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Now if you are simply asking that Merits be a tradable resource, or even trade-within-account, I am sorry, but that's not going to happen. Characters of different levels earn Merits at different rates. Merits are supposed to streamline the reward process for that character, and that's not going to be changing any time soon.
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So instead of having 15 of one resource that I can use, I'll have 5 each of three resources that I can't.
That's brilliant.
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And this.
Basically too many 50's to count, but I'm generally a brute/scrapper/tank kind of guy.
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...
So, Posi. If I come down there, and stood in front of your desk, could you seriously look me in the eye and explain to me with a straight face how Base Salvage was confusing?
[/ QUOTE ]That's what I'm thinkin'.
[/ QUOTE ]
Once more, with FEELING!
Basically too many 50's to count, but I'm generally a brute/scrapper/tank kind of guy.
The last thing this game needs is another form of reward currency.
@cozmic
Kid Kozmic - lvl 50 Ill/Emp Controller
Agent Chance - lvl 50 Traps/DP Defender
Venatores - lvl 50 Broadsword/Shield Scrapper
[ QUOTE ]
So, Posi. If I come down there, and stood in front of your desk, could you seriously look me in the eye and explain to me with a straight face how Base Salvage was confusing?
[/ QUOTE ]
you can go take a survey from the other 98% of the game that doesn't view the boards 
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the tears in this thread are delicious
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Pre-issue 6 or should I say pre-issue 5 is when I still felt super play this game. Now most of my toons feel like they are slightly better than a luitenent playing the game. As for as minimum effort, I never said that. I dont mind working towards a goal but at the same time the goal needs to be obtainable in a reasonable amount of time and effort for everyone not just the expert player. 8 to 12 months for single IO is just too long thats what I am saying. If you casually play your alts then chances are its going to take near that kind of time to get 200+ merits.
[/ QUOTE ]
I remember those old days, but the new days we're actually stronger while not being stupidly overpowered.
and where are you pulling 8-12 months from? ...maybe if you never play w/ anyone I guess...
[/ QUOTE ]
200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are too casual to worry about max IOing a toon.
Infinity and Victory mostly
dUmb, etc.
lolz PvP anymore, Market PvP for fun and profit
[ QUOTE ]
The last thing this game needs is another form of reward currency.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm so confused, how many electrum pieces do I need for Pangean Soil now?
Infinity and Victory mostly
dUmb, etc.
lolz PvP anymore, Market PvP for fun and profit
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
the tears in this thread are delicious
[ QUOTE ]
Pre-issue 6 or should I say pre-issue 5 is when I still felt super play this game. Now most of my toons feel like they are slightly better than a luitenent playing the game. As for as minimum effort, I never said that. I dont mind working towards a goal but at the same time the goal needs to be obtainable in a reasonable amount of time and effort for everyone not just the expert player. 8 to 12 months for single IO is just too long thats what I am saying. If you casually play your alts then chances are its going to take near that kind of time to get 200+ merits.
[/ QUOTE ]
I remember those old days, but the new days we're actually stronger while not being stupidly overpowered.
and where are you pulling 8-12 months from? ...maybe if you never play w/ anyone I guess...
[/ QUOTE ]
200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are to casual to have a forum account.
[/ QUOTE ]Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
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the tears in this thread are delicious
[ QUOTE ]
Pre-issue 6 or should I say pre-issue 5 is when I still felt super play this game. Now most of my toons feel like they are slightly better than a luitenent playing the game. As for as minimum effort, I never said that. I dont mind working towards a goal but at the same time the goal needs to be obtainable in a reasonable amount of time and effort for everyone not just the expert player. 8 to 12 months for single IO is just too long thats what I am saying. If you casually play your alts then chances are its going to take near that kind of time to get 200+ merits.
[/ QUOTE ]
I remember those old days, but the new days we're actually stronger while not being stupidly overpowered.
and where are you pulling 8-12 months from? ...maybe if you never play w/ anyone I guess...
[/ QUOTE ]
200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are to casual to have a forum account.
[/ QUOTE ]Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
[/ QUOTE ]
A Lady Grey can be run in 45 minutes.
Infinity and Victory mostly
dUmb, etc.
lolz PvP anymore, Market PvP for fun and profit
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
the tears in this thread are delicious
[ QUOTE ]
Pre-issue 6 or should I say pre-issue 5 is when I still felt super play this game. Now most of my toons feel like they are slightly better than a luitenent playing the game. As for as minimum effort, I never said that. I dont mind working towards a goal but at the same time the goal needs to be obtainable in a reasonable amount of time and effort for everyone not just the expert player. 8 to 12 months for single IO is just too long thats what I am saying. If you casually play your alts then chances are its going to take near that kind of time to get 200+ merits.
[/ QUOTE ]
I remember those old days, but the new days we're actually stronger while not being stupidly overpowered.
and where are you pulling 8-12 months from? ...maybe if you never play w/ anyone I guess...
[/ QUOTE ]
200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are to casual to have a forum account.
[/ QUOTE ]Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
[/ QUOTE ]
A Lady Grey can be run in 45 minutes.
[/ QUOTE ]Casual gamer doesnt have many toons level 45+ if any.
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
[ QUOTE ]
Casual gamer doesnt have many toons level 45+ if any.
[/ QUOTE ]
Speaking of which, I finally reached the 50 merit point with two of my characters. One is level 48 and the other is level 47. I play a lot, but I have a lot of alts, so I'm not going to earn a total of 200 merits on one character for a looong time.
Once Issue 14 arrives, I expect to earn FAR more skeeball tickets over time than merits.
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the tears in this thread are delicious
[ QUOTE ]
Pre-issue 6 or should I say pre-issue 5 is when I still felt super play this game. Now most of my toons feel like they are slightly better than a luitenent playing the game. As for as minimum effort, I never said that. I dont mind working towards a goal but at the same time the goal needs to be obtainable in a reasonable amount of time and effort for everyone not just the expert player. 8 to 12 months for single IO is just too long thats what I am saying. If you casually play your alts then chances are its going to take near that kind of time to get 200+ merits.
[/ QUOTE ]
I remember those old days, but the new days we're actually stronger while not being stupidly overpowered.
and where are you pulling 8-12 months from? ...maybe if you never play w/ anyone I guess...
[/ QUOTE ]
200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are to casual to have a forum account.
[/ QUOTE ]Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
[/ QUOTE ]
A Lady Grey can be run in 45 minutes.
[/ QUOTE ]Casual gamer doesnt have many toons level 45+ if any.
[/ QUOTE ]
So then why would such a person give a poop about not being able to max out his toons?
Infinity and Victory mostly
dUmb, etc.
lolz PvP anymore, Market PvP for fun and profit
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200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are to casual to have a forum account.
[/ QUOTE ]Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
[/ QUOTE ]
A Lady Grey can be run in 45 minutes.
[/ QUOTE ]Casual gamer doesnt have many toons level 45+ if any.
[/ QUOTE ]
So then why would such a person give a poop about not being able to max out his toons?
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DING! DING! DING!
We have a winnah!!
Most casual players don't care. The people who do are the hardcore folks, advocating on behalf of the casual players to make it easier for the casual folks to get their Merits, which would also have the side effect of making it even easier for those same hardcore folks to maximize their Merit gains.
Enlightened self interest, FTW!
Actually, there are some players who are really suffering under the system, as it stands. It's the players who are getting hooked enough that they are no longer casual, but who have yet to learn the tricks of the hardcore players. These players are starting to care about how to get more performance, and are reeling under the sticker shock they get when they try to figure out how much it would cost in any of the in game currency to get the stuff that would make them "really cool." A basic education in playing the market should ease the sticker shock and help them understand how to get the things they need without paying an arm and a leg. With all of the factors that hit the market at the same time (not just Merits, but PVP 2.0 and Dual Builds, too), and the new factor coming in Issue 14 (Skee-ball tickets), using the Market wisely will require more patience than it did beforehand.
New story arcs coming soon (ARC IDs will be aded when I finish the arc):
So, you want to join the Hellions? (level 1-14 Villainous arc)
Sparks & Steel (level 5-20 Heroic arc)
and
So you want to join the Skulls? (level 1-14 Villainous arc)
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I got to say in my 3 years of playing the merit system has really done alot more harm then good. Casual or hardcore, it makes acquiring some of these uber-IO's extremely dificult in a reasonable amount of time.
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I am having trouble imaging any possible way that it is taking longer to get uber-IO's than it was before merits. Unless you did one KHTF before and magically rolled a LOTG or Miracle Global,
They may be more expensive, but you said 'amount of time'. It has decreased. I got 3 of the 'Big Three' total in the entire time TF drops were the old way, and i ran plenty of katies back in my day. I have earned 3 big three since and I have merits spread across a dozen characters still. Unless you ran exclusively Katies or Speedens AND had decent luck with the RNG, it is now MUCH quicker to get what you want.
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Really the only thing that is wrong is not having the option of just geting a random roll OR merits for a reward.
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If you had that choice there would only be one choice (for every TF but two) -- Merits. Why would I choose a random roll for a Positron, when I could get the merits and roll for THREE random rolls. Of course, Speedens and Katies would choose the random rolls. And people would still predominantly run KHTF and Speeden because you get more 'bang for your time'
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200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are to casual to have a forum account.
[/ QUOTE ]Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
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And before merits those people who did not have time for a TF were only able to buy a Numina's with 50-80 million influence. Now they still can still pay 50-80 million influence OR they can get one every year through merits. Whats the problem?
Merits are better than the system they replaced. They are not perfect.
hmm...me thinks I need clarification from a Dev post before i13...think it was BABs that said the Merits and Random Roll Systems couldn't co-exist...now I'm wondering if he meant that as the system wouldn't work at all having both...or just they didn't want both options in there...
I can only see people settling on a Random Recipe Roll for:
Katie TF
Cap SF
Villain and Hero Respec Trials
Eden Trial
I would think (and probably everyone else too 
) the market would be quite happy if both Merits and TF Rolls were available for reward choices
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200 merits is 5 Lady Greys and a Katie if that takes you 8-12 months you are to casual to have a forum account.
[/ QUOTE ]Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
[/ QUOTE ]
And before merits those people who did not have time for a TF were only able to buy a Numina's with 50-80 million influence. Now they still can still pay 50-80 million influence OR they can get one every year through merits. Whats the problem?
Merits are better than the system they replaced. They are not perfect.
[/ QUOTE ]And on top of that, you can still go for random rolls for a tenth of the merit cost of one of those expensive top-dollar recipes.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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Speaking of which, I finally reached the 50 merit point with two of my characters. One is level 48 and the other is level 47. I play a lot, but I have a lot of alts, so I'm not going to earn a total of 200 merits on one character for a looong time.
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I've been playing this game since Beta, and I only just recently got my first 50. Most of my characters are in the mid-30s. I consider myself a casual player, although I don't know if I'd fit the definition by some people's standards here. I do know that if I was serious about this game, I wouldn't be five years into it, playing constantly without dropping my account, and still have only one 50.
In all that time, I have never had a problem for lack of IO's. I IO'ed out my main, because I CHOSE to play a power set that was lacking soloability. I can't really think why I would even consider spending that much time and effort on IOs unless a) I was already 50 or b) I was trying to compensate for a weakness in the build.
The argument that the casual gamer needs IOs misses the point that the idea is that the casual gamer doesn't need IOs.
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Once Issue 14 arrives, I expect to earn FAR more skeeball tickets over time than merits.
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This is so true for me, as well. 
I'm curious how much the influence spammers/factories inform the DEVs decisions when they designing these various new features. You know, those darn emails about X influence for $10 and such. I suppose they would start selling Merits as well if they were trade-able which would distort the market to some degree. It seems to play into their decisions to some degree.
I honestly don't see why tradable merits are such a big deal; they are redeemable for goods that are.
Infinity and Victory mostly
dUmb, etc.
lolz PvP anymore, Market PvP for fun and profit
[ QUOTE ]
Me thinks yall dont know what casual actually is. Casual gamer wont have time to do a tf/sf/trial. You looking at 30 to 45 minutes at best for their time played a few days a week, now spread the play sessions across multiple alts. Now you see how this can end up taking months or years for IOs?
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Sorry, but you've got that wrong. Casual vs. Hardcore is not about how much time you play. It's about your attitude to the game.
You can play multiple hours per week, but if your primary motivation is to just play, and the only work you put into your characters is to make them effective enough that you'll enjoy your play time, you are a Casual Player.
You might only play 2 hours a week, once a week. But if you spend your time, both in game and out, concentrating on maximizing your character, on doing only the content that supports that goal, and getting everything "perfect", you are a Hardcore player.
I play multiple hours per week. I have been on many TFs and Trials. I have multiple characters, and I IO my characters starting at about level 12 (so I don't have to keep replacing expired enhancements -- that the IOs are usually more powerful than regular enhancements is just a bonus).
I am not, by any stretch of the imagination, a Hardcore player, but I spend more time in game than some self-avowed Hardcores.
It's a matter of attitude, not how much time you play.
In my opinion, none of the reward systems in this game have ever been remotely fun, so you can't claim that something enjoyable has been lost by changing it.
Honestly, I don't understand how people can boot up a game and start worrying about efficiency and ROI. Maybe it's because I get bombarded with that all day at work, but I think you're all crazy for even mouthing the word "optimal".
My fun is optimal when I stop worrying about how I can purple out and focus on hanging guys off of lamp posts with knockback, or getting PUGs to roll over Invincible missions, or completing Sara Moore on Invincible, without an emp (7 horrible hours well-spent). In all the time since I started, in beta, no changes made to the game have ever really changed that.
All this bickering over rewards systems is just symptom that the game is not providing rewarding new experiences frequently enough. I hope the mission architect helps to alleviate this. Loot is a bonus, not the goal.
[ QUOTE ]
... even trade-within-account, I am sorry, but that's not going to happen. Characters of different levels earn Merits at different rates. Merits are supposed to streamline the reward process for that character, and that's not going to be changing any time soon.
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Boo.
Of course, I can earn merits faster on one of my 50s, buy a recipe and give it to another character on my account with the help of a friend. Does this make the 'other' character's earn rate higher? It virtually does, but requires a middle man.
It's the same end result, but the middle-man can be taken out with account-wide rewards. Same could be said with influence, recipes, enhancements, salvage etc. I Don't get why the Devs feel like they need to make us jump through hoops. Timesink, I guess.
<Does a bunch of TFs with the most capable character>
<Transfers finished IOs through base storage>
So what's all this I hear about "Untradeable Merits"?
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... even trade-within-account, I am sorry, but that's not going to happen. Characters of different levels earn Merits at different rates. Merits are supposed to streamline the reward process for that character, and that's not going to be changing any time soon.
[/ QUOTE ]
Boo.
Of course, I can earn merits faster on one of my 50s, buy a recipe and give it to another character on my account with the help of a friend. Does this make the 'other' character's earn rate higher? It virtually does, but requires a middle man.
It's the same end result, but the middle-man can be taken out with account-wide rewards. Same could be said with influence, recipes, enhancements, salvage etc. I Don't get why the Devs feel like they need to make us jump through hoops. Timesink, I guess.
[/ QUOTE ]The devs would have to have a majorly defeatist attitude to think "Well, we don't WANT people to do this... but we can't stop them... so we might as well make it as easy for them as possible!"
It's not like the devs WANT you to twink out your lowbie characters, but make you jump through hoops as a time sink. They don't want people to twink (it's generally bad for any MMO, no reason to ever encourage it)... but it's not a big enough problem to worry about, and any potential fix would do more harm to the general players than is worth it.
But that doesn't mean they have any reason to make it easier for you. And as for people who get suckered when a stranger steals the enhancements or influence they said they were gonna help transfer: Well, I don't think the devs lose any sleep over it, to say the least.
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If you insist on pre-I6 performance, then you are no longer a "casual" player. That's really all there is to it - the "casual" player does not need that. The casual player can play the game with just SOs and generics. If you expect to be able to put in minimal effort and get to the greatest heights of power immediately, then really, your expectations are flawed.
[/ QUOTE ]Pre-issue 6 or should I say pre-issue 5 is when I still felt super play this game. Now most of my toons feel like they are slightly better than a luitenent playing the game. As for as minimum effort, I never said that. I dont mind working towards a goal but at the same time the goal needs to be obtainable in a reasonable amount of time and effort for everyone not just the expert player. 8 to 12 months for single IO is just too long thats what I am saying. If you casually play your alts then chances are its going to take near that kind of time to get 200+ merits.
[/ QUOTE ]
This.
Basically too many 50's to count, but I'm generally a brute/scrapper/tank kind of guy.