Push the story to the extreme
By
Aerie,
Posted on: 2008-07-13 09:26 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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2) We win the war and we are now on the Rikti homeworld, all new zones on that world, trying to destroy them completely.
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That's not very heroic.
[url=http://vox-doom.deviantart.com]Take A Gander At This.[/url]
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2) We win the war and we are now on the Rikti homeworld, all new zones on that world, trying to destroy them completely.
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That's not very heroic.
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Depends which faction of the Rikti wins their own little civil war. The ones who want peace wins then yes your totally right. However i'm thinking the others win, the one's who want to wipe out humanity.
In that case heroism is in saving your own world, winning the war.
Those sound like great arcs or possibly entered through Ouroboros, but I doubt they'd change the gameworld so much at this stage.
"Idealism is such a wonderful thing. All you really need is someone rational to put it to proper use." - Kerr Avon
Myopic Aardvark on Twitter
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2) We win the war and we are now on the Rikti homeworld, all new zones on that world, trying to destroy them completely.
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That's not very heroic.
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Perfect for the villains then?
"Idealism is such a wonderful thing. All you really need is someone rational to put it to proper use." - Kerr Avon
Myopic Aardvark on Twitter
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In that case heroism is in saving your own world, winning the war.
[/ QUOTE ]By wiping out an entire civilization? I thought mankind had evolved past that kind of... I can't think of a word for this.
That's pretty damn villainous.
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By wiping out an entire civilization? I thought mankind had evolved past that kind of... I can't think of a word for this.
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How about Barbarism... 
Golden-Phoenix - Lvl 50 Fire/Fire Tank
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How much wood would a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could Chuck Norris?
I think the word you're looking for is Genocide.
And no, it's not overly heroic, but I bet Guy Gardner would do it
We built this city on Rock and Roll!
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By wiping out an entire civilization? I thought mankind had evolved past that kind of... I can't think of a word for this.
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How about Barbarism...
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I was thinking american... 
If it's a case of us getting wiped out or them getting wiped out, which would you choose? Is it heroic to let them win and let humanity die?
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If it's a case of us getting wiped out or them getting wiped out, which would you choose? Is it heroic to let them win and let humanity die?
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Is this part of that "absolute power" thread earlier? Because thats the direction I can see it take now.
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If it's a case of us getting wiped out or them getting wiped out, which would you choose? Is it heroic to let them win and let humanity die?
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Is this part of that "absolute power" thread earlier? Because thats the direction I can see it take now.
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Was that an answer?
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If it's a case of us getting wiped out or them getting wiped out, which would you choose? Is it heroic to let them win and let humanity die?
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Is this part of that "absolute power" thread earlier? Because thats the direction I can see it take now.
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Was that an answer?
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Take it as a hint that the answer to your question is in that thread.
That is yes and no. Depends on who you ask.
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If it's a case of us getting wiped out or them getting wiped out, which would you choose? Is it heroic to let them win and let humanity die?
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In an extreme situation, then we would have to do whatever was needed to save ourselves - but I think there'd be another way of preventing them from invading us again.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Well i'll make it simple then.
In the scenario I envisage every peace loving Rikti has been killed. All that remains is the Rikti who want to wipe out out, every single last one is dedicated to wiping out humanity. They know it's not our fault, but they want us gone anyway. They won't ever stop, won't quit, won't give in. If we don't wipe them out humanity is doomed.
So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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Answer with a question.
Is it heroic to kill in order to protect?
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So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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Answer with a question.
Is it heroic to kill in order to protect?
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Maybe not heroic, but it might be required sometimes, in extreme situations.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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Answer with a question.
Is it heroic to kill in order to protect?
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Maybe not heroic, but it might be required sometimes, in extreme situations.
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Would you consider yourself a hero afterwards?
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So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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Answer with a question.
Is it heroic to kill in order to protect?
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In this situation, where we have done no wrong where we were the attacked not the attackers, yes. Same as it is heroic to kill in order to save an innocent, or protect a child. Risking one's own life to save another, when that life you are protecting has done no wrong, yes, heroic.
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So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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Answer with a question.
Is it heroic to kill in order to protect?
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Maybe not heroic, but it might be required sometimes, in extreme situations.
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Would you consider yourself a hero afterwards?
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That might depend on the danger involved.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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If it's a case of us getting wiped out or them getting wiped out, which would you choose?
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I'd choose not to introduce a kill or be killed scenario in a game where such a scenario is decidedly unthematic.
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Well i'll make it simple then.
In the scenario I envisage every peace loving Rikti has been killed. All that remains is the Rikti who want to wipe out out, every single last one is dedicated to wiping out humanity. They know it's not our fault, but they want us gone anyway. They won't ever stop, won't quit, won't give in. If we don't wipe them out humanity is doomed.
So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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In my opinion, it's not heroic to commit genocide, whatever the reason.
There would be other options in this case anyway, like looking into a way of barring the Rikti from ever entering our reality again.
[url=http://vox-doom.deviantart.com]Take A Gander At This.[/url]
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Well i'll make it simple then.
In the scenario I envisage every peace loving Rikti has been killed. All that remains is the Rikti who want to wipe out out, every single last one is dedicated to wiping out humanity. They know it's not our fault, but they want us gone anyway. They won't ever stop, won't quit, won't give in. If we don't wipe them out humanity is doomed.
So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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In my opinion, it's not heroic to commit genocide, whatever the reason.
There would be other options in this case anyway, like looking into a way of barring the Rikti from ever entering our reality again.
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The solution would involve portals in some way - they fix anything 
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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In the scenario I envisage every peace loving Rikti has been killed. All that remains is the Rikti who want to wipe out out, every single last one is dedicated to wiping out humanity. They know it's not our fault, but they want us gone anyway. They won't ever stop, won't quit, won't give in. If we don't wipe them out humanity is doomed.
So is it then not heroic to defend yourself, save humanity? Or is it better to die?
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Would it be heroic to fight a war of extermination to save us from extermination? No, I don't think it would. It would be heroic to target their capability to exterminate us while respecting the sanctity of life, even that of our enemies.
Even if we did fight a war of extermination there'd be tipping point beyond which they wouldn't have the capability to threaten us. To carry on wiping out the Rikti past that point would strip us of any moral high ground.
What would be cool is if the hero missions revolved around targeting their technology and command structures, while the villain missions were less sensitively targetted. Heroic missions could be like all those men-on-a-mission stories like "The Heroes of Telemark" and "The Guns of Navarone", whereas the villains could indulge in base terrorism.
Of course I can't see NCsoft making content that could in any way be interpreted as promoting terrorism by letting players play terrorist type missions. That sort of thing would get Jack Thompson a full pardon
a hero is only a hero when he/she saves the day, not when he/she saves one kind and destroy an other civilization.
you kill the attacker, and protect the weak, and in the rikti case you could just destroy there lab.
as they say, un-arm a villain is more heroic then kill the man.
For a future issue do you think it would be a good idea to really turn it on it's heel?
How about either:
1) The Rikti win the war, and in a future issue we the heroes and villains are fighting as an insurgency force trying to reclaim the planet.
2) We win the war and we are now on the Rikti homeworld, all new zones on that world, trying to destroy them completely.
3) Humanity turns on the super beings, heroes and villains are forced to ally in order to survive.
I know it would take a lot of effort and a BIG issue, but I think it would really be fun, and turn the game on it's head.