Can I get some Chocolate wih that??? 
Anyone else think this guy just bought the retail (never "reserved" his copy), and now is trying to argue his way in early?
I believe when people are blatantly whining about stupid crap that's been explained with rationale to them over and over, we're supposed to give out pie .
Although! Maybe we could hook ya up with some chocolate pie. 
"I'm flying free with my beautiful butterfly wings!" ~ Randy Marsh
You are complaining about this????????
Ok let me give you some history with NC Soft.
CoH had a beta, 4 days prior to launch date the beta servers went down. 2 Days before launch was the head start for "PRE-ORDER" customers. Launch Day a LOT, I repeat, A LOT!!!!!!!! of people didn't have their damn games in hand that were in the pre-order. The reason was because they were trying to retail the game the EXACT day that the servers went up.
I thought to myself how STUPID this was because it's an online game, we can't play it without the servers up anyways.
So it seems NC Soft learned from their mistake. They now are letting retailers sell the game ahead of time so that those pre-order customers and others are almost assured being able to get in on release.
[ QUOTE ]
we're supposed to give out pie .
[/ QUOTE ]
Yay pie!
Blueberry-Rhubarb Pie
Ingredients:
pastry for a two-crust pie
2 c blueberries
1 1/2 c rhubarb, chopped in 1/2" pieces
1 c sugar
3 T flour
pinch of cinnamon
3/4 t lemon zest
Procedure:
Preheat oven to 400*F.
Line a nine-inch pie pan with pastry dough, allowing a half-inch of crust to hang over the edge of the pie pan. Put blueberries and rhubarb in a large bowl. In a small bowl, mix together sugar, flour, cinnamon and lemon zest. Pour sugar mixture over fruit and stir gently with a rubber spatula until mixture is well distributed. Transfer to lined pie pan. Use remaining dough for a lattice top. Fold the overhanging bottom crust back over the ends of the strips and crimp the pastry for a decorative finish. Bake for, 15 minutes, then reduce heat to 350*F and bake for 20 to 30 minutes, or until crust is golden and juices are bubbling. Cool for several hours before cutting to serve.
[ QUOTE ]
Or you missed Cuppa going blue in the face saying it.
[/ QUOTE ]
I would have liked to have seen this.
I miss all the good stuff. 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Neither Cryptic nor NCSoft have any control precisely when stores put CoV on shelves. Stores understand that the CoV servers officially go up on Oct. 31st...but they can decide to put the game on shelves before then.
[/ QUOTE ]
PC Software producers are just as able to setup a hard street date as a book, movie, or music producer... And most retailers will follow hard street dates... Ever notice how most movies are released on a Tuesday?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, but with games it's not an industry-wide thing like with movies and music. There are certainly exceptions, sure, Half-Life 2 as an example. And since no one outside of Pre-order customers can een enter their code until Monday, it doesn't really matter if you can buy the box early (a situation typically reserved for MMORPGs) NCSoft isn't likely to want to enforce a street-date. Generally retailers simply put the games on the shelf as soon as they get them, and the distributors are just happy they're getting sales and leave the competition up to the stores.
IIRC (and there's a good chance I don't) the reason music and movies have such strictly enforced street-dates was to prevent unscrupulous retailers from being able to obtain the product early and then overcharge for it, being that they were the only place it was available.
There were at LEAST four threads about pre-orders having to be in EARLY to get the headstart.
Of this I'm certain. Not sure if it was actually The C To The J who was mommying each, but I figured I'd give her the credit. She's usually the gal who rides shotgun on rampant n00bism.
And when she doesn't?! Guys like me show up and get surly! Sorry for the tone, but if you've got idiots, sometimes you need to treat em as such. I'm really a nice guy! Honest!
"I'm flying free with my beautiful butterfly wings!" ~ Randy Marsh
[ QUOTE ]
Because there's this industry called the "retail" industry, that allowed me to reserve the game even when it was first announced. I find it convenient to use, because unlike purchasing things online, I get to go out of my apartment and interact with actual human beings, who can answer questions and deal immediatly with any problems or issues that may arise.
So you're saying that its the retail industry's fault that they launched the game early, and not at all playNC's fault for locking the game out for anyone other than pre-order customers. Just sit back and imagine right now how many kids got this game on Friday from their local EB or GameStop or (fill in here) and got it home, only to find themselves locked out because they weren't a Super Special member? Think of the customers PlayNC is losing!
[/ QUOTE ]
YES
Think of the dumb customers PlayNC is losing.
Offical launch date is Oct 31. I don't know about the calendar your world works on, but on mine, that's Monday. I've NEVER EVER seen an Offical Launch date of Oct 29 for CoV.
HOWEVER, with my PRE-ORDER BOX that I purchased at Best Buy, it stated that there was a 2-day HEAD START.
[ QUOTE ]
head start
n.
1. A start before other contestants in a race.
2. An early start that confers an advantage.
[/ QUOTE ]
Again, I'm not sure how the dictionaries are printed in your world, but mine are printed much like this.
It IS the retail establishment's fault that you didn't get your pre-order. Where you pre-ordered, they should have sent you a pre-order box. It is *NOT* in any way, shape, or form, PlayNC's responsibility to hand deliver your pre-order box.
Nor is it their responsibility to teach you reading comprehension or common sense.
I am just sick and tired of not just posts like these, but the whole attitude of entitlement that people have now a days. Everything has to be spoon-fed, and coated in Nerf foam. I'm sorry for this rant, but the abject infantile stupidity of these posts are driving me insane, and I unfortunately fell face-first into this one hoping for an intelligent observation of some gaff or mishap in CoV marketing. Instead I find, not just one post by some baby who can't read, but another supporing the OP. And I'm sure there will be more infants comming crying that they should be playing in the head start, even though they didn't pre-order, or did but didn't bother to pay attention to the numerous posts about pre-order codes, pre-order boxes, and so-forth.
Heh, no worries about that sense of entitlement, man.
America's showing signs of peaking in its lifestyle, even now if ya look at oil.
We simply are living an unsustainable quality of life. Nowhere to go but down, unless we figure out cold fusion and how to feed the world.
And if our resource greed doesn't crash us in the next hundred years, all the super resistant bacteria strains will.
There's already staph strains flowing through hospitals that are totally resistant to every current antibiotic known to man.
If you get immuno compromised and contract them, they WILL kill you.
So! Stay healthy, don't go to hospitals less ya have to, and don't pay this kind of thinking too much mind.
It'll literally kill or ruin the people who act like this in the longrun.
"I'm flying free with my beautiful butterfly wings!" ~ Randy Marsh
[ QUOTE ]
There's already staph strains flowing through hospitals that are totally resistant to every current antibiotic known to man.
[/ QUOTE ]
MRSA is broad-spectrum resistant, but it is not universally resistant. There are rarely-used antibiotics (often with nasty side effects) that can still take it out.
Non-therapeutic (aka agricultural) use of antibiotics should be outlawed, since it's contributed to the problem greatly.
If you get immuno compromised and contract them, they WILL kill you.
So! Stay healthy, don't go to hospitals less ya have to, and don't pay this kind of thinking too much mind.
It'll literally kill or ruin the people who act like this in the longrun.
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
we're supposed to give out pie .
[/ QUOTE ]
Yay pie!
Blueberry-Rhubarb Pie
Ingredients:
pastry for a two-crust pie
[/ QUOTE ]
etc.
I love you.
I actually seriously recommend that everyone who is greatly upset with the current conditions prepare this recipe and have said pie. It won't fix anything, but pie is good.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Neither Cryptic nor NCSoft have any control precisely when stores put CoV on shelves. Stores understand that the CoV servers officially go up on Oct. 31st...but they can decide to put the game on shelves before then.
[/ QUOTE ]
PC Software producers are just as able to setup a hard street date as a book, movie, or music producer... And most retailers will follow hard street dates... Ever notice how most movies are released on a Tuesday?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah, but with games it's not an industry-wide thing like with movies and music. There are certainly exceptions, sure, Half-Life 2 as an example. And since no one outside of Pre-order customers can een enter their code until Monday, it doesn't really matter if you can buy the box early (a situation typically reserved for MMORPGs) NCSoft isn't likely to want to enforce a street-date. Generally retailers simply put the games on the shelf as soon as they get them, and the distributors are just happy they're getting sales and leave the competition up to the stores.
IIRC (and there's a good chance I don't) the reason music and movies have such strictly enforced street-dates was to prevent unscrupulous retailers from being able to obtain the product early and then overcharge for it, being that they were the only place it was available.
[/ QUOTE ]
Doesn't matter if it's industry wide or not. Interesting tidbit, many of the vg distributors are the same as music and video distributors... Further, there are laws in place to protect and enforce hard streets, regardless of it being 'industry wide'...
Sony had no problem with there being a hard street date for EverQuest 2. Blizzard had no problem with there being a hard street date for World of Warcraft.
Now. I do understand (and agree) with the logic behind not having a hard street date for this title, especially after the happy fun chaos that happened with the CoH launch... I really only have an issue with States saying that Cryptic and NCSoft have no ability to set a hard street date.
And, yes, overcharging is part of it. However, it's more so that all storefronts have a 'fair' shot at the First Day sales, which are a nice bulk of the purchases... Both reasons also apply to pc video games... Especially ones with addictive properties like a MMO...
Let's Dance!
[ QUOTE ]
Stop telling me its the retailer's fault! That isn't the point! The point is that its out now, and what is being done about it. The point is that the retailers broke the street date and, as a result, PlayNC may be losing customers who are angry at being locked out of the game they just bought, who may very well go and buy something else instead. Think beyond the means and think of the ends, folks.
[/ QUOTE ]
NC Soft and Cryptic Studios cannot be held responsible for failures in the retail channel. No one can except the retailers themselves. Would it be nice and generate supremely good PR if NC Soft did something to compensate for the retailer's mistakes? Yes, but it might not be cost effective or even practical.
"Casual gamers" of the kind you're referring to are very rare in the MMORPG market, even though they are a major component of the console market. MMORPGs require monthly fees and long-term time commitments, not to mention an active internet connection (preferrably a high-speed one), both of which are anathema to the retail casual gamer.
Yes, many MMORPG participants describe themselves as "casual" gamers, but these are not the same as the "casual gamer" component quoted in retail marketing statistics. Two completely different groups and two completely different sets of expectations. Yes, the retail market "casual gamer" would not tolerate a game showing up on shelves before they can play it. (Not to mention that such a thing is impossible to imagine in a console game, single player computer game, or limited access internet game.)
WoW players do not fall into that "casual gamer" category, and neither do CoV/CoH players. Battlefield/Battlefield 2 players, Counterstrike players, and even Neverwinter Nights players, however, can and do fall into that group.
Most active retail chains understand this distinction at the management level, however, they often fail to communicate that distinction to their employees. But again, you cannot fault NC Soft or Cryptic for a failure in the training programs at EB Games, Best Buy, and so on.
In short, although it would be nice if they could do something, I'm not convinced it would be practical, nor am I convinced they should.
Oh, and a final note, the internet is the last place I would ever expect to see "mindless conformity". Nope, not here. Especially not in a forum.
================================================== ===
AE Story Arc #536752: Torn Asunder
An army from far, far away has been driven from their homeland and landed on Earth. They desperately need a new home and they're liking the look of ours.
================================================== ===
[ QUOTE ]
I believe we have actually posted Sheboygan to death.
[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed. The dogpile is getting embarassing.
How about that Ginger Dip with Apples and Pears, though?
This cream cheese dip sings with fruit flavors! 
What an interesting thread. The OP doesn't want to play the blame game, because the people to blame (himself and the retailer) can't make kiss the boo-boo make it better.
Instead he wants the corporation to instantly revise its entire schedule of employee work times and put a full complement of GMs on for the weekend, open early, build and debug servers weeks in advance of the promised date, and in general have things ready just in case some mope accidentally on purpose gets hold of a copy early because, you know, that one guy paid his fifty bucks so he deserves to play right now (even if the game isn't available) or he'll kick his widdle feetses.
It's threads like this that make me realize how much I like shortbread cookies.
You know, the striped chocolatey ones you can dip in milk? Yeah, striped shortbread cookies. Oh, and those little white cookies with the chocolate frosting on 'em, can't remember what they're called, but I get 'em at the bakery department at Safeway. I also kind of like the Rice Krispie assortment box too except when they have something silly like Spongebob Sprinkles. I'd rather have the chocolate drizzle ones or the plain ones, yum yum.
I also kinda like the Pecan Shortbread cookies but if I don't have any milk in the house I don't get 'em.
[ QUOTE ]
What an interesting thread. The OP doesn't want to play the blame game, because the people to blame (himself and the retailer) can't make kiss the boo-boo make it better.
[/ QUOTE ]
Work in the evil field as a retail drone has probably biased me, but just a fun comment here.
There was no hard-street date, PC software (yes even MMOs have used them before) can use Hard street dates, and they will get followed. There are federal laws in place to assure that this occurs.
Now it still can't be fixed, just a rant/ramble. Personally, I don't see it much of a 'thing to be fixed' anyway. It felt more like an attempt to avoid a problem that occured with the CoH launch.
Let's Dance!
[ QUOTE ]
Look, I realize that PlayNC may not have wanted the game on the shelves before the 31st (which I still think is the worst possible launch date they could have picked). But they ARE. People are buying it RIGHT NOW, totally unaware that they cannot play it.
Are you guys following me? Even people who didn't reserve it! Guys just looking for a new distraction, who check out the neato box art, read the back and then buy it, are getting burned when they get home. Every person I've spoken to has said that if that happened to them, they would return the game and spend the money elsewhere, with no exceptions.
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't see you posting on the thread anymore, but just in case: one of the elements you're missing here is that one of the best things an MMO can do is SPREAD THE LAUNCH POPULATION OVER TIME, which makes Monday an excellent start date.
Why?
1) Hardcore fans with the preorders had 2 days to start and move on to the upper-level zones.
2) On monday, the current subscribers who didn't preorder will be "in the know" and asking for the game. They'll start, but not cause a "flood" of lag on the newb zones- something that will ALSO DRIVE PEOPLE AWAY.
3) Over the course of the week, the casual purchaser will get the game and come on, preferrably to a less-crowded zone.
Plenty of MMO's tried the "UBER LAUNCH" and got badly burned by it. Heck, WoW, which succeeded, had plenty of criticism for having to "ration time" for players. It wasn't just that SERVERS were at capacity- the NEWB ZONES were at capacity.
Better to distribute launch... first by giving rabid players a pre-start, then by starting regular subscribers on days normally "down" in retail, and finally accepting the flow of new people once the "heavy retail days" start.
------
Regarding what they can do when they discover that the servers aren't ready? Devs can't do much- open the servers early seems to be what you wanted to hear, but doing so would be a form of a breach of contract to the preorder folks who bought the right to those 2 early days.
I bet you are one of those parents that allow their 8year old to buy GTA III and then complain that you didn't know whats in it. In our daily lives for the last couple years we have been told to check into a game before you buy it. It doesn't take more than 10minutes of your time to type in a search for "X game" and read up about it. I wouldn't be wrong in saying you are in the minority. Most people I know that even think about playing an MMO get actual information from the official site and forums and reviews from magazines, websites, tv, and even the news. Paying to play a game is still a fairly new concept for most people and I know many who said, "Why would I ever do that?" a couple years ago now playing one if not more different MMOs. I like most people have read about a game before I go buy it. To put money down at a game store about a year ago and not read up about it monthly and then weekly/daily before release just seems a little out of whack, if you were indeed anticipating the release of this game as you say, you surely would of been able to participate in the 2day head start with the pre-order package.
The Pre-Order box tells you that because you Pre-Ordered you get a two day head start. It was the only reason I pre-ordered. I also bought a pre-order set for my friend in Britian. It was announced a while ago that CoH wouldn't start till October 31. The 2 day head start started.... two days before October 31.
So far I know at least 3 different MMORPG's that have rewarded significantly there customers that pre-order. Coh is one of them and honestly they reward pretty damn big...
Wow gave me a book... hated the game... and I felt I was ripped off.
Next time you plan on buying the game make sure Gamestop gives you your damn pre-order box.
[ QUOTE ]
I could not think of a better way to alienate your casual playerbase.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well they COULD put AVs in your missions ... Oh wait ...
/e giggle!!
this thread made me laugh, thanks everyone.
Sabres, your pie sounds delicious! I've always made rhubarb/apple, but leave it to an infiniton to have a good pie idea!
and, just in case this thread tries to die, and not let me laugh anymore....
0MgEEEE, r33GeN iZ ovUrPoowuR3d iT shUd b nUrFfed!!!
[ QUOTE ]
What an interesting thread. The OP doesn't want to play the blame game, because the people to blame (himself and the retailer) can't make kiss the boo-boo make it better.
Instead he wants the corporation to instantly revise its entire schedule of employee work times and put a full complement of GMs on for the weekend, open early, build and debug servers weeks in advance of the promised date, and in general have things ready just in case some mope accidentally on purpose gets hold of a copy early because, you know, that one guy paid his fifty bucks so he deserves to play right now (even if the game isn't available) or he'll kick his widdle feetses.
It's threads like this that make me realize how much I like shortbread cookies.
You know, the striped chocolatey ones you can dip in milk? Yeah, striped shortbread cookies. Oh, and those little white cookies with the chocolate frosting on 'em, can't remember what they're called, but I get 'em at the bakery department at Safeway. I also kind of like the Rice Krispie assortment box too except when they have something silly like Spongebob Sprinkles. I'd rather have the chocolate drizzle ones or the plain ones, yum yum.
I also kinda like the Pecan Shortbread cookies but if I don't have any milk in the house I don't get 'em.
[/ QUOTE ]
Mmm.. Those are good... I also like the Pepridge Farm Brussels cookies.. Expensive but such a great texture to them...
To Sheboygan,
I did not read the 7 following pages of text, but I'll take a wild guess that people flamed you for not knowing. Know that I'm with you on this one. The same thing happenend to me back when COH came out. The same pre-order two day head start thing was being done and I got the retail box about two days prior to the actual "normal" server start. When I tried to complain about this, I got so much flaiming that I simply had to let the matter be. I was ready for the same thing this time.
Even though alot of places where talking about the two day head start, it does not excuse that the most important place that should be talking about that little bit of information did not mention anything about it: the store clerk. I totally agree with you on this. Some of us actually shop casually when we want something - hell, if we are too busy in real life, we might even just call and put stuff asside without asking too many questions. When I go and buy a game that I know I want, I don't necessarly check out the boards, web sites and all that stuff. I might not even notice a poster about the said product I'm going for when I enter the store - often easily missed when they are in a sea of advertisment anyway. Most of the time, I drive to the store, I rush in, buy my stuff, leave. Yes, you heard me. Just like when I buy groceries.
All this would have been simply avoided (both times, for you and me) if the stores would have not sold the RETAIL box before the actual starting date. If they insisted on selling the games before that, then the least they could have done is give the bonus CD with it. It's as simple as that. I don't like buying things I can't use right away, and I especially hate the fact that they don't mention on he box that the game won't be playable prior to a specific date.
So for those of us who actually buy things like most other people do, which is by having a minimum information about the product like price compare and so on, details like "you won't be able to use this because the makers of the game will block you from doing so" when it's not even on the box, just might like to hear about that information when we hand the cash over the counter.
I'm mostly complaining about the first time this has happenend to me. I'm sad to see that it happenned to other people as well this time around. I still think that it's wrong, and I bet you would have been less mad if the clerk would have at the very least explained this to you (some people who pre-ordered like me where very happy to see the box come in early since it let's us keep playing passed midnight on Sunday).
They should have never put it on the shelves before the 31st. That's all.
Heh, seems all the misguided whiners have moved to THIS post.
Geeze, arguing about the "validity of" and "worrying about" Cryptic and NC's subscription levels is a blatant fricking farce.
You whiners want ONE THING only. To be let in early even though it's made perfectly clear you won't be til the game IS LAUNCHED.
I DID pre-order months ago. Apparently you missed all the emails saying if you pre-order early, you got a headstart.
Or you missed the links saying it.
Or you missed Cuppa going blue in the face saying it.
This's the worst kind of BS fanboy tantrums I've ever seen. Grow the heck up or get out. You got other games? Go play em. Didn't get a pre-order? Maybe you'll learn for next time. Duh.
The people at Cryptic and NC have jobs to do. Get a life and let them get ready for Launch.
"You go to Hell, Mr. Hat! You go to Hell and you die!" ~ Mr. Garrison
"I'm flying free with my beautiful butterfly wings!" ~ Randy Marsh