Zen_Concern

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SHould you be able to solo everything. No. Get over it.

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Let me reply with a statement that blatently accuses you of saying something you did not.


Should you have to team to play the game? No. Get over it.

About a month ago I made a thread that asked if anyone else saw a trend in the game to get people to group more and solo less to the point of it eventually becoming forced grouping. Some people said yes and some people said no. On test and a few other forums people have talked about changes that make them feel that the game is forcing them to group.

Just recently we get this quote from Statesman.

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You should always be able to do your own missions alone.

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I never, never, never said that. Many missions ARE solo-able. Many aren't. Bosses, Elite Bosses and AV's usually require help. So if you see any of those on a mission, get help!

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So with the previous Statement of Statesman saying that 3 white minions should be equal to one Hero we have the above statement.

Now that Bosses usually require help does anyone see a trend in the game towards forced grouping?

Well, personally I used to say that I would always team with a DM/Regen scrapper. Until I teamed with a few that seemed a little to crazy and debt happy. They actually did not mind getting debt, while I hated it. So the play styles simply did not match.

Also have you ever seen a high level /Regen scrapper exemplared down below IH? Simply Hilarious. The first time they die, they sit there and go "Wow, I never even bother to look at my green bar anymore."

That last was priceless when I heard it for the first time. Anyway I am just saying that I am alot more carefull in picking up /Regen scrappers than I used to because of all the FOTM idiots out there who don't really know how to use their characters.


Also if you think you have a problem getting a team you should try playing a Dark Defender. I still get tells that go like this:

GroupLeader: "So are you a bubbler?"
Me: "No, I am a debuffer."
GroupLeader: "So you are a specialized healer?"
Me: "No, I am a debuffer with other abilities."
GroupLeader: "Sorry we either need a dedicated healer or Bubbler everything else sucks in a group. You really have a solo build."

At this point I just laugh at the GroupLeader. Then, I write his name down on a list of people that I will not help until they beg; and if they are very rude on a list of people that I will never help.

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I think there are "casual team players" and "casual soloers" So claims that team based content is screwing the "casual gamer" aren't accurate. they're screwing SOME casual gamers. And some more then others, at that. The problem is, when someone feels they're getting screwed, they're rarely calm enough to make such distinctions.


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That would be why I said "one aspect of casual gaming."

That is also why in my original post on this thread I pointed out that there are different kinds of casual gamers. I thought I summed it up pretty well, not that Statesman even wants to touch the issue of casual game play or hardcore game play.

The very last thing Statesman wants to do is admit that the direction of the game is turning it into an EQ clone with spandex. A month ago I would have said that this game being compared to EQ archtypes was ridiculous, however after the new Epic ATs were released and the other new content that is being release was shown to me I think that they are trying to implement encouraged (forced) teaming.

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I don't really agree that team-based content is screwing anyone at all. The people getting "screwed" as you say, were the soloing casual gamers anyway. More teaming does not mean less soloing.

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That is starting to change with the new mob HP in I3.

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One aspect of casual gameing is the ability to solo and progress through content.


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And with that fallacy as a central premise I can easily ignore the rest of your post.

Preference for soloing or grouping has nothing to do with casual vs advancement driven play.

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What the heck do you mean by Casual vs advancement driven play? Are you implying that casual players do not want to advance?

Second how is the statement a fallacy. Please assure me that you are grouped 24/7 and do not solo at all. I would love to hear you make that statement.

Yep, your crazy. You also don't speak for all casual players.

Nice thread but it does not address any of the underlying threats to casual gaming. One aspect of casual gameing is the ability to solo and progress through content. Slowly with each update the solo part of the game is being overshadowed by the team part of the game. Casual players do team. Casual players also solo and due to the nature of casual playing many casual players will find themselve soloing with the LFG flag up. Depending on when they play and what AT they play that flag may be up for a long time. Thats fine for some players. Other players view it as something that will cause them to stop playing this game.

If you are wondering about what new content that was added that is geared to teamplay and not solo play here is a small list:

1. New Hazard Zones. Not intended to be solo friendly despite scrapper claims.

2. Release of an Epic AT that is greatly influenced by teamplay. In fact its centered around teamplay. I am not saying that it is bad for a new archetype to be based on teamplay I am just saying that it supports my point.

3. HP increase. This may or may not be in the release of issue 3. While some classes have no problem with the HP increase in some level or all level ranges, some ATs that were already to a degree group dependant now find themselves more group dependant.

These are just the major changes coming in Issue 3 that are geared toward making solo not just less attractive but a pain for some classes that already find it a pain.

This is not to say that it is not possible to solo, it is just pointing out that as the boring factor increases the fun factor decreases. You could say that none of the previous solo material has been removed from the game but then as I pointed out they could be making game changes that will be eliminating some of the solo material from all the classes.

I can also say that after a character has played through the solo content about 20 times a person gets rather familiar with even if it is given window dressing and some new fancy duds. So some new solo content, besides window dressing on old missions, may not be a bad thing.

From the way I look at the update the new updates are geared exclusivly for the gamers who spend more than five hours a week playing this game.

Heck I can look at it another way. Why do so many people make alts? If it was a problem with their character they could just respec right? Wrong. If they are really a casual gamer the most likely will not have 2 or 3 consecutive hours to do the respec TF. What option is open to the character? Re-roll and re-grind back to where he was. Yep the low level missions start to look really boring after you have done them over 20 times. Just something else in the game that is not casual friendly.

Yep the first time I ever got debt on my Eng/Eng toon was in the respec trial. Why? Not because of the mob toughness but because of the group. It sure wasn't me that was pulling mobs without the group being ready or stumbling into a prox mine. Personally I think that the respec trial should have a solo option.

In the right group its not hard but getting that group is a pain in the keister. Currently the Reward does not match risk in any way shape or form.

What will be done to Blizzard?

If nothing is done to Blizzard can you make an accurate description for that warns Ice blasters how situational it is.

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i honestly believe that if you don't have two consecutive hours in the day to complete something, that you should stop wasting your time playing video games and learn some serious time management or get a less hectic schedule.


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I honestly believe that if you spend more than two consecutive hours in front a computer playing a video game you need to get out more. Just thought I should mention that since we were talking about what we believed !

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The success rate on the respec for those who can't find a team is 0%.

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Yep. It is also 0% for people who don't have two hours to do it.

It was alot of fun to pop on real quick and participate.

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I'll let you in on a little secret: this is story is just the tip of the Issue 3 story. Folks, this is the start of A Council of War.

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I love dropping cryptic hints like this to my gameing group. The little hints that make them fear and dream of what is to come. No more hints Statesman it might stifle my imagination.

But statesman would never lie to us. He is as reliable as the media! I refuse to believe that my elec blaster powers are worse than my ice powers. The sky is green not blue I tell you. (Head turns slowly around until it faces backwards)

Remember that Statesman is eating pie. If you were eating pie then you would be able to drain an AV with friends too.

Actually I have the problem with my level 10 character that I cannot get any more missions from my first contact and the only contact she gave me was the one in the Hollows so I am stuck in the Hollows. I don't have any other contacts nor can I get any.

Oh, and everyone has posted how the low level game is screwed. Devs say their going to fix it and no one is holding there breathe.

Roger that I can't wait to be a villain and have both Controller and Tanker powers. MWhhahhaha.

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And yet it is the achievers who will complain leveling is too boring, because they ignore all other aspects of the game and devote all their time to one goal.

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Only if they feel that their fun is being hampered to make fun for others. Leveling is fun. Forceing people to level slower is makeing them do less of the thing that makes the game fun to them.

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I've given up.

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I posted a zillion ideas

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The game is leaning hard towards min/maxers and since that is
the case I no longer care.

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Agree and sympathize.

Well if Statesman wants people to farm in mass numbers of mobs for it to be challengeing all I have to ask is: What is the usefullness of PA in a large group?

PA spawns two to four guys who randomly agro things for 45 seconds or I could take a class that can Disorient everyone in the area of effect at the same level or earlier actually. What is the role of the illusion controller at later levels when Everyone has their more powerfull holds.

How can PA even begin to compare to other holds/disorients when you are fighting 24 minions at a time. The fix to PA has taken PAs teeth out as far as large groups go useing your reasoning of more mobs = more xp.

The more things there are for PA to "Agro" to controll the less usefull it is. Also its random. All I have to say about the get more mob approach to balance xp. Illusion seems to suffer the larger the group gets.

I was sure I explained what an MMORPG stood for somewhere but it must have been on another thread.

Massive: This means that the world is huge. Lots of content to explore. New content being added. This is the kind of thing you can't get from a console.

Multiplayer: The ability to know that all around you other players are engaging in the virtual universe and to interact with them if you choose to. The knowledge that the world can be changed by not just you but by those around you.

Online: Self explanitory.

Role: The ability to create a concept of what you want a character to be and to put that concept into the Massive world of Multiplayer action. This should always be emphasized in these types of games and CoH has done this the best of all games that I have payed. Role does not mean rigidity of function however.

Playing: Self explanitory. We are hear to interact with the world not turn it into a forum or chat room. (My personal feeling.)

Game:This is game folks and should be fun for everyone! No one should be left going "Gosh you want me to feed you again! But I just fed you and I am tired of looking after you!"

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See. You are Supposed to be herding.


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Good example of how players are finding ways to increase the size of groups to a decent challenge. Plus the game lends itself to this strategy. Kudos to the players for listening to Statesman's vision and makeing it work in game!

See, Statesman is playing the game your playing!

Check out the post that Statesman made to the Tankers. I have complained alot about the Cryptic responses we have gotten from the Devs but this one really blew me away by how concise and straight forward it was. Plus, there was a bit of depth that let you see that they really were listening to our posts. I feel so appreciated right now that I just want cry at how good this response was.

Keep up the great replies Statesman! At least once every two weeks. This post was awesome. Its not just hope its down right inspireing. I just can't say enough.

Here is the link to his Statement that I am gushing over!

I don't even play a tanker regularly and I am excited about this.

Tanker post from the Dev!

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As promised, I've been looking into the issues facing Tankers; I thought I'd explain the direction we're going. As we analyed it, Tankers have three very valid concerns (aside from the issues with specific power sets):


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Wow, I have to say that I eat all the words I have said about your responses in the past Statesman. This is a great post that goes into detail about where you are trying to take the game and is well thought out. Awesome, just Awesome!

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*sigh* I don't mean to be rude, but Statesman, it just keeps sounding like you want us to play the game your way. Not the ways we want to. Granted, some of the gameplay is rather dull and repetative, but it's the way some people want to play. Bizarre as it may sound.


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And heaven forbid anyone opens their mind to some other options besides "OMFROXXOR!!11! PURPL3 pahct is the SUXXOR1!!"

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Heaven forbid Statesman opens his mind.

Well, the communication from Statesman is "This is how I see the game and your looking at things the wrong way."
Players "Uhm, but this is why we are right. Why are we wrong?"

Statesman "This is how I see the game should be and you are wrong and we are working to fullfill my vision."

To be honest I am surprised this post got so many posts by statesman. I wonder if he feels offended by all the posts here or if he really thinks he is right and wants to try and make us understand why he is right.


Whoops sorry Statesman. You do care! Thanks for the response and my apologies!

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You're absolutely correct. The problem is, once again, that the high level players (38) can battle against foes that are much, much higher level than they are. A small group of said heroes can find a spawn appropriate for them...whereas what's tough enough for a full group of 8 level 38's? It's much, much tougher for that large group to find something that's a challenge - and can give them great XP - than it is for the the small group.

That issue is next up - right after the Expansion goes live.


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