Venture's Reviews II: The Nightmare Continues
By
Aisynia,
Posted on: 2009-05-16 24:40 in Mission Architect
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*low whistle* Damn Venture, you tryin' to make War Witch cry?
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I would bet money -- a small sum, but money nonetheless -- that Melissa "War Witch" Bianco didn't go anywhere near the 5th Column TF or SF. I haven't run them, but the description sounds way, way below her average work. I'm not going to say she hasn't done one or two really lame arcs before (Captain Petrovich comes to mind off hand), but generally she does better work than this.
Because, yeah, if nothing else? ANY of the native villains siding with Nazi Statesman is just unimaginably stupid.
But Venture's right, I'd also bet money on that. This close to their planned ship date, they're not going to rewrite those arcs from scratch. They should, no matter how late it makes i15, and they ought to back them up with at least some non-TF, non-SF missions to make the return of the 5th Column some kind of a meaningful event, but they won't. Lame.
Mr. Squid, I've never thought that critically of the LGTF until your analysis. I assumed there was some critical piece of the Rikti storyline that I was missing. I only recently finished the RWZ storyline, I was doing it one mission at a time in dribs and drabs, savoring it across many different alts as I enjoy the the Rikti war so much.
I always thought the portal elements might come up, but they didn't. It makes sense that the Rikti would be looking for a way to power a mega portal to their homeworld, but you're right, that task force does seem to have a bunch of disparate elements in it. Hamidon was stuck in to train players how to run a new Hamidon raid.
Why doesn't the Honoree (who does have a story which ties to the Glacia and Infernia) and HroD'tohz have more heavies like the Riders defending them in the final mission at least? Why doesn't the task force have mini-objectives that can't be failed like the ITF to prevent speeding? Why are the I15 TFs more speedable than either? That said, I like the ITF simply from the standpoint of miniobjectives that make you fight - the team can only speed so much.
(edited for paragraph breaks and wall o' text)
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Well if you don't like it you SHOULD raise a stink about it.
I think I just did.
Your influence could serve to tip the devs into doing something about it.
At this point I don't think anything could be done to these TFs that isn't a superficial change. There just isn't time.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Most teams I've been on who did TFs just barreled through them without regard to story, and without regard to anyone on the team who might be interested in reading the briefings and such. So I've never been on a TF where I had time to stop and try to enjoy what was going on (with the exception of one Posi TF, but I didn't enjoy it).
If I want to know the story, I have to go to Paragon wiki (and I never enjoy it, since I'd rather be able to get all of that stuff while I'm playing the TF). So, I can understand why the devs might be inclined to do a half-hearted story for a new TF, since most players seem to skip over it entirely for the sake of speed, XP, and merits. I don't think that excuses them for doing something mediocre, but I can understand why they wouldn't feel like putting in too much effort for something most people wouldn't appreciate.
Goodbye, I guess.
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Adding to the threadjack: I believe that the senior story writers on the CoX team have been working on Going Rogue since NCSoft bought the IP from Cryptic in late '07. I believe this because the content released in i12 and i13 were, frankly, appallingly bad for the most part - a few of the Midnighter related arcs are OK and the ITF is pretty good, but the VEAT arc is laughable, and the later Cimerora arcs (at least villainside) were so full of wallbangers I'm surprised I still have a keyboard.
So I'm not surprised the i15 TFs are as bad as they are. I think they were written by junior storywriters who Didn't Do The Research.
That said, I also believe that i15 went into open beta at the same quality level other issues went into closed beta, which means there's more leeway for change than players might be expecting if the issue were locked down enough to be in a regular open beta. Make your case and hopefully the devs will realize they're about to put their foot in it.
It's too bad Posi made that crack about the issue being about the 5th anniversary; if not for that remark there wouldn't really be much pressure to release the issue before it was ready, as far as I can tell. I would much rather they fix all these problems than release this issue buggy; there isn't anything in it that we can't wait a little while to get.
And for a while things were cold,
They were scared down in their holes
The forest that once was green
Was colored black by those killing machines
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Well if you don't like it you SHOULD raise a stink about it. Like it or not, you are the metaphorical 800 pound gorilla of the reviewer and lore world, and if you feel the I15 additions to content are horrid, then you should say something.
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While it is amusing to watch Venture rip someone who asks to be ripped, you way way overstate his importance.
I'm with Jetpack, while I agree that Venture does a great service to the community, provides lots of exposure for arcs, and gives some helpful feedback, his tastes are to the player base in general as any other reviewer's taste is to their audience. Drastically different.
The annoyance Venture expresses at minutiae is vastly overinflated in comparison to what your average person would express. It's why we love him. We love to see him rip into something we hated, and we love to hate him for ripping into something we love.
Meta-entertainment at it's finest.
Venture, I hope you take this as a compliment, the line you walk is not a simple one. You do good work sir.
I probably should have said something earlier, since the thread seems to have moved on to criticizing the I15 TF/SF - something that I myself, along with others, requested - but I just wanted to say this, about steampunk:
We also have a pretty good idea about what radiation does, after over a century of study (and quite a few fatalities). And to the best of my knowledge, it does not give you superpowers, or allow you to change your existing ones, or accelerate your metabolism, or... well, any of those other things that it does in comics. (Mostly, it gives you nausea, burns, and an increased risk of cancer, if not prompt death from cell damage.)
So what do we do about it? Tap Positron on his pauldron and politely tell him that he's impossible? Or shrug and acknowledge that those green neon beams and clouds have more to do with magic and popular misconceptions from 50 years ago than science, and go with it?
My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
We also have a pretty good idea about what radiation does, after over a century of study (and quite a few fatalities). And to the best of my knowledge, it does not give you superpowers, or allow you to change your existing ones, or accelerate your metabolism, or... well, any of those other things that it does in comics.
You may notice the "exposed to cosmic rays" type origins have fallen off in comics in the last 20-30 years or so.
People are willing to suspend disbelief when it comes to radiation because radiation affects genetics (badly, in real life, but still) and genes touch on the whole "hidden powers of the brain" schtick that unfortunately too many people really do believe in in real life. This makes it easier to swallow. It's not a question of whether or not it's possible that radiation could do the things it does in comics; it's a question of how much do you have to suspend disbelief to overlook it. Characters using radiation to alter human metabolism are invoking wacky science that doesn't really exist but it's easy to see how it could. Someone building (e.g.) a steam-powered robot that can pass for human and somehow doesn't scream DEFINITELY NOT A NEMESIS AUTOMATON to a heat sensor is breaking most of the laws of physics, starting with the laws of thermodynamics. Steam-powered robots that fool telepathic aliens with technology centuries more advanced than ours...no. Just no.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
You are of course familiar with Clarke's Law? I submit that to the man on the street and possibly the typical comic book reader as well, "sufficiently advanced" starts at about the fourth grade level.
You know better, and so do I. But...
I won't link to the Rule of Cool, but it's really at the heart of this. Your definition of what is "Cool" may (and obviously does) vary from the Devs', but I believe that is their ultimate fallback justification: "Because it's Cool that way."
My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
There are a lot of things in the CoX-verse that completely and utterly violates the law of physics. Heroes and villains flying around in the air despite not having lightweight bones or feathers. People blazing around at 50 mph or jumping to sheer heights. Firing energy blasts from our hands and not having that fry our hands to a crisp. "Arresting" people by smashing them in the face with a mace, axe, sword, or katana and no one get as much as a bruise from it. Frying people's inner body using radiation is considered "heroic," as is setting people on fire, encasing them in a solid block of ice, or electrocuting them with lightning bolts. Teleportation technology violating the Heisenberg uncertainty principle, as well helping everybody be virtually immortal. And so on and on.
All of those not only break the law of physics, they shatter it into smithereens, then violate the corpse of physics repeatedly in inappropriate ways.
I file the Nemesis' "steampunk" technology under the same category that I do everything above. It works that way because it just does, and because it's COOL!
Play my MA arcs!
Tracking Down Jack Ketch - ArcID #2701
Cat War! - ArcID #2788
Guys, Venture's got his opinions, you've got yours. Just leave 'em to him. It's his $15 a month, remember? 
"If I had Force powers, vacuum or not my cape/clothes/hair would always be blowing in the Dramatic Wind." - Tenzhi
Characters
I disagree. Kid $name is brilliant.
Missed this somehow...the problem with it, in this case, is I was using a kid superhero character. Ursus Minor, on Freedom. He's not a "kid" version of an adult super, he's a child superhero in his own right. Calling him "Kid Ursus Minor" doesn't make sense at all.
While the "Kid" appellation is cute, it doesn't work in all cases. The arc works just as well without it.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
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There are a lot of things in the CoX-verse that completely and utterly violates the law of physics.
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I started another thread here to keep this one on track...
And for a while things were cold,
They were scared down in their holes
The forest that once was green
Was colored black by those killing machines
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They can't understand why our heroes might not want to join the Freedom Phalanx, or even understand that they've portrayed the Phalanx characters are arrogant, unlikeable jerks at best and sociopathic fascists with delusions of godhood at worst.
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It's not just me, yay!
I take it further, though. I'd say they're so shallow and unlikeable, they can be cited as a primary cause for the IP falling flat on its face whenever it's tried to expand beyond an MMO.
They're not characters, they're avatars. And it shows.
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And I can't even imagine what they were thinking when they decided oft-requested features like player-designed content and flashbacks should be married in the canon to obvious villain plots.
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Ditto.
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While the "Kid" appellation is cute, it doesn't work in all cases. The arc works just as well without it.
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I said the same thing to the author in my comments. In addition, to the best of my knowledge, "Kid" is ussually gender specific in superhero or western comics. Kid Colt... Two-Gun Kid...
Kid Valkyrie just sounds off for some reason. Maybe Young Valkyrie would work better. Maybe substitute "young" for "kid" thruout.
Also, I know you review by request Venture, but would you consider a suggestion. The same author as "Young FP" wrote "Axis and Allies". It just may be the most villainous arc I've yet played. It sets up, and forces the the player along for the ride, the complete victory of the Nazis and 5th Column, including the takeover of the US.
This concept has been used before in novels, films and comics. The Red Skull conquers the world in the current Avengers/Invaders series. But there is always a way out, or at least the suggestion that its possible to resist, an ominous hint of doom for the Reich. In this author's arc there is not even a whisper of that possibility. Total victory, period.
"Axis and Allies" badly needs to be opened up at the end. Or at least make it part 1 of a larger story.
Morally, its the darkest arc I've seen. Just curious to have your opinion of it Venture.
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While the "Kid" appellation is cute, it doesn't work in all cases. The arc works just as well without it.
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I posit that Kid $Name works in more cases than $Name does. I find it easier to swallow that my hero will have a teen sidekick sometime in the future when he's famous, than that my hero, with an established backstory, somehow is a teen for this arc.
This arc is kinda a Teen Titans version. It runs on sillyness and some suspension of disbelief required to accept the static timeline (Clamor, the King still being around). I know I enjoyed the arc immensely as a fun non-canon possible future distraction.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
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Well what I meant is that there is no real connecting thread amongst the missions of those task forces. Lets look at the LGTF for an example.
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Funnily enough, the LGTF has been designed to have a very specific theme: namely, it features all the major setpieces of The Apocalypse of St. John. So it's a bad example of "TFs that follow no set theme", but a very good example of "TFs that make absolutely no internal sense because the Devs were following their own crazy logic".
Character index
I posit that Kid $Name works in more cases than $Name does.
I don't care if it works in more cases than not; it doesn't work in enough cases to warrant not using it.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
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I posit that Kid $Name works in more cases than $Name does.
I don't care if it works in more cases than not; it doesn't work in enough cases to warrant using it.
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Fixed for you, assuming you've not shifted your PoV.
Alternatively you could have said : It fails to work in enough cases to warrant not using it.
As opposed to $Name, which only ever works if your hero just so happens to be A: teen B: from the future C: interested in joining the Teen Phalanx?
My point stands.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
As opposed to $Name, which only ever works if your hero just so happens to be A: teen B: from the future C: interested in joining the Teen Phalanx?
Presumably a player that clicks on an arc that says "this arc assumes you're a teen hero" will not be put off by the arc actually assuming he is a teen hero.
Prefixing "Kid" to the player's name assumes the character is not a teen hero, that he is the sidekick of an adult version of himself and that he is not already named "Kid Something". If I had run the arc with a hypothetical "Kid Venture" or "Venture Lad", it would be constantly calling me "Kid Kid Venture"..."Kid Venture Lad"...blech.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Yet you didn't, partly because characters with that particular name aren't all that common in the vast sea of characters period.
End of the (my) line, it's not perfect, but it's the best way to do it. We now return you to the regularly scheulded awesome.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
Yet you didn't, partly because characters with that particular name aren't all that common in the vast sea of characters period.
Actually I did, the character's name was Ursus Minor. "Kid Ursus Minor" is a bit redundant and more than a bit grating.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Well if you don't like it you SHOULD raise a stink about it. Like it or not, you are the metaphorical 800 pound gorilla of the reviewer and lore world, and if you feel the I15 additions to content are horrid, then you should say something. We must remember that these TF's have not been warmly recieved, and there are numerous other people who would agree with you. Your influence could serve to tip the devs into doing something about it.
After all, despite what they may or may not be doing to the lore, we do have a dev team that has demonstrated time and time again that it listens to its playerbase.