Memphis_Bill

For future reference, "Constructive" and "Agreeing with my post" are not the same thing.

What was your statement?

No elaboration. You have declared unilaterally that those mandatory, essential at level one powers become obsolete, and do so rapidly.

So which "mandatory, essential at level one powers" are you referring to? Because from playing, oh, EVERYTHING, none become obsolete.

But you can, of course, imply that it's suboptimal by declaring powers obsolete. I am not dictating anyone's playstyle. I am arguing against a change that is, at the least, pointless and at worst damaging to certain powersets or ATs. I'm arguing at the baseline of play, not the person who (for instance) decides to try to IO out a Stalker's defense and offense and try to run without Hide.

Now think of the reason WHY that is. It's been spelled out in the thread before.

I have never argued against a Tanker's choice not to take Taunt. I'm on record, as can be searched easily on these forums, as *suggesting* someone take it when first playing a set to see if they feel they need it. Nor have I ever argued against petless masterminds. Don't imply by positioning that I would take such stances.

Hide, however, is *essential to the functioning of that AT.* While not all secondary tier-1 powers are at that level of important, it does do something many of them do - It sets up a key state for the AT. Others maintain a base level of playability through a level of defense (of various types, including immobilizing or knockback, yes) or resistance Who made that decision? The devs. And, chuckles, they *are* that important. They have set up powers at level one to ensure soloability and specific minimums for the AT or powerset. It may be self defense. It may be offense. It may be a self buff/heal.

And you, chuckles, are saying they're wrong. And have yet to prove that case.

To use your own statement, you're not that important.

Blood of the black stream. See "EAT at War Witch's" in my sig.

Oh really.

A self-heal is obsolete?
HIDE is obsolete? (You know, one of the essential powers for *every single stalker* out there?)
An/another immobilize is obsolete?
An attack (EVERY Defender and tank) is obsolete?

YOU may CHOOSE not to use it for some reason, but they are far from obsolete. My blasters will still use the level 1 immobilizes at level 50. My tanks still use the level 1 attacks. My scrappers and brutes quite OBVIOUSLY still use the level 1 shields. My defenders certainly use the attacks. And yes, I still use Gale.

*looks at level 1 female characters with valkyrie cape and magic pack capes - not the boleros* Oh?

Nope. Just "Does that look good with this outfit."

I'll tend to run the cape missions anyway, just to have all the options available.

O2 boost is also mez protection (disorient/sleep,) +PER and END drain resist. That's not becoming an AOE.

Yeah, well, look at who said it.

As far as a second build letting you skip it, as mentioned elsewhere? By that time you're 10. Think of it as a free set of slots to go somewhere else if you don't think you'll need it any longer.

And yet they can live so much better WITH them.
Force bolt - minor damage, keeps a wide range of enemies away from an AT that starts off VERy squishy (as well as their very squishy pets.)
Gale - Same (plus helps in positioning.)
Sonic Siphon - Good -Res debuff, so it helps the AT do more damage *from level 1.*

All these powers are good both solo and teamed.

As opposed to:
O2 boost - useless solo.
Deflection shield - OK, as a MM, most *assume* you start off with a pet. (Some choose not to, admittedly, for whatever reason.) However, FB is still more useful and ensures you have SOME sort of offensive power - that also acts defensively in keeping things away.)
Sonic Barrier - Useless solo.

The devs cannot guarantee you'll be teamed (or teamed with anyone that pays you the least bit of attention.)They CAN guarantee you'll be solo - you are the second you log in.

The pattern holds true pretty consistently:
Stalkers - should be blatantly, mind-numbingly obvious
Defenders - Another obvious one. No defender has zero capability to attack.
Blasters - "Keep away" power early on for a squishy AT.
Tankers - Usually a minor attack - that's quick, low END and now has bruising.
Controllers/Corruptors - Again, solo utility. Yes, even Trick Arrow (gives Illusion a immob, which it's missing, gives Plant -fly so other powers can work on the target on the ground, stacks with other immobs overall and helps with Containment.)
Scrappers, brutes - Basic, most common (typically smah/lethal) def or resist (except regen, which starts the +regen.)
Dominators - fast, Dom-building attack at range
Masterminds - Powers that affect or protect you that can be used even if you can't summon pets for some reason. (END, for instance.)

Looking specifically at controllers and corruptors:

COLD DOMINATION - Infrigidate. Lowers enemy damage, speed and recharge. T2: Ice shield, useless solo.
EMPATHY - Healing aura. Self heal. T2: Heal other. Useless solo.
FORCE FIELD - PFF. Self protection. T2: Deflection shield, useless solo.
Kinetics: Self heal. T2: Siphon Power. The self heal is more immediate at keeping you alive, both depend on tohit.
Rad - Radiant aura, self heal. T2, Radiation Infection. Lowers DEF and ToHit, but a constant END drain. Self heal is usable in low END "must survive" situations regardless of enemy.
Sonic - Sonic Siphon - Lowers enemy Res, player does more damage. T2: Sonic Barrier, useless solo (for all sets - Mind, for instance, doesn't get a pet, so it never becomes useful solo.)
Storm Summoning - Gale - KB, minor damage. Useful solo for survival (and minor damage.) T2: O2 boost, useless solo.
Thermal - Warmth, PBAOE heal. T2: Thermal shield. useless solo.
TA: Entangling arrow. Stacks with immobs, provides -fly to sets that don't have it (Plant) and provides an immob to sets missing one (Illusion, Mind.) T2: Flash arrow. Doesn't help Plant (-fly from Ent.Arrow,) for instance. Not as much utility.


So /unsigned, as always. "Fix it" implies the design is broken. It is not.

Then don't play it. I'll keep my soft control and fun knockback.

No, not really.

Foolish, unaware comment. You do realize multiple blaster sets were available on release, yes?
Then you aren't looking.

Hmm. Just played with one last night.
And amazingly, YOU DO! Imagine that!
And they do.
I think you've got other issues, personally.
Nova. Energy Torrent. Explosive Blast. All AOE. 1/3 of the set.
And they definitely do damage. Yes, even as a defender.

Perhaps you should learn what you're talking about before complaining.

Refusing to learn to work with what's in the set you chose, yes.
Refusing to learn to work with a set someone else is playing, yes. And yes, that includes saying "Hey, could you aim *into* me instead of knocking things away, or direct that into a wall" if you're melee.

It doesn't take long for anyone with two brain cells to rub together to figure out "Oh, if I hit that, it has a good chance of going back that way. Maybe I should pay attention to what I'm doing and act accordingly."

Refusing to do that, or just whining that "omg that set has knockback it's ebil and must be nerfed?" Yes, that lands solidly in the "idiot" pile.

It's not, despite what you're trying to do here, about "Other sets have other effects," so don't try twisting it that way. It's about not bothering to use the effects of the set you chose effectively.

Just as a note. If you're using IOs, any bonuses in forms hold through all other forms.

Yes. The recent "Can shift to dwarf while mezzed" a few issues back should be enough to answer that.

This, and

This.

The problem isn't knockback. It's idiots that don't want to learn how to play with it - and that's not just the person with the KB powerset.

They do not.
Why are VEATs drooled over? Four words.

"Hey look, stacked leadership!"

The AT itself is, IMHO, boring to play. Teams want the buffs, period. Nobody says "Hey, look, someone with stealth that can crit!" when seeing a Bane or Widow. It's all "Stacked buffs, stacked buffs!" To the point where most VEAT discussions end up with "nothing can touch you with multiple VEATs."

Boring reason to roll an AT.

Flipside, why are Khelds sometimes "meh"ed at? Memory of crap players, quite frankly. You know the ones. "Oh no, a void, I'm going to go hide! Someone kill it! EEEEEK!" Not damage scalars. Not "They go boom a lot when switching forms." But, frankly, players who play leeches instead of squids. Never mind voids have been nerfed for so long they're barely a threat. (Not to mention the whole "OMG it says epic and it's not godmode I deleted it at six it sucked!" crap that has been spewed over the last 15 issues.)

It's similar to stalkers in a way. Are they squishier than most other melee? Sure. But they can still stand there and scrap. I know. I DO. But what rep did stalkers get (which came up when people said why they didn't invite stalkers?) "Oh, they're one-trick ponies, they AS and run away waiting for hide." That's not the AT. That's crap players.

Would I turn DOWN a damage buff, or faster swapping of forms? Of course not, depending on the cost. Do I think they need more slots? Absolutely not.

Oh, and as for this:
Yes, the VEAT storyarcs suck. They're among the worst in the game, post level 15 or so (and are only average, but have decent flavor for the AT, before then.) That said, they *are a part of the AT.* So no, I will NOT put that argument away. I will, however, continue to take the devs to task for rushing such a slipshod, lousy set of arcs out for an EAT.

And I disagree. I've never felt as irritated and *frustrated* with anything as I did leveling my VEATs - to where I don't want to level others. "Effective" is such a pointless word in that description. Effective at what? What is "Effective?" I've got more ranged damage and control in my Khelds. I don't lose my resistances and buffs if I run low on END. I have more build flexibility (human, bi- or tri-form) each with their own weaknesses and strengths. I don't have to rely on rather weak stealth to get the most damage out of my attacks.

And for me, what Khelds are *far* more effective at than VEATs is simply *being fun for me.*

Save settings does affect the pop help. And that was why I said "Other characters - hit load settings."

No, it doesn't affect "go talk to montague" and the like, but it does affect everything else.

Turn them off on one character.
Save settings.
Other characters - "Load settings from file." Never see a ! again.

You are incorrect. But I'm not going to argue with a new wall today.
And Vel: No. Not when the person pretty much refuses to listen and "get it" over two threads. And you couldn't PM that why?

IN preparation, perhaps. In game, though (running Levantra's missions typically) they keep referring to your (assumed-human) body as "birth form."