S4 discussion about rules and stuff
By
Antibiotical_EU,
Posted on: 2008-07-25 11:41 in Everything about PvP
What makes you go for level 24 for middle weights?
As nothing has been realised at the moment this is pure speculation to how event will run. So please bear in mind the forth coming event may only resemble S4 and may or may not run all classes and all servers. I'm working GR with this. Please be patient and bear with us.
It will be interesting tho to see what people think.
Aye as Ks pointed out is just a debate what people think since there seem to be a lot in game.
This is not related to any inside info since there aint any and is pure debate.
Id like to see most of what TG said, cept i dont want to see heroe/villain mixed teams mainly because unless u limit the teams to 10/12 (1 of each AT +epic) you have to tie in each AT to another Ie can either pick Defender or Corr but not both, or u start leaving out melee toons etc.
One thing that I really want to happen is Server based regionals, since the last S4 server champions have had bragging rights and now would seem a gr8 chance to see new SG/teams holding the throne of server champions.
Whatever happens tho im deffo gonna try my hardest to be there in some form, hopefully this has the oppurtinity, especially at the lower lvl class to encourage people who dont normally PVP to participate.
Just for fun id love to see lowbie FFA comps at like max level 15, but lower would also be fun, I think it would just be a laugh. Hopefully bring some fun back to PvP and stop some whining.
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i dont want to see heroe/villain mixed teams mainly because unless u limit the teams to 10/12 (1 of each AT +epic) you have to tie in each AT to another Ie can either pick Defender or Corr but not both, or u start leaving out melee toons etc.
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I would like to see a pentad system that matches hero villains and allows a mix up maybe?
Domi/Controllers
Tank/Brute
Scraper/Stalker
Corr/Defender
VEAT/HEAT
Blasters,MM's could be standalone categories.
I think mixing heroes/vills will allow more diversity in team fights and break the fotm pentad teams that could be brought forth.
Mixing will allow player skill to shine as well good tactics over fotm.
Also i was in a debate yesterday with someone claiming that IO's and Purple sets shouldnt be allowed.
The simple fact is the game has evolved and the invention system is part of the game.Locking purple sets or IO's out is like locking pvpers out of this event or its the same as not allowing inspirations in matches.
Once again this is just my opinion and there is no relation to what GR together with KS are planning or me knowing something. 
I think IOs should be banned
why should people have an unfair advantage because they spend all day and night farming for their "mad purpz"? I actually want to play the game, thank you very much.
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I think IOs should be banned
why should people have an unfair advantage because they spend all day and night farming for their "mad purpz"? I actually want to play the game, thank you very much.
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Because in the same manner,inspirations,TK,cage,assasin strike,aim,bu and rads all together should be banned too.
IO's are part of the game evolution and part of daily PvP.
Besides lol if you lock out IO's/sets/Purps, dont expect to see PvP players joining cause there aint many PvPers without em 
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I think IOs should be banned
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You cant ban IOs on live servers, people arent going to respec them all out
thePhilosopher Martial Arts/Regen/Fire Scrapper
theRegulator Empathy/Energy/Soul Defender
Total Inertia Ice Blast/Kinetics/Psy Corruptor
Total Inferno Ice Blast/Thermal/Leviathan Corruptor
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I think IOs should be banned
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Totally disagree, especially at the lvl 50 Heavy weight side. Youve had time to get them, and its complete bull that u need to farm 24/7 to get them. Play your lvl 50s dont have to be on a farm, Play the market.
Seeing theyve been out for a couple of issues youve had plenty of time to sort this, calling it a unfair advantage is just a poor excuse imo.
If youd rather just lvl up yourself another toon thats your perogative.
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I think IOs should be banned
why should people have an unfair advantage because they spend all day and night farming for their "mad purpz"? I actually want to play the game, thank you very much.
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Because in the same manner,inspirations,TK,cage,assasin strike,aim,bu and rads all together should be banned too.
IO's are part of the game evolution and part of daily PvP.
Besides lol if you lock out IO's/sets/Purps, dont expect to see PvP players joining cause there aint many PvPers without em
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This is a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. I would think that someone coming into this with a vanilla IO or SO build wouldn't stand a snowballs chance in hell against a fully set based or purple IO'd build. If you allow them it's pretty much eliminating 'casual' players from taking part. If you don't allow them you're likely eliminating a lot of pvpers.
Also if they say sets aren't allowed the system of self policing done in the last S4 can't possibly exist. If a team hammers another team 50-3 (which was quite common in the last S4) someone is bound claim the other team was using sets/purples. Every match would need a GM adjudicator, which would be impractical.
A possible way round it would be to have a 2 tier tournament, one division for the dedicated pvpers (anything goes), another division for the casuals (no sets). Not an ideal solution but like the first S4 it would open the event up to the highest number of participants.
I think it would need to incorporate villains and heroes, but I'm unsure about 10 player teams. It was hard enough arranging match times to suit 2 teams of 5 players never mind 20 players. A 2/2+1 maybe were 2 of your team had to be heroes and 2 villains + one other of either side. Checks and balances would be needed so you don't end up with 20 identicle teams so for example if you had a controller you couldn't have a dominator and if you had a brute you couldn't have a scrapper (all hypothetical).
Epic ATs were disallowed last time, I'm certainly not going to say they should or shouldn't be allowed (I'm not that brave ).
Should allow Epic ATs imo since Widows seem to be a great team pvp toon.
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I think IOs should be banned
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So because you cant get a toon IOed means that everyone else has to suffer because ur too lazy to play 50s in pve? Ban IOs and gl getting alot of ppl. Everyone and their grandmother has IOs nowadays. There isnt a way to ban them, and ppl will not spec them out of their toon, so if this is the way you feel, then have fun pveing 
For middleweight either make it 30 or 38, since ppl like sirens and wb lvls.
I can see why no IOs isnt a bad idea, would make a level playing ground as obviously some people are going to be purpled and some are not. But ye IOs, are basically SOs now, would be fun to see some slow motion PvP if were no IOs
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Also if they say sets aren't allowed the system of self policing done in the last S4 can't possibly exist. If a team hammers another team 50-3 (which was quite common in the last S4) someone is bound claim the other team was using sets/purples. Every match would need a GM adjudicator, which would be impractical.
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I do talk [censored] at times. Of course you could just look at the opposing teams player info to see if they're running sets. I'm not sure what's worse, that I didn't think of this when I wrote the post or that it popped into my head when I was sitting having my breakfast. 
lollllllllllllllllllllll
*Grabs flame suit and marshmallows for the bonfire*
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I can see why no IOs isnt a bad idea, would make a level playing ground as obviously some people are going to be purpled and some are not. But ye IOs, are basically SOs now, would be fun to see some slow motion PvP if were no IOs
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Why punish those who work hard to establish decent builds with purple enhancements?
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I would think that someone coming into this with a vanilla IO or SO build wouldn't stand a snowballs chance in hell against a fully set based or purple IO'd build.
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Contrary to popular beliefs, I have exactly 0 purples. I get by.
Still can't use my sonic in monday nights cause it ruins it too much 
@Rooks
"You should come inside the box... Then you'll know what I mean."
Just to make it clear to everyone Xan was making fun. ( i know i know i am party spoiler )
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Just to make it clear to everyone Xan was making fun. ( i know i know i am party spoiler )
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DAMN YOU GREEEEEEEEEEEEEK
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Also i was in a debate yesterday with someone claiming that IO's and Purple sets shouldnt be allowed.
The simple fact is the game has evolved and the invention system is part of the game.Locking purple sets or IO's out is like locking pvpers out of this event or its the same as not allowing inspirations in matches.
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I assume that although S4 is more attractive to hardcore PvPers than anyone else, that it will still be open to casual PvPers and maybe even novices. To that end I feel that it will be hard to give everyone an advantage of a level playing field if rares or uniques are used. Hardcore players probably/possibly maxed out their builds by raising their influence income in the usual methods (no need to mention which in the hopes of preventing another off topic debate that has no relevance here ).
Unfortunately not everyone uses these methods. I had 80 million with my influence earner before the salvage invention system came into affect and mainly just to get the influence badge as there wasn't much to spend influence on back then. Even now I'm still sub 300 million and probably due to playing alts a lot and not spending as much time on the one character as I used to, but even with all that influence I couldn't easily if ever get the same amount of uniques and rares in my build as maybe the least well off hardcore PvPer.
I think if someone like me had solely standard Invention origins and was playing someone with uniques and rares, it would feel like Gary Linnekar versus Dwayne Chambers (Mr Clean v Mr Performance Enhanced), to the effect that if I were to lose I could say that I only lost because I hadn't got any uniques or rares. Not true of course as I would lose even if it was the other way round probably hehe.
I think I'd like it to be the basic IOs only allowed, if this was to take part on the test server everyone could do a respec and maybe there would be a supply of free or very inexpensive IOs for everyone and judges could check each characters info to make sure there weren't any bonuses listed.
I suppose as long as everyone playing were happy with purple sets etc. being used then it's of course fine but I feel it makes it, certainly the heavyweight category, open just to hardcore pvp and perhaps defeats some of the object of making the whole S4 open to anybody. Maybe a way around it is to have an open event outside the standard competition events where there's no limits on enhancement types,but this should perhaps be classed as a exhibition event and not a competitive one.
As I don't know a great deal about this event as I wasn't involved in the last one, and perhaps won't be this time (I'm not a competitive person), I may be overlooking something and seeing it all wrong but this is how I feel at this point in time.
Any thoughts ?
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Just to make it clear to everyone Xan was making fun. ( i know i know i am party spoiler )
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DAMN YOU GREEEEEEEEEEEEEK
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I wish I was as cool as Xanthus.
@Rooks
"You should come inside the box... Then you'll know what I mean."
why wont you love me rooks
The only imba purples are the ranged Apocolapyse set and the melee proc. The others dont make a lot of a lot difference from a pvp point of view . . .the diffence between a 35% recharge build and a 60% recharge build isnt a lot.
thePhilosopher Martial Arts/Regen/Fire Scrapper
theRegulator Empathy/Energy/Soul Defender
Total Inertia Ice Blast/Kinetics/Psy Corruptor
Total Inferno Ice Blast/Thermal/Leviathan Corruptor
Since is obvious S4 is in the works i would like to have a debate about potential ruleset and with what mindset should this tournament be approached.
This is my opinion only of course as always and would like to have a debate about it and hear from rest too since GR wasnt in previous event as well.
Classes:
-Would like to have Heavyweight and a Middleweight tourney just like previous S4 had gone down.
-Tournament could retain the previous matchup style by having regional servers battle it out to the top and then the regionals battle it out for EU top positions.
-Pentad style retained
-Mixed Hero/Villains teams in order to avoid whiners that still cry about heros being overpowered and also openning up a whole new tactical level regarding within the competition.
-Insps of course allowed
-Heavyweights at 50 of course Middle weights 24
-enhancements: Since we are at i12 and the game has evolved is obvious at heavyweight at least all is allowed.Considering the regionals also will be taking place on test server where is easy as hell to create builds how u want em heavyweight cant have tbh restrictions on purples,IO's and so on and so on.
Well these are just my thoughts and what i gathered from some debates in game so feel free to discuss