Garthalus

Thanks for the feedback. I've been toying with Mids and I came to the following conclusions based on that and your interesting perspectives on the matter...

1.) Hasten is a must-have
2.) Investing in LotG +Rech enhancements are about the only way to close the global recharge gap (on a full-time basis)
3.) HO's in Siphon Life are probably worth the investment, but alternate frankenslotting approaches are viable, if less efficient

Based on that, here's the modified build I came up with. Note it has Defense over the soft-cap as mitigation for debuffs (Cimerora, Antimatter, etc.) as I was able to squeeze it in without adversely impacting build performance. The only purple I used in the build is the Hectacomb proc for Smite. Overall, it borrows a lot from Gaiden's build. Slightly better Regen/Recovery, higher toggle endurance burn offset by more endurance reduction enhancement values in Smite and Midnight Grasp.

Anyway, here's the final product...

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.707
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Slammer Sam: Level 50 Technology Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Dark Melee
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Smite -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx:47(A), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:47(3), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:47(5), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:47(7), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg:47(17), Hectmb-Dam%:50(19)
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:40(A), LkGmblr-Def:40(13), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:40(17), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg:40(23)
Level 2: Shadow Maul -- Oblit-Dmg:40(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg:40(3), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg:40(5), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:40(7), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:40(15), Oblit-%Dam:40(19)
Level 4: Focused Senses -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx:40(A), LkGmblr-Def:40(15), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:40(23), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg:40(25)
Level 6: Combat Jumping -- Ksmt-ToHit+:30(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+:35(37)
Level 8: Siphon Life -- HO:Nucle(A), HO:Nucle(9), HO:Nucle(9), HO:Golgi(11), HO:Golgi(11), HO:Golgi(13)
Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- EndRdx-I:40(A)
Level 12: Hurdle -- Jump-I:40(A)
Level 14: Health -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx:40(A), Numna-EndRdx/Rchg:40(43), Numna-Heal/Rchg:40(46), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg:40(46), Numna-Heal:40(46), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+:40(48)
Level 16: Dodge -- LkGmblr-Rchg+:40(A), LkGmblr-Def:40(34), DefBuff-I:50(42)
Level 18: Agile -- LkGmblr-Def:40(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+:40(37), DefBuff-I:50(42)
Level 20: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod:40(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg:40(21), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc/Rchg:40(21), P'Shift-Acc/Rchg:40(25), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc:40(43), P'Shift-End%:40(43)
Level 22: Quickness -- Run-I:40(A)
Level 24: Boxing -- Acc-I:40(A)
Level 26: Soul Drain -- GSFC-ToHit:40(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg:40(27), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx:40(27), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx:40(29), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx:40(29), GSFC-Build%:50(31)
Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def:40(A), LkGmblr-Rchg+:40(40), DefBuff-I:50(42)
Level 30: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+:27(A), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx:40(31), ImpArm-ResDam:40(31), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg:40(40), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg:40(50)
Level 32: Midnight Grasp -- C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg:47(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg:47(33), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg:47(33), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx:47(33), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg:47(34), RechRdx-I:50(34)
Level 35: Evasion -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx:40(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg:40(36), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg:40(36), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:40(36), RedFtn-Def:40(37)
Level 38: Weave -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx:40(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg:40(39), RedFtn-EndRdx:47(39), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg:40(39), RedFtn-Def:40(40)
Level 41: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I:50(A)
Level 44: Physical Perfection -- Mrcl-Rcvry+:40(A), P'Shift-EndMod:40(45), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc:40(45), P'Shift-End%:40(45)
Level 47: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(48), RechRdx-I:50(48)
Level 49: Super Jump -- Zephyr-ResKB:40(A), Zephyr-Travel:40(50), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx:40(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I:45(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I:45(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I:45(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 6: Ninja Run

So, I've just about wrapped up my current project, a Dark Melee/Super Reflexes Scrapper. I've been building him expressly to solo AVs in the end-game. What I need now is some advice on end-game balancing on a modest budget. I thought about Hectacombs and LotG +Rech IOs, but I wanted to work some kinks out of the final build before investing chunks of influence on those "high end" IOs.

Here it is, comments are welcome.

Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.707
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Click this DataLink to open the build!

Slammer Sam: Level 50 Technology Scrapper
Primary Power Set: Dark Melee
Secondary Power Set: Super Reflexes
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Body Mastery

Hero Profile:
Level 1: Shadow Punch -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(3), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), T'Death-Dam%(43)
Level 1: Focused Fighting -- LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(7), LkGmblr-Def(17), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(29)
Level 2: Smite -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(3), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(13), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(15), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), T'Death-Dam%(43)
Level 4: Shadow Maul -- Oblit-Dmg(A), Oblit-Acc/Rchg(5), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(5), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(19), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(25), Oblit-%Dam(25)
Level 6: Focused Senses -- LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(7), LkGmblr-Def(17), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(29)
Level 8: Siphon Life -- Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(9), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(9), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(11), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(19), Heal-I(31)
Level 10: Practiced Brawler -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(11)
Level 12: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 14: Combat Jumping -- Ksmt-ToHit+(A), GftotA-Run+(40), GftotA-Def(45)
Level 16: Health -- Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Rcvry+(43), Numna-Heal(46), Numna-Heal/Rchg(46), Mrcl-Heal(48), RgnTis-Regen+(48)
Level 18: Dodge -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(31)
Level 20: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(21), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(21), P'Shift-End%(45)
Level 22: Quickness -- Run-I(A)
Level 24: Agile -- DefBuff-I(A), DefBuff-I(31)
Level 26: Soul Drain -- GSFC-ToHit(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(27), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg/EndRdx(27), GSFC-Rchg/EndRdx(37), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx(37), GSFC-Build%(37)
Level 28: Lucky -- LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(A), LkGmblr-Def(34), DefBuff-I(40)
Level 30: Boxing -- Acc-I(A)
Level 32: Midnight Grasp -- C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(A), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(33), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(33), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Mako-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(34)
Level 35: Evasion -- LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(36), LkGmblr-Def(36), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(36)
Level 38: Tough -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(39), ImpArm-ResDam(39), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(39), ImpArm-ResDam/Rchg(40)
Level 41: Weave -- RedFtn-Def/EndRdx(A), RedFtn-Def/Rchg(42), RedFtn-EndRdx/Rchg(42), RedFtn-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42), RedFtn-Def(45), RedFtn-EndRdx(46)
Level 44: Conserve Power -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 47: Physical Perfection -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-End%(48), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(50)
Level 49: Super Jump -- Zephyr-Travel(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(50), Zephyr-ResKB(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- QckFt-EndRdx/RunSpd(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Critical Hit
Level 6: Ninja Run

I prefer positional Defense, specifically Ranged for Blasters.

S/L Typed defense is less beneficial, IMO.

It's a trade-off. I picked MultiStrikes initially because of the AoE/Melee mix and the better endurance reduction enhancement values.

Are there other ways of doing the same thing..? Sure, tailor to add more recharge, frankenslot to suit, etc. etc.

The guide is not meant as the "end all - be all" for SD/WM Tanks, it's merely a place to start for the uninitiated. Going this route (per the guide) seemed a good balance. From there, folks can optimize to suit their playstyle, but at least there's a solid base they can start from... And that was precisely my goal.

Go and tinker to your heart's content, because what makes sense for you will likely be something you enjoy more. And hey, that's the name of the game, right?

(points to guide in signature)

Sweet mother this is annoying! Not only does my Shield Tank "stutter" while jumping, but he sounds like a whole troop of guys going "hut hut hut hut hut" all out of cadence.

Whatever happened to "if it ain't broken, don't fix it"?

The "SuperScout Scrapper" thing made me chuckle.

Firstly, because there are varying degrees and types of this behavior that you are overgeneralizing. Second, because flat-out, hard-charging, spawn-diving daring the team to keep up Scrapping is the only way I play with my Scrappers. Asking a Scrapper to be conservative and not act like a cracked up monkey with A.D.D. seems counter-intuitive.

Good: Scrapper sprinting ahead of the team and spawn diving into the next spawn, dealing lots of pain in the process.

Bad: Same thing only Scrapper consistently is over his head and getting hammered into the ground, leaving that next spawn targeting the rest of the team before the Tank is positioned to catch aggro.

Good: Scrapper bouncing around the fight and wasting high-pain targets (Sorcerers, Quantums, Cysts, etc.)

Bad: Scrappers bouncing around and pulling multiple spawn aggro onto the team (read: over aggro cap for Tanks)

Good: Scrapper going left while Tank goes right, then tandem-herding to the same location for AoE destruction.

Bad: Scrapper going off on his own and getting spanked before asking team to come save his faceplanted self.

Ultimately, several Scrapper sets offer good aggro control. Don't underestimate them. My recent Kat/Inv Scrapper had two Tanks taunting Freakshow bosses off him and they couldn't break the aggro lock they had on me. Not that I minded, but it was funny as hell.

You're not describing an aggressive Scrapper, you're describing bad players. That type of behavior, by the way, I have seen with plenty of archetypes... Including some Tanks that I needed to personally jump in and save with my Scrapper. Some after they got smeared across the floor.

Just be careful with generalizations. Not all fit the same mold. But I do agree that all things being equal, Tanks are better equipped to hold aggro and survive it. I love both my Scrappers and Tanks, so I can also fully support the "I'm a Tank, I win" philosophy. But also remember not to be too uptight about this... It's a game, and nobody remembers the good teams that flow along without drama, but EVERYONE remembers the horror shows that result in people telling each other in private "What the hell did he just do?" and "OMG, we are SO screwed!"



Those teams always make my day. At least once my blood pressure goes down and I can laugh about it.

OK, I'll throw in my two bits for what they are worth...

Ice Armor with the new power customization options for colors can be much more subtle than you are used to. Consider it, as it has similar survivability (perhaps better) than Shield Defense when built properly. It has a self-heal/HP boost and a phase/heal Tier 9. It lacks the PbAoE attack (Shield Charge) but makes up for it with a damage aura. The set is also exceptionally good with aggro management with two potential taunt auras. On top of that, you have a great endurance recovery tool in Energy Absorption. That power alone takes some of the pressure off your endurance management, allowing more aggressive slotting for powers and attacks.

Since Ice Armor is most effective at the center of a spawn (where you will be most of the time anyway), AoE heavy secondaries such as Fire Melee, Warmace, and Battleaxe are a good choice.

Ice/ + (AoE Secondary) will be an absolute aggro magnet on teams, which is where I tend to operate most of the time. If you are a proficient Tanker, it can be somewhat easy mode for that, but still satisfying.

The other end of the spectrum is to look into Willpower. While WP lacks a damage aura and has an anemic Taunt aura, it offers some fantastic survivability and will essentially eliminate any endurance woes with Quick Recovery and Stamina (if you go that route). I recently leveled a Willpower/Dual Blades Tank on Triumph named Grognar to 50 and it was a bit of a challenge. Dual Blades offers good AoE potential and fast activating attacks, but aggro management took a lot of attention. Lots of tactical positioning and being VERY aggressive moving ahead of the team to be the first one diving into spawns to collect them within the RttC aura and establish aggro. Flip side is that he was very fun to play, a great challenge, and offered some impressive damage in the mid-late game once the combos got going. At the end, his build was soft-capped to Energy/Negative Energy, close to the HP cap for Tanks, and was pushing some impressive damage.

That would be a different route, but not one I would advocate to someone with modest Tanking skills. On the other hand, it was an excellent challenge and really allowed me to re-hone some of my methods for aggro control.

I don't recommend Dark Armor. Love it as a Scrapper, just cannot get into it for Tanks.. I've tried. Stone Armor is another I passionately dislike. My Tanking style is very dynamic and Granite just kills that. Even with Teleport, it's less responsive than I want and the slow/damage reduction goes against the grain for me. I don't want a meatshield, I want a durable hero that deals back his measure of hurt to the bad guys.

Invulnerability is a solid alternative to Willpower. Less diverse, perhaps, but has a good Taunt aura and matures relatively early. That Psi hole hurts later on though, so look at IO sets to either offset or mitigate if you want to be versatile in the late game.

Electric Armor/Melee are a wild-card for me. I'm in a leveling pact with a good player right now and he's running a EA/EM Tank with good results. Overall, though, my first impressions match yours for Electric Armor. Pure-resistance sets like Fire Armor and Electric Armor can be very strong, but they get hit with just about every debuff that gets aimed at them. That alone can be a bit of a hassle with stacking holds breaking through your mez protection, etc. Death Mages always stacked Immobilize on me with my Fire Tank, not for long but enough to be a pain.

Speaking of which, Fire Armor could also be an option if you are looking for a change of pace. Personally, if I were going to take Fire Armor again or try Electric Armor, I would pair it with a high mitigation Secondary such as Warmace or BattleAxe that offered knockdown/knockup. Super Strength I would pass on just because of the Def debuff from Rage. I have a Inv/SS Tank and I can see the effect in survivability when it drops. Also, I like consistent performance, so the up/down nature of Rage is less appealing to me now than it used to be.

So yeah, if I were going to suggest something different..? WP/DB. Nice challenge, great survivability, solid soloing potential if needed, and it will shine on teams if you play it right. And, it's different. Sure, when Issue 9 came out, WP/DB Tanks were a dime a dozen, but now...? Hardly ever see them. Dare to be different.

I'm not seeing the most prevalent mission bug I have run into since I16 launched... My apologies if this has been mentioned elsewhere.

I generally lead teams and my mission settings are generally somewhere around +6 heroes equivalent / Bosses / +2 level opponents / Arch Villains

Problem I have been seeing over and over again is that missions will spawn at +2/+3 level opponents (nothing unexpected there), but the AV at the end of the mission will be +5 to me. That gets hideous when you think that for the sidekicks on the team, they are +6 to them. Might as well be shooting spitballs and beating on the AV with a wiffle bat...

I've tried changing the mission settings, etc. but the AV always seems to be spawning at at least 2/3 levels higher than the rest of the mission. This happened on nearly all of the Portal Corps mission arcs (Tina McIntyre, Unai Kemen, etc.) and resulted in me essentially giving up on the arcs. I placed numerous /bug reports and have yet to see any action on it, so I have no idea how widespread the problem may be.

Claws/

Shockwave...

Mmmm. Shockwave.

Claws/ has a ranged component with Focus and Shockwave that really adds flexibility to the build for "generalist" play.

And I agree with others here, as the whole "combo" thing feels like someone is trying to force me into an attack chain. With Claws/, it's all about spamming the right attack at the right time... and that's it.

YMMV I guess.

[ QUOTE ]
Since “best chain” doesn't specifically imply “highest DPS”, I'll suggest Incinerate -> Scorch -> Cremate -> Scorch.

Compared to Incinerate -> Greater Fire Sword -> Cremate -> Fire Sword, it does 6.5% lower DPS, but uses 11% less EPS, which is a reasonable trade off for long fights. Recharge is similar, at +145% vs. +134%. The main advantage, though, is that it only requires three attacks instead of four, freeing up slots and a power choice for other aspects of your build.

[/ QUOTE ]

So, silly question here... to chain that three-attack chain together, you need to have a total of 134% recharge in each power (enhancement + global)?

Some broad strokes on your current build...

1.) Take Whirling Sword. It's a nice AoE attack.
2.) Slot Parry like an attack with some Defense enhancement. You are spamming it anyway, do some damage with it.
3.) 3 slots in Swift... Really?
4.) Delay Stamina (late 30's). Prior to that, Quick Recovery is plenty.
5.) Drop the To-Hit Debuffs in RttC. Not much return for the slots.
6.) Slotting for Super-Jump is not the greatest...
7.) Don't slot Disembowel with Kinetic Crash... The bonuses are OK, but you get more milage out of something like Crushing Impact.

Just some quick impressions...

Points to guide in signature .>

[ QUOTE ]
In normal missions, I just arrange to tank alternate mobs with the other tank, so that there's always a nice tight group for the damage to blow away.

[/ QUOTE ]

With two good Tanks, this can work EXCEEDINGLY well. I've only had the opportunity to team with someone willing to leapfrog each other a couple times, but man... The team just steamrolled as a result.

But...

It makes me feel so conflicted while pounding away on Pylon 17...

Yeah, I found myself wondering about the +10% Recharge bonus from Time Lord's Boon...

Seemed like a Temp power, but I couldn't turn it off...

[ QUOTE ]
I've yet to have a Scrapper that has outlasted one of my Tankers in a toe to toe situation.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is as it should be, but frankly, I run into a lot of Tanks in TF's and PuG's that my Scrappers can out-survive while dealing a ton of pain in the process. Hell, I ran with a Shield Defense Tank last night whose positional Defense values were LOWER than my Fire/Shield Scrapper (who doesn't have Weave). I was dragging the team behind be with three Tanks in tow through mission after mission... Was exciting, but I just felt sad those Tanks couldn't keep up.

YMMV I guess.

In my completely subjective opinion... People love Shield Charge for a few reasons...

First, it is perhaps the most visually dynamic power that you'll see on a Scrapper. You click the power and your character crouches back a moment then... BAM! You blur into pure kinetic energy that crosses the gap in an instant and explodes in a burst that blows the spawn apart, knocking them off their feet and clearing the immediate area around you. For me, that animation has the whole "comic book super-hero" vibe to it nailed down cold. With other AoEs, you spin around in place, stomp the ground, clap your hands, etc. With this one, it's a dynamic whole-body motion that just conveys boundless energy and focused intensity.

The other aspect that I think people love is that it's also movement and an attack. It has a tactical element missing from other powers... For example, my Shield/WM Tank often will use Shield Charge to burst out of one cluster of foes into another... The residual taunt effect from AAO on the old group combines with Gauntlet and the threat generated in the new group, essentially pulling them together without stopping to move between one group and another. The analog with Scrappers would be to move between packed groups to maximize the boost from AAO and also to ensure sufficient targets in range for your attacks.

It's a great power, and one that I also was very "meh" about until I took it and experienced it first hand. Since then, it's been at the top of my AoE power list for "fun factor". Which is funny, since its in the Scrapper [u]Secondaries[u].

But like I said, that's just my point of view...

[ QUOTE ]
If you needed some help you could have just asked...
Like Chaos said, post your build and we'll start from there...

Here's a couple of videos for you to look at on just how weak shield really is...

Video 1

Video 2


Video 2 was done at level 40... just in case you think you need to spend some ridiculous amount of inf on the build...

[/ QUOTE ]

That's pretty impressive for Video 2. Nice work.

I was on a team last night with 4 Tanks... No infighting, no prima donnas... Just fun team play.

Generalizations (such as the one I am making now) are inherently inaccurate.

OK, I'm going out on a limb here and suggesting something DIFFERENT from the rest of these folks.

Spines/ is the classic AoE set with a damage aura in the primary and lots of solid AoE attacks.

Fire Melee/ has a nice fast-recharging AoE in Fire Sword Circle. It's well balanced with great single target damage.

What I am going to suggest is Claws/

Yep, people forget how much AoE prowess Claws 2.0 has these days. Spin is available early, you get Eviscerate (cone), and Shockwave is the icing on the cake.

Combine a set like Claws with something like Fire Armor or Dark Armor with a damage aura and you are styling. See, Follow-up boosts both to-hit and damage, so it maximizes your damage aura (and Cloak of Fear's mitigation if you take /DA). Plus, Claws/ offers a bunch of mitigation with knockdown/knockback which can be great with a highly moblie Scrapping style like mine. Shockwave can be used to "sweep" foes into a corner or against a wall to cluster them for Spin and Eviscerate.

Yeah, Claws/Fire Armor would be my suggestion. If for nothing else, for something different that's not a cookie-cutter build you see two of on teams...