Best pets in a vacuum.
By
Atheism,
Posted on: 2009-06-03 21:40 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
Opps, meant to post this on the mastermind board, not the defender board. My bad.
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
[/ QUOTE ] Think of us as pets if you want. After all, we consider defenders just fillers. 
edit: In all fairness I think of tanks, controllers, khelds, blasters, brutes, stalkers, dominators, corruptors, and VEATs as fillers too.
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
[/ QUOTE ] Think of us as pets if you want. After all, we consider defenders just fillers.
edit: In all fairness I think of tanks, controllers, khelds, blasters, brutes, stalkers, dominators, corruptors, and VEATs as fillers too.
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Now, now. I all fairness sometimes they're not just fillers: they're audience members and fans.
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
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Lol 
In a vacuum, Izd have to say the best pets would be from Necromancy and Bots.
All the others, except the oni, would instantly die when their lungs collapsed from lack of air, and the oni would be useless with no oxygen to fuel his flames.
@Roderick
bots and thugs seem to have the highest DPS and zombies are most survivable.
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bots and thugs seem to have the highest DPS and zombies are most survivable.
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Actually, bots have one of the worst dps. Their advantage is that they survive so well so their dps is better than Ninja/Necro because melee pets way easier. You deal ZERO dps if you are dead. Robots have good aoe damage if you have ways to slow the foes (tar patch for example).
In terms of raw dps, Thug is definitely at the top mainly because they have the range to maintain that dps.
Ninja supposedly has the highest dps when both Jounins are at melee range but like I said, you gotta survive to produce that DPS.
Merc is actually pretty good too once you put procs in them.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
[/ QUOTE ] Think of us as pets if you want. After all, we consider defenders just fillers.
edit: In all fairness I think of tanks, controllers, khelds, blasters, brutes, stalkers, dominators, corruptors, and VEATs as fillers too.
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Now, now. I all fairness sometimes they're not just fillers: they're audience members and fans.
[/ QUOTE ] lol
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
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agreed but as a Kin defender i find the Stone Tanks more useful to me. Luckily they dont need intelligence. All i have to do is the Move Command to the middle of a group and give out SB when needed and it's a golden couple.
Whining about everything since 2006.
Ammo switching for Dual Pistols was my idea:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=135484
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In a vacuum, Izd have to say the best pets would be from Necromancy and Bots.
All the others, except the oni, would instantly die when their lungs collapsed from lack of air, and the oni would be useless with no oxygen to fuel his flames.
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Yup, I thought this exact same thing, hah!
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bots and thugs seem to have the highest DPS and zombies are most survivable.
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Actually, bots have one of the worst dps. Their advantage is that they survive so well so their dps is better than Ninja/Necro because melee pets way easier. You deal ZERO dps if you are dead. Robots have good aoe damage if you have ways to slow the foes (tar patch for example).
In terms of raw dps, Thug is definitely at the top mainly because they have the range to maintain that dps.
Ninja supposedly has the highest dps when both Jounins are at melee range but like I said, you gotta survive to produce that DPS.
Merc is actually pretty good too once you put procs in them.
[/ QUOTE ]And both Bots and Thugs have better survivability than Zombies do. It's fairly trivial to cap their defense due to the Force Shields from Protector Bots (7.5% base, x2 for all but Protector Bots and MM), and the Maneuvers from Enforcers (8.5% base, x2 for all Thugs).
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
[/ QUOTE ] Think of us as pets if you want. After all, we consider defenders just fillers.
edit: In all fairness I think of tanks, controllers, khelds, blasters, brutes, stalkers, dominators, corruptors, and VEATs as fillers too.
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Now, now. I all fairness sometimes they're not just fillers: they're audience members and fans.
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Or plucky comic relief. And/or Vengeance bait.
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
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Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
[/ QUOTE ] Think of us as pets if you want. After all, we consider defenders just fillers.
edit: In all fairness I think of tanks, controllers, khelds, blasters, brutes, stalkers, dominators, corruptors, and VEATs as fillers too.
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Now, now. I all fairness sometimes they're not just fillers: they're audience members and fans.
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Or plucky comic relief. And/or Vengeance bait.
[/ QUOTE ]No, Blasters and Sidekicks are Vengeance bait.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?
[/ QUOTE ]
Six scrappers. Still far and away the best pets defenders get. Usually not quite as smart as the AI, but that's why defenders have that "team chat" command option.
[/ QUOTE ] Think of us as pets if you want. After all, we consider defenders just fillers.
edit: In all fairness I think of tanks, controllers, khelds, blasters, brutes, stalkers, dominators, corruptors, and VEATs as fillers too.
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Now, now. I all fairness sometimes they're not just fillers: they're audience members and fans.
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Or plucky comic relief. And/or Vengeance bait.
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And they should all be wearing red shirts. 
answered in the MM forum. thugs > all
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In a vacuum, Izd have to say the best pets would be from Necromancy and Bots.
All the others, except the oni, would instantly die when their lungs collapsed from lack of air, and the oni would be useless with no oxygen to fuel his flames.
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If we're allowed to look outside MMs, Singularity would be a good choice as well.
Suggestions:
Super Packs Done Right
Influence Sink: IO Level Mod/Recrafting
Random Merit Rolls: Scale cost by Toon Level
reposting from MM forums.
defense is far more important in today's game than resists and wiht pets with tiny health pools. when you consider that the probots only get one bubble each vs. the enforcers both getting both manuevers you start to realize that thugs is simply not squishy. the enforcers and the bruiser also have decent resists on top of the defense. each probot bubble and each enforcer manuevers is 7.5% base defense. the real difference is the manuevers cant fall off and STAY OFF if yo uare in the middle of a long fight for periods of time. both primaries have the exact same amount of +defense.
you dont actually give up any dmg to slot enforcers with two io def buffs. probots dont have much dmg to start. slotting 4 acc/dam pet io's caps them in both although you will want one to be an acc/dam/end for both tier 2's.
when you consider you can add 10% more defense and 20% more resistance from 4 io's in gang war - still ignoring the secondary here - thugs wins out entirely.
for the numbers - the probot's shield and enforcers manuevers are both 7.5% defense. both can be enhanced and then stacked for 21-22% defense to all pets EXCEPT The probots bubbles as they cant double bubble themselves. the manuevers is always on - the bubbles wear off.
you cant softcap ALL of the bots even if you are FF unless you also take manuevers since the probots will only hit around 39% from their single bubble, ff single bubbles and ff dispersion bubble. thugs will cap out all pets as traps or ff with no manuevers at all.
to bottom line it all:
my thugs/traps - all 4 pet uniques in gang war, ONE defense buff in enforcers
tier 1 pets: 20% resists to all, 46.5% defense to all
tier 2 pets: 46% resist to letha, 20% resist to everything else, 46.5% defense to all
tier 3 pet: 46% smash/lethal, 26% fire/cold/toxic, 20% resist, 46.5% defense to all
enforcer manuevers also prevent things like confusion and perception debuffs on the pets.
my bots/traps (with one edict of the master defense and one sovereign right resist and TWO defense buffs in probots)
tier 1: 36% resist lethal/cold/psi, 10% resist rest, 41% defense to all
tier 2: 36% resist lethal/cold/psi, 10% rest, 31% defense to all
tier 3: 36% resist lethal/cold/psi, 10% rest, 41% defense to all
(numbers pulled in game, no calculator used)
thugs wins
as for top aoe dmg - it's a wash between thugs and bots. when you consider that slotting achille's heel -20% resistance proc in enforcers and they keep it up at a 90% rate due to having 12 attacks between them that use it and the significantly faster recharging and animating aoe's on thugs it ends up being even. anecdotal: i can team tp into a spawn with fresh pets and once under control the bots will melt them faster. i team tp to the next spawn and it's going to be a while before incendiary missiles or any of the aoe's ar eup. in fact it's not uncommon for the assault bot to sit there for up to 10 seconds doing absolutely nothing.
i have both at 50 with identical io builds (traps is pretty cheap to io out hehe). the obvious differences are the extra io's in gang war vs. no repair, and the achilles heel vs. the extra defense buff in the tier 2 pets. when it comes to dealing aoe dmg in a farm - it's a wash. fire bomb does less dmg than swarm missiles but has a substantially faster recharge. enforcers aoe's blow away the aoe's from probots and tier 1 drones. single target dmg bots has nothing on thugs as the bruiser does very good single target dmg especially when combined with an achilles heel proc from enforcers and acid mortar (also with an additional achille's heel proc for both characters). also because the bots arent soft capped i'm replacing pets far more often - especially the probots who with the heal are the overwhelming majority of the sets survivability.
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each probot bubble and each enforcer manuevers is 7.5% base defense.
[/ QUOTE ]Enforcer Maneuvers is 8.5% base, not 7.5%
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
QR
Dustbunnies
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each probot bubble and each enforcer manuevers is 7.5% base defense.
[/ QUOTE ]Enforcer Maneuvers is 8.5% base, not 7.5%
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If City of Data is right, Enforcer Manuevers is 6.5% at level 1, and 8.5% at level 50. Around level 25 or so it should be 7.5%.
I intend to check this out, because it surprises me. Although I can see why henchmen would gain stronger defenses as they go up in level. Why Thugs would get this and not Bots I do not know.
Because Thugs rule 
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
just checked using second build which i've never set on my thugs/traps and they give 8.43% per enforcer at level 50 unenhanced. doing the same on my 50 bots/traps the probots are 7.5% unenhanced
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just checked using second build which i've never set on my thugs/traps and they give 8.43% per enforcer at level 50 unenhanced. doing the same on my 50 bots/traps the probots are 7.5% unenhanced
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Yep, I got the same results from analyzing your numbers in the other thread. So I'd consider it confirmed.
If the way City of Data describes the modifier being applied is right, Manuevers should give increasing Defense per level the same way henchmen Resistances rise due to level.
Just wondering about pet performance, ignoring every other factor. I'm only worrying about the 6 commandable pets with both their upgrade powers.
What puts up the most single target damage, and what's the most survivable?