[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Are we allowed to complain yet?
[/ QUOTE ]
Nope not yet. As they say, "We have to wait for numbers".
[/ QUOTE ]
Kinda like we weren't allowed to assume that villain PPPs I7 would all be Patron-themed sets of 4 powers, with no alternate elemental sets, because it hadn't been spelled out in bright neon? 
I prefer calling it a discussion with a critical eye towards likely pitfalls.
I don't think PPPs are gonna be sucktastic except for people who wanted the thematic variety of hero APPs. Their potentcy and utility will almost assuredly be similar to hero APPs, if for no other reason, because the game franchise is going through a very PvP-centric phase right now. Not sure about the merits of the MM sets, though. I'm sure there'll be a lot of initial scutiny of those right off the bat next week or the week after.
dose any one know exactly when i7 is coming out on the training room or live?
It's never a for sure thing. I think I remember once that a red name gave notice that an Issue would be going up the next day, but it's not routine. The only thing close to a routine is that a new Issue has gone up on Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Fridays (as far as I can recall). Any Monday developements are rare because companies tend to hold department meetings and do final checks of reports.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Are we allowed to complain yet?
[/ QUOTE ]
Nope not yet. As they say, "We have to wait for numbers".
[/ QUOTE ]
Kinda like we weren't allowed to assume that villain PPPs I7 would all be Patron-themed sets of 4 powers, with no alternate elemental sets, because it hadn't been spelled out in bright neon?
[/ QUOTE ]
Exactly.
Interesting expectations you guys had for the ambitions of your villains.
Since these Patron Arcs also seem to be our 3rd respec missions, can we expect something like the following?
Will you delve into Ghost Widows darkest desires?
- She wants to destroy the Circle of Thorns! Go get em!
Siroccos shocking secret!
- Sirocco's shocking secret has been stolen by the Circle of Thorns!, go kill em before they can tell the world!
Makos dangerous drive!
- He wants to drive the Circle of Thorns, out of Sharkhead! Go drive em out!
Black Scorpions shadowed past?
- Back in college, Black Scorpion was a.. member of the Circle of thorns! Go kill those who remember his shadowy past!
And can we do the Respec without actually having to take any of these powers?
[ QUOTE ]
Since these Patron Arcs also seem to be our 3rd respec missions, can we expect something like the following?
Will you delve into Ghost Widows darkest desires?
- She wants to destroy the Circle of Thorns! Go get em!
Siroccos shocking secret!
- Sirocco's shocking secret has been stolen by the Circle of Thorns!, go kill em before they can tell the world!
Makos dangerous drive!
- He wants to drive the Circle of Thorns, out of Sharkhead! Go drive em out!
Black Scorpions shadowed past?
- Back in college, Black Scorpion was a.. member of the Circle of thorns! Go kill those who remember his shadowy past!
And can we do the Respec without actually having to take any of these powers?
[/ QUOTE ]
I know there are other SF that don't involve the CoT BUT I hope these have nothing do with them at all, I wanna fight something else in a CoV SF. I figured Mako's would have something to do with the coralax and the others would have involve thier faction of arachnos.
I was hoping that Burke could be a patron, for those of us with more mercenary hearts.
Issue 23: All your base are belong to us?
[ QUOTE ]
Firstly, Arachnos would destroy you, as they busted you out and suddenly you decide to fly solo.
First off, they busted our characters out of jail, and then said "you're on your own". Their own people attack our characters on the streets. They can't suddenly turn around and say our characters owe Arachnos anything.
[/ QUOTE ]
Sure they can. Doesn't mean they're right. I'd say the debt's usually paid off by level 20, around when the PCs bust a few other villains out of the Zig.
[ QUOTE ]
Secondly, there aren't enough hours in the day for Arachnos to even begin hunting down everyone they have a grudge against.
[/ QUOTE ]
In all fairness, if Arachnos as a whole really wanted to actively hunt any given villain, it'd be a short fight. The Rogue Isles are theirs, after all, and most villains aren't really welcome anywhere else.
[ QUOTE ]
That problem is exacerbated when you realise that if they sent troops after any of our characters, they would lose. As EvilGeko pointed out rather a good bit upthread, our characters have killed thousands of Arachnos personell by level 40. Any troops they sent would come back in boxes. They would have to send real talent, something they're obviously short on or they wouldn't be breaking supers out of jails.
[/ QUOTE ]
They're busting supers out of the Zig for two reasons:
1. The Zig's apparently almost as impregnable as Disney Land, and
2. Recluse's little "Project Destiny" thing, as nebulous as that still is.
Yes, by the time you hit level 40, you've wasted thousands of spiders, but not all at once.
[ QUOTE ]
Finally, what would happen if Arachnos did go after the Destined Ones with enough force to pose a real threat? Simple, the Destined Ones would turn to the enemies of Arachnos for protection. Nemesis. The Council. Malta. Even Longbow. All of whom would jump at a chance to get valuable intelligence on Arachnos technology, tactics, bases, troop strengths.... (Though I pity anyone who chose Malta; better to die on your feet than live on your knees.)
[/ QUOTE ]
Assuming that Arachnos decides to go after the Destined Ones as a whole, rather than one or two at a time, and that any of those groups would be willing to put the Destined Ones up in the long term (by this point, Nemesis and Malta are the only ones the Destined Ones haven't directly struck at in numbers similar to Arachnos). If Arachnos got it into their heads to wipe out specific PCs, they'd probably succeed.
Of course, I don't see refusing to work with any of their big bosses as sufficient reason.
In all fairness, if Arachnos as a whole really wanted to actively hunt any given villain, it'd be a short fight. The Rogue Isles are theirs, after all, and most villains aren't really welcome anywhere else.
Neither is Arachnos. Leaving the Rogue Islands would completely eliminate their ability to send large forces after you, though you might have to worry about someone else instead. Still, history is full of examples of groups much larger and more powerful than Arachnos (say, the US government) chasing people who weren't anywhere near supervillain level unsuccessfully.
Yes, by the time you hit level 40, you've wasted thousands of spiders, but not all at once.
You won't have to, unless you're stupid enough to stand in an empty football field and wait for them.
Assuming that Arachnos decides to go after the Destined Ones as a whole, rather than one or two at a time,
Wouldn't make a difference either way.
and that any of those groups would be willing to put the Destined Ones up in the long term (by this point, Nemesis and Malta are the only ones the Destined Ones haven't directly struck at in numbers similar to Arachnos).
Not a big assumption.
If Arachnos got it into their heads to wipe out specific PCs, they'd probably succeed.
Right now, there's a guy named Osama bin Laden who has rather a few people on his trail, and they don't seem to be doing so well. He doesn't even have superpowers.
Arachnos can't keep its own house in order. They're not going to suddenly morph into some monolith of efficiency at the drop of a hat. Frankly I doubt they could catch the Marx Brothers, never mind anyone with real resources.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
[ QUOTE ]
Neither is Arachnos. Leaving the Rogue Islands would completely eliminate their ability to send large forces after you, though you might have to worry about someone else instead. Still, history is full of examples of groups much larger and more powerful than Arachnos (say, the US government) chasing people who weren't anywhere near supervillain level unsuccessfully.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hey, now. It's not the US government's fault that people keep screwing up the spawning for Bin Laden by beating up all the clockworks!
More seriously, though, I do think the difference is pretty vast. Certainly, it's possible to escape such a fate, but if the target were in the middle of, say, Hawaii, and had no prior warning of an organized effort against him, I'd say the odds would be on the aggressors' side.
[ QUOTE ]
You won't have to, unless you're stupid enough to stand in an empty football field and wait for them.
[/ QUOTE ]
Assuming you know they're coming, and assuming that they're not forcing you into a strategically disadvantageous position.
I'm not saying it's definite, I'm just saying that given the reach Arachnos has, the raw numbers at its disposal, and the fact that they have the run of the Rogue Isles, I'm saying that if Arachnos wanted someone dead there, it'd d probably be happening.
[ QUOTE ]
Wouldn't make a difference either way.
[/ QUOTE ]
Sure it would - if Arachnos picks a fight with one or two people, most of the villains don't really care except how it directly impacts them, particularly if Arachnos either doesn't say why they're doing it, or puts up a dummy reason. If it's an islands-wide pogrom of all Destined Ones, they're all in it together. One or two people are usually easier to wipe out than a whole army.
[ QUOTE ]
and that any of those groups would be willing to put the Destined Ones up in the long term (by this point, Nemesis and Malta are the only ones the Destined Ones haven't directly struck at in numbers similar to Arachnos).
Not a big assumption.
[/ QUOTE ]
Sure it is. For one, you're a hot target - the villains who hide you are taking fire for the duration of your stay, at a level of fire directly proportionate to your utility to them. For another, many of these groups are also shown to be currying favor with Arachnos - no proof it's not a trap in the first place. Moreover, since the Zig-sprung villains tend to be known as Destined Ones even outside of Arachnos if in-game NPC dialogue's any indication, the villain groups aren't likely to be wholly trusting of anyone coming their way under that description. Finally, and most tellingly, all of these groups are at least as bad as Arachnos, and wouldn't be above putting a bullet in any villain they've "saved" the moment they've given up anything useful.
I won't say it's universal (Sky Raiders likely won't care, Council has ways of making sure you're one of them, Malta and Nemesis are probably playing Arachnos as much as Arachnos is playing them), but it's not going to be universal.
[ QUOTE ]
If Arachnos got it into their heads to wipe out specific PCs, they'd probably succeed.
Right now, there's a guy named Osama bin Laden who has rather a few people on his trail, and they don't seem to be doing so well. He doesn't even have superpowers.
[/ QUOTE ]
He's also not on an isolated part of American soil and is surrounded by a large number of supporters, and whichever side of the fence you're on for Bush, I'd like to think we all agree that he's not as ruthless as Recluse.
[ QUOTE ]
Arachnos can't keep its own house in order. They're not going to suddenly morph into some monolith of efficiency at the drop of a hat. Frankly I doubt they could catch the Marx Brothers, never mind anyone with real resources.
[/ QUOTE ]
We've never really seen them try, outside of the comics (which, IMO, isn't a good gauge of measuring anyone's competence).
The powers sound interesting but I guess I'm okay with them because Ghost Widow's set ends up matching my Necro/Dark MM's concept very nicely.
I might be less enthused if I had a character concept that didn't fit with any of powers/patrons (Spectral Sharks? Okaayy - that seems like it could only applied to limited range of concepts)
More generic powers might be better for those who want them to fit with their characters.
Or better yet - CUSTOMIZABLE powers that allowed you to pick the FX even if the actual game effect was unchanged. (Maybe even just a change in coloring?)
I don't know if someone else mentioned this or not (too many pages). There seem to be some problems with the descriptions;
Some seem to be like Power pools - you get 2, then you have to have at least 1 of the first two to get the third, and then you need 2 of the first 3 to get the fourth (like Soul Mastery - Master Mind subset). However, some sets say that two of them only need one other to get them (Mace Mastery - Master Mind subset). While others say that only one of the 4 needs one other power from the set (Mu Mastery - Master Mind subset).
They probably all work like power pools.
Also, it's crap that MMs dont get a bonus pet. :P
[ QUOTE ]
I would also like to say common sense won out as the way to go with expectations on the PPP mechanics. This is exactly how I expected it to work. One pool per AT per Patron, with four powers in the pool, selectable as per any other 4-power pool.
[/ QUOTE ]
Ditto.