Faultline & Boomtown = Ghostown
By
9783_Dollar_Man,
Posted on: 2004-11-15 08:36 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Here's my suggestions for improving the hazard zones:
1.) how about a Mobile Army Superhero Hospital (M.A.S.H unit) at the entrance?...
2.) ...how about an army supply person who would level you and give you insp and enh (sorta like the grey ghost in PI).
3.) how about a contact in the zone that you dont neccesarily have to get from another contact...
4.) how about more zone specific badges for each zone, like kill 100 COT in faultline, etc...
5.) how about zone specific accolades...
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Very good, DrWinkie. I was just about to post some almost identical suggestions when I saw your post.
Really, rather than "Faultline & Boomtown = Ghost town" I think it is more generally "Hazard Zone = Ghost town"
With the exception of a PP and Hollows, most of the hazard zones are deserted most of the time. Even PP has far less people in it than it used to, and Hollows generally only has people hunting the quadrant near Atlas and Flux. You don't often see groups elsewhere unless they are making the freaking dangerous journey to one of the Hollows missions.
1) I like the suggestions and agree with them almost completely. Every hazard zone should have a triage location or M.A.S.H unit to give you field treatment (a.k.a short distance TP to them and awaken). Heck, you could even have a few of them in the zone and get sent to the nearest one. Since most hazard zones are HUGE and dangerous to travel in, that would help reduce the grief of having to make the long dangerous journey back to the group/mission, dodging densely packed groups of mobs by yourself.
2) Your "Army supply person" is also needed badly. Virtually every time I have hunted or done missions in a hazard zone, everyone's enhancement tray ends up full and it is too much of a pain to go sell. After 30 that may be fine, but pre 30 when there is never enough influence this is a rough restriction (that's what I always hated about KR too).
3) Hazard zones definitely need contacts and missions, that is one of the things that actually keeps many in the Hollows. It never occurred to me to have contacts there that you don't have to be introduced to. That would be great. I think the missions they give you should be fairly random too. One thing I actually DON'T like about the hollows is that the mission arc is completely linear and the same for everyone. So, you frequently have multiple people on the team with the exact same missions. That gets boring.
4) I think zone specific badges is a great idea. Hey, you're helping to clean up a hazard zone, you deserve some badges for it.
5) Zone specific accolades is the one idea I don't really care for. I like accolades being extremely rare. I would like to see a couple of accolades you could get at lower levels though. This is completely subjective of course, it's all a matter of preference and would be fine either way.
6) The only other thing I can think of that would help "fix" hazard zones was also alluded to earlier by someone... give them access from more zones. It is MUCH more preferable and would help promote their use if you could access them more easily like PP and Hollows.
Very good ideas, DrWinkie. Thanks.
Dwimble
I posted about this too about two months ago. The thread got many of the same suggestions: Exp bonus, more missions, and complaints about running through red areas to reach lower level hazard zones gates (which dev thought this was a good idea anyway?).
I play tons of alts on Virtue, Protector, and Infinity, and I'm the king of hazard/trial zones. They key is to take an active role in adventuring in them. So many people take a quick peek into a zone, see no one is there and then leave a little more depressed.
If you want to have fun in hazard zones, you have to make it happen. The vast majority of heroes out there don't click 'team seek' even though they may be open to grouping. So how do you find out? Ask them.
My lvl 14-19 alts will log on in Faultline, set up the team window to find heroes of the right level and AT, then start sending tells to the soloers (after inviting the lucky people who are actually looking for teams). And it's not some crappy "Hey, wanna team?" tell. It's something like, "Hi, want to fight with a team in Faultline?" What, where, and how in a simple statement.
Sometimes you won't get a response, sometimes they are about to log off, or they are in a mission. But more often than not, they are flattered that you asked. It's a numbers game, a percentage of all the tells you send will accept. And before long I always have a 6-8 member team for hazard zone fun.
And it never fails, that a third of my newly formed group has to ask 'Where is Faultline again?' ::sigh::
My groups tend to stick to clocks in Faultline. They are the easiest enemy there. Why hunt a harder equal level enemy when they give the same experience. A 19 boss is a 19 boss.
Another reason I stick to clocks is for ease of navigation. A tip for all of you to afraid to actually explore Faultline. Superspeeders can get around just fine if they stick to the east or west walls. It's only the middle that gives you trouble.
Usually, we're the only group in the entire zone. Every hunt, all team members gain at least one level if not more.
Also, I tend to focus more on trial zones over hazard zones. Trial zones are meant for groups with 6-8 heroes and sometimes have multiple bosses in groups, thus the experience over time is a little better. Hazard zones are less challenging and meant for smaller teams. So for my money Sewer/Hollows > Perez. Faultline > Boomtown. Terra Volta > Dark Astoria, etc.
The hazard/trial zones have given me so much fun. I've taken groups of level 2s through the sewers down to the south junction, through the underworld, and beyond to finally emerge a few hours later all past level 10.
I've had Faultline groups that initially stuggled, then worked out new tactics that allowed them to reach the 'south wall' (the holy grail of any Faultline group).
Not to mention the DA Cemetary runs. And the Terra Volta hero teams, fighting the good fight in the toughest areas around the zone, keeping the hordes of Freakshow/Lost/Sky Raiders at bay for all the respec teams. It's sad how many high level soloers never experienced any of that.
Of course, part of the reason I have so much fun in hazard/trial zones, is because I like to group. I like the challenge of forming and leading pick-up teams. I like having a different mix of powers to combine each time. I like the organized chaos of huge trial zone battles.
Honestly, a big part of the hazard/trial zone issue is the fact that the majority of heroes have a "I'd rather be soloing" approach to the game. No amount of hazard zone 'fixing' can do much about that.
Faultline requiers eveyone to have a Travel Power and at least one with Recall Friend. SJ and Fly are the best for this zone and with the easy to fall get seperated layout this zone really should be uped to lvl 30-40 content.
Add in a new Emeny and some cool caves/always enterable mission doors and you would get ppl to hunt in it.
Yes the Hazord zones ahve kind of proven to be the opposet to what they were planed to be.
I Hunted solo in Boom and DA with both my Scrapper and BLaster. I plan on doing the same with my Tanker.
I agree with these ideas, I think they would make these areas much more interesting and fun for players to explore. When I first went to Boomtown during Beta, I had to hover through most of it because we were afraid to touch down. Never have I felt so awe inspired at destruction and the music.
Faultline equally scared and awed me. I LOVE this zone. I think it's one of the most well done areas. It is scary. If you fall, you fall for a long time, and into a very unhospitable environment. For me that is a part of the fun.
I think zone monsters are good things too. Not necessarily the Kraken, but some that are HUGE and nearly unstoppable. Finding ways to sneak past them (don't make it impossible, but definitely not easy) to find a way into some missions.
I also think there HAS to be more indoor missions in the Hazard Zones. Especially places like Faultline and Eden. How fun would it be to go out to Eden and have to "break" into the Utopia Complex.
Also I think that Vicious Rikti Monkey Island should have missions out there. 
Okay those are my thoughts.
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Creys folley sucks. Big areas w nothing but swarms and monkies. Spawns with level 40 lt's in with 33 mobs, etc. mobs are poorly distributed in level ranges, packs of high level mobs mixed in with lower levels. Groups of 32 and 37 fighting side by side. This zone coudl be good if it wasnt buggy.
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Yeah, STAY OUT OF CREY'S FOLLY! I like all those nice juicy Crey and Freak mobs all for me.
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As for Boomtown, it always seems pretty crowded to me. Faultline is teh suxxor, tho. Even if it was completely flat, why would I want to go to a zone filled w/ Vahz, CoT, and Clocks?
No thanks.
I think the main thing is that the cities are way easier than the hazard zones and, in general, much safer. I don't think adding in more door missions are the answer, because all that means is more groups en route to missions, while we're looking for more groups to actually populate the zone.
One neat thing would be to dolly all the hazards up like The Hollows, in the sense of having a big story arc that culminates in a trial, maybe even an instanced version of the zone. I recognize how they set up Trial and Hazard zones, but I don't think there really needs to be a clear division, and The Hollows is one of the neatest self-contained arcs available.
Also, if they do plan on adding some sort of underwater aspect in the future, either a partially flooded Faultline or the lake behind it would be neat areas to explore.
Finally, a neat thing would be to make hazard zones the buffers between "villain areas" and "hero areas" in City of Villains, or at least contested zones in some way.
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It probably doesn't help that almost everybody has a bad first experiance with Faultline. The first time most of us went in there was most likely the talk to Security Chief->Hunt 20 Vahz in Faultline that you got as soon as your level was high enough to actually enter the zone.
Great, now I have to hunt Vahz who spawn in large groups at +1 to +6 my level solo because there's nobody else who wants to hunt in here. Oh boy, I can't wait to try attacking a group with 3 +1 Eids, 5 +1 Morts, and a bunch of +1 Abominations alone. I think I did what most people do for that mission, draw the aggro of a nearby mob and run like crazy for the police drones. Once the drones take out the eids and a few morts you can sort of muddle through the rest. It's still no picnic and certainly not a place I wanted to return to.
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Excellent point. I love Faultline. Visually, it's one of the neatest areas I've ever seen in a MMORPG.
On the other hand, I hate Vazhilok with their puke and their slow darts and their DDD eidolons. Ugh. Hate them. 
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Hazard Zones that are used:
Perez Park
Hollows.
Perez Park
Zone
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Zone---Perez----Zone
|
|
Zone
Hollows:
Zone-- The
Zone-- Hollows
All the other ones:
Zone--Hazard Zone.
Or in the case of the bloody Rikti
Zone---Hazard Zone full of crap---Crash site.
See a pattern?
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UMMM NO, I don't actually.
There's only 1 way into most Hazard zones, which makes them harder to access. That's the piont, which ignores the sewers, that go to Boomtown at least IIRC.
IMO, a bigger issue is no SKing. That means when I team Subby w/ my lowb buddies, for example, we can't go hunt in Creys or Eden. So I'm making teams in PI and Bricks and FF, that already ahve too many peeps.
I love love love solo hunting in Faultline. It has the magic combo for my main.
Tall buildings with no fire escapes + Teleport = Perfect sniping spot
Vahz + Clockwork = non-flyers who can't get to the rooftops, except for Oscillators, which aren't a big threat
I sit in safety and Teleport Foe individual mobs up to the rooftop and take them out one at a time. When I've beaten all but the bosses, I can zap down to street level and take them out without their crowd of buddies getting in the way.
I got my Gearsmasher and Gravedigger badges super-easily by hunting in Faultline, and I plan to get the CoT badge that way as well.
T
Just for the record, making risk=reward is definitely one of our goals - we're trying to add spice and reward to bring people to the harder/underutilized zones.
One of the trickinesses of having a largely "loot free" game is trying to make rewards interesting for such things - obviously if characters are motivated largely by XP+influence as the major rewards it makes things a bit tougher for the designers - many players tend to go and do whatever the easiest source of XP is and ignore most everything else. And we like the lack of loot, generally.
But I know Jack & co are thinking on the issue, in any case.
-jg
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Jeremy Gaffney
VP Product Development, NCsoft
Agree and disagree.
Faultline is a ghost town. I got 1 or 2 "kill x" missions there, did them as quickly as I could, and never went back. The biggest reason is that my only travel power when Faultline was level-appropriate for me was SS and Faultline really stinks when you have only SS. The other reason was that it's located way down at the bottom of Skyway City and is a pain to get to.
Boomtown, OTOH, was and is a favorite hunting spot for toons in their teens. You can get around it reasonably well even without a travel power, and the approach to it is less hazardous than the approach to Faultline.
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I find it interesting that people are trying to maximize their xp, I seem to spend all my time these days trying not to outlevel story arcs and task forces, ninja-ing mission objectives and deliberately building up debt.
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I assume you are under 30 then. I havent had missions for 2 levels now. If I had died more, it would be even more dull.
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You are quite correct, but if we're talking about Faultline and Boomtown then aren't we talking about under 30? With the addition of The Hollows plus the increased mission bonus I suspect that fewer people of the appropriate level are street patrolling at all, not just in those two zones.
It is great that the staff is looking for ways to get players to use the "ignored" zones.
One suggestion that might work:
Actually have the Faultline Trial running.
Faultline is a trial zone... yet there is no trial running in it. If there is, I have heard nothing about it. Get the Faultline trial running, confer out the badges and Enhancements, etc and you will definitely entice quite a few people.
As it stands, the only people who go into Faultline are either:
A) Doing a hunt mission
B) Looking for the badges
C) Are killing time by looking at the sights
I've done all three, and I have yet to return to Faultline. I love the place though. It's a graphical joy to look at and is wonderous in its savage, destructive quality. It is absolutely beautiful to look at, but hellish to wade through on foot.
I would second the idea of kicking up the levels in there by maybe 5 or so. Put that in and get the trial running and Faultline may be saved.
Head of TRICK, the all Trick Arrow and Traps SG
Part of the Repeat Offenders
Still waiting for his Official BackAlleyBrawler No-Prize
My problem with both of these zones is the same.. that I have to go through bad guys higher level than is level appropriate to get to them. Boomtown starts at 11, and yet in Steel Canyon all the bad guys near its entrance are level 15 through 20. But at least the ones in Steel don't mez... In Skyway on the way to Faultline, which is level appropriate at 14, you'll have to side step a good number of level 18 and 19 Lost and Clockworks, the lieutenants and bosses of which like to mez, sleep, and hold people (mez and sleep for the Lost, the clockworks will hit you with Tesla Cages). Now, each of these is made easier with a travel power, but not everyone takes a travel power.
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Ah I remember my boomtown days. I loved that map! It's where I met a lot of my long time friends and SG members. The hunting there was always so good at that lvl. Faultline on the other hand was one of those places I always tried to avoid.
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I'm with you on this one. Boomtown is the best XP/minute zone once you're L16-19. Before that, it's just annoying. Faultline is aweful! There's bosses in every pack of MOBs and bosses at L14?! You just get owned and sent back to Steel Canyon. It's a lesson in frustration.
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My word, these places are perpetual ghost towns. Its a shame really because they are such nice changes layout wise and the scale is fabulous (especially Faultline). The wierd angles and vertical contrast is really cool, unless youre a Super Speedster of course.
I swore that Faultline was supposed to be a trial zone, the place is a wasteland the villains should all move there cause I dont see any heroes there (3 at the most usually).
I'm on Pinnacle so I cant speak for other servers, but I remember when Boomtown used to be fairly packed with players. I go there now and I see tumbleweeds and can hear a pin drop lol.
I would love to see more than arrest xxx in Boomtown/Faultline. Its not like the Hollows or Perez Park where the places are packed with Heroes at any given time.
What could make these places more desirable to combat in? Badges, trails, unique villains?
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1) Hospitals -- perhaps just as run-down as the zones, so they only restore you to half health and half end; it's the run back from hospitals that ends teams quickly in such zones...
2) Shops -- underground black market or some kind of vigilante 'fence' (that lives on the seedier life of super herodom, but is a hero, nonetheless) that gives better sell value than the standard shop; place it somewhere friendly to those fighting in the zone, but a pain for those NOT in the zone, so that people don't come to the zone JUST to sell...
3) Slightly friendlier movement to speeders; let's face it, the zones that see the least action tend to be the least run-friendly zones.
4) Equal treatment of travel powers. Either make these zones friendly to all movement types or make equivalent high gravity or high magnetics zones that make getting around with flight, leaping, or teleport just as much of a pain/timesink as these zones are to runners. The former seems to be the best approach...
Personally,
I note there are now 8 zones (that I know of) that completely blow for runners: boomtown, faultline, Terra Volta, Rikti Crash Site (due to mob density and mob-level disparity of those clumps, not terrain), and the 4 SS zones.
Where are the 8 zones that hose up leaping? How about the 8 zones that hose teleport? What about the 8 that hose flight? Let's keep it square. By 'hose up' I mean take 4-5 times as long to get around as when using those powers in other, non-problem zones.
Personally, I think player-avoidance of zones where movement is a pain ... speaks volumes. Players don't seem to want to endure this annoyance. In reality, I don't think creation of more of this is a solution, but rather it'd compound the issue.
I'm forced to ask why dev time is wasted on content that sees little use (compared to the content players have shown, by zone occupance, they like)? Analysis of The Hollows, which has some limited terrain issues and poses fewer issues to runners than say, faultline -- but also has good flavour -- might be in order. Are the problematic terrain areas assidously avoided by players in The Hollows or do players actually range about in them in numbers (unlike faultline, usually)? The answer to that analysis should give the devs some further direction...
My 2 inf.
-- Xurbax
The reason I usually avoid Hazard zones, is that there is very little story involved in those zones. And they turn into what I can Frag Fests, groups running around killing with no thought or reason. And personally I dislike that kind of atmosphere, so I don't go there. The Hollows is a step in the right direction for Hazard Zones and Terra Volta is better too.
By accepting what is and making the best use of every situation, life can be fulfilled without a constant demand for more.
--Wen Tzu
I'm not too worried about Boomtown, Faultline has never been real popular, because of it's anti-SS feeling. And with a lot of SSer's there aren't a lot of people who want to be in there.
My real worry is the slow downfall of Perez. I'm on Liberty and Triumph with ALTs regularly and I can't get a group in Perez to save my life. Once I sat there for 4 hours with a Seek Team on, doing Solo Greens and I didn't get a single invite, I did get two levels but no invites.
Ya, lets make all zones flat and easy to run around so that everyone in the game only has Superspeed! While you are at it get rid of the Shadow Shard.. you can't run between all those floating islands so what good is it?
Blech..
Frankly I am sick of the number of superspeeders in the game. The fact that a few zones are not 'convenient' for them is _WHY_ some people take other forms of travel power. Frankly I think there are not enough zones that are not easily traversable by running and SS. Be nice to have a reason to have Fly for example.
Oh well.. people want everything easy.. Hasten & SS baby.. City of Speedsters
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Where are the 8 zones that hose up leaping? How about the 8 zones that hose teleport? What about the 8 that hose flight? Let's keep it square. By 'hose up' I mean take 4-5 times as long to get around as when using those powers in other, non-problem zones.
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Shadow Shard hoses leaping just as much as super speed. The Crash Site is just as irritating with leaping as it is with super speed (every time you land, a million mobs spawn). Boomtown is NOT hard for super speeders to get around in.
So basically that only leaves Faultline and Terra Volta as zones that are tough on JUST super speeders. Which, honestly, is just the way it is. You CAN get around those zones just fine. It just takes 4x as long.
The only solutions I can see are to make every zone boring and flat, or build ramps on everything, or give super-speed the ability to super-leap as well. All of which seem like bad ideas to me. Seriously, you chose the travel power that lets you run really fast. Big holes in the ground are your kryptonite. Deal with it. 
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Equal treatment of travel powers.
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I got no problems with things being made easier for speeders. Ramps, run up walls, whatever.
IF Flight gets upped to the speed of Super Jump and TP gets a big End Cost Reduction. Equal Treatment baby.
Yeah, I like how speedsters say "It takes me forever to get to the back of Terra Volta". Now you know the pain of a flyer who takes forever to get ANYWHERE.
I really don't think geometry is the issue. People will deal with and enjoy funky geometry if they're given an incentive.
My suggestion? Put a contact in every hazard zone. Groups of 4-8 can go up and talk to him and he'll give you a series of tasks to do that are essentially a series of generic hunt and simple door missions in the hazard zone. That way, groups have a reason to hunt in the hazard zones and can still get the bonus.
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Where are the 8 zones that hose up leaping? How about the 8 zones that hose teleport? What about the 8 that hose flight? Let's keep it square. By 'hose up' I mean take 4-5 times as long to get around as when using those powers in other, non-problem zones.
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I heartily disagree, because these zones only penalize players who have chosen SS as their ONLY travel power. You suggest that doing this is unfair; I suggest that you haven't examined the issue closely. People who choose SS as their travel power almost always do so because it allows them to dip into the SS Power Pool for Hasten early without "sacrificing" another power to "buy-in" to a different Travel power. In other words, getting Hasten and SS is more efficient early on in terms of power selection than getting Hasten + Hover + Fly, or Hasten + Recall Friend + TP, or Hasten + Combat Jumping + SJ. Super Speed is also the fastest travel power out of the box AND has an inherent Stealth component built in. It also fits neatly into the standard pre-20 build patterns that most players adhere to, allowing them to dip into the important early powers in their Primaries and Secondaries to build a workable array of staple powers, pick up Hasten AND a travel power, and then dive into Fitness so they can get Stamina by 20. Choosing ANY other travel power early on is not only slower and harder on Stamina and the player, but interferes with the optimum-efficiency power decisions early game, and most players know that by now. Right out of the box, SS blows the other travel powers away.
...but players have to PAY for that. Super Speed gives you NO vertical movement capability, which means that getting around in zones that encourage three-dimensional movement with just SS is a pain. It encourages you to choose a different Travel power, or to invest in two. If the dev team were to "dumb down" their zones so that everywhere was as friendly to SS as they are to SJ, or made zones that penalize players for choosing a Travel power without Super Speed's mechanical advantages, there would be no reason to choose anything but SS. Hell, why not make the Oranbega tileset a flat plain and get rid of the Shadow Shard altogether? Let's make it City of Speedsters!
The way it is now, going the SS route already carries significant advantages in terms of early power selection, travel speed in the majority of zones, and universal combat utility. Everyone knows the problems with the power, but get above level 40 and I guarantee you, 90% of players have it in addition to a second, 3-D capable power. The Speed Pool just that good. Making the game even more SS-friendly is a horrible idea.
I love the layouts of Faultline and Boomtown, Faultline particularly. Both of them have unforgiveably bad location and unfriendly inhabitants (Faultline particularly).
Boomtown has a low level of 12 and is in the extreme north end of Steel Canyon where the level 19s spawn. This puts it as far as possible away from the Yellow Line (extreme southeast corner) and hospital (extreme southwest corner). When I first get the mission to go to Boomtown and hunt Clockwork, I put it off for several levels, because it's not very safe to run through Steel Canyon at level 12. And dying in Boomtown? You have to run back through the gauntlet again. Once you actually get to level 14 or 15 and you have your travel powers, you're starting to think about heading off somewhere else. Boomtown does have Lost and Vahz and Clockwork for some irritating status effects, but there are also Trolls and 5th Column for mostly knockdowns and the odd DOT.
Faultline is the same. Entry level is level 14, but it's at the extreme south end of Skyway City where the level 20s spawn. It's almost as far away as it could be from the Yellow Line and the hospital. As long as we're pointing out that Faultline is empty because it's death for Superspeeders, I might as well mention that you can't even get most Superspeeders as far as Skyway, where Faultline connects from. The only people there are generally trying to put together that Synapse Task Force or hunting in the north end. By level 18 or 19, big enough groups can bottom-feed off the low-level Warriors and Tsoo in Talos anyway.
Because of the distance to the hospital from those zones, even if it were possible to get a group together there, they also fall apart with surprising speed.
Someone already pointed out that at those levels, Tankers have barely begun to resist things like Negative and Energy, and Clockwork and Vahz simply aren't worth the effort, the long run from the hospital, the dangerous run through 5+ territory, or the hazards of terrain for the same XP and a nice view.
It's a pity, really, because some of the best exciting combat I've ever seen in COH was standing on the edge of a huge, monstrous cliff in Faultline, our heels over the edge, fighting off a massive double-wave of Clockwork, with several bosses. There was nowhere for us to go, and the three of us fought like maniacs to keep from being killed there or swept over the edge. Great fun.