Discussion - Dev Diary: Designing Day Jobs Feature

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But they did implicitly when they created a second, new set of badges based on the exact same twitch gaming for the upcoming winter event.

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Well they did lengthen the time for the second set.

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There is no other message that can be drawn from that than, "We listened to your concerns about not being able to get those badges, and ignored them."

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I think you are right about the second half of that statement, but I didn't see any evidence that they actually listen to any of the people who pointed out problems with the slope. (When it was briefly on the test server I looked at 2 gates, and their hit boxes were still off. One had half it's height embedded in the slope, the other could be tripped outside the poles.)

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Actually, I don't mind the thirty day earning time, and making those badges a long term goal. But I know that arguing that it isn't fair for the devs to create badges you feel you can't get has already failed to sway them, so you need to find another angle to convince them.

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I doubt even when presented with a logical well thought reason they would change their minds. Case in point: Empath. I've lost track at how many ways I've personally explained the badge is broken (numerically wrong, broken vs designed time frame, and made harder with ED), both before and after Positron admitted it was broken (decimal error that was allowed to continue to exist, despite the fact that any such errors in the players favor are quickly dealt with), yet zero acknowledgment that player concerns are even valued when it comes to badges.

Personally I just think the developers, like a good portion of the people responding here, simply do not understand people who like collecting badges. At that point the badge system as a whole breaks down for those that do like the badge minigame.

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Personally I just think the developers, like a good portion of the people responding here, simply do not understand people who like collecting badges.

Or there is a subset of badge collectors who don't understand the intent of the system and have unrealistic expectations that will never be met.

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Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"

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Personally I just think the developers, like a good portion of the people responding here, simply do not understand people who like collecting badges.

Or there is a subset of badge collectors who don't understand the intent of the system and have unrealistic expectations that will never be met.

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I don't think any of the modification proposals are unrealistic, nor do I believe, at this juncture, that they'll "never" be met. THIS is the time to discuss the system, both for and against, not after its implementation.

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Personally I just think the developers, like a good portion of the people responding here, simply do not understand people who like collecting badges.

Or there is a subset of badge collectors who don't understand the intent of the system and have unrealistic expectations that will never be met.

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Actually, I have stated plenty of constructively possible and realistic suggestions in this thread.

* Is it not realistic to think the developers could cap the off-line timers to 8 hours a day? Entirely realistic. They've already shown that they can limit rewards per 24 hour period.

* Is it not realistic to use invisible "badges" for to gate the greater rewards? Absolutely possible. There are several already existing in the game at present.

* Is it not realistic to have "Day job titles"? They've added titles that you can get at the trainer for the Veteran Rewards Program.

Seems that you have some fairly unrealistic expectations that because you don't care as much about badges as some of the others here, and that we should let our objections remain silent. That truly isn't possible or, for that matter, not your place to decide. If you continue to be nonconstructive in your posts towards me, you will be the only person in my forum ignore list.

I have not asked for the removal of the system, just the portion that is having problems. I also have not received any clarification about several concerns that I've made near the beginning of this thread in my first post in this thread.

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I'd like to throw out a hypothetical question to the people that don't like the 30 days., mostly to satisfy my own curiosity.

You say you don't like that it will take a year to get all the jobs listed. Well, what if the jobs they've given us are only half of the whole list? What about if it's only 1/4?

I don't know how many jobs are actually available, but with the first possibility, even 15 days off line would still take a year to get all of them. The latter possibility means that getting one job every week wouldn't be fast enough.

Basically, is the 'year' estimate only for THESE jobs, or ALL jobs?

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The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.

Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?

A: You crash into another one.

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Basically, is the 'year' estimate only for THESE jobs, or ALL jobs?

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At this point it is a year estimate for only the announced jobs.

If it is only 1/2 or 1/4 of the actual list and the 30 days stands, I think I might well close my account in protest. I say this is because this would no longer be a game that I would want to support.

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Basically, is the 'year' estimate only for THESE jobs, or ALL jobs?

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At this point it is a year estimate for only the announced jobs.

If it is only 1/2 or 1/4 of the actual list and the 30 days stands, I think I might well close my account in protest. I say this is because this would no longer be a game that I would want to support.

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Feeling the need to add my two cents again, but I agree with Snow Globe. I feel strongly enough that this is bad design implementation that if they tried to make me take 4 years to get offline badges, I'd quit outright in protest. I would simply turn my back on my favorite game and never look back.

That said, the posted list said it contained "most, but not all" of the Day Job badges. That means there can be no more than 11 others.

Right, right... crawling back in my box now...

(Oh, and Snow Globe? Venture is the only person in my ignore box. Arguing for the sake of drama is about the most un-cool thing someone can do on an online forum. And his arguments all come down to "you're wrong" or "that's irrelevant" without any giving any reasons to support his side, whatever it may be. )

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Main Hero: Chad Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1396 Badges
Main Villain: Evil Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1193 Badges
Mission Architect arcs: Doctor Brainstorm's An Experiment Gone Awry, Arc ID 2093

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Thanks, both of you. I missed the bit about 'most but not all' and it's always good to make an attempt to understand both sides of any discussion.

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The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.

Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?

A: You crash into another one.

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Basically, is the 'year' estimate only for THESE jobs, or ALL jobs?

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At this point it is a year estimate for only the announced jobs.

If it is only 1/2 or 1/4 of the actual list and the 30 days stands, I think I might well close my account in protest. I say this is because this would no longer be a game that I would want to support.

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I've been a staunch supporter of Badge [censored] rights in my career in the game and I've agreed with many of your Badging Stances, SG. But seriously, you'd quit the game over this issue? Can you explain that to me?

I've become much less of a Badge [censored] since Inventions came out. The task of crafting for Badges broke my desire to "have them all" as it were. I'm ok with that. There was always a list of Badges that had an asterisk in my mind, denoting the fact that I would never earn them in my career in the game. At a certain point, it's just not worth it. I'd rather spend my time playing the game instead of worrying about which Badges I need to work toward.

Anyway. Ramble mode off. I guess I'm just surprised you'd leave the game over this issue.

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Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes

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I've become much less of a Badge [censored] since Inventions came out. The task of crafting for Badges broke my desire to "have them all" as it were. I'm ok with that. There was always a list of Badges that had an asterisk in my mind, denoting the fact that I would never earn them in my career in the game. At a certain point, it's just not worth it. I'd rather spend my time playing the game instead of worrying about which Badges I need to work toward.

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I wouldn't quit, but the number of badges with asterisks would be so great I'd probably just drop all forms of collective badging altogether and stick with accolade-only badges.

Personally, I think that 240 hours to get 2 hours of benefit is too high of a ratio. I understand the desire to not make the game about farming for day job bonuses, but I don't really think the numbers came from anywhere except "Well, it sounds good to me".

Here are my personal preferences assuming no new code:
Full Benefit gained with no badge: 22 hours * 10
Full Benefit gained once badge achieved: 22 hours * 8
Badge achieved with gaining the full benefit twice: 22 hours * 10 * 2

I'll note that with these numbers it still takes a while, but you are still likely to get the power within 10 days instead of two weeks, and even if the badge requirement was kept at 3 grants of the power you could still get it within a month instead of actually needing closer to 40 days depending on actual playtime.

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I'd like to throw out a hypothetical question to the people that don't like the 30 days., mostly to satisfy my own curiosity.


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My issue is that it isn't 30 days. It's 30 * 24 hours, which means that it grants in more than a month. It's just a really, really high number for 1 badge. I expect an Epic badge to take 30 days of real life time to get. I don't expect that every single new badge introduced should be equivalent (in my mind) to an epic badge's requirements.

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Basically, is the 'year' estimate only for THESE jobs, or ALL jobs?

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At this point it is a year estimate for only the announced jobs.

If it is only 1/2 or 1/4 of the actual list and the 30 days stands, I think I might well close my account in protest. I say this is because this would no longer be a game that I would want to support.

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I've been a staunch supporter of Badge [censored] rights in my career in the game and I've agreed with many of your Badging Stances, SG. But seriously, you'd quit the game over this issue? Can you explain that to me?

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At twice the stated list, if I played regularly, I wouldn't get all the badges in 2.5 years (assuming I actually play my badge character, and I do). At 4 times the stated list, it would be 5 years, and I wouldn't even have enough time to get Empath if it were fixed. That is the problem: sure it might be up to 15 extra days for the first badge, but that delay is compounded with every single badge.

What should be basic math is lost on some of the supporters. I figure this is because they only want one or two jobs so they can get the accolade, which is about par for the course when it comes to the badges.

On the other hand I like playing my badge character, even till this day. I got her to level 50 a month after CoV/Issue 6, and was my first level 50. With this system, I'm being told I have to choose between a character I love to play and a mini-game I love to play. I should not have to choose between the two.

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I've become much less of a Badge [censored] since Inventions came out. The task of crafting for Badges broke my desire to "have them all" as it were. I'm ok with that. There was always a list of Badges that had an asterisk in my mind, denoting the fact that I would never earn them in my career in the game. At a certain point, it's just not worth it. I'd rather spend my time playing the game instead of worrying about which Badges I need to work toward.

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I finished up all the Issue 9 badges this last June, except for Master Craftsman, but if I want the day job badge, I have to give that badge up. I am nearly finished the flashback badges (6 of the 40-44 challenge badges left, and about 15 "extra" flashback missions to complete that set).

I too would rather just play the game. But with these badges, I get penalized for actually playing the game. I would have to wait longer because I wanted to play the game. "Wait longer" equals "penalty". It is an incredibly simple equation. I forfeit time toward earning the badge by playing.

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Anyway. Ramble mode off. I guess I'm just surprised you'd leave the game over this issue.

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It would be the straw that broke the camel's back.

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I haven't read all these posts....I mean...jesus.

But I thought I'd add in my own opinion.
Personally, I think you should only be able to achieve one of the accolades. I mean, if you're a police chief and a super hero, you hardly have time to become a physician, no matter how little you actually fight crime.

In fact, I think it'd be great if, when you were limited to only two different day jobs, allowing for only one accolade, essentially removing the element of badges from this part of the game entirely. That would squelch the whole notion that Badge hunters would need to obtain each badge, since they'd never be able to have more than 2, 3 if you include the accolade.

Of course, they could, at any time, give up their job, and choose another, just like in real life. But no one has the time to be a hero, and a professor, and a doctor, and an intern, and a cop, and a shop keeper, etc.

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On the other hand I like playing my badge character, even till this day. I got her to level 50 a month after CoV/Issue 6, and was my first level 50. With this system, I'm being told I have to choose between a character I love to play and a mini-game I love to play. I should not have to choose between the two.

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What is it that makes a badge a badge to you? You seem to be okay with the fact that you can't do every mission, get every IO, get every combination of powers, or complete every other aspect of other things in the game. But once something becomes a badge, then it is now part of a single collection that you must complete.

How is it you are able to separate collecting badges from other items in the game, but not different types of badges from each other? What is it that makes badges part of a single collection to you? Is it the fact that they are all called "badges"? Is it the fact that they are counted together?

Keep in mind that some people might want to collect Day Jobs too, so while making Day Job badges invisible might satisfy your style of collecting, other collectors could be hurt by that change. What could the devs do that would allow those collectors to collect Day Jobs, but still make you not feel you needed them all to complete your badge collection?

Would any of these possibilities be satisfactory to you?

* Count each type of badge separately in the game. In other words, Achievement badges go to one count, Exploration to another, Day Jobs to another, etc. If separating the existing counts wouldn't be feasible, then separate just Day Jobs from the rest of the badge count.

* Call Day Job badges "certificates" instead.

* Show Day Jobs in a separate "skills" window that shows a tree of all the offline skills you have acquired. You could set your title by clicking on a skill.

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What could the devs do that would allow those collectors to collect Day Jobs, but still make you not feel you needed them all to complete your badge collection?


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I have a method that I believe satisfies most, if not all of the complaints, while retaining the system flexibility, in my signature as a hyperlink. It uses existing methods for badge representation to keep Day Jobs to "one" badge entry, while allowing people who want to change their jobs to be able to do so within the current confines of the rules.

I'd be interested in seeing this idea gain more traction. Quite a few readers have commented they like the idea, so I'm hopeful a similar response can be said of the Devs in community suggestions, especially at this period of time.

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I'll answer your questions from my point of view, even though I'm pretty sure you were addressing Snow Globe. These are my answers, and I'm not trying to speak for anyone else by giving them.

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What is it that makes a badge a badge to you?

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If it shows up on the window when you click "Badge" under the nav bar, then it's a badge.

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You seem to be okay with the fact that you can't do every mission, get every IO, get every combination of powers, or complete every other aspect of other things in the game. But once something becomes a badge, then it is now part of a single collection that you must complete.

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I also want to do all the story arcs, even though people can't see my souveniers. But that's more because I want to experience the content than as a collection.

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How is it you are able to separate collecting badges from other items in the game, but not different types of badges from each other? What is it that makes badges part of a single collection to you? Is it the fact that they are all called "badges"? Is it the fact that they are counted together?

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That's pretty much it, for me. If it's called a badge, and it shows up in the badge window, then it's a badge and therefore should be collected.

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Keep in mind that some people might want to collect Day Jobs too, so while making Day Job badges invisible might satisfy your style of collecting, other collectors could be hurt by that change. What could the devs do that would allow those collectors to collect Day Jobs, but still make you not feel you needed them all to complete your badge collection?

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Make them something other than badges? Perhaps the game tracks them as badges, the same way it stores the choosable Veteran Rewards in the badge menu, but they show up in a different menu from the badges? If they're not under the badge window and they don't count towards your character's personal badge total under their info window, then I honestly don't care what they do with them--I'm simply not interested in the Day Jobs system anyway.

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Would any of these possibilities be satisfactory to you?

* Count each type of badge separately in the game. In other words, Achievement badges go to one count, Exploration to another, Day Jobs to another, etc. If separating the existing counts wouldn't be feasible, then separate just Day Jobs from the rest of the badge count.

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No.
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* Call Day Job badges "certificates" instead.

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Yes, if they don't show up in the badge window and aren't counted towards the badge total.
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* Show Day Jobs in a separate "skills" window that shows a tree of all the offline skills you have acquired. You could set your title by clicking on a skill.

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Again, yes, as long as they're not in the badge window and don't count towards the badge total.

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Main Hero: Chad Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1396 Badges
Main Villain: Evil Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1193 Badges
Mission Architect arcs: Doctor Brainstorm's An Experiment Gone Awry, Arc ID 2093

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"Yahtzee" at Zero Punctuation did a review of EVE Online last month that sums up my feelings for any offline reward system pretty well.

The site is hilarious, but this link is absolutely NOT safe for work due to language.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/vide...208-Eve-Online

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Main Hero: Chad Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1396 Badges
Main Villain: Evil Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1193 Badges
Mission Architect arcs: Doctor Brainstorm's An Experiment Gone Awry, Arc ID 2093

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On the other hand I like playing my badge character, even till this day. I got her to level 50 a month after CoV/Issue 6, and was my first level 50. With this system, I'm being told I have to choose between a character I love to play and a mini-game I love to play. I should not have to choose between the two.

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What is it that makes a badge a badge to you? You seem to be okay with the fact that you can't do every mission, get every IO, get every combination of powers, or complete every other aspect of other things in the game. But once something becomes a badge, then it is now part of a single collection that you must complete.

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I've actually done all the heroic story arcs, task forces, and trials. I'm about 75% done villain side. I've built and designed several bases. The rest is because in some cases like IOs there is nothing to complete.

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How is it you are able to separate collecting badges from other items in the game, but not different types of badges from each other?

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Because badges are one aspect of the game. Not 5-7 different aspects. You do realize that this question could be rephrased "How is it you are able to separate your arm from other items on your body, but not different types of appendages from each other?" Of course this change of phrase is absurd, but so is the question.

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What is it that makes badges part of a single collection to you? Is it the fact that they are all called "badges"? Is it the fact that they are counted together?

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Badges use the same system in the game. They are all the same type of reward. It has been this way since issue 2. You can't break apart the system.

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Keep in mind that some people might want to collect Day Jobs too, so while making Day Job badges invisible might satisfy your style of collecting, other collectors could be hurt by that change.

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This line of reasoning might be acceptable if they were already in the live game. They aren't there yet. There is nothing for the developers to remove.

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What could the devs do that would allow those collectors to collect Day Jobs, but still make you not feel you needed them all to complete your badge collection?

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Remove them entirely from the badge system.

Failing that, change how the rewards work to not penalize normal play. I would consider "normal play" to be at most 9 hours (longest current TF lasts about that long) so people could earn a maximum of 15 hours per day. They would need to change the reward times accordingly. Finally reduce the time for all the day job badges, even if it was only by 10 days.

It would take 8 months to earn all the listed badges. For someone dedicated enough to do this award a "Jack of all Trades" accolade.

Example:
Each day can accumulate a maximum of 15 hours. Most rewards take 150 hours or 10 Real Life days of logged out time to reach the maximum benefit. Award the badge at the 2nd milestone. After you unlock the reward, you would need 105 hours or 7 real life days to earn again.

Still gated, still taking into account need for balancing reward vs time, but no penalty for playing the game. Those that only want one or two jobs will continue to reap the same reward as much as they want.

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Would any of these possibilities be satisfactory to you?

* Count each type of badge separately in the game. In other words, Achievement badges go to one count, Exploration to another, Day Jobs to another, etc. If separating the existing counts wouldn't be feasible, then separate just Day Jobs from the rest of the badge count.

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Nope. Still using the badge system.

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* Call Day Job badges "certificates" instead.

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They tried that with gladiators. Gladiators are still badges.

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* Show Day Jobs in a separate "skills" window that shows a tree of all the offline skills you have acquired. You could set your title by clicking on a skill.

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Making a skill system that functions completely independent of the badge system would work. However at this late stage, I'm enough of a realist to know that will not happen.

This doesn't mean that I'll sit back and let the system go ahead without voicing my opinions for what needs to be changed.

They need to do something like I suggested above to make it less punishing to those that care about the badge system yet let people that want just one or two jobs (and accolade) get them.

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I have a method that I believe satisfies most, if not all of the complaints, while retaining the system flexibility, in my signature as a hyperlink. It uses existing methods for badge representation to keep Day Jobs to "one" badge entry, while allowing people who want to change their jobs to be able to do so within the current confines of the rules.


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You are forgetting about accolades for day jobs, including the mythical Renaissance Man(Woman) accolade for having all of them, as well as the badges for having 5 and 10 day job badges.

The idea that players should only have one day job is coming from players, not the devs.

The badges represent things you have done, not *what you are doing*


You still have to go back to locations that you already have the badge for to get a previous buffs or to recharge a day job accolade.

I'd say those charges take a tad too long as well, but it's very much a game balance issue at that point.

BTW, the core difference in our sides of the issue is that yours seems to be "I don't think you should have that", while mine is "I think that's a bit more of a time investment than is really needed."

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And, yes, there are people that "can't wait for the badges", and ones that have to have them "now".


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Name them.



Oh, BTW, the Wizard of Oz called. They need their Straw Man back.

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CaptA for one apparently.
I'm sure if you dig through these forums you will see many more based on what I can guess from the implications in his message.

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I have patience. It's apparently a rare trait these days.


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I farmed Empath. Patience what now?

(of course, I'd never *ever* farm Empath twice. I do have a Hero and a Villain badger, but only one of them will have that badge.)


Side note, months ago I had a conversation with a prominent badger about day jobs joking about how they could make it as awful as possible (or, screw the pooch as my grand parents would say.) One of us jokingly said "I know, make you stay logged out for a month straight.".

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Yeah, I think there are more patience badges, you just have to keep being patient.

I've heard people complaining about the Vet Badges, too.
Oh, how horrid that they should have to play for 15 months for the vet wings!
Sure you can't get recipes for the vet-wings, but how many other kinds of wings can you get recipes for?

The time doesn't have to be continuous. So the month strait didn't happen.
....but none-the-less prophetic or hilarious that it came up in conversation!

I don't think it's awful at all, but then
- I do have a lot of alts
- I don't intend to try to get all the Day Jobs badges on one character
- I don't even intend on getting Day Jobs badges for alot of my characters (because they aren't appropriate)
- I'm only planning on getting Day Job badges that fit character conception or ones that lead to Accolades that are in character conception.
- I will park my characters that I want to get certain Day Job badges at a parking spot for that badge when the Day Jobs go live.
- I won't worry about how long it takes to get the Day Job badges

For my input, I'm now suggesting that once a Day Job Accolade is gained, there should be a period of at least another 30 days before another Day Job badge can be gained...if not longer...

How many Day Jobs can a hero have?
What is this turning into? City of Temp Services?

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How many Day Jobs can a hero have?
What is this turning into? City of Temp Services?


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sorta like this

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Because badges are one aspect of the game. Not 5-7 different aspects. You do realize that this question could be rephrased "How is it you are able to separate your arm from other items on your body, but not different types of appendages from each other?" Of course this change of phrase is absurd, but so is the question.

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It's not absurd. Story arcs, task forces, and trials are all missions, but yet they are considered different types of missions by people, each with a different style of gameplay. Should task forces be removed because some people don't like to team, but want to be able to do every mission?

What about this new Mission Architect system that's coming? Even if people could have done all the dev-created missions, there's no way they could keep up with the large influx of player-created missions.

Should we drop the Mission Architect system so players aren't forced to play for unhealthy amounts of time in order to do them all? Or should we tell them, "Hey, feel free to do all the task forces, trials, and key story arcs, but sorry, you won't be able to do every single mission."

Badges do have a common system in which they live, true. But the methods by which one acquires them varies greatly. And some types of badges will be easier to collect than others. If you want to collect modern coins, that will be easier than wanting to collect coins from ancient times. If you want to get as many Bachelor's degrees as possible, that will be easier to get than as many Ph.D's as possible. Just because two items are of the same general type does not mean they should have the same ease of collectibility.

And whether or not an item is a badge is only one aspect of that item. The activity required to get many of the Achievement badges, defeat X of Y, has much in common with the activity involved in doing Defeat X of Y missions. Exploration badges require an activity similar to the "Go to Location x" missions. And many Accomplishments are given by completing specific missions.

The types of badges seem to have just as much in common with certain types of missions as they do with each other. So why draw the line between badges and non-badges? Why not say all missions and mission badges must be collectible, but non-missions and non-mission badges don't matter?

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This line of reasoning might be acceptable if they were already in the live game. They aren't there yet. There is nothing for the developers to remove.

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How could Day Job badges be part of the game before Day Jobs were? Now that Day Jobs are being added to the game, some people might want to collect them, and use badges as the mechanism by which to do so. But just because you are happy with what is currently available to be collected, that means that someone who wants to collect Day Jobs shouldn't be given the same privilege? The only things that should be allowed are things that are already there?

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Making a skill system that functions completely independent of the badge system would work.

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How is having them called "certificates" and counted separately from badges not functioning completely independent?

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Failing that, change how the rewards work to not penalize normal play. I would consider "normal play" to be at most 9 hours (longest current TF lasts about that long) so people could earn a maximum of 15 hours per day.

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NCSoft does not get money based on how much you play the game. They get money based on how long you subscribe. They aren't penalizing normal play. They are giving constant rewards to everyone who is subscribing. If you're in the game, you still get far better rewards than when not, but now even those who don't have as much time to play are gaining something during every hour.

If their goal is to reward players for every hour subscribed to the game, then limiting it to a maximum per day penalizes the players who don't have as much time to play. I have a feeling that this new system is called "Day Jobs" partially because it's targeted towards players who have them in real life.

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Failing that, change how the rewards work to not penalize normal play. I would consider "normal play" to be at most 9 hours (longest current TF lasts about that long) so people could earn a maximum of 15 hours per day.

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NCSoft does not get money based on how much you play the game. They get money based on how long you subscribe. They aren't penalizing normal play. They are giving constant rewards to everyone who is subscribing. If you're in the game, you still get far better rewards than when not, but now even those who don't have as much time to play are gaining something during every hour.

If their goal is to reward players for every hour subscribed to the game, then limiting it to a maximum per day penalizes the players who don't have as much time to play. I have a feeling that this new system is called "Day Jobs" partially because it's targeted towards players who have them in real life.

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I have to agree here.

Something that's been missing from this discussion, or at least, the parts of it I've read, is the recognition that any issue is founded as a business decision foremost. What changes to the game can they make that will preserve the existing subscriber base, -and- attract even more subscribers? With any change such as this, they've put thought and analysis into how many old players might leave on account of it, how many players who might have left (due to not feeling they're getting their subscription's worth) instead decide to stay, and how many new players might be attracted.

My guess is the day jobs feature will keep a lot of casual players from letting their subscriptions drop. Loyal casual players may well be the most profitable ones to have as well -- they pay their subscriptions, but don't tax the servers much for it.

An in-game friend of mine and I were chatting last night; she's definately a casual player, and is fortunate to be able to play for a few hours one night a week. She remarked at one point that she felt like she would never get a character to level 50. Well, with day jobs, she'll be getting a lot more satisfaction for the few hours a week she can play, and has a much better chance at reaching the higher-level content. I think there's probably a lot of players in that situation, and some will likely elect to keep their subscriptions current because they're getting more character satisfaction for the monthly price.

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