I've played every blaster primary to level 20, and my main is a level 50 elec/dev. As a blaster, my health has three states. Full, half, and faceplant. The 3% boost to blaster hit points won't change this. No offense meant to Jack, but his blaster defiance post sounded like an April Fool's joke.
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You should also work with your Tanker to coordinate aggro. You may wish to enter a battle first to take a load of damage, then have a Tanker come in and taunt (or punch-voke) enemies off you once you are in Defiance range.
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Seriously Jack have you ever taken an Alpha Strike from a group of mobs as a blaster? I started to challenge the fact that the tanker COULD acquire aggro off of you with the taunt changes, but then I realized the tank would have no problem. Dead blasters don't draw aggro 
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If you have a healing Defender in your group, you should ask them to not heal you unless you are in imminent danger of being defeated.
[/ QUOTE ]This is exactly the kind of statement we were afraid we would hear when discussion of desperation first began. To hear it from the lead developer of the game is disheartening.
[ QUOTE ]
Defiance range, you should use defensive Inspirations (or defense buffs from other players) to manage your Health loss to a reasonable rate.
[/ QUOTE ]Defense really doesn't help here. If everything misses you are at 100%. If one shot hits you are down to 50%. Two shots take you out. However, I will give you that the new sonic debuff (hate the name) set may be the blasters best friend in this regard.
I realize all of that sounds quite negative, which is sad because overall I like the concept of defiance. Like many, however, I really believe that defiance needs to be given to scrappers and give the blasters criticals. Blasters are the marksmen, scrappers are the tenacious sort that would only hit harder the more damage they took, and I know a lot of scrappers that pride themselves on 'living in the red'. I know at this point it might look weird to switch them, but it would definitely be a much better fit for the archetypes.
Thanks for listening
I stand by my original observation about this, I don't think the time window given (the thin time slice in Blaster combat between "damaged" and "inspecting the floor") would be long enough to be useful, by the time you're taking damage you know is tactically untenable you're running away as fast as you can or you're mezzd and on the ground with something chewing on your face, in either case I can't see this being terribly useful or additive to blaster survivability or effectiveness.
Without some resist or defence to moderate that incoming damage it's too big and too unpredictable to run this kind of knife edge tactic without being just as unconscious, just as often, in fact, it'll encourage behaviour leading to this. Encouraging blasters to play piñata to be an effective AT will just entrench blasters as the Kings and Queens of debt.
My take on defiance is that it's a nice power, but will rarely be utilized because the point at which it kicks in is the point at which you either get healed by a teammate to keep you alive (esp late when a single volley could take 50% or more of your HP), you decide to run, or you pop an insp (respite or awaken, you have a 50% chance on using either). All 3 scenarios cancel defiance (healed or dead in 2, left combat in 1).
The idea of many to raise the ramp point is valid, but I think that may unbalance things. Instead, I propose a different type of buff. Make the defiance buff last the duration of buildup or something like that, and is applied whenever your HP drops. If it's time based to the HP, this way you don't have to worry about being a whisker from death to use this; your HP can swing back up from a heal when you're low but you don't lose the buff.
Let's say you drop to 30%, and defiance kicks in for a +80% dmg buff. Now you have a defiance 30% hp buff, and it lasts even if healed. Or, you were buffed at 30% HP, but dropped down to 10% hp from another attack, so now you get the +320% dmg buff immediately applied, overwriting the +80% dmg buff.
By making it a buildup type buff with a value set by your HP, you can be healed without diminishing the buff.
Oh, and the bar isn't needed honestly. If you're in defiance mode, I hardly think knowing how far into defiance you are is your top concern. Surviving is. I also don't like how it squashes the other 2 bars together either.
I can live with Defiance. Heck, I can take anything and make a positive use for it. It actually came in very usefull in the missions I ran on Test today. I fail to understand, though, why you guys thought that this would help blasters in the area they need help the most...late-game survivability on teams.
Blasters are front-loaded ATs. Defiance just makes them even moreso by bypassing the standard enhancement progression limitations, letting them get to that wall even faster than before. Yay, I guess.
If the lower resists/defences go live, blasters will see even less healing than they did before from healing Defenders who are going to be too hard pressed keeping the tanks on their feet to even think about a blaster who can be KO'ed seconds into a fight from some ranged guys who happened to be just within range of an aggro pulse of the one target the blaster felt safe enough to attack.
Any true boost to blasters should adhere to the following criterea:
<ul type="square">[*]Must protect the blaster from being defeated in what sometimes seems an arbitrary manner.[*]Must not involve giving blasters Resists or Defense, in keeping with States' vision of the AT.[*]Must offer a benefit that helps blasters of all levels and power ranges, without being too powerful.[/list]My idea...
TRUE GRIT
"Blasters are notoriously fragile, but they nonetheless stand the front line against the hordes of villainy threatening to overrun Paragon City. So great is their resolve to carry on through a fight that Blasters can sometimes take a hit that would flatten anyone else."
Beginning at Security Level 10, Blasters gain the TRUE GRIT ability. Any attack that would result in a Blaster's defeat will trigger the ability; The Blaster's health will stabilize at 1 HP, giving the hero a last chance to heal, launch a final attack, or escape out of harm's way. This ability is on a three-minute timer and the read and white blaster AT icon will appear in the characters effects area.
That is what I would like to see, anyways...
A in creativity
C minus in effectiveness
F in meeting the needs of Blasters survival
Most of the people here seem to be asking for defiance to start sooner, because of the fast way that a blasters hitpoint bar seems to drop. But I've got a alternate idea. How about we tie in some sort of defiance factor on what percentage of your hitpoints you get hit with within a timed window.
So lets say you go into a frey with 2 even con minions and they both get in lucky shots on you. From what I've seen of melee lets just say you take 60% damage. Now being a 40% hitpoints isnt going to normally trigger defiance. But if you go into a fight and lose 60% of your hitpoints right from the get go, your in trouble and know it.
So how about the speed that you take the damage becomes the factor, not percentage of hitpoints left.
Lets look at it from a roleplaying point of view, then from a numeric point of view. This is gonna be long folks, so make sure you've got a cookie to munch on while reading.
Eternal torch walks into a room with two rather disagreeable Hellions who are trying to kidnap a scientist. The Hellions turn around and pull a pistol out and take a shot at our hero. But hit with grazing hits, not much damage there.
So ET moves in and hits them with a fireball, these guys dont see that dangerous, best to arrest them without hurting them too badly. As they close into melle range one pulls a sledgehammer and one stays back and shoots. (A typical mob AI tactic)
The shooter shoots again, another grazing hit. Eternal Torch cant stand this punishment all day, but his life isnt threatened yet. And then it happens the sledgehammer user knows what he's doing and knocks the snot out of our hero, putting him on the ground. The situation just became desperate (Hero takes over 40% damage in a few seconds from the gun shot and the heavy hit from the sledgehammer)
A dark fury crosses Eternal Torch face as he says in a low voice, "It's lord of the flies time now..." And blasts them both with flame that match the intestity that he's feeling. He's not holding back now. In a few seconds the teleporters recall the badly burned and defeated villains to the hospital where they'll be treated before teleportation to the Paragon City Police Station for booking, while Eternal Torch consoles the victim and gets information on whats happening inside of the building.
That, in my opinion, is defiance in action. Now for the numbers.
ET moves in on 2 hellions guarding a hostage. He jas 260.5 hitpoints at max. Both Hellions pull out guns and shoot. Both hit for 26ish damage. Thats 260.5-54=206.5 hitponts left.
One hellion moves into melee range while ET throws a fireball. No bonus to damage because even though he got hit hard, it wasnt even 25% damage. The next round is tougher though. ET gets hit by a sledgehammer and a gunshot for 84+26 damage (110) Now thats 206-110=105 hitpoints. He's taken a 50% wack in hitpoints from the get go. Now that should kick in Defiance right there. Defiance goes into effect (You can figure out the scale. But losing 50% of your hitpoints in 2 hits is pretty damn major) and his damage gets boosted in turn.
This is my idea of how defiance should work. Also maybe give it a 4 to 6 second window (Roughly 2 attacks) after it is activated, because the first thing that I think of when I lose 50% of my hitpoints in a second. Is popping a green, not blasting the enemy.
Post feedback folks, but I think this is the way to go.
Oh, and the kickin time on defiance as it is on test now is off. It's not starting at 39% like it should from what I can see.
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With consideration of the HP changes.
Defience needs to kick in about 75% hp. It can still go to 500% near zero, but I want 100% by 50%.
Why? by 50% i'm going to get one shotted by the next Lt/boss. Minons are not a problem in the late level. I could actually use the damage on them, but I dont need it. The extra damage doesn't save me a shot.
also in its current form, it dorks up the lower levels. It gives them the capabilty to reach the damage cap before they should. I speak mainly to pre-SO levels. Once a blaster has SO, its almost a given(like debt badges) they thier attacks are 6 slotted.
I'm looking at 25-20% over all damage boost from this. But defience has nothing to do with that. The 500% damage cap does that. There are a lot of ppl that worry about teams plays and what no. Most defenders and controllers can buff the blaster. I dont see this as a problem.
Let me repost this from the Max targets thread from the Test forum:
[ QUOTE ]
Set a maximum number of targets that can be affected by most offensive powers:
Taunts (including Tanker inherent Taunt - 'PunchVoke') is set to 5.
This will limit the amount of 'herding' done by players to a more reasonable and realistic level.
[/ QUOTE ]
This new Issue Update on Defiance should give you a good chuckle.
quoted for those that don't want to navigate the link:
[ QUOTE ]
You should also work with your Tanker to coordinate aggro. You may wish to enter a battle first to take a load of damage, then have a Tanker come in and taunt (or punch-voke) enemies off of you once you are in Defiance range. These tactics make battles a tad more complicated, but some groups will find that the added damage of the Blasters Defiance to be worth the effort.
[/ QUOTE ]
The Cryptic team is advocating that a blaster initiate combat to get to the good defiance levels, then have a Tank Taunt 5 of the enemies off. Do they think people are stupid? What happens if the damage inflicted on the Blaster is DoT? What if there are more than 5 enemies that the Blaster pisses off (or worse spread out that a Taunt couldn't hit them all anyway)?
Cryptic is pushing faulty strategies as a new ub3r method to the good expees.
Defiance is an interesting concept, but how do you expect to be defiant if you are already dead? How can you be defiant when you are held or stunned? The only way to make this remotely useful in the later game is to team with Sonic DEBUFFers, not take Health (from the fitness line) and be more wreckless.
>> I'll add that I agree with others that mentioned Scrapper & Blaster specials should get swapped. Blasters should get Criticals. Scrappers should get Defiance.
>> Basically any kind of healing is counter-productive to the goals of this power. Regeneration Aura, not good. CoT healing nodes, not good. Health & any HP increasing accolade, not good. All of these effects are in fact good for the Blaster, but bad for utilizing the Defiance.
>> I am disappointed that NCSoft/Cryptic have already made an official announcement about Defiance. It is still under debate (it would be pretty snobbish to ask for feedback & not listen to your player base).
>> Give JackZodiak another chance to voice his opinions.
After Testing for the last few days, My feedback:
The concept is valid, but the reality does not match that concept.
1. At low levels you actually have enough time between reaching <40% health to take advantage of this ability before you are beyond help. At higher levels the time between reaching <40% and death is near instantaneous the vast majority of the time. If you find yourself at <40%, your primary concern is retreat or healing, not generating more aggro.
2. The scale is not effective. Sure, at low levels before you gain SOs, or even DOs, you can make good use of a +500% damage boost. But the low levels weren't where blasters needed help. At higher levels, bonuses over approximately +200% will be completely lost due to the cap. Therefore the current numbers, while impressive on paper, cannot be realized.
3. The Defiance Meter, as it currently stands, is not helpful. Sure you can place your mouse over the bar, wait 5 seconds, and see what your current "defiance level" is. But in a situation where you actually have anything to look before dying last half a second. No one has time to "figure out" the bar.
My suggestion:
Do away with the Defiance bar. Make the damage bonus scale in direct proportion to the current Health level.
IE:
100% Health = 0% Bonus
99% Health = +1% Bonus
98% Health = +2% Bonus
...etc
50% Health = +50% Bonus
...etc
10% Health = +90% Bonus
...etc
1% Health = +99% Bonus
This will prevent low level blasters from abusing the power, gaining 500% damage solo by falling from a high place to get to 1 Health, and blasting purples with an AE.
This will also allow high level blasters to actually make reasonable use from this ability without becoming over-powering. Typically, a higher-level blaster will only get to 70% Health before panic sets in, and they have to decide to heal or retreat. This produces a bonus of 0% to +30%. This may not be the astronomical numbers of the current scale, but it is something useable more often.
In exchange for the over-inflated damage bonus numbers of the current scale, please consider a small boost to accuracy at various points. I suggest it scale somewhere along the lines of the damage boost. Why? Because if you are having your behind served to you on a platter, it will often be accompanied by "MISS MISS MISS MISS". There is no point in having all that extra damage if it isn't hitting anything.
Thank you for your time and attention.
~Yeshael
I like the idea of defiance... but I feel it does nothing to help the blaster in reality.
Bottom line is, blasters either have full health, or they get a little aggro and die instantly. The time between 100% and 0 is usually very small... this was somewhat negated through taking the EPPs (which still screws you over in the pre-40 game), but with the new changes to resist/defence, even those dont help very much.
I could only really come up with 2 'fixes'
1) Make defiance kick in at higher health levels
2) Just remove/lessen the Blaster's ability to get debt. Sounds stupid, I suppose, but dying sorta goes along with being a blaster. If you have no resists, are super squishy, and deal lots of damage, you are bound to get aggro, and you are bound to die.
Others have posted their ideas, which I'd like to second:
1. Start Defiance bonus at 50% health. To compensate for kicking in earlier, I would be okay with lowering the cap to 400% instead of 500%. A blaster could always use Build Up for an added bonus.
2. Provide accuracy buff in Defiance. More damage won't do a lick of good if you can't hit the target.
3. Maybe a slight rechage bonus to attacks. A blaster going down defiantly will spasticly shoot anything that moves. So faster recharging attacks would make sense.
1) Now blasters will have more HPs than defenders and controllers? I really dont like the sound of that.
2) Defenders (who were at 66% of effect with their secondary compared to blasters fall even further down the damage chart.
3) Blaster Secondaries could still use being fixed/adjusted. Wouldnt it be better to focus on that than to try to come up with a new game mechanic/gimmick. If blasters need some help why not center that help around the blaster secondaries that are lacking.
4) At higher levels, even a 1000% increase in damage when below 40% HPs would mean next to nothing with the amount of status effects baddies are throwing out.
[ QUOTE ]
When a Blasters health drops below 40%, they will begin to see an increase in their damage output. A small increase at first, but the lower their health gets, the bigger the increase becomes.
This thread is for you to provide feedback to the Devs on the above issues. You are allowed to post ONCE in this thread. Make it count! If you post more than one time - the extra posts will be removed.
If a dev responds this count will be reset.
[/ QUOTE ]
defiance is practically worthless. at 40% health I'm running like hell not trying to get in the last shot. a blaster post level 30 goes from 40% to worm food too fast.
Thanks for the damage cap boost.
removed
Defiance was great for my level 3 Archery/Ice and my level 5 Sonic/EN, but... was completely useless for my Level 25 AR/EN in Croatoa or anywhere else. At the low levels, where hits are infrequent and don't do as much damage, with a few lucks, you can use Defiance to save your life. I was able to take down a purple Fallen gunner that was +4 to me with defiance WHEN I finally hit.
I was also able to save myself from Vahz Mortificators, horde of corpses, the occaisional clockwork mob, etc...
...but at Level 25, all that happened if I actually -tried- to use defiance (even at the 39% health mark) was that I'd get one-shotted by a lieutenant, or salvo'ed to death by minions.
Basically, combined with the 'no debt 'till level 10' change, Defiance only teaches low level blasters to play recklessly, which is bad for them in the long run, and definitely bad for teams. Also, after a certain point (let's say level 20 or so), Defiance is /completely/ useless, and you're better off popping a green inspiration and use the high damage you do have, rather than risking death to get high damage that probably won't save you, and almost certainly will get you into death.
Like I've said before: Defiance won't help stupid players, because they'll die and get into debt trying to use it, and Defiance won't help smart players, because they'll keep themselves healed up to a point where they'll never see it.
Give defiance to Tankers or Scrappers to offset their immense proposed defense nerfs. They can certainly use it a lot more than we can.
EDIT:
If you want defiance to be useful as a damage buff, start it at 80% health, and lower the actual buff. Consistency is what makes a bonus worthwhile, and currently, Defiance doesn't have that. I personally just use the 10.5% base bonus from assault on my blaster on live, and it's definitely better than Defiance for damage-boosting potential even solo.
Also, why not have defiance give you a greater chance of a "breakfree" effect the more damage you take, AND increase your defense vs status effects? It'd sure be more useful throughout the whole game than pure damage would. By the time you get single origin damage enhancers, even if it did kick in at 79% health, defiance wouldn't be much of a buff anyhow. Status protection is a much better buff to blasters.
And if you won't give us that, at -least- add accuracy to defiance.
Arc Salvo: Okay hold one sec guys, we can't just rush in blindly vs these Nemesis, they've got these ranged aoe's tha-
Teammate1(charging in): Shut up, Arc Salvo, you lame*$% Viewtiful Joe wannabe! What do you know?!
Teammate2(also charging): yeah, ST#& arc salvo u PWR RANGR U!
Arc Salvo: *sigh*
This doesn't seem to have the intended effect of increasing blaster survivability. I suggest adding, in addition to the damage increase, a defense versus ranged attack buff that is dependent upon the blaster not attacking.
After the blaster takes damage, the damage and ranged defense buff is applied. As long as the blaster doesn't attack, the ranged defense buff holds, as soon as he/she attacks, the defense buff drops.
This would give the blaster some measure of defense during that period of time while the tank tried to the get the mob(s) back under control (or the blaster runs).
I have no problem with the manner which this has been implemented into the game; but why in the world is this ability not inherent to all archetypes?
Obviously none of the developers see anything unbalancing about it for the blasters, so I would like to know why it would be for any other archetype.
All heroes are essentially defiant. Thats what makes them great heroes. Superman is not a great hero because he's super resistant and strong, but because he is always defiant no matter the odds. The same with every other great archetypal hero we've come to love to read about, and now have the chance to play.
By their very nature 'All' heroes should always have an advantage like defiance. Its what seperates them from the common policeman or vigilante. Its not a job, its a deep-rooted duty and part of their being.
Give this to all Archetypes.
Defiance is completely awesome at low levels. It certainly allowed me to take out some groups of MOBs that I otherwise would have been unable to.
As some point though Defiance becomes relatively worthless. Blasters at higher levels tend to either be healthy or dead. If something knocks me down to 40% or lower, I start chewing green chiclets and maybe even running.
I'm hoping a balance can be found.
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My "main", Rathstar, is a level 37 Energy/Energy Blaster: he was the first hero I created, back in November 2004, and he's still my primary hero that I play regularly. I tested out the new Blaster stuff this weekend, and here's my input.
Just as I expected, Defiance was practically useless: I was either mezzed or dead before it ever became a factor in most battles. The one or two times I actually survived long enough to get off an attack before I was dead, it was neat to see the increased damage output, but it was mostly irrelevant. My target would've been dead from regular damage anyway, or I was taking damage from someone else entirely, rendering the effect of Defiance moot.
On my new Archery blaster, however, it was quite nice for levels 1 to 5 (as far as I've played him, so far). There was a couple of times when the Defiance did help me "finish off"a particularly tough target, before it finished me. But I never really had much of a problem with lower level Blastering before, so Defiance was just icing on the cake. In fact, it often felt a little like cheating -- it felt way too "Scrapperish" for my taste -- not at all like a Blaster.
Bottom-line: Blasters have never really had a big problem with being damage-dealers in the first place. Defiance fails to address the fundamental problems with Blasters: a lack of ranged defense, status effects, and "instant aggro". I would prefer to see these problems addressed, instead.
Give Defiance to someone else who now really needs it: Tankers.
I have found Defiance make little difference in my battles. Almost every time my health would get to the point in which I could use it, I was basically a dead man walking, for there was no way to escape or defeat the enemies.
I really do like the idea of the power and how the concept is more original and dynamic. I just havent found it to be very effective.
Net effect of Defiance at low levels: Slightly positive; it gives a minor increase to the chance of winjing a fight gone somewhat bad.
Effect of Defiance at level 14+: None. At this point, you are green, mezzed, or dead. In none of those conditions does Defiance matter.
"Defiance" is meant to fix Blasters? It does not.
As many have said, looks like it works at lower levels, where Enhancements are not as effective. But it is useless at higher levels.
"Defiance" is a power more suited for Scrappers. If the power was described to me as is, without knowing which AT it was for, I would immediately assume it was a Scrapper power. Heck, even as a Tank power it would work... making them 'hulk-out' with their damage.
But not Blasters.
You are missing the mark when it comes to Blasters. Mainly because you are ignoring the one strength they should have over all other AT's: Accuracy.
Look at Heroes in all forms of media throughout the years. From the all the different comic book heroes, to those of the silver screen, to those in literature, and even those in legends of antiquity... what is the common to all those heroes that used any sort of ranged weapon or power? THEY HIT WHAT THEY AIM FOR! From the gunslinger in old Westerns using his superior skill with his Colt Peacemaker to survive a shoot out at high noon. To heroic archer that slays the dragon by hitting the one weak spot in its scales in classic fantasy. To the legendary Robin Hood, splitting the shaft of another arrow with his final shot to win the archery tournament. And when in a comic, unless they are facing an equally powerful super villian, do you see a Blaster Hero miss? All examples of Accuracy over Damage.
Yet in game, Blasters regularly miss. Especially at higher levels, even against equal level minions. How can you not see the problem with this?
Give Blasters the power they need: an inherent Accuracy Power. And if you want to add a damage buff to it as well, make based on how well a Blaster hits its target, and not how close to death the character is.
Blasters will do more damage if they hit their targets more often, instead of missing.
Blasters will survive longer if they hit all the minions they target, taking them out. Instead of having them running up and beating the Blaster to death after multiple misses.
Admit "Defiance" was a bad idea for Blasters, give it to another AT, and move on.
here was the stated goal of Defiance.
When the chips are down and defeat is imminent, how does a hero muster the strength to execute that finishing blow? If youre a Blaster, its compliments of Defiance, the hidden power reserve that will kick in when your health drops to dangerous levels. Get the details on this new Issue 5 auto-power that hopes to bring battling Blasters a much welcomed second wind just when they need it most!
==================
Second wind to me is survive. the additional damage at so low leaves high level blasters that are 1 and 2 shoted with nothing. Give it to tankers that could use the ramp in my opinion.
I would like a real second wind; how about at 40% you increase the blasters defense. Not has high as the damage rate as listed but enough to notice. Keeping the blaster around long enough to pop a green or get healed. If the goal is survivability pumping damage is not the answer, pumping defense or health regen is.
I hate the whole idea of this power! Advising blasters to tell defenders not to heal them and to avoid area heals goes against everything Statesman has said about wanting us to seek out teams and use team work to overcome the challenges of the game. Plus I can see blasters getting teleport just so they can teleport into the air and volunteerly fall to reduce their health so they can do more damage. Does that sound like the normal behavior of a superhero?!
"Don't attack yet. Let me fly up to the top of the sky and fall then i'll be able to do 10 X damage!"
This is just the stupidest idea i've heard. I've said this in another post but please don't ruin this game in the name of balance.
First: This was a really neat idea. Thank you.
Second: I'd also agree a scaling accuracy buff would not be a bad idea for this. It seems like most of the comic book situations you based this concept on included that.
Third: I tested this with a brand new Sonic/Eng blaster I rolled up, my Eng/Dev blaster based on my I4 test build at level 24, and an Elec/Eng blaster at level 19.
From around 1-8 (DJ Boom's (BOOM, BABY!) current level), I found myself doing really well as long as I started fights at 50% health. This won't be a good tactic after I start accruing debt.
For my midline guy, I found a solo Heroic mission in the Hollows (defeat all Trolls in cave, from Julius) to be where I started using it less. It was just too risky and didn't last long enough unless in a one on one fight, though it did save my bacon when an Ogre I ran into outside the mission decided to try to eat me.
For my 24 blaster, it was not a factor. In a street hunt against Family in IP, I either held my own without the definance meter ticking anywhere beyond 10%, or by the time it had ramped up, a Capo was scraping my armor off his boots.
Suggestions:
Start the defiance ramp higher. 60%? Also, the defiance meter needs to be easier to read. I'd suggest a bright red or yellow that will stand out against the UI, and very possibly flash or pulse while Defiance is at cap.
Defiance should last longer. Either let the capped defiance last for a certain period of time (10 seconds?) or make it recede slower than it ramps up as long as the blaster is using combat powers.
Buff accuracy on the same sliding scale as damage to HP, but don't make the ramp as extreme. I'd say cap the accuracy at 200%.