MA cliches: What to avoid in your new Arc.
By
Aces_High,
Posted on: 2009-04-22 06:15 in Mission Architect
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One of the biggest attractions of this system is to be able to run your character's origin stories in actuality rather than just in your head. That's not exactly a vanity story.
[/ QUOTE ]That's one of the biggest attractions?
Really?
"Gengis Khan is stabbing Abraham Lincoln while Dick Tracy stares at Geordi with an erotic look in his eye again!"
Very stressful. I'll be in the holo-shed.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
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"Gengis Khan is stabbing Abraham Lincoln while Dick Tracy stares at Geordi with an erotic look in his eye again!"
Very stressful. I'll be in the holo-shed.
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I... read that as Genghis Khan stabbing Abe Lincoln WITH his D-
... nevermind.
-STEELE =)
Allied to all sides so that no matter what, I'll come out on top!
Oh, and Crimson demands you play this arc-> Twisted Knives (MA Arc #397769)
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Do we really need another arc about a glitch/virus/someone hacking into the Architect mainframe? Apparently the system was coded by drunken toddlers with brain damage for how easily it craps out.
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Or, y'know, Dr. Aeon. Which amounts to pretty much the same thing.
Character index
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nobody is Shakespeare. Well, except one guy, and he's not really into the forum discussion thing. He's dead.
[/ QUOTE ]That's what his publisher wants you to think. Everything sells better when the public thinks the author is dead.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Boy, nothing like hitting up the old forums to take the wind right out of your sails. Originality is dead and gone and will probably only come again once every few hundred years. Creativity still exists but isn't embraced except by a rare few. Instead, any attempt at it is ridiculed before the idea is even really fully formed in the mind of the creator. For a brief few shining moments, I was dead excited about writing my own missions...until I came to the Forum and found that apparently I was one of the stupid, banal, unwashed masses. How disappointing.
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Originality is dead and gone and will probably only come again once every few hundred years.
[/ QUOTE ]Originality is hiding your sources 
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Well said. Thanks, I think I will.
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Vanity Arcs - We know you have a Villain or a Hero. That's nice. So do we.
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One of the biggest attractions of this system is to be able to run your character's origin stories in actuality rather than just in your head. That's not exactly a vanity story.
Unless you mean specifically those stories that over the top "look at my character and how awesome they are".
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I've so far published one and am working on a couple other arcs that happen to involve some of my characters. I don't think this is a bad thing in and of itself. I don't include my characters because they're my characters. I include my characters because I think they either have, or can contribute to, a story worth telling. I don't consider that vanity any more than I consider it vanity for any other author to write a story about characters he created.
That said, I do take pains not to let any of my characters overshadow the player. The player is the protagonist after all, even if I'm using the arc as a means to convey my character's story. I'm not too proud to let my creations play second fiddle to--or get beaten up by--the player (though, as with any good comic book hero or villain, it can generally be expected that they'll live to fight another day).
I'm not sure I had a point with all that. But if I did, I guess it's that while vanity arcs most certainly exist, the presence of a character the author actually plays doesn't make something a vanity arc. I'm not sure if anyone was suggesting it did. But I figured it was worth saying anyway.
I've written one arc that utilised a friend's character because I loved how it interacted with the story. I'm wondering now if that player's going to get criticized for self-insertion into a story they didn't write...
I wouldn't doubt it :P The best I can gather since launch the reviewers and public don't like:
<ul type="square">[*]An arc with characters based on the creators player list[*]Arcs that have the creators friends in them, character or otherwise[*]Arcs where you use a stranger's character[*]Arcs tat use current contacts[*]Arcs that use current objects as contact[*]An Arc thats about a person's SG[*]an Arc thats about in game canon[*]Arcs that are about a character's view of life[*]An arc with more then a paragraph worth of text in the whole thing, clues included o.x[*]Arcs that use defeat alls[*]Arcs that require you to do something other then beat ot steal something in the last room[*]Arcs that use escorts or allies[*]Arcs that use destroyable or defendable objects[*]Arcs that have bosses with knockback protection[*]Arcs that have Patrols or ambushes[*]Arcs that have a map larger then small is apparently a sin[*]Arcs that use custom critters[*]Arcs that use in game factions other then freakshow, 5th Column or Council[*]Arcs with no Plot, theme, or morale lesson.[*]Arcs with too much Plot, theme, or morale lesson[/list]
So if I get this right, the only proper thing to do is make a radio mission with freaks on a tiny map? I find myself ripping my hair out at the public outcry as I attempt to satisfy them. *facefault*
-C.A.
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So if I get this right, the only proper thing to do is make a radio mission with freaks on a tiny map? I find myself ripping my hair out at the public outcry as I attempt to satisfy them. *facefault*
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Your arc has more than one word in it! And it uses a lot of big words with more than one syllable! ZERO STARS FOR YOU!!!!
Goodbye, I guess.
@Lord_Nightblade in Champions/Star Trek Online
nightblade7295@gmail.com if you want to stay in touch
LOL
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The best I can gather since launch the reviewers and public don't like:
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True. Some of 'em don't.
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
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Vanity Arcs - We know you have a Villain or a Hero. That's nice. So do we.
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One of the biggest attractions of this system is to be able to run your character's origin stories in actuality rather than just in your head. That's not exactly a vanity story.
Unless you mean specifically those stories that over the top "look at my character and how awesome they are".
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I've so far published one and am working on a couple other arcs that happen to involve some of my characters. I don't think this is a bad thing in and of itself. I don't include my characters because they're my characters. I include my characters because I think they either have, or can contribute to, a story worth telling. I don't consider that vanity any more than I consider it vanity for any other author to write a story about characters he created.
That said, I do take pains not to let any of my characters overshadow the player. The player is the protagonist after all, even if I'm using the arc as a means to convey my character's story. I'm not too proud to let my creations play second fiddle to--or get beaten up by--the player (though, as with any good comic book hero or villain, it can generally be expected that they'll live to fight another day).
I'm not sure I had a point with all that. But if I did, I guess it's that while vanity arcs most certainly exist, the presence of a character the author actually plays doesn't make something a vanity arc. I'm not sure if anyone was suggesting it did. But I figured it was worth saying anyway.
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Yeah. It can be tricky, and there are some traps to watch out for. This is true of all kinds of fiction writing, incidentally (or tabletop RPGs, for that matter), where the writer naturally will develop an affection for her characters.
One thing that's very good to do in writing is to work out character backgrounds thoroughly and thoughtfully. The more you know about where a character comes from, the better you'll be able to write him. Where did he go to college? What were his favorite courses? If he's at a party, what will he be drinking? Does he follow baseball? Hockey? What are his favorite teams? Etc.
That's all very good to work out. But what's very bad is when the writer thinks all of that background material has to come out on the printed page. If it's not relevant to the story (this story, the one you're telling now) in some way, just let it inform you, but the reader doesn't need or want to see it.
The problem with "vanity stories" more often than not isn't the fact that it's about the writer's own character. The problem is when the writer treats it as an excuse to go off on a "Let me tell you about my character" monologue. Which if you've ever encountered in real life without some avenue of retreat, you know can be one of the most excruciating things in the world.
So in short, don't be the guy yammering about everything his 18th level D&D character has ever done, in a campaign his audience never played in.
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Vanity Arcs - We know you have a Villain or a Hero. That's nice. So do we.
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Did anyone tell the Devs?
I'm wondering if some of these wouldn't be better classified as TROPES as opposed to cliches, the difference being that a trope is simply a common storytelling device that isn't inherently good or bad.
What makes a trope bad, and turns it into a cliche, is when something is done over and over and over BADLY. For instance, let's take the "Gotta Fight The Contact" Trope. In some arcs, it seems that the contact's intent from the very beginning is to lead you into a trap, and you, as a player, were helpless against falling into it. This can get frustrating after a while, because these missions just keep telling you how much You Suck. You don't want a game rewarding your hard work with insults and betrayal (though to be honest, you can quit a mission arc at any time... the fact that you don't even though you do smell a rat IS your own fault 
), and to have it happen over and over just gets annoying.
By contrast (gotta toot my own horn here, sorry), in my arc, the contact goes to do something decidedly not cool, and you, as a player, take it upon yourself to stop him. He's not after YOU, he's after someone else. If you had been paying attention through the story, you probably saw something like this coming. The difference between this scenario and the one above being that the player isn't the one getting the crap treatment, which makes this use of "Gotta Fight The Contact" more acceptable... at least, I hope so, anyway!
-STEELE =)
Allied to all sides so that no matter what, I'll come out on top!
Oh, and Crimson demands you play this arc-> Twisted Knives (MA Arc #397769)
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I'm wondering if some of these wouldn't be better classified as TROPES as opposed to cliches, the difference being that a trope is simply a common storytelling device that isn't inherently good or bad.
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I'd say most of these are. They're not inherently bad, although they're easy to use badly.
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For instance, let's take the "Gotta Fight The Contact" Trope. In some arcs, it seems that the contact's intent from the very beginning is to lead you into a trap, and you, as a player, were helpless against falling into it. This can get frustrating after a while, because these missions just keep telling you how much You Suck. You don't want a game rewarding your hard work with insults and betrayal
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A prime example of throwing the Idiot Ball that a lot of arcs fall into. If the contact is clearly setting me up, and the arc won't let me do anything about it because it assumes I don't see his intentions, then the arc is telling me that I'm an idiot, and that doesn't fly well. If you want to have the contact stab the player in the back, either make sure you're subtle enough that it's a surprise (which is very hard to do), give the player room to get out of it, or make it clear that the player has no choice but to go along. If you always assume the player is smarter than the contact, you'll avoid these problems.
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For a brief few shining moments, I was dead excited about writing my own missions...until I came to the Forum and found that apparently I was one of the stupid, banal, unwashed masses.
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Bah, don't let us tell you what you can or can't write. We'll be happy to tell you what we think does or doesn't work, but we're just loud, opinionated blowhards. I may not like the "Architect getting bugged" plot, especially because I've seen it so many times, but if you've got an idea to do it well, I'm certainly not going to stop you. Heck, you may just change my mind on the whole thing.
We'll always have Paragon.
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Vanity Arcs - We know you have a Villain or a Hero. That's nice. So do we.
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Did anyone tell the Devs?
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lol
Heh...I want to do my heroes origin story but haven't found the time to do it since I've been farming like everyone else 
Seriously though that was my first thought, but most people make missions that are fun for them. that is what is cool about the MA...Variety.
That being said there are only so many options in there, of course some things will be overused but do you...that is what it is for.....besides farming. 
�The only way to deal with an unfree world is to become so absolutely free that your very existence is an act of rebellion."
@Mr. Magnifico
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I find myself ripping my hair out at the public outcry as I attempt to satisfy them. *facefault*
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The smart thing to do would be to *not try to do that.* Everyone has different tastes and attempting to bend over backwards in order to please mutually exclusive desires on the part of players is a good way to break said back.
It'll also save you from premature baldness.
Current Published Arcs
#1 "Too Drunk to be Alcoholic" Arc #48942
#2 "To Slay Sleeping Dragons" Arc #111486
#3 "Stop Calling Me"
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For instance, let's take the "Gotta Fight The Contact" Trope. In some arcs, it seems that the contact's intent from the very beginning is to lead you into a trap, and you, as a player, were helpless against falling into it. This can get frustrating after a while, because these missions just keep telling you how much You Suck. You don't want a game rewarding your hard work with insults and betrayal
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A prime example of throwing the Idiot Ball that a lot of arcs fall into. If the contact is clearly setting me up, and the arc won't let me do anything about it because it assumes I don't see his intentions, then the arc is telling me that I'm an idiot, and that doesn't fly well. If you want to have the contact stab the player in the back, either make sure you're subtle enough that it's a surprise (which is very hard to do), give the player room to get out of it, or make it clear that the player has no choice but to go along. If you always assume the player is smarter than the contact, you'll avoid these problems.
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I believe that doing stupid things because the contact tells you to is okay if the missions make it clear that your character realizes it's stupid too.
To take two examples at *cough* random. If your Contact is obviously trying to play the whole "Do my dirty work, hero" card, having mission entrance pop-ups like "'Concerned citizen', my ear. You have to wonder how destroying this drug lab will further CONTACT's schemes. Best look for clues as to what he's really up to while you're clearing this place out." lets you know your character's not falling for it any more then you are. Letting the arc end with the contact's schemes in ruins too help.
Or if your Contact insists on living in a different world and calls hell-hounds "puppies" and rifts in the fabric of reality "holes in someone's yard", just make sure the accept texts and mission clues make it clear that your character isn't buying the cover story any more then you are. Sure, the rifts need to be closed, and the demons chased off, but that's no reason to act as if your character is -actually- expecting there to be fluffy little dogs and mounds of dirt when they arrive.
Sometimes things just have to be done. Yes, destroying that Nemesis robot factory will somehow further Nemesis' schemes, but it still needs to be destroyed. So long as you acknowledge to the players that you aren't expecting them or your character to be snowed under by the cover story, I think it's still okay to run with it.
And if you have an actual well-executed betrayal twist, then go for it! Just have Sister Flame play test it first and make sure she doesn't figure it out before the big reveal.
And there's also the ages-old heroic exchange:
"Careful, Batman, it might be a trap!"
"Of course it's a trap! But this is our best chance to get to the bottom of all this, Robin!"
"Seeing a trap is one thing, staying OUT of it is another thing entirely!" -Happosai, Ranma 1/2
-STEELE =)
Allied to all sides so that no matter what, I'll come out on top!
Oh, and Crimson demands you play this arc-> Twisted Knives (MA Arc #397769)
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Vanity Arcs - We know you have a Villain or a Hero. That's nice. So do we.
[/ QUOTE ]
One of the biggest attractions of this system is to be able to run your character's origin stories in actuality rather than just in your head. That's not exactly a vanity story.
Unless you mean specifically those stories that over the top "look at my character and how awesome they are".
Thrythlind's Deviant Art Page
"Notice at the end, there: Arcanaville did the math and KICKED IT INTO EXISTENCE." - Ironik on the power of Arcanaville's math