My brain needs a project.

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As far as I know the Achilles Heel procs don't stack, but those would definitely add a considerable amount of damage.

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I have the Achilles Heel -res proc in Hack, and the Gladiator's Fury -res proc in Headsplitter (hence the importance of the cone). Likewise, Hecatomb in hack, Armageddon in Headsplitter (again, important cone).

The Achilles Heel and Gladiator's Fury procs do stack.

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Yeah, seconds after I hit "Post" and reread what I posted, it dawned on me what you must have meant. (I edited it, too.) Thanks for the confirmation.

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The 2 separate -res procs could easily add that much dps, especially factoring in the speed of the gapped attack chain. The mentioned attack chain generates 3 proc chances every 8.156 seconds. Doing the math (the simple version that doesn't account for redundant procs), you're probably going to get ~14.7% -res over time. 1.147*(203.6 + proc benefit) = 233.53 + (1.147 * proc contribution). I'm pretty sure that the damage procs are going to contribute more than 2.15 dps.

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This is pretty much it. In point of fact, I'm doing about the DPS that Bill suggested for saturated AAO when I'm just dueling the pylon by itself.

In the pylon results thread, it was pretty clear that my BS/Shield is no DM/Shield, but I definitely don't lag as far behind DM/Shield as these results suggest.

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Keep in mind that the AH proc is pretty much the reason why Katana and BS are capable of competing on these the top end damage potential lists. Dual Blades and Claws can both be put up there because they've got impressive DPA and integrated stackable +dam powers. Fire can compete because it's got bonus damage as an innate benefit. Dark Melee does well because it's packing Soul Drain. Katana and BS just have Build Up, which is great for burst but horrible for sustained. The AH proc is the only thing they've got to compensate (and, even then, Claws and Dual Blades can still manage to use it but to a lesser extent).

That's true, Umbral.

The sweet spot in all that though, is that when you're teaming with Broadsword or Katana, those -res procs become force multlpliers, increasing not only your damage, but everyone else's too.

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I guess it sounds like I'm being called out here, so if anybody wants to time me on Freedom, I'll demonstrate.

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My BS/Shield isn't far behind you over on Justice, though I suspect yours is the far superior build.

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Question:

If you're double stacking Rage, does the 10 second crash occur every 60 seconds? It does, doesn't it? I'll need to reduce the overall damage by 1/6th? Wow.

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Sort of. Depends on how long it is double stacked. But yea If you hit it every 60 seconds you eventually will have a 10 seconds of crap every 60 seconds.

This is mainly why I have rage only single slotted with 1 recharge. Enough global recharge to not have too much overlap of the double rage.

So what happens when you hit soul drain around all those mobs and they eventually die off?

Several responses:

I am ignoring procs.

Chaos_String, I did use your chain of HS, Hack, Disem, Hack. Being able to stick the Gladiator -DR in HS to stack with the Achiles' Heel -DR will definitely boost your DPS to nasty levels. Who's going to hate on a 40% dam-res debuff?

So there's no calling you out, there, man. I didn't want to go through the hassle of adding every possible proc that could be added to every attack chain.

HelinCarnate:
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So what happens when you hit soul drain around all those mobs and they eventually die off?

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DM falls lower and lower. As the 10 versus 3 chart showed, DM dropped to the middle of the pack when it only had 3 enemies feeding SD.


Everyone, I'm not out to prove anything one way or the other with this. I can add all the other primaries in.

I can yank AAO and choose SR as the secondary. (Although I'm not sure what the point would be.) Part of me doesn't want to bother with the other secondaries at all due to knowing that /FA can certainly add a lot of damage, but it has to take acrobatics in order to stand next to a pylon without getting knocked on its backside. (2 -KB procs isn't enough) And that rather kills any effectiveness. But I'll probably do it anyway because I am trying to find a way to make my em/fa brute more effective than he is now.

Other items of note not accounted for:
Time to cast Buildup, Soul Drain, Active Defense
Soul Drain might be a wash because it does damage

As mentioned, I'm not taking IO procs into account and we all know the increased effectiveness they provide.

If someone could create a tool that would let me pop in an attack chain and turn on or off buffs including every available proc and taking into account global and enhanced recharge, I'd use the crap out of it. But I haven't found that tool yet.

Great now I have to find a way to work CAK into my build. Either that or settle for an inferior dps chain. I would ask if you are putting in the extra crit from certain abilities in your calculations, but that seems like too much work for what is only a moderate damage adjustment.

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I'm pretty sure that the damage procs are going to contribute more than 2.15 dps.

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Yeah, the -resists are the biggest, but purple damage procs aren't bad either. Probably about 13 DPS in his build and chain.

There's a new -res proc? Please inform, I've been out of the loop for a while.

Fury of the Gladiator, PBAoE -rez 20%, it's a PvP set. Expensive at WW, too. It's great in Sweeping strike and stacking with Ablating's AH proc.

Edit: Now correctly states its PBAoE and not AoE (probably obvious, but...)

Oooh for cones, I may have to rethink my Flashing Steel slotting. It'd be a great time to switch up to 5 purps and that.

Oh man I want to go home and play with builds now.

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Oooh for cones, I may have to rethink my Flashing Steel slotting. It'd be a great time to switch up to 5 purps and that.

Oh man I want to go home and play with builds now.

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I'd suggest putting those in Golden Dragonfly, rather than Flashing Steel.

-Res procs are really best against hard targets like bosses, EBs, AVs and GMs, since they're the ones that will stay up long enough for the -res to go to work. Flashing Steel is a minion shredder, and a little -res on targets which are either dead or gonna die in another hit anyway, doesn't have much impact.

It might be optimal for boss farming though, if that's something you're into.

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Oooh for cones, I may have to rethink my Flashing Steel slotting. It'd be a great time to switch up to 5 purps and that.

Oh man I want to go home and play with builds now.

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I'd suggest putting those in Golden Dragonfly, rather than Flashing Steel.

-Res procs are really best against hard targets like bosses, EBs, AVs and GMs, since they're the ones that will stay up long enough for the -res to go to work. Flashing Steel is a minion shredder, and a little -res on targets which are either dead or gonna die in another hit anyway, doesn't have much impact.

It might be optimal for boss farming though, if that's something you're into.

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Once I swap out shockwave for eviscerate, I'll put the Glad -DR in evisc.

It'ss too bad that using eviscerate in an ST attack chain would seriously hurt the overall damage output. At least that's what my gut tells me. The persistent 15% chance to crit + the -DR proc might make it ok.

Actually in my AV soloing chain FS replaces DA if the enemy isn't lethal or melee based (softcapped to FCEN and close on ranged).

Putting it in GD is an option, yes, but I'd have to reconsider the slotting.

Actually now that I know of the two new important IOs for my character, regardless of price, I should be able to loosen up the slotting on my attacks (silly Mako's Bites). I think I have the perfect setup.

So if I get this right, there is no plan to get the highest DPS chain for Spine, DB or claw.. simply because they can't compete with the other sets? what if people wanted to get this information? since for example.. I have a spine/regen and a db/wp scrapper... I know I could use this, and i'm sure i'm not the only one.

It's just for his testing.

I know there are highest DPS chains for DB and claws lying around, just have to find them or ask for them.

As for spines? Yeah I don't go there.

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So if I get this right, there is no plan to get the highest DPS chain for Spine, DB or claw.. simply because they can't compete with the other sets? what if people wanted to get this information? since for example.. I have a spine/regen and a db/wp scrapper... I know I could use this, and i'm sure i'm not the only one.

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Slapping in all the primaries now, EH.

I also think I'm going to yank the secondary buffs completely.

On that, I will need high end ST attack chains for mace and axe.

And DB! With associated combo information.

DB :

Low recharge chain

BF -> Attack Vitals (AS, VS, SS)
+127% recharge in BF


Medium recharge chain

Empower (NS, AS, BF) -> SS
+213% recharge in BF

Per my testing, the Empower combo doesn't stack properly, unless you wait for about a second, decreasing DPS. Other people have reported it works for them, although I haven't seen videos. You'll have to choose if you want to consider one or two empower buffs for your chain.


High recharge chain

BF AS SS AS
+313% recharge in AS, but becomes more efficient than the other chains before that point. I'm too lazy to calculate it, though, and procs play a big part in that so this might be a chain you're not interested into.

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BF AS SS AS
+313% recharge in AS, but becomes more efficient than the other chains before that point. I'm too lazy to calculate it, though, and procs play a big part in that so this might be a chain you're not interested into.

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Oh why not? I ran with the 304% recharge needed for HS, Hack, Dis, Hack.

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Oh why not? I ran with the 304% recharge needed for HS, Hack, Dis, Hack.

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I think you should choose a recharge allowance that's a bit more reachable, like 270-280. An attack chain that's unobtainable is of little use.

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Slapping in all the primaries now, EH.

I also think I'm going to yank the secondary buffs completely.

On that, I will need high end ST attack chains for mace and axe.

And DB! With associated combo information.

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no nice, thanks Bill

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Oh why not? I ran with the 304% recharge needed for HS, Hack, Dis, Hack.

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I think you should choose a recharge allowance that's a bit more reachable, like 270-280. An attack chain that's unobtainable is of little use.

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270 was the goal. However, Chaos pointed out that even with a .5sec gap between disembowel and the second hack, using much less than 304% recharge, that chain did more damage than the chain I had posted.

So when we get down to the nittygritty, we really need to look at each chain and determine what pauses might exist with 270% recharge and whether they're worth using anyway.

I could go back in and add that half a second to the chain time for BS, but even without the added time, we see where BS falls, so I saw no point in messing with it further.

Anyone know the recharge on:

Gambler's Cut > Golden Dragonfly > Gambler's Cut > Soaring Dragon

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Anyone know the recharge on:

Gambler's Cut > Golden Dragonfly > Gambler's Cut > Soaring Dragon

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GD needs 250%

The chain I used was GD, GC, SD, GC.