Hehe and if you wanted to do a true test you'd need an example of where the market would be WITHOUT farming, compared to the current market.
It's all just speculation no matter how you word it; still waiting for a proper Rune price though.....
I don't wanna save my soul now,
I just wanna lose control,
And even if it takes a lifetime, to learn:
I'll learn!
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zomg chatarsis I am honestly tryin to see the point u are making, but cant - as bright eyes and Tuarus has said :
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6mth ago -
Mu vestment - 6 million influence => 6 mill profit
now-
Mu vestment - 600 000 influence => 600 000 profit
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Difference is 5,4mill. That's the profit I'm talking about that he lost...
Not said a single thing about how much influence he had at the time or if the drop was for free or anything like that.
Talking only about the prices compared and the profit lost compared to 6 months ago.
Get the point now? Or would you like to add a bit more that I wasn't talking about?
This brings 3 points to mind to me.
1.The impact of farming can't fairly be assesed as you cannot remove it or [censored] it to any major degree.
2.Even if the mish reset exploit that farmers use was nerfed enough people would still take there fav AT to PI to run mishes and try and maximize there profit, so would the removale of big map farming really make any great diffrence.
3.The prices of salvage can also be effected by market traders trting to ramp prices for there own profit and may have no relation to farming at all.
just my 0.02 inf anyway
you were not being very clear.
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you were not being very clear.
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I was not clear when I said I was comparing the profit now and the profit 6 months ago?
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Do explain how a profit can be made if the prices dropped from 2-3 million to 600k?
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But as you said. Compared to a few months ago you did not make a profit if you compare the prices.
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Look at the prices of purple recipe drops (higher then ever).
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The price of purple recipe's has dropped a lot since they were introduced.
The prices of purple recipes has dropped to a degree, the price of the relevant salvage associated with them has risen dramically.
Chronal skip, Platinum, Impervium etc. Some of these are selling for ridiculous INF now.
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Do explain how a profit can be made if the prices dropped from 2-3 million to 600k?
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There is the culprit for the misunderstanding.
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The prices of purple recipes has dropped to a degree, the price of the relevant salvage associated with them has risen dramically.
Chronal skip, Platinum, Impervium etc. Some of these are selling for ridiculous INF now.
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I stick to ready made ones when i can to avoid that.
Also villain side magic salvage has dropped a lot, so making them aint the bitter pill it was to swallow.
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you were not being very clear.
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I was not clear when I said I was comparing the profit now and the profit 6 months ago?
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Do explain how a profit can be made if the prices dropped from 2-3 million to 600k?
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But as you said. Compared to a few months ago you did not make a profit if you compare the prices.
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Did you have an initial outlay to acquire the salvage you are selling?
No
Then even if the market bombed and you were only getting six inf per item of salvage, it'd still be a profit, just not as large a profit as before.
In other words not every profitable business has to pull down MS figures each year.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
Over and over again... I was just comparing the influence he earned. Not how he got the salvage or anything like that.
That 600k compared to 6mill is not a profit. (now someone will reply and say yes it is.)
Sure it is a profit but compared to what the older price was it's not a major profit. (is this better?)
I'd be more inclined to think the changing prices on the AH is more to do with the changes the devs made regarding which groups drop what type of salvage rather than what one part of the community is or isn't doing.
Tbh since the drop changes I've found I'm using the AH less and less. I make more IO's than I did previously and generally I'm vendoring any left over salvage rather than selling it on the AH. I used to find I could make a profit by selling salvage on the AH, making more than the default vendor price, now I find the opposite.
The only prices I've found have gone up overall are the vanilla IOs, which I put down to the dxp weekend before last. Before that point IOs were stupidly cheap to buy on the AH, you could kit yourself out for less than the price of equivalent lvl SOs.
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That 600k compared to 6mill is not a profit. (now someone will reply and say yes it is.)
Sure it is a profit but compared to what the older price was it's not a major profit. (is this better?)
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And so the confusion was all down to you and your idea of what a profit is and isn't 
I did call it a little profit, like a shrunken Moses.
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Then even if the market bombed and you were only getting six inf per item of salvage, it'd still be a profit, just not as large a profit as before.
[/ QUOTE ]Because the time to acquire the salvage is completely free, yes? Economics don't work that way.
Thats implying people play for the drops only and not the xp.
If they playing for xp then the time taken to accrue drops is negligable as they werent there for those in the first place and are just an extra little bonus, like finding a shrunken 10p on the floor
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That 600k compared to 6mill is not a profit. (now someone will reply and say yes it is.)
Sure it is a profit but compared to what the older price was it's not a major profit. (is this better?)
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And so the confusion was all down to you and your idea of what a profit is and isn't
I did call it a little profit, like a shrunken Moses.
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Yah... I kinda have this odd habit of expression my own opinions and not the opinions of others. 
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That 600k compared to 6mill is not a profit. (now someone will reply and say yes it is.)
Sure it is a profit but compared to what the older price was it's not a major profit. (is this better?)
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And so the confusion was all down to you and your idea of what a profit is and isn't
I did call it a little profit, like a shrunken Moses.
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Yah... I kinda have this odd habit of expression my own opinions and not the opinions of others.
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And that also includes changing the meaning of words from what others think and know they mean
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Yah... I kinda have this odd habit of expression my own opinions and not the opinions of others.
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that i can respect. But changing the meaning of a word or the english language isnt the same as expressing an opinion - but hey ho; at least I got that now.
but yes thank you for clarifying your special use of the word "profit". And yes that kinda of clears up things about you opinion. Got it.
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That 600k compared to 6mill is not a profit. (now someone will reply and say yes it is.)
Sure it is a profit but compared to what the older price was it's not a major profit. (is this better?)
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hang on 1st its "not a profit", then "its not a major profit" - wow 2 contradicting "opinions" in 1 post
oh never mind. Tuarus - i think he's finally got wot we were saying is "profit"
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Look at the prices of purple recipe drops (higher then ever).
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The price of purple recipe's has dropped a lot since they were introduced.
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True, as did everything. But most purples prices have been steadily creeping up the past few months.
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True, as did everything. But most purples prices have been steadily creeping up the past few months.
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I must admit iv not noticed that, but anyway thats hardly the same as the price of purples being higher than ever is it?
I also doubt purples will ever be as high in price as they were at the start, thanks to more of them dumped on the market.
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I can't help wondering though (as I'm intrigued), people who farm to get a lot of drops - do you still make money, on the farming part, more so than you'd make selling a 2 million inf orange / rare drop?
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1.2 mill per 10 mins EARNED inf. Not that i farm *coughs*
@Damz Find me on the global channel Union Chat. One of the best "chat channels" ingame!
I suppose the prices are affected in some way by farming, but the buyer perhaps wins on this occasion but maybe in a couple of months it'll be back to how it was for those salvage types. Supply and demand.
If some new recipes come out that are useful and popular that require those items of salvage, maybe they will reverse and become expensive to buy and of financial benefit to the seller. Perhaps we'll see on the next update
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I must admit iv not noticed that, but anyway thats hardly the same as the price of purples being higher than ever is it?
[/ QUOTE ]The launch prices can't really be taken into account, since the demand was incredibly high compared to the supply. However, now that things have stabilized, if the prices keep increasing, that's a clear sign of inflation.
Now whether that's due to farmers is a whole other kettle of fish.
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Yah... I kinda have this odd habit of expression my own opinions and not the opinions of others.
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that i can respect. But changing the meaning of a word or the english language isnt the same as expressing an opinion - but hey ho; at least I got that now.
but yes thank you for clarifying your special use of the word "profit". And yes that kinda of clears up things about you opinion. Got it.
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I do wonder one thing... Is EU short for what?
English United?(subtle hint... It's not)
Perhaps some parts of this "EU" does not have english as the main language... Now what could this mean.
Hmm... Oh right. Perhaps that english is my second language and sometimes I mess up where words are supposed to be(I can't see the difference between to and too).
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That 600k compared to 6mill is not a profit... However that might have been wrong of me to say.
Can I somehow repair it by saying that 600k is not a major profit compared to 6mil instead?
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hang on 1st its "not a profit", then "its not a major profit" - wow 2 contradicting "opinions" in 1 post
oh never mind. Tuarus - i think he's finally got wot we were saying is "profit"
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Actually now it is you that is confusing things.
I was simply improving my first statement to better fit.
And again... Sometimes my english is a bit bad.
But here... I will fix the quote for you.
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Hi,
about 6 months ago this Thread was started and got very heated among some of us.
We are now 6 momnths on from this and I would like to say that those that predicted salvage prices would fall from this were correct.
Yesterday I got dropped a Mu Vestment and a Black Blood of the Mandate. These used to sell for 2 - 3 million inf each, and yesterday they sold for 600,000 and 60,000 inf respectively.
No point to this thread apart from pointing out that some people who seemed to be so anti-farming to the point of it must be removed and stopped at all costs were wrong as we now all benifit
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You can't make such a judgment based purely on the past and present prices of just two items of salvage. Sure, they're cheaper now than then; but there are plenty of other things which are way more expensive now than then as well.
To come to a conclusion that farming does/doesn't effect prices, you have to study the ENTIRE market; taking regular readings of every single item for sale in the AH and comparing it against items being collected by farmers. The only people with access to the data to do this are NCSoft, not the players.
You're just trying to find justification for your farming, when really, there isn't one. Some people like doing it, some people don't. Neither side will convince the other that their view is right, because we just don't have the data to be able to make a reliable analysis.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.