Will this fix PvP as well?
Ie. Will a scrapper/tank/Brute/Stalker be able to at least launch (even though it's debuffed) an attack at a Stormie if they can overcome the knockdown? Because I wasn't able to in the arena prior to I6...
Moonlighter
50s include MA/SD, MA/SR, DP/Elec, Claw/Inv, Kat/Dark, Kat/Fire, Spine/Regen, Dark/SD
First Arc: Tequila Sunrise, #168563
Considering Hurricane is pretty much useless in open-areas against non-melee, it isn't unbalanced at all. I play a scrapper most of the time, but I have also played two AT's with hurricane (Ill/Storm and Storm/Elec) and in neither case was the power overbalanced. It works great in confined spaces, terribly in large spaces except against Melee-only foes. Even then, you can still get attacked by foes with knockdown protection and accuracy insps.
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Any chance Kheldian Dwarves can get that too?
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Any chance Kheldian Dwarves can get that too?
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I think the reason for the fix is because pure melee ATs (pre-41) don't have any options if their attacks are debuffed to nil.
A Kheldian Dwarf can always switch to human or Nova form and blast away.
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Honestly, I have never been able to hit a player with hurricane up with a scrapper or tanker...
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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You know this was put in pre ED when a fully slotted hurricane made it impossible for the melee types to cap on a controller or defender with hurricane on. Since this is no longer the case and since you have to touch the affected indivduals with the hurricane to debuff them, could this "fix" get removed? It isn't necessary anymore
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This fix was made because two Hurricanes meant that melee characters could not attack at all. It happened in issue 2, before PVP was close to being implemented in the arena or CoV.
That has not changed.
Also, in PvP, Hurricanes continue to debuff for 10 seconds after you're in it, which makes it even easier to debuff melee ATs to zero range than it is in PVE, where the debuff only lasts while you're in the hurricane.
So, anyway, I don't see any reason to remove the fix.
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Honestly, I have never been able to hit a player with hurricane up with a scrapper or tanker...
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Incidentally, I was posting purely about PVE. I only know some of the situation regarding Hurricane's interactions in PVP. I was talking about fighting Tsoo and Banished Pantheon, and I don't understand relating that specifically to PVP.
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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I had no problem superspeeding into a hurricane and slaming Bone Smasher on the stormies, which usually disoriented them, allowing me to placate and then AS.
Usually you can get in and land a hit before being pushed away, so if you have a mezzing attack rush in and employ it, then placate and AS. AS doesn't always have to be your opening strike.
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I tried this several times in Siren's Call, and it failed every time. I simply was not able to get close enough to a storm defender to hit them.
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and you shouldn't be able to! At all!!!
I can't believe they did this *weeping*
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I had no problem superspeeding into a hurricane and slaming Bone Smasher on the stormies, which usually disoriented them, allowing me to placate and then AS.
Usually you can get in and land a hit before being pushed away, so if you have a mezzing attack rush in and employ it, then placate and AS. AS doesn't always have to be your opening strike.
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I tried this several times in Siren's Call, and it failed every time. I simply was not able to get close enough to a storm defender to hit them.
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and you shouldn't be able to! At all!!!
I can't believe they did this *weeping*
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I thought Kinetics was the new Storm?
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
Heh, I still have not-so-fond memories of getting kicked to the moons by a resourceful Kinetics defender with Repel active during PvP...darned low mag knockback resistance in Acrobatics... 
Save the drama for yo' mama.
This is a great annoyance for my Blapper too - any chance to help out on that?
Sure, i have some ranged damage, but my best ranged attack 8I am fire/energy) needs to be fired within the storm, and I can't melee at all in the storm.
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This is a great annoyance for my Blapper too - any chance to help out on that?
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Not likely. You have Ranged options. Many Scrapper, Stalker, Tanker and Brute builds do not have Ranged options. The exclusion to the Range debuff only applies to those AT's for that reason.
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This is a great annoyance for my Blapper too - any chance to help out on that?
Sure, i have some ranged damage, but my best ranged attack 8I am fire/energy) needs to be fired within the storm, and I can't melee at all in the storm.
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I handled this by adding 2 Range SOs, 1 ACC DO,1 DMG SO and 1 END RED SO in my closer range power, now I can fire it outside of the hurricane range and it does WELL.
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?
There is no reason why Scrapper ranged attacks are immune to range debuffing
There is no reason why Blaster melee attacks are vulnerable to range debuffing.
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Hey,
I also rolled up a Stormie for fun in the Bloody Bay event. "Boltz." First time I've played with Hurricane.
Holy Moley! Linked with Superspeed, I was zipping about scattering villains like bingo-balls. Eventually someone in the horde would use a ranged Mez on me and blow me away, true.
If anybody knows how to turn off that toggle as a melee AT, I'd sure like to know.
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So YOU were Boltz! I HATE YOU. 
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?
There is no reason why Scrapper ranged attacks are immune to range debuffing
There is no reason why Blaster melee attacks are vulnerable to range debuffing.
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Because it actually makes sense to do it the way you recommend. Melee attacks should not be affected by range debuff, and range attacks should. This makes sense and is internally consistant. However, since this is their vision, common sense, logic, and playability are all sacrificed to make things more according to this warped and unrealistic "vision"
Sorry, I5 and now I6 have left me fairly bitter about the dev team and their lack of understanding about how PLAYERS play their game.
119088 - Outcasts Overcharged. Heroic.
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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?
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...or at least put a minimum range cap in place, even if that shortens melee range. IIRC, that's the fix that was put in place for the mob version of Hurricane in PvE.
After doing some testing in the arena with a friend, we came to the conclusion that a blaster's melee attacks (secondary or power pool) were being debuffed to zero. They would only go off if the two characters were actually in physical contact with each other, and the repel on Hurricane is strong enough that you can't do that without a power that resists repel such as Unstoppable. It's literally impossible for a non-melee AT to get a melee attack off against a character running Hurricane.
I'm the Stormy, by the way (see sig). He's the one with a Blaster for his main. Just so you know.
Cheers,
~R~
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?
There is no reason why Scrapper ranged attacks are immune to range debuffing
There is no reason why Blaster melee attacks are vulnerable to range debuffing.
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It was explained that powers are split up for ATs, so you can apply a "global" change to AT powers easier than you can all powers that are melee.
Still here, even after all this time!
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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?
There is no reason why Scrapper ranged attacks are immune to range debuffing
There is no reason why Blaster melee attacks are vulnerable to range debuffing.
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The reason is as he stated blasters, kelidens, defenders and controllers have options for ranged attacks that tankers and scrappers do not have.
It may not make "sense" but rarely does game balance make sense outside of game mechanics.
It would make sense that my tank with super strength should be able to pick up a car or any other thing and throw it as a ranged attack, the games however doesn't allow for it because of balance issues.
It has nothing to do with making sense.
Nemsis lv50 Inv/SS
Arch-Nemsis lv 50 SS/Inv
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This is a great annoyance for my Blapper too - any chance to help out on that?
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Not likely. You have Ranged options. Many Scrapper, Stalker, Tanker and Brute builds do not have Ranged options. The exclusion to the Range debuff only applies to those AT's for that reason.
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What about those that buff and heal. I have remembered being caught in the hurricane and I could not heal teammates with my empath and storm defender using o2 boost because the range debuff effects heals too. Is there a reason as to why healing range gets debuff?
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
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This is a great annoyance for my Blapper too - any chance to help out on that?
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Nearly all Blasters have access to a ranged Stun or Hold that will drop Hurricane. This gives Blappers a MASSIVE COLLOSAL advantage over all melee AT's when facing most kind of Storm users. I'm not ashamed to tell anyone My blapper in particular got the Tracer badge faster than any other build I've ever played.
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This is a great annoyance for my Blapper too - any chance to help out on that?
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Not likely. You have Ranged options. Many Scrapper, Stalker, Tanker and Brute builds do not have Ranged options. The exclusion to the Range debuff only applies to those AT's for that reason.
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I don't think that is fair.
From a design and coding perspective it seems easier to me to apply a range debuff cap, than apply a check that looks to see what the AT making the attack is.
Simply applying a minimum range that cannot be debuffed bast, say 5 feet since I think that is about the range of most/all melee attacks.
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?
There is no reason why Scrapper ranged attacks are immune to range debuffing
There is no reason why Blaster melee attacks are vulnerable to range debuffing.
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Because it actually makes sense to do it the way you recommend. Melee attacks should not be affected by range debuff, and range attacks should. This makes sense and is internally consistant. However, since this is their vision, common sense, logic, and playability are all sacrificed to make things more according to this warped and unrealistic "vision"
Sorry, I5 and now I6 have left me fairly bitter about the dev team and their lack of understanding about how PLAYERS play their game.
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Actually, it's because there is a technical limitation that prevents them from doing it by attack type, or complicates implementing in that manner. This has already been discussed at length in the past. Basically, what it boils down to is, implementing it in the manner you suggest is more trouble than its worth, and the ATs in question have extensive ranged options for dealing with things like hurricane.
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?
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...or at least put a minimum range cap in place, even if that shortens melee range. IIRC, that's the fix that was put in place for the mob version of Hurricane in PvE.
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Actually, the fix discussed in this thread (making melee ATs immune to the range debuff) is the fix that was put in place for Hurricane in PvE. I'm not sure where people are getting the idea that this was somehow a PvP or primarily PvP fix, as it was implemented two issues before the arena.
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After doing some testing in the arena with a friend, we came to the conclusion that a blaster's melee attacks (secondary or power pool) were being debuffed to zero. They would only go off if the two characters were actually in physical contact with each other, and the repel on Hurricane is strong enough that you can't do that without a power that resists repel such as Unstoppable. It's literally impossible for a non-melee AT to get a melee attack off against a character running Hurricane.
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That's not crippling for him because he has ranged attacks in his primary. If a blaster can't Total Focus a defender, he can shoot the defender. If a brute can't Total Focus a defender, he can...what...wave Temporary Invulnerability at him?
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"
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You know this was put in pre ED when a fully slotted hurricane made it impossible for the melee types to cap on a controller or defender with hurricane on. Since this is no longer the case and since you have to touch the affected indivduals with the hurricane to debuff them, could this "fix" get removed? It isn't necessary anymore
On Justice