyes_EU · 09-11-2008 07:04 AM

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Also it's likely that the proliferated-set characters Alphane has are his newer characters and so he may be playing them better (purely due to getting better as time/experience goes on).

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That would be my guess as well.

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The_MESS · 09-11-2008 07:32 AM

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My two GOMOD alts are Cold/Ice Plant/Emp both proliferated sets.... Discuss

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What do you mean by GOMOD? some more detail would be nice as most sets can be powerful if slotted/built a certain way

Carnifax · 09-11-2008 07:44 AM

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Hmm for single target damage wise isn't Rad/sonic fairly godly as well due to the mahoosive -res that get's applied (it's known as an AV killer set...and this is on defenders!).

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I'd rate Dark/Sonics above it personally (I am biased but Dark has more -resist, which is also stackable). I'd also question if either of them could actually manage to solo an AV, I doubt they'd survive the aggro for too long (again I think Dark might be a bit better at it thanks to Fluffy).

It's not really God Mode though, you're great vs AVs in teams, but a Sonics defender trying to solo largish bunches of white mobs is slow as hell. Any AOE biased toon would laugh at them.

MMs are probably the closest to overall god mode in the game really, there's very few situations my Thugs/Traps or Necro/Dark could be considered weak in the PvE game.

DreamWeaver · 09-11-2008 07:58 AM

I thought the Large Hadron Collider was built to look for God Moders?

PP doesn't generate that kind of field, IMHO - it's more about encouraging chronic altitis and giving people yet more creative options to build new heroes. Currently unable to keep my paws off my flatmate's Cold/Cold Dominator.

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Carnifax · 09-11-2008 08:02 AM

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I thought the Large Hadron Collider was built to look for God Moders?

PP doesn't generate that kind of field, IMHO - it's more about encouraging chronic altitis and giving people yet more creative options to build new heroes. Currently unable to keep my paws off my flatmate's Cold/Cold Dominator.

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Enough about your tawdery affairs with digital characters, we're talking about proliferation here

Agreed on the point though, a good flavour of the month alt can really revitalise the game for you and can seem really powerful as you discover combos.

Dr_MechanoEU · 09-11-2008 08:03 AM

hmm had just heard Rad/sonic was a good set for single target DPS (yes AoE wise isn't that great)

Found my Bots/FF fairly nifty though it's a fairly passive set, can stack up some nice +def in total on the bots plus if it all goes pearshaped there's always PFF (great for when the ambushing EB decides to go exclusively after you due to the game code, stick on PFF and go for a smoke, come back, EB is dead)

I've not really seen anything I'd classify as a God mode powerset besides the obvious stand out ones, Ill/Rad and Fire/Kin.

Still I tend not to min/max and play whichever set suits me...

Though Build up + Aim + Fireball + Firebreath does seem to wipe out large spawns with a fire/fire blaster I wouldn't classify that combo as godly since it lacks the inherent safety of 38 (or whenever they get Transferance) fire/kin.

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DreamWeaver · 09-11-2008 08:07 AM

Actually, scratch that - Cold/Cold Defender. Was working till 3am and had an hour's reward gaming after that. Need more caffeine.

Between stackable holds and AOE slows, Heat Loss and all the stackable debuffs, I can solo +2/3 Death Mages if I've got a Breakfree handy (and preferably a mid/large yellow).

Heat Loss absolutely rocks, though I'm having trouble using it in larger teams (if I trigger close to the tanks/scrappzors they get buffed but no-one else does, if I hang back with the squishlies it's the same deal, and if I trigger as a team alpha I get a lot of very angry mobs after me...)

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BrightEyes_EU · 09-11-2008 08:15 AM

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Between stackable holds and AOE slows, Heat Loss and all the stackable debuffs, I can solo +2/3 Death Mages if I've got a Breakfree handy (and preferably a mid/large yellow).

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I think my only char that can't consistently solo +2/3 Death Mages is my Empath. But yeah Cold/Ice is a nice set.

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Doctor Storm- Brute SS/Elec SL 50
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Okton · 09-11-2008 08:23 AM

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Hmm for single target damage wise isn't Rad/sonic fairly godly as well due to the mahoosive -res that get's applied (it's known as an AV killer set...and this is on defenders!).

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I'd rate Dark/Sonics above it personally (I am biased but Dark has more -resist, which is also stackable). I'd also question if either of them could actually manage to solo an AV, I doubt they'd survive the aggro for too long (again I think Dark might be a bit better at it thanks to Fluffy).

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Clicky.

With a shiv. But still...

CoX 50s: <ill/rad> <ice/ice> <fire/kin> <grav/sonic> <ice/storm> <earth/kin> <kin/elec> <cold/psy> <thugs/dark> <fire/dark> <dark/elec> <night widow> <EM/ninj> <mind/icy>

Carnifax · 09-11-2008 08:26 AM

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Hmm for single target damage wise isn't Rad/sonic fairly godly as well due to the mahoosive -res that get's applied (it's known as an AV killer set...and this is on defenders!).

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I'd rate Dark/Sonics above it personally (I am biased but Dark has more -resist, which is also stackable). I'd also question if either of them could actually manage to solo an AV, I doubt they'd survive the aggro for too long (again I think Dark might be a bit better at it thanks to Fluffy).

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Clicky.

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There's a Shiv tanking (and doing lots & lots of damage) for them though. I'm talking about solo, not with a pet Tankmage-in-a-box in tow.

Hey, sneaky ninja-edit. No fair

Okton · 09-11-2008 08:28 AM

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There's a Shiv tanking (and doing lots & lots of damage) for them though. I'm talking about solo, not with a pet Tankmage-in-a-box in tow.

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So, like a dark without Fluffy you mean?

CoX 50s: <ill/rad> <ice/ice> <fire/kin> <grav/sonic> <ice/storm> <earth/kin> <kin/elec> <cold/psy> <thugs/dark> <fire/dark> <dark/elec> <night widow> <EM/ninj> <mind/icy>

Carnifax · 09-11-2008 08:32 AM

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There's a Shiv tanking (and doing lots & lots of damage) for them though. I'm talking about solo, not with a pet Tankmage-in-a-box in tow.

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So, like a dark without Fluffy you mean?

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No, Fluffy is their Tier 9 pet. The Rad is free to use EMP as they see fit

Like I'd imagine a Dark/Sonic could do as well with a Shiv in tow.

Whats that black toggle running in the vid, beside the Leadership pool?

Okton · 09-11-2008 08:35 AM

Just kidding Carni

That's Dark Embrace (epic shield).

CoX 50s: <ill/rad> <ice/ice> <fire/kin> <grav/sonic> <ice/storm> <earth/kin> <kin/elec> <cold/psy> <thugs/dark> <fire/dark> <dark/elec> <night widow> <EM/ninj> <mind/icy>

JawDropper_EU · 09-11-2008 09:18 AM

There's an ice/cold corruptor who solos AV/heroes US-side, without the aid of Shivans. Dunno if a defender could do it though...greater debuffs and all that.

Regarding PP, I was disappointed that no PP has so far been announced for i13 as i really really want an archery/radiation corruptor. I was gonna slot it for +recharge so I could have perma AM then have a 20sec or so Rain of Arrows that would have the chance to scourge. Yum. It might have enticed me away from WoW (currently eating my free time), tried a rad/arch defender but its just not the same. Too defender-y not enough scourge

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Lord Mayhem · 09-11-2008 11:12 AM

Just to answer the implied question in the subject, no I don't think proliferation is godmode if the devs are careful about it, which I think they have been so far re the changes to Psychic Blast and their continued denial of certain sets to certain ATs (Dark Miasma to Controllers, for instance).

Funnily enough some of the characters I've played recently with I12 proliferated sets have seemed weaker than some of the non-proliferated ones I played before - sure, that's definitely personal bias in what I picked, but it does make me think that personal bias is as much to blame for the OP's claims as it is for any blinkered spurious claims I could throw around based solely on my I12 proliferated characters.

Objective good, subjective bad

EU_Damz · 09-11-2008 11:48 AM

cold/* defenders ROCK!!!! Cant wait to get high enough to be able to start slotting it properly.

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Alphane · 09-11-2008 01:43 PM

Well to provide a little more info
Cold/ice Between the slows/holds/debuffs/sheilding I really just had to drop the nice damage I could have been doing, just a little too much power there I feel
Plant/Emp The confuse power you get (pre travel) compares favourably with the tier 9 confuse power of another set, plus an AoE sleep (useful if used carefully) and AoE and ST hold, An AoE +regen, And some other mad AoE with tendrils that I really havent had a chance to test but when I fired it at a 3 warriors hanging out on the corner it tore them to shreds (still need to run some proper test to see how that works properly ) and I still againt got 'Seymour' tagging along yet. Thats an awful lot of control for one Alt.
Ok yes I've seen Fire/kins burn through 8 man maps and seen AV's that had been unbreakable crumble at the sight of a Rad.
So perhaps partially this is a combination of effects that I am experiencing here. One of which might be the fact that because Def/Troller powers have a more subtle effect they appear in game with a somewhat exagerated magnitude to make them noticable/fun/something valuable. Also my growing experience of the game could be a factor (and on the cold/ice side at least the fact I play in an team of similar powersets lots of our effects stack well together but I imagine my Cryo would perform well in any team.)
And shaman when I was Duoing with a friend of mine (early teen lvl with a tank) I was considering hiring in fillers to make the missions a bit more challenging but my friend was only really finding her feet with her new Alt so I didn't really want to 'push the envelope' the only time I can think of when he has really lost control is on a cave map vs. CoT with a couple of over eager melee guys, the party got too spread and we wiped. He rarely needs to fire his heavy hitters (AoE hold, AoE +regen).
Too be honest both of them seem to be too good at there jobs and I kinda run them at about 60% output and still never really have much trouble.
Was really just wondering what other peoples experiences with these powersets where and also if the fact that they where designed with a slightly diffrent team dynamic in mind ie Villian AT's have diffrent strengths/weaknesses than Heroes, has just randomaly swapping powersets red/blue created a game balance conflict.
Cheers for your replies look forward to hearing your further thoughts.

EU_Damz · 09-11-2008 04:11 PM

Well since my new "experiment" toon is a cold/* defender (team him up!! Iced Brain!! you know you wanna!!) i think im starting to find out his weaknesses.
By himself if the going gets tough and the team is over their heads then there isnt really anything he can do about it unlike an emp/dark/rad/kin who can heal from their primary/secondary.
But thats the difference between certain sets.

*Some sets like cold, FF, sonic prevent damage ever being done to you, however if the damage does get through then there isnt much the player can do about it (which of course pool powers come into effect but we wont count those yet). Like you said a team/duo of colds (as an example) will hardly need a heal but your then sacrificin high dmg for higher def.

*Other sets however like rad/kin/thermal/emp are best based for teams that WILL need a heal/buff once in a while (example red/purple con mobs and AVs) and are therefore more desirable than the other sets in these situations.

I dont think there is ANY god mode set/power in the game, yes there are very powerfull sets in certain situations but even they have weaknesses. Granite armour used to be considered God mode but put a granite against psy clockwork and well . . . . . so much for that theory.

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