Official Thread for Recluses Victory: PvP Zone
By
Adam7,
Posted on: 2006-05-01 24:15 in Developers' Corner
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2. The spawning at 1 hp thing is almost completely negated if you have a self-heal.
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I wonder how long before Defenders start staying behind at the base, patching up the wounded so they can get back to the war ASAP. I know a few people who might really like this idea...
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It would certainly feel a lot more like an actual battle. Huh... I'd be tempted to roll up a proper defender or corrupter for that.
Be well, people of CoH.
What I continue to see in CoH/V (and especially Recluse's Victory!) is that Range is not a Defense in PvP. If you are lucky you may get a first strike with Range, but from then on the battle is Melee. Hover is useless in PvP also since you either get Held, Teleported, or melee-stunned by a superleaping Melee AT since the Range on ranged attacks in CoH/V is a joke. 80 feet. That's a non-existant distance in PvP. Human opponents defeat 80 feet of range in 1 to 2 seconds. This imbalance should be addressed and balanced in gameplay either with more damage or range or something.
Quixotik
"I did not say this. I am not here." -Guild Navigator
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2. The spawning at 1 hp thing is almost completely negated if you have a self-heal.
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I wonder how long before Defenders start staying behind at the base, patching up the wounded so they can get back to the war ASAP. I know a few people who might really like this idea...
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It would certainly feel a lot more like an actual battle. Huh... I'd be tempted to roll up a proper defender or corrupter for that.
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I always figured that was what going to hospital was for. Felt like an actual battle to me. I'm sick of getting really into what I'm doing, getting one or two shotted by something I never saw, then having a bit of a stretch and look around the room while I rest. Or, since I die a lot, going to make some coffee while I wait to regen naturally. Maybe if it was just Recluse's Victory that this had been implemented on, I could deal with it.
This kind of activity cycle is what turned me off Counterstrike. I hate the idea of getting involved in something, getting interested, and then having to stop and wait for a while before I can continue.
Black Starbeam - The Reciprocators
Making money, not earning it.
there's an SG called the Council Giant Robots on rv 8 right now.
evil arctic sun
archon voss
i also saw heroes too. Cricket and Cuppa.
Level 50 is a journey, not a destination.
▲Scrapper Issues List - Going Rogue Edition▲
If the 1 hp/end thing stays in and expands to all the PvP zones, I will take a character and sit him in the hospitals, while I get the 5 hour badges, and just heal and buff everyone to get them into the battle quicker.
Dawncaller - The Circle of Dawn
Too many blasted alts to list, but all on Virtue.
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If the 1 hp/end thing stays in and expands to all the PvP zones, I will take a character and sit him in the hospitals, while I get the 5 hour badges, and just heal and buff everyone to get them into the battle quicker.
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It's already in all the PvP zones, has been since I7 was released to test.
Black Starbeam - The Reciprocators
Making money, not earning it.
PvP in CoX is not fun, nor is it very Comic Book like. While RV is a fun zone the "reward" for turning the zone is near non existant and then a few min later you're doing it all over again...joy! /sarcasm.
Add to that the abuse of powers by players to kill people off without them even having a chance to fight back and PvP is a total failure in CoX. The Developers attempts at balancing the powers vs each other is sucking all the fun out of the PvE enviornment for a failed PvP enviornment.
Hiding gank squads who just Teleport foe / hold-fear-stun-immobolize / kill you are not fun nor are they encouraging to even want to ever enter a pvp zone. Typical coward-stroke-my-epeen behavior from humans has of course made sure that PvP the way the developers have made it is a total failure, unless they want you to just play tankers/brutes who have the potential to survive and dish out some hurt in return. Forget playing any sort of squishy at all.
Again I will also reiterate that PvP in CoX is NOT very Comic Book like.
There are no cool battles vs your nemesis where cars are tossed around, building sides smashed in by impacting bodies, climbing out of the rubble to dish out the same to your foe. No energy beams being fired at each other and deflected by one shot cast shields and countered by your own beams, etc..
Analysys: PvP = Failure.
It may hold some excitement for some but then why aren't they playing a real pvp game like Counterstrike or WoW or Guildwars thats balanced around such things..though WoW itself has some issues in PvP.
Devs stop wasting time and resources on this PvP crap and start adding to / fixing the PvE game that we all love.
Djeannie's Costume Creator Overhaul Wishlist
Carnie Base
"Once the avalanche has started, it is too late for the pebbles to vote" -Kosh
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2. The spawning at 1 hp thing is almost completely negated if you have a self-heal.
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I wonder how long before Defenders start staying behind at the base, patching up the wounded so they can get back to the war ASAP. I know a few people who might really like this idea...
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I hope this doesn't become the norm.
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Fast way to get healing badges, though. 
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Again I will also reiterate that PvP in CoX is NOT very Comic Book like.
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One could argue that MMOGs in general are not comic book like. Moving on.
Crossposted to the official thread from the debt thread. I'd like my voice to be heard by the devs, I should've posted here in the first place...
Pillboxes, heavies, and the unkillable AVs... there's just too many ways to get debt in this zone.
I like the concept of the zone, and I think it'll be a lot of fun, but I'm going to have to avoid going there until I'm level 50. I don't want to be 4-5 loads of debt behind the eight ball with nothing to show for it except maybe a few points of PVP rep.
If PVP is going to have risk, it needs reward, too. Right now the rewards are:
1. PVP rep. Which isn't really that important outside of badges, or for PVP hardcore. But the game's TRYING to appeal to casual players, too...
2. Prestige. But that's only if you win the zone AND bag some villains before the clock counts down. There are much easier and safer ways to earn prestige that I wouldn't bother "farming" RV for it.
If the rewards are that scrawny, why is the risk so incredibly heavy? It doesn't make any sense. You're better off avoiding RV if you want to get anywhere with your character. Sure, it's fun, but climbing out of a sandtrap of debt afterwards isn't fun at all.
Global @Twoflower / MA Creator & Pro Indie Game Developer.
Mission Architect Works: DIY Laser Moonbase (Dev Choice!), An Internship in the Fine Art of Revenge (2009 MA Award Winner!) and many more! Plus Brand New Arcs for Issue 21!
PvP is NOT fair; nor is "comic book" combat when one gets the drop.
That being said - RV was a pffft for me - and I've come to LIKE PvP. Couldn't get Test to work at faster than "slowly flipping pages" frame rate. For those wondering... that = fatal.
Hard to tell what worked and didn't.
When I went on early, the Heavy was MONEY on taking down a pillbox. Honestly (shhh - don't let it get out!) - too easy.
The pillboxes do too much dmg. Blaster shot once, died in ONE return volley.
Didn't see ANY Doms (sad), nor Defenders (double sad ' the hero archtype... blah blah blah).
OK
1) wish bounty was there
2) more Vert terrain- but not TOO much,
3) Missions?
4) AV's NOT set to SILLY
5) NO frackin' debt / reduced for the last hit crapola
6) limit in how many Heroes OR villains in RV on Live; intro RV1, RV 2, etc when a cap or ratio is set.
7) Will do other thread but... and I love Def's - but Blasters now blow chunks. A Stalker approaches 2 toons, 1 dies, he may/may not get #2. Blaster approaches ANY 2 CoV toons and..... Mo' Debt. HOW is this balanced? And I don't PLAY Blasters since the Devs hate them now.
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Second of all, where the heck are the villain heavies? I see hero heavy stations everywhere, but I've seen one villain station.
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Straight forward from the villain base in the little park area is one, and there's another about a block east of Bravo in a little empty lot between two buildings. I got that one a lot. Not sure where the third one is off the top of my head.
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Oh, also, lots of pillboxes were bugged.
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There was definitely something weird going on with Golf, maybe a couple of the others too, about it not releasing the current affiliation and switching over properly. Forgot about that.
One drawback of the internet is how it has trained so many people to think that one day is a long time.
I decided I'm going to start a huge list of all issues pertaining to level 50 PvP, and this Zone in particular:
FIRST AND FOREMOST ..The constant mez-fest. Every AT in the game can get get a Mez, and SOME At's get a Mez PLUS Mez protection. In PvP, this MUST BE ADDRESSED DEVS AND YOU ALL KNOW IT. Because it leads to the following:
-"Squishies" being unplayable/useless/killed within 2 seconds of the start of fights.
-Constant "Jousting" by Melee chars who take off over HALF your HP's AND mez you in the same hit.
-"Range as defense" being being the most gimped "defense" in the game.
-Maintining Crucial toggles impossible
-"Haves and Have-Nots" situations (*/*/Psi trollers becoming tank mages)
-Forced Min/Max teaming and the exlusion of Debuff-Based Corrs/Defs/MM's....
-Doms only being playable IF they have BF's and their opponents have none = BINARY
-ALL Longbow having Mezzes = Extra squishy Debt and lots of it.
- "SR Scrapper City" ...Ellude means NEVER being held, EVAR...by ANYTHING.
-Killstealing: You finally hold something... some Scrapper/Stalker jerk runs up and takes credit
-NPC Killstealing: Same as above only now you caused someone debt on accident.
-Being chainheld while controlling a Pill-Box = Turrets do nothing (Turrets SHOULD default to aggressive)
-Being TP'd out of bodyguard range and held = instagank (can't change to Defensive mode when held)
How to counter this? I propose that any attack which causes mezzing/immob should in-turn suppress all of that user's own Mez protection for the duration of the mez they attacked with.... exclusively in PvP of course. It's too late to remove mezzing from the game, but we can still make it a fair playing field.
Other issues:
-AV's spawning +4 the pillboxes they're only supposed to "Help" Retake ...This totally Trivializes "Heavies"
-Wardens on every corner...totally owning 90% of Arachnos troops
-Wardens starting fights with MM pets and the pets aggroing back b/c they're set to Defensive
-Most Squishies being worthless for "Heavy" and Pillbox control: IE: instaganked.
-MM's OTH, almost unkillable when controlling Pillboxes. (And My MM only had 3 pets!)
-Scrappers, Brutes, and Stalkers only leaving their bases when their "Ultimates" were up.
-Can only recruit players by watching Broadcast... search window doesn't limit by "Instance"
-/Whoall command should ONLY show players up top... not the ones down inside the bases.
-SS + SJ FTW! ...Every ganker in the game had this... why aren't these toggles mutually exlusive?
-Almost No one is rolling squishy support builds...thus no one is safe rolling squishy support builds...Irony?
-Why don't MM's in bodyguard mode get Teleport-Foe resistance like all other +DEF sets?
-Why doesn't the 1-HP rule penalize everyone equally by applying a No-Regen debuff?
-Why isn't there a gateway to switch Instances directly? ...zoning to G-V first takes too long.
-I also saw people in Every zone, including Mercy and PO... isn't this allowing them to buy INSP's?
And one last.. MAJOR... issue: The "Teaming fixes AT-imbalances" MYTH... Umm, NO. This game currently is NOT built around Teaming balancing out PvP, it's built around Teaming = Better ganksquad and that's all. The AT's that do the ganking solo, still do all the ganking when teamed, only faster. And the AT's that get ganked in 1-on-1 only get ganked quicker by another team. You can't tell me that a Team of Dominators is even remotely comparable in power or ultility to a team of Scrappers. And mixing up the AT's doesn't help either unless they're all Min/Maxxed to become Tank-Mages when combined. IE: Defenders and Corruptors, need a buddy system just to do their jobs... all other low damage or AT's without self-heals/StatuProtecion require a "Pocket-Empath" and Buffbot...
Tell us Devs... is it fair to look at this unfair situation and take it to mean that you Condone "Triple Boxing" in order for any build except Regens / IceArmors / SR/Nin's to be able to compete in PvP? We all know the dataming shows that "buffbots" and "healers" have no incentive to venture out into the fray and actually "participate" actively in PvP... What's up with that and why are you still silent about it after 3 very very long Updates since PvP was first implimented in Issue-4? Are you trying to tell us that only those who can afford 3 accounts should be allowed to choose and compete?
*Note: Will update this list at the end of Friday...minus the rants...for brevity's sake.
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- "SR Scrapper City" ...Ellude means NEVER being held, EVAR...by ANYTHING.
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really?
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Why isn't there a gateway to switch Instances directly? ...zoning to G-V first takes too long.
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there is one, directly opposite the entrance to the top of the base.
Level 50 is a journey, not a destination.
▲Scrapper Issues List - Going Rogue Edition▲
After trying all the "Fragile" ATs during this event I must admit that melees with mez seems to be unfair. On both sides. As a Fragile with a huge glowing target on your back constantly being hunted you shouldn't have to worry about being mez'ed with every 3rd shot from a FoTM melee as well.
I now feel empathy for my squishy friends that have to carry trays full of breakfrees every time they enter a PvP zone.
At least I can feel their pain when I get one shot held/killed by Ghost Widow through both Unyielding AND Unstoppable!
Just replying to the last post to say:
STIIIIIIIIL canNOT zone into RV.
ANYother zone (including missions, bases, etc.), hero side AND villain side: roger-doger, zoning as normal, even with graphics at "we're lagging like a Beta event, Captain!"
However, even with all graphics set to "Warp 10, Captain! (aka "oooooooooooooooooo, featureless masses with warping dimensions" and "frame-rate is capped, but I can't see @#%$!"), fluff off, and every combination otherwise (optimal or sub-optimal): zoning bar goes to 1/5th, stops, computer freezes (graphics crash).
This is the same thing that happened in Beta...except that by setting graphics way down, I could still zone/dostuff. If having an Aegia is the only way to access the new content, color me extremely dissapointed. You guys KNOW Aegia is far from the only graphics card out there: make it work for other cards too!
And I have an NVidia, for those curious...
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Just replying to the last post to say:
STIIIIIIIIL canNOT zone into RV.
ANYother zone (including missions, bases, etc.), hero side AND villain side: roger-doger, zoning as normal, even with graphics at "we're lagging like a Beta event, Captain!"
However, even with all graphics set to "Warp 10, Captain! (aka "oooooooooooooooooo, featureless masses with warping dimensions" and "frame-rate is capped, but I can't see @#%$!"), fluff off, and every combination otherwise (optimal or sub-optimal): zoning bar goes to 1/5th, stops, computer freezes (graphics crash).
This is the same thing that happened in Beta...except that by setting graphics way down, I could still zone/dostuff. If having an Aegia is the only way to access the new content, color me extremely dissapointed. You guys KNOW Aegia is far from the only graphics card out there: make it work for other cards too!
And I have an NVidia, for those curious...
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If you are not running xp you may be screwed my friend.
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Again I will also reiterate that PvP in CoX is NOT very Comic Book like.
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One could argue that MMOGs in general are not comic book like. Moving on.
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This whole game was designed to be a comic book. Your comment adds nothing to the discussion and is not relevant in any way.
Djeannie's Costume Creator Overhaul Wishlist
Carnie Base
"Once the avalanche has started, it is too late for the pebbles to vote" -Kosh
I was throwing buffs all over the place...speed boost just rocks.
And for the record: I got Evil Artic Sun real good. But no screenshots 
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I was throwing buffs all over the place...speed boost just rocks.
And for the record: I got Evil Artic Sun real good. But no screenshots
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you were hidding in a bubble next to a spectral terror and invisible the whole time you sneaky hero!
/shakes fist
(it's an evil fist)
and it was awesome seeing you guys in-game like that. Freaked me right the hell out to walk in and see people in special costumes with familiar names. I actually n00bed out for a second and asked Archon Voss how he got the cool robot arm. he said it was a bicycle accident.
Level 50 is a journey, not a destination.
▲Scrapper Issues List - Going Rogue Edition▲
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After trying all the "Fragile" ATs during this event I must admit that melees with mez seems to be unfair. On both sides. As a Fragile with a huge glowing target on your back constantly being hunted you shouldn't have to worry about being mez'ed with every 3rd shot from a FoTM melee as well.
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Absolutely. Tried a couple Defenders, Controllers, and a Dom.
My kin/dark (which was really a "do I want to continue a live character" test for me as well) did decently - IF she was always hidden. Though Siphons and Transfusions didn't go off very often - partially from the lag (expected, given the event) and partially from armors...
Everything else?
I've gotten mezzed. I'll go make some coffee... Oh, it hasn't worn off yet? I'll go grind beans for more coffee... Look, I'm dead!
The zone *itself* is rediculously mez heavy with the NPCs - and I don't mean the AVs. Any stealth, forget it, get mezzed anyway.The PVE game got annoying for my Blaster with that - made the run to 50 turn into a grind ("I'll get you, mezmerist/sapper/etc... if I ever wake up... ") - and that's without opportunistic Brutes and Stalkers. Or Doms, for that matter.
I *still* say the 1hp/1end thing is just silly. Why bother with the PVP timer then? By the time you're done resting, even with Health and Stamina, and at the port out... the timer's done with. I ended up running out with only a few HP and finding an obscure corner somewhere, hoping nobody'd find me while I rested, or following the emp Wardens around.
Tactic du Jour - Annoy someone, run off and hide in the pillbox's FF. Very popular with MMs, especially, from what I saw.
And - I /bugged this, yes, but didn't see if this got fixed yet - before, I got held/phased by a Drone that moved as I was leaving. I stayed mezzed and phased for 5 minutes before logging - had people trying to CM me, AS me, hit me, anything... yes, it's an odd situation (I was expecting to die, think I got down to 1-2 HP) but ... it's a bit annoying.
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I decided I'm going to start a huge list of all issues pertaining to level 50 PvP, and this Zone in particular:
FIRST AND FOREMOST ..The constant mez-fest. Every AT in the game can get get a Mez, and SOME At's get a Mez PLUS Mez protection. In PvP, this MUST BE ADDRESSED DEVS AND YOU ALL KNOW IT. Because it leads to the following:
-"Squishies" being unplayable/useless/killed within 2 seconds of the start of fights.
-Constant "Jousting" by Melee chars who take off over HALF your HP's AND mez you in the same hit.
-"Range as defense" being being the most gimped "defense" in the game.
-Maintining Crucial toggles impossible
-"Haves and Have-Nots" situations (*/*/Psi trollers becoming tank mages)
-Forced Min/Max teaming and the exlusion of Debuff-Based Corrs/Defs/MM's....
-Doms only being playable IF they have BF's and their opponents have none = BINARY
-ALL Longbow having Mezzes = Extra squishy Debt and lots of it.
- "SR Scrapper City" ...Ellude means NEVER being held, EVAR...by ANYTHING.
-Killstealing: You finally hold something... some Scrapper/Stalker jerk runs up and takes credit
-NPC Killstealing: Same as above only now you caused someone debt on accident.
-Being chainheld while controlling a Pill-Box = Turrets do nothing (Turrets SHOULD default to aggressive)
-Being TP'd out of bodyguard range and held = instagank (can't change to Defensive mode when held)
How to counter this? I propose that any attack which causes mezzing/immob should in-turn suppress all of that user's own Mez protection for the duration of the mez they attacked with.... exclusively in PvP of course. It's too late to remove mezzing from the game, but we can still make it a fair playing field.
Other issues:
-AV's spawning +4 the pillboxes they're only supposed to "Help" Retake ...This totally Trivializes "Heavies"
-Wardens on every corner...totally owning 90% of Arachnos troops
-Wardens starting fights with MM pets and the pets aggroing back b/c they're set to Defensive
-Most Squishies being worthless for "Heavy" and Pillbox control: IE: instaganked.
-MM's OTH, almost unkillable when controlling Pillboxes. (And My MM only had 3 pets!)
-Scrappers, Brutes, and Stalkers only leaving their bases when their "Ultimates" were up.
-Can only recruit players by watching Broadcast... search window doesn't limit by "Instance"
-/Whoall command should ONLY show players up top... not the ones down inside the bases.
-SS + SJ FTW! ...Every ganker in the game had this... why aren't these toggles mutually exlusive?
-Almost No one is rolling squishy support builds...thus no one is safe rolling squishy support builds...Irony?
-Why don't MM's in bodyguard mode get Teleport-Foe resistance like all other +DEF sets?
-Why doesn't the 1-HP rule penalize everyone equally by applying a No-Regen debuff?
-Why isn't there a gateway to switch Instances directly? ...zoning to G-V first takes too long.
-I also saw people in Every zone, including Mercy and PO... isn't this allowing them to buy INSP's?
And one last.. MAJOR... issue: The "Teaming fixes AT-imbalances" MYTH... Umm, NO. This game currently is NOT built around Teaming balancing out PvP, it's built around Teaming = Better ganksquad and that's all. The AT's that do the ganking solo, still do all the ganking when teamed, only faster. And the AT's that get ganked in 1-on-1 only get ganked quicker by another team. You can't tell me that a Team of Dominators is even remotely comparable in power or ultility to a team of Scrappers. And mixing up the AT's doesn't help either unless they're all Min/Maxxed to become Tank-Mages when combined. IE: Defenders and Corruptors, need a buddy system just to do their jobs... all other low damage or AT's without self-heals/StatuProtecion require a "Pocket-Empath" and Buffbot...
Tell us Devs... is it fair to look at this unfair situation and take it to mean that you Condone "Triple Boxing" in order for any build except Regens / IceArmors / SR/Nin's to be able to compete in PvP? We all know the dataming shows that "buffbots" and "healers" have no incentive to venture out into the fray and actually "participate" actively in PvP... What's up with that and why are you still silent about it after 3 very very long Updates since PvP was first implimented in Issue-4? Are you trying to tell us that only those who can afford 3 accounts should be allowed to choose and compete?
*Note: Will update this list at the end of Friday...minus the rants...for brevity's sake.
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If your going to make a crybaby rant try to be unbiased.
How about this! All the Psychic Spiders... EVERYWHERE, constantly attacking people, through stealth, through invisiblity etc. Don't cry about longbow I played both sides, trust me the damn spiders are way WAY more annoying.
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I was throwing buffs all over the place...speed boost just rocks.
And for the record: I got Evil Artic Sun real good. But no screenshots
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Please try a non-stalker villain AT. Thank you.
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If your going to make a crybaby rant try to be unbiased.
How about this! All the Psychic Spiders... EVERYWHERE, constantly attacking people, through stealth, through invisiblity etc. Don't cry about longbow I played both sides, trust me the damn spiders are way WAY more annoying.
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Maybe they haven't played from both sides. So it sucks from both hero and villain sides. What's your point? The reported the one they played from being flawed.
Black Starbeam - The Reciprocators
Making money, not earning it.
The event was extremely fun, but I still feel the need to throw in a few comments.
First up is the signature Villains/Hero's... They are unstoppable, on several of the instances I was in the entire side tried them and got stomped. If it's your intention that when we see them entering the fight that we are just supposed to get out of the way that's fine, but if your expecting us to fight back, that's just not going to happen currently.
The level 54 turrets on the uncaptured pillboxes were about right in my opinion. My MM could "very slowly" take them down one at a time though they were about all I could handle alone. I doubt a "non tank" type class could take them by themselves and any of the tank types need quite a lot of time to do it alone so it's about the right challenge level.
I was dissapointed in the auto level to only 40. I want to test versus level 50's on both sides with all thier powers in play so everyone can see if the APP's/PPP's stack up fairly or if it's completely unbalanced.
In short, the zone is fun, the opportunity to test was also well appreciated, so I'd say it's a big success.