Yes, everything is speculation at this point.
I was under the impression that we would simply go into a third area "Preatoria" and experience things from the perspective of our "evil twin", not truly switch sides and go into the actual zones of the other faction.
I guess that they could code it* so that your Scrapper couldn't pick up redside exploration badges when cruising Mercy and Cap, and your Brute couldn't pick up explore badges in Atlas and I.P., otherwise you would be looking at doubling up on Accolades.
You could keep your $Inf in Preatoria if you assume that your "Evil Twin" has roughly the same Fame/Reputation in his world as you do in yours. I guess.
*shrug*
*Yeah, "Standard Code Rant" applies.
They have specifically stated that fallen heroes can go to the Rogue Isles and redeemed villains can go to Paragon City.
My question how will PPP/APP work if there side switching.
NeoSaturn-L50 Kat/Regen Scrapper
Paragon Family Swift
NeoSaturn's Deviations
All speculation on my part, but let's try this...
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When switching sides, will we lose all infamy/influence? I would think we will, since it doesn't really make sense otherwise. The cost of switching sides.
[/ QUOTE ]I'm actually speculating no on this one. Though there may be a cost involved, I don't see you losing ALL your inf. From a story perspective, it's not really that hard to argue that the more influence you have as a hero, the more infamy you have as a villain. Superman and some random D-list hero both go evil at the same time... which one makes the news more with their now villainous exploits? The villain to hero explanation is a lot more stretched, but it can still work. Still, gameplay is more important than the story behind it in the end... I'm just saying the story can still work.
In addition to that, I don't see the devs removing all your enhancements when you switch sides, either (unless they really don't want anyone to do it). As such, if they DID remove inf, it would just be common practice to convert all your inf on hand to enhancements, carrying the best ones over with you, and giving the rest of your inf and loot away (or storing it in the SG) before transferring over. If we're thinking about blocking inf transferring from side to side because of the "potential harm" it could do the markets... I wonder which of the two options is really more harmful in the end? (Believe me, if I need to somehow waste a billion influence before my hero can "safely" transfer over to redside, the market is going to KNOW it!)
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If you have a level 50 hero or villain and switch sides, will you also automatically unlock the Epic AT for that faction? I would hope so, but I have my doubts. I think maybe with Going Rogue we should unlock all 4 epic ATs with your first 50 of either hero or villain.
[/ QUOTE ]I can see this one going either way. It'd probably be better if just getting to 50 on any character regardless of AT unlocked it all... but I've thought that since the beginning, before Side Switching was even announced, so...
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If we choose to make a morally "grey" character and tread the line between good and evil, will we be able to visit both Paragon City and the Rogue Isles in addition to Praetoria? I very much doubt this will be allowed, but it really should. If you're "grey", you should be able to visit any zone. Though I'm uncertain how you would go from Paragon to the Isles, or vice versa, without stopping in Praetoria first. It would be nice though, experience both sides at the same time with the same character.
[/ QUOTE ]It's been indicated that if you side switch once, it's not a one-way trip. You can always switch back again later (too lazy to find the quote on this one). So experiencing both sides will be open to everyone (that buys the expansion)... but whether or not morally gray characters can do it at will is unknown. It really depends on a few factors.
First, how do characters that start out neutral work? Do they just play through Praetoria until they're forced to pick a side (and thus conform to playing the game in the way it's currently set up), or can they come and go as they please?
If they can access any zone they want, hero or villain, than what's the trade-off? What do full heroes or villains, who have to side switch the hard way (and HOW hard is it, anyway?) get out of it? Is there any benefit to being full hero or villain (even if you DO switch sides now and then), rather than being morally gray?
I can see it working out in dozens of different ways. There's too many factors to make an accurate guess at this point, I think. So... we'll have to wait and see.
Well the original plans for side switching per the devs way back during I6/COV beta until I7 when it was shelved had the following information.
* You would keep your AT
* You would lose all your inf.
* It would have other costs associated with it. {Note: speculation included loosing all of your enhancements.}
* Originally it would involve a special story arc where you decided the fate of a longbow agents family. Depending on your actions you would switch or not.
* It would be repeatable.
* They had considered possible exploits and worked to prevent them.
Ok additionally Positron at one point indicated a dislike for EPP's on the villain side and PPP's on the hero side. Indications are that they couldn't remove access to this was one of the reasons that side switching was back burned.
The last least to a logical deduction that if you are over 40 you probably will be forced into a respecification and have to select your powers again and have to use the new sides end power pools. If that is the case one can speculate that it will unslot and remove all of your enhancers.
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
List of Invention Guides
Just a thought, but if your char can switch back and forth, BOY, the markets would go nuts wouldnt they? Your ebil marketeers on one side could bring a ton of money over, etc, etc.
At this point they might as well merge the markets.
I really doubt at this point that it'd involve losing all your Inf or enhancements, the player whining would make I14 look well-received.
And I've said before, I don't see why turning hero would make you lose your Patron pools, since the arcs where you get them seem to involve beating up that patron and stealing their stuff. 
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* You would lose all your inf.
* It would have other costs associated with it. {Note: speculation included loosing all of your enhancements.}
[/ QUOTE ]
Honestly, these two things would be really stupid.
Nobody would be dumb enough to let it take their influence. They could just transfer to an alt before doing it. It would just result in complaints when people did it by accident.
Losing enhancements would be even worse. In fact it would punish people for actually investing time in their characters. The best candidates for side-switchers would be people who have no enhancements? Imagine if you had rare IOs or even purples, and the game tried to take them from you if you wanted to switch. That would be even more complaints from accidental switches.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Although if Going Rogue included Villain APPs and Hero Patrons, it would be awesome.
There's been a bunch of Hero Patron threads in my memory, but I can't remember much about them. I'm pretty sure we can come up with interesting sets based on signature characters. Positron in particular could have a cool radiation-themed set... though I wonder, can they set up contacts to be both Task Force and regular contacts?
I am curious as to weather we will see a level increase with this expansion. Take us to level 60.
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* You would lose all your inf.
* It would have other costs associated with it. {Note: speculation included loosing all of your enhancements.}
[/ QUOTE ]
Honestly, these two things would be really stupid.
Nobody would be dumb enough to let it take their influence. They could just transfer to an alt before doing it. It would just result in complaints when people did it by accident.
Losing enhancements would be even worse. In fact it would punish people for actually investing time in their characters. The best candidates for side-switchers would be people who have no enhancements? Imagine if you had rare IOs or even purples, and the game tried to take them from you if you wanted to switch. That would be even more complaints from accidental switches.
[/ QUOTE ]
Keep in mind that this was discussed in I6 at CoV Launch and during CoV beta, back before there were expensive enhancements or any use for money beyond collecting large numbers. Losing influence and enhancements mean losing SOs, which, even at level 50, weren't much more than a three-four million for a full set
That said, it's coming to a point where they may as well merge the markets. After spending some time on the Hero side of things and enjoying my many millions made from selling things cheap and snagging huge bids, the harsh truth of the Villain market is starting to depress me. Few items seem to sell at all, and when they do, they sell for very low prices. Most salvage that even has anyone bidding sells for below vendor price, and most doesn't have a single soul looking to have it. Whether that's due to population differences or the fact that people are off grinding the AP Architect, I cannot say, but I'd enjoy a unified market. We might as well.
Also, I don't believe there was ever a confirmation done about being able to start as a "morally grey" character. I'm pretty sure you'll have to choose whether you'll be a heroic vigilante or an evil conformist in Praetoria, with the option to earn points towards the other side and switch at some point. Even the signature characters being introduced are very much clear - one is a hero, the other a villain. You could probably get very close to neutral, but you're always going to be on one side or the other, never straddling the line as such.
Beyond that, all we really have is speculation that I couldn't guess one way or the other on.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I do recall it being said that we could be a double agent too. In my mind that would neccessitate being able to visit all zones. And it would be a glaring omission if you couldn't start grey and let the moral compass go where it may.
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I am curious as to weather we will see a level increase with this expansion. Take us to level 60.
[/ QUOTE ]
Most likely not, although there have been suggestions of an additional system that can boost the power of level 50s while leaving them still at numeric level 50, and special content that's only available to those boosted 50s.
Character index
[ QUOTE ]
I am curious as to weather we will see a level increase with this expansion. Take us to level 60.
[/ QUOTE ]Dev confirmed: Never happening.
Maybe it will be like Oroborous flashback missions with access to a mission list for either side.
That would be fun.
...I wonder what they're going to do about Accolades?
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That would be fun.
...I wonder what they're going to do about Accolades?
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I'm curious about that too. The +HP/end accolades and Magus are all really annoying to get heroside. So much so that I've never gotten them all because of the farming and time-investment required. Redside at least 3 of my characters have the full set.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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[ QUOTE ]
I am curious as to weather we will see a level increase with this expansion. Take us to level 60.
[/ QUOTE ]
I agree with the others about the 'unlikeliness' of a level cap increase. The Devs have essentially told us it will never happen and I can understand why because far too much of the game would have to be redesigned to accommodate it.
But according to the infamous Market Survey of August 2008 (which has been fairly accurate with the things it has predicted so far) the Devs are already considering an alternative idea along the lines of what Silver_Gale implied where we'd have a "virtual" level cap increase to 60 without the number itself actually increasing. The following quote describes the idea:
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Accomplishments will lead to rewards that will significantly distinguish level 50 characters from one another. One such reward is the Universal Enhancement Slots. Ten Universal Enhancement Slots are available to be earned in the expansion, and each one has the potential of adding significant power to the character, essentially bringing them to a hypothetical "Level 60" once they have earned all ten slots.
[/ QUOTE ]
So with a system like this we'd have a new goal to play towards that would make our level 50s more powerful without actually having to change the numerical level cap value. 
Loth 50 Fire/Rad Controller [1392 Badges] [300 non-AE Souvenirs]
Ryver 50 Ele� Blaster [1392 Badges]
Silandra 50 Peacebringer [1138 Badges] [No Redside Badges]
--{=====> Virtue ♀
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
* You would lose all your inf.
* It would have other costs associated with it. {Note: speculation included loosing all of your enhancements.}
[/ QUOTE ]
Honestly, these two things would be really stupid.
Nobody would be dumb enough to let it take their influence. They could just transfer to an alt before doing it. It would just result in complaints when people did it by accident.
Losing enhancements would be even worse. In fact it would punish people for actually investing time in their characters. The best candidates for side-switchers would be people who have no enhancements? Imagine if you had rare IOs or even purples, and the game tried to take them from you if you wanted to switch. That would be even more complaints from accidental switches.
[/ QUOTE ]
they could just make it so that when you switch sides you are forced to switch to a dual(triple/third?) build made only for that faction you are switching to, kinda like SoA's at 24. that way you still have all your old stuff but you arent able to move things across enemy lines. of course inf would be another subject, i think its justified to strip it but give a warning so people can just pass it along to a friend/alt account.
edit:
actually that could be one of the selling points of the boxed expansion: access to more build slots. im no developer but it sounds simple to code considering we already have dual builds.
It would be stupid and pointless to strip enhancements or salvage when switching, they're the same on both sides.
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I am curious as to weather we will see a level increase with this expansion. Take us to level 60.
[/ QUOTE ]
I agree with the others about the 'unlikeliness' of a level cap increase. The Devs have essentially told us it will never happen and I can understand why because far too much of the game would have to be redesigned to accommodate it.
But according to the infamous Market Survey of August 2008 (which has been fairly accurate with the things it has predicted so far) the Devs are already considering an alternative idea along the lines of what Silver_Gale implied where we'd have a "virtual" level cap increase to 60 without the number itself actually increasing. The following quote describes the idea:
[ QUOTE ]
Accomplishments will lead to rewards that will significantly distinguish level 50 characters from one another. One such reward is the Universal Enhancement Slots. Ten Universal Enhancement Slots are available to be earned in the expansion, and each one has the potential of adding significant power to the character, essentially bringing them to a hypothetical "Level 60" once they have earned all ten slots.
[/ QUOTE ]
So with a system like this we'd have a new goal to play towards that would make our level 50s more powerful without actually having to change the numerical level cap value.
[/ QUOTE ]Yeah, expect PVP'ers to cry foul at this, what's left of them anyways. Super-powered level 50 enters PVP zone and own all the regular level 50. I don't see why the devs are so afraid to raise the level cap.
[ QUOTE ]
That said, it's coming to a point where they may as well merge the markets. After spending some time on the Hero side of things and enjoying my many millions made from selling things cheap and snagging huge bids, the harsh truth of the Villain market is starting to depress me. Few items seem to sell at all, and when they do, they sell for very low prices. Most salvage that even has anyone bidding sells for below vendor price, and most doesn't have a single soul looking to have it. Whether that's due to population differences or the fact that people are off grinding the AP Architect, I cannot say, but I'd enjoy a unified market. We might as well.
[/ QUOTE ]
i'm neither for, or against, merging the markets.
i would like to specifically rebut the suggestion that there is no stock, or worthwhile opportunity, in the redside marketplace however.
over the past few weeks i began to replay some of my villain characters and market dipping for recipes/io's for personal use, not for resale. duirng that time i played a lvl 30 brute and lvl 50 corrupter. a few sf's or hami raids here n there. by few, i mean less than 5 apiece for both characters over several weeks.
in that time, through regular drops and random rewards rolls via the merit vendor, i've made approx 300,000,000. just from recipes, no premade io's, no salvage sold or even posted.
the possibilities are there and patience is the key. obviously the system was not designed to create billionaires overnight, despite the grandstanding of market forum goers about the many billions won or lost in tussles over the price of lucky charms.
the tortoise and the hare my friend, it has some application here.
Kittens give Morbo gas.
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Yeah, expect PVP'ers to cry foul at this, what's left of them anyways. Super-powered level 50 enters PVP zone and own all the regular level 50. I don't see why the devs are so afraid to raise the level cap.
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They aren't "afraid," it's just a bad move for this particular game. Castle has said that players at level 50 are really powerful already. We're at a point where we can already do almost anything as far as powers, slots, and inspirations go. Giving us more of those things as level-up rewards would just make the normal game content silly.
Besides that, this game isn't built on a system that would allow for easy leveling-up past 50. Way too much of the game already "caps" at 50. This game isn't WoW where we can just tack on more levels. Tons of things in the game are "maxed out" at level 50. What would happen to all the signature heroes and villains who are level 50-54? The most powerful gangs in the CoH universe that cap out at level 50? What would happen to mothership raids? Purple IOs? Hami-Os? The game just isn't designed to handle a level increase.
Plus, what about all the people who are level 50? This is a game based on alting and having different characters. I know people who have 20 level 50s. They now have to take all those characters and gain 10 more levels? Yuck.
Nobody is "afraid" to raise the level cap. They just realize it's a dumb thing to do in this game. There are plenty of ways to add end-game content and give players stuff to do that don't involve increasing the number next to your name.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, expect PVP'ers to cry foul at this, what's left of them anyways. Super-powered level 50 enters PVP zone and own all the regular level 50. I don't see why the devs are so afraid to raise the level cap.
[/ QUOTE ]
[EDIT: Looks like Dispari's post beat mine by a few minutes so I guess this post basically supports it.]
I don't think it's a matter of being "afraid" to raise the level cap in this game. I think it's more a matter that they would have to redesign a majority of the game from the ground up to accommodate it.
The fundamental issue is that this game is based on a strict "powers earned a specific levels" model whereas other MMOs tend to be more "skill point" based. In those games it's relatively easy to balance a level cap increase because all it means for character building is that people would have a few more points to allocate to the preexisting skills everyone started with at level one. In this game if the Devs raised the cap from say 50 to 60 they'd have to worry about things like having teir 10 or 11 powers in all the powersets, what levels they would be awarded at, and rebalancing all the critters in the game to allow for them to be levels 55 to (supposedly) level 64. Then after this you'd have to worry about all the enhancements and all the complaining that would happen with everyone's HOs and Purples suddenly becoming obsolete. The list of problems they'd have to deal with would be insurmountably huge.
Basically this game's design does not lend itself to just "flipping a switch" and setting the level cap 60. *shrugs*
The alternative idea of the Universal Enhancement Slots avoids most of the problems I just described. You have to realize that a level 50 with 10 of these slots would effectively be a level 60 in all the ways it would matter for this game except for the number next to your name still being a "50" instead of a "60". People would still have to earn those 10 new slots the same way you have to earn an amount of XP to gain a level now so it would be pretty much like having to earn 10 levels of XP in any other situation. I really don't see how this could cause that much trouble for PvP because in your example it'd effectively be the same difference PvPers deal with now if a level 20 tries to fight a level 30. As far as this game would be concerned a "level 50 with 10 Universal Enhancement Slots" would be a "level 60" character for both PvP and PvE.
Loth 50 Fire/Rad Controller [1392 Badges] [300 non-AE Souvenirs]
Ryver 50 Ele� Blaster [1392 Badges]
Silandra 50 Peacebringer [1138 Badges] [No Redside Badges]
--{=====> Virtue ♀
The more I think about Going Rogue, which I am greatly anticipating, the more questions I have. I do hope some of these are able to be answered before long.
When switching sides, will we lose all infamy/influence? I would think we will, since it doesn't really make sense otherwise. The cost of switching sides.
If you have a level 50 hero or villain and switch sides, will you also automatically unlock the Epic AT for that faction? I would hope so, but I have my doubts. I think maybe with Going Rogue we should unlock all 4 epic ATs with your first 50 of either hero or villain.
If we choose to make a morally "grey" character and tread the line between good and evil, will we be able to visit both Paragon City and the Rogue Isles in addition to Praetoria? I very much doubt this will be allowed, but it really should. If you're "grey", you should be able to visit any zone. Though I'm uncertain how you would go from Paragon to the Isles, or vice versa, without stopping in Praetoria first. It would be nice though, experience both sides at the same time with the same character.
Any other question, concerns, comments? Everything is obviously speculation at this point, but hopefully we won't be in the dark for much longer.