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Needless to say, not all ATs have access to these powers. And so yeah, I question the idea that my Blaster is supposed to feel safer because of [for instance] Confuse; a power he or she doesnt even have access to. I have also never seen KB protect me or anyone from a mez or a sleep, but clearly... sheesh. This is ridiculous.
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Last time I checked, every AT had the capability of taking all of those powers I listed, with the possible exception of Kheldians (Im not sure which power pools get locked out on them, they really are not my cup of tea).
Those are all RESISTANCES, not the powers themselves. Confuse Resistance say is quite limited outside of the AE, but it does have value.
But yes, active mitigation (like KB) reduces incoming attacks significantly and therefore can prevent the mez being fired off in the first place. Taunt resistance is mainly a PvP thing, but placate resistance is very useful versus arachnos mobs.
Something like say darkest night, which effectively floors the enemy to-hit makes the mezzes miss.
Also Aid self is an aggro-magnet ? erm .... no.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
EDIT: due to the fact that these remarks are being taken out of context in another thread, they're removed.
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Last time I checked, every AT had the capability of taking all of those powers I listed, with the possible exception of Kheldians (Im not sure which power pools get locked out on them, they really are not my cup of tea).
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Flight and Teleport.
<QR>
*SIGH*
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Sleep resistance (Currently in health)
Stun resistance (Aid Self)
hold Resistance (Acrobatics has protection and resistance)
immob Resistance (Combat jumping has protection, weave has resistance)
Slow Resistance (Not Truly present, but hasten and superspeed mitigate -recharge and -slow)
Confuse and Fear Resistance (Tactics)
and one that is not available from anyone for a self buff from their primary or secondary
taunt/placate resistance (assault)
Vengance has a whole basket of goodness
Protect(Fear, Knockback, Knockup, Repel),
Resist(Fear, Disorient, Sleep, Immobilize, Hold, Confuse, Taunt, Placate)
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How anyone above grade school can actually read that and not realise its actually listing powers that give reistance to effects I do not know.
Good to know that you STILL dont actually read what you respond to, let alone what you actually quoted.
<edit> to add QR, I know Bill knows this wasn't aimed at him, but just being clear
oh and thanks for the info Bill.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
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Here's a little hint: if you have any kind of a heal enemies will indeed try to target you first.]
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Heres a little hint, no they dont, unless you are talking PvP.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
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And by all means. Stop being insulting, you'll likely be banned for it, eventually.
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Given the fact that you insulted me first in this and other threads, and given the fact that you have flamed the OP and others to hell and back in this thread, I will most likely be banned after you are, Fuzzy Pink Cthulhu.
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Until then stop complaining about 'GOD MODE or NONE'
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When I start taking orders from you you'll be first to know, Fuzzy Pink Cthulhu. Till then, get over yourself.... or use an Inspiration for that. As we all know, Insps. fix everything. 
I hope you do not slot your powers, enhancements are a waste of resources, with so many INSPIRATIONS out there....!
Binary statuses FTL:
Bad
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Psssssssssst! I didn't say jack about you before your first post! =-3
You came in and the last paragraph of your first post was the following.
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p.s Artic, just ignore "rachel." She showed her colors well and truly in the main forums' MA thread; trust me giving her more time is just opening yourself up to more of her trying to tell you what you should be doing every second you're in the game.
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Revisionist History For the Lose!
And if by 'Flamed the OP' you mean 'returned spin with dismissive attitude and vitriol with negativity' you're right!
Inspirations don't fix everything. But they would solve the OPs problem without wasting a ton of Dev Team time to make a set even you've said would be pointless to create (Thanks to your tight builds)
Honestly? I don't -want- a reply to this post. So it's not me flaming you or trying to call you out. I've very quickly cut apart what -tiny- argument you had about Binary mez and your declaration that I was insulting first.
-Rachel-
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Here's a little hint: if you have any kind of a heal enemies will indeed try to target you first.]
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Heres a little hint, no they dont, unless you are talking PvP.
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Yeah, don't know where Bad is getting this from. There is absolutely NO enemy in the game that uses a 'kill the healer' AI. It's possible that they could be introduced, but there are no enemies that have it in the game right now, as per a direct quote from Castle.
The threat formula does not include healing, especially self-healing. Just sitting next to a mob and healing yourself will not get you aggro from him. Sight-aggro may occur, but that is not due to healing. You could easily test this out by healing yourself using this power next to a gray-conned mob.
The only heals that I know of that would cause aggro are ones that affect an enemy in some way, such as Dark Regeneration, Twilight Grasp, Transfusion, and the like.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Here's a little hint: if you have any kind of a heal enemies will indeed try to target you first.]
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Heres a little hint, no they dont, unless you are talking PvP.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, don't know where Bad is getting this from. There is absolutely NO enemy in the game that uses a 'kill the healer' AI. It's possible that they could be introduced, but there are no enemies that have it in the game right now, as per a direct quote from Castle.
The threat formula does not include healing, especially self-healing. Just sitting next to a mob and healing yourself will not get you aggro from him. Sight-aggro may occur, but that is not due to healing. You could easily test this out by healing yourself using this power next to a gray-conned mob.
The only heals that I know of that would cause aggro are ones that affect an enemy in some way, such as Dark Regeneration, Twilight Grasp, Transfusion, and the like.
[/ QUOTE ]I still swear she's not playing the same game everyone else is.
Wow... Hard to believe this thread is still going on. Also hard to understand why so many seem to have so much trouble dealing with status effects in game. Must be either pure hyperbole & exaggeration, or they simply haven't graduated past the "random button-mashing" player level yet.
If you're on a team, you will have others to support you.
If you're solo, you will rarely encounter more than one enemy capable of status effects. If a player can't deal with one single enemy using all the tools at their disposal, they need to just log out & uninstall the whole game.
I've only been playing for a little over a year, but I've ran every AT up to 50, with the exception of a scrapper, and there was never any status effect situation I was not able to deal with by using existing powers, and a rare fallback on breakfrees. To this day, I don't even go out of my way to carry breakfrees on any of my squishy characters. If they happen to have one great, if not, no big deal.
Trying to make all AT's "equal" is just silly.
EDIT: due to the fact that these remarks are being taken out of context in another thread, they're removed.
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They don't like targeted rezzes either, come to think of it. Anyone who thinks Howling Twilight or Twilight Grasp is an aggro-free power is free to go test what I'm saying; HT in particular will draw the wrath of every last NPC in the area pronto. TG draws aggro from the target. Please do not waste your time telling me it doesnt.
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Perhaps that might have more to do with the fact that Twilight Grasp does -dmg, -regen & -to hit or Howling Twilight stuns and has a -regen effect too? The fact those powers cause aggro has exactly ZERO to do with the healing component.
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Targeted or untargeted, but especially targeted.
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Targeted powers will attract attention because they affect enemies (as is obvious). They won't magically attract more attention than those putting out lots of damage or those with taunting abilities (barring an enormous bug which at the moment does not exist). If you use a targeted heal/rez/debuff/whatever on an enemy that has been forcibly attracted to another player (by taunts/damage/whatever), you will not draw their attention. That's just the way the aggro system works.
Powers that do not target enemies do not draw aggro. Period. They will not suddenly ignore their target and run after you because you used Aid Self. It can't happen. You can buff your teammates until your fingers bleed, and as long as you don't affect enemies, they aren't going to pay any attention to you at all.
tl;dr version: If you do something to an enemy (attack them, debuff them, use them as a heal target, whatever), and they haven't been angered by someone else already, they will attack you. If you do something to yourself or another player, and don't affect enemies at all, they will not change their behavior to attack you.
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All this still has little bearing on the fairness of the GODMODE! vs NONE WHATSOVER state of status protection amongst various ATs.
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Which has been addressed previously as a problem with no easy solution, assuming you consider it a problem at all.
We'll always have Paragon.
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Be on a team. Be a Defender, Corruptor or Controller with access to a heal. Targeted or untargeted, but especially targeted.
Watch which person on the team draws a ton of aggro; those NPCs want the healer dead and they want the healer dead now. The most striking example of this I have ever seen was on a blueside respec trial.
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Completely untrue.
My 50 emp def, 50 /therm corr, 50 controller with med pool, and 50 blaster with aid self do NOT generate aggro like you are saying. I could toss in my 50 kin def and 50 /kin corr as well as my 50 D3 def do NOT generate "a ton of aggro" when teamed.
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They don't like targeted rezzes either, come to think of it. Anyone who thinks Howling Twilight or Twilight Grasp is an aggro-free power is free to go test what I'm saying; HT in particular will draw the wrath of every last NPC in the area pronto. TG draws aggro from the target. Please do not waste your time telling me it doesnt.
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Untrue again. My 50 D3 def does NOT "draw the wrath of every last NPC in the area".
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If you can keep players alive, NPCs don't like you. I've played enough Dark/darks to know. And my Blasters respecced out of Medicine because they got tired of dying. As soon as that pool was gone, problem solved!
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My blaster died because I was generating too much DAMAGE. My D3 def from using DN...
Amazing.
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Anyone who thinks Howling Twilight or Twilight Grasp is an aggro-free power is free to go test what I'm saying
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I don't recall seeing anyone say they were agro free powers. Of course they draw agro, because they affect the mob you are targeting to achieve the heal. Transfusion is the same way.
Try the same test with Heal Other, Cauterize, O2 Boost, Frostwork, Aid Other, Aid Self, Radiant Aura, Healing Aura, Warmth, or any of the other heals that do NOT target an enemy to draw their effect from.
Here's a good test for that: Log into any character with any of the powers I mentioned. Enter a mission that contains enemies with no particular perception bonuses. Have a character with sufficient stealth (an Illuision controller springs to mind) go into the middle of a mob. Make sure you are outside of the natural agro range of the mob and fire a single target heal at the person stealthed in the mob. If you have not already agroed the mob I would be willing to bet nothing happens.
If that doesn't convince you, try the same thing with a stone tank, in Granite, not attacking, and with with Mud Pots turned off. Just to be sure that the tank survives and is not doing anything to increase their agro retention. The lack of any stealth power on the target of your heal (the tank) would be a better test.
The fact that 2 or 3 particular powers that heal cause agro (which no one is disputing, for the record) is NOT proof that all powers that heal cause agro.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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They don't like targeted rezzes either, come to think of it. Anyone who thinks Howling Twilight or Twilight Grasp is an aggro-free power is free to go test what I'm saying; HT in particular will draw the wrath of every last NPC in the area pronto. TG draws aggro from the target. Please do not waste your time telling me it doesnt.
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Perhaps that might have more to do with the fact that Twilight Grasp does -dmg, -regen & -to hit or Howling Twilight stuns and has a -regen effect too? The fact those powers cause aggro has exactly ZERO to do with the healing component.
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Exactly.
Siphon speed, siphon power, and transference are powers which draw aggro due to their debuff portions and have zero heal component.
BI is simply wrong about 'heal aggro' for any current critter, and I can happily cite Castle as the source of that.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
Isn't there a limit on how many foes you can hold aggro on. Maybe she's getting targeted from the bleed over.
That's not heal aggro that's "Well he's busy...there's another one!" aggro.
Aggro cap is 17. A single character can hold the immediate attention of no more than 17 mobs. You can hold more aggro than that, but the mobs won't attack until an enemy is defeated and brings you down under the 17.
That could be what BI is seeing, or she's just not realizing that the Tanker or whoever doesn't have the aggro on a mob, then targets them with a large debuff/heal (Twilight Grasp is one of the largest value Debuff Mods out there, in regards to the threat formula. Howling Twilight is another one. In short: Dark Miasma is a threat fiend, but not because of the heal, but because of the crap ton of debuffs) and gets the aggro.
It has nothing to do with the heal, but with the debuffs.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
[ QUOTE ]
Isn't there a limit on how many foes you can hold aggro on. Maybe she's getting targeted from the bleed over.
That's not heal aggro that's "Well he's busy...there's another one!" aggro.
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It's more likely that she's the first player that has actually affected the enemy, overwriting the initial sight aggro. Players that have done something to an enemy take priority over players that have simply walked into their perception radius.
We'll always have Paragon.
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That could be what BI is seeing, or she's just not realizing that the Tanker or whoever doesn't have the aggro on a mob, then targets them with a large debuff/heal (Twilight Grasp is one of the largest value Debuff Mods out there, in regards to the threat formula. Howling Twilight is another one. In short: Dark Miasma is a threat fiend, but not because of the heal, but because of the crap ton of debuffs) and gets the aggro.
It has nothing to do with the heal, but with the debuffs.
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And toss in if D/D def, then cone attacks like FS, TT and NF could hit mobs outside the tank's (or equivalent) aggro range.
EDIT: due to the fact that these remarks are being taken out of context in another thread, they're removed.
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EDIT: due to the fact that these remarks are being taken out of context in another thread, they're removed.
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this thread rools
Crap, I thought it had been mezzed and killed.
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/pokes head in
/runs away
[/ QUOTE ]
See? Even the OP wants nothing to do with this monster he's created!
See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.