Aett_Thorn

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Let me sum it up for you.There is a new issue coming out some time or other.It's so awesome you will have to pay for it.
They told us now so we could start saving up for it.

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You will get the issue whether you pay for the expansion or not, you just won't be able to access the expansion material (Praetorian zones, Praetorian costume parts, etc.) unless you have it.



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Of course, if you buy the Super Gold version of the game, it already contains the Going Rogue expansion.

Mod8 actually got the Going rogue editions four months before it was begun.

AE missions follow generally the same rules as most missions. As such, AVs get downgraded to EBs unless you're on a big enough team or have the difficulty set to 5.

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Im sorry maybe Im hopething that the devs will ever get clues about QoL features from other MMOs that have found good things like this.

Just a fyi.. creating content has no relation to building QoL features

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The Devs have been consistently creating new QoL features. Just because they haven't worked on a QoL feature that you'd like doesn't mean they haven't been putting in QoL features.

Creating content and QoL features can involve overlapping staff. For something like what you want, CAstle would probably need to be involved. An in-game character builder would need to take some time from the powers guy, to make sure that all of the powers were being listed properly. That would mean time away from something like fixing Dominators, which is also Castle's department.

Creating the in-game character builder would take art. This would take away from getting a new zone, or from getting icons to be the proper symbol, or from creating new buildings for new features.

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What I post is fact.

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No, it's really not. You have yet to show us any data that shows that Tankers are hurting. Even if you did, you'd then need to show that the hurt would be fixed, in the general public's eyes, by replacing powers currently in the set with ranged options. If you haven't done that, then you have shown us no facts to back up your opinion that Tankers having ranged attacks would help them.

All you have done is said that you'd like Tankers to have ranged attacks, and think that other people would like this. Those aren't facts, they're opinions.

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Objective ;expressing or dealing with facts or conditions as perceived without distortion by personal feelings, prejudices, or interpretations. By this definition, anyone asking for more overall tanker dmg is purely objective by what kind of dmg the devs give to tanks.

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Wow. No. That's just completely wrong. People have come here and said that tanker damage is fine. Others have said that it's not. Neither have presented any facts to back themselves up. That means that it's pretty much completely a subjective opinion, and not based on objective facts.

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Besides the "Medium" dmg branded on them and the overall lack of high dps should be enough.


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Ummm...enough for what? To give you some intangible 'fact' that Tankers need ranged damage? Tankers are high survivability, medium damage. That's what they are in game. I see nothing wrong with that, and you have given no facts, let alone any that might come close to changing my mind on it.

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Ideas friend, Ideas. As radical as it seems, the radical in many an industry has been the reason things have changed, and usually for the better. Shutting down ideas just because they don't fit into your reasoning doesn't mean they should be halted. You may not see it as a change thats needed, but others do.

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I have an idea for all characters in-game to get cupcakes. Throwing cupcakes at an AV would one-shot kill it. Throwing it at any other enemy deals no damage. As ridiculous as this sounds, I'm betting that I could get a few people behind it.

Having a little support for something doesn't make it a good idea. Want to present a case that it is a good idea? Get some facts to back you up. Not some 'others' opinions, that you haven't even come close to analyzing the general population. You think that a lot of people would be behind giving Tankers more ranged attacks, while replacing some of the current powers in the set? Go and ask the general population whether they'd like it or not. You don't even seem to have a consensus in the tanker forum, though. I'd probably say that the majority of tanker players, including those not on the forums, would resent having current powers stripped to get the ranged attacks.

But here's a nice, neat concept for you: burden of proof. If you're the one advocating for a change over the status quo, then the burden of proof is on you to present facts that state the status quo needs changing. If you don't have them (and you don't), then try to find ways to get them.

Changes to the game can sometimes be good, and sometimes be bad. We've seen both in this game. Advocating for any change, no matter what the merits of the change are, is not a good way to go. Certainly, the devs aren't going to go for that. Why would they? Put every change into the game that people suggest? First off, there's not enough time. Secondly, there are some bad suggestions. There are some suggestions put forth by players in the Suggestions forum that would drive large amounts of the playing population away from the game. There are suggestions that I've seen that would make it ridiculously easy for RMTers to spam the heck out of you. Would those be changes that you'd get behind, just because they're radical ideas? Probably not.

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I just don't see why so many hate the idea.

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People disagreeing with the idea does not mean that they hate the idea. I do not like the idea posted by Ultimo in this case. I don't hate the idea. I have problems with it. I have stated them in this thread. To make me dislike the idea, the issues that I have with it need to be addressed. That's called either a) compromise, or b) changing the idea to suit the population you're aiming it for.

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After all history has been one radical idea change to another. Change HAS to happen.

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And change IS happening in this game. However, people have the right to say what direction that change goes. If somebody says that they have an idea that they'd like to see, others have the same right to say that they'd rather not see that idea implemented. People have differences of opinion. You seem to be saying that people don't have the right to voice an objection if somebody posits and idea that they don't like. And that, my friend, is folly. People have the right to agree or disagree with any idea posted in this forum.

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It is after all a super hero game based off Marvel and DC that much is obvious. So why not continue and develope some new powers, more additions, and more "comic like" tanks.

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WE get new powers and more additions with each issue, pretty much. Asking for more 'comic like' Tankers is like asking for a more cereal-like breakfast. Which cereal are you talking about? Are you talking about oatmeal (technically a warm cereal), or Frosted Flakes? Or maybe Apple Jacks? Or maybe Raisin Bran?

Comics are notorious for having different power levels for their characters. The things that they have going for them over an MMO is a story-teller, and a non-persistent world. The story-teller gets to adjust the power level of the character at any time, bringing them up or down depending on how they want the story to go. The bevy of powers that Superman got in the 50s alone should be enough to show you that the story-tellers could just about give him whatever the frick they wanted to if they needed it to fit the story.

Living in a non-persistent world allows the stories to be isolated. Character X might never see Character Y, so you don't need to worry about how powerful Character X is to Character Y, even if they have the same Foe, A. Character X might be able to beat Character Y every single time, but both can beat Foe A because they never have to be compared.

In an MMO, you have neither the persistent world nor the storyteller. Our characters can interact with each other. We'll handle the same missions at different times. We'll fight the same foes in the same place on different occasions. To handle that, you need balance. Balance both between ATs and within an AT. You want to have your character options be different but roughly equal. Character X should be able to defeat Foe A just like Character Y can, but they can do it in different ways.

Allowing Character X to be able to defeat Foe A the same way that Character Y can, in addition to being able to do it his own way, while Character Y cannot do the same thing creates problems.

In this way, giving Tankers more blasts, while not giving Blasters more defenses at the same time, is a bad idea. You'd be allowing Tankers to do some of what Blasters can do, while not allowing Blasters to do some of what Tankers can do. Even with the damage multipliers factored in, you'd be creating a safer Blaster, potentially an infinitely-safe, lower-damage Blaster, out of Tankers, while giving nothing back to Blasters to equalize this.

If you DO give Blasters some armors, then you need to do something for the other 4 Hero ATs (counting Khelds as one AT for this, though they're really not). IF you do that, and keep bringing the ATs closer together (after all, why shouldn't tankers, if they have melee damage and ranged damage in their secondaries, not also be allowed some controls or debuffs?) then you do away with the AT system in general. They tried that in the Alpha phase of the game, and it didn't work out too well.

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They have made it faster already.

And quite a few people used it before, as it is... because you are *flying.*

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Wasn't it the most popular travel power chosen, based on the datamining the Devs did a while ago?

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No, I'm not.

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I wasn't planning on it, either.

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Aren't all the Giant Monsters in the game a part of the Canon of the game? If they are, shouldn't they all be fought?

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Just because they are canon doesn't make them worth fighting over and over.

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Well, you were playing a Brute...



...although the truly villainous approach would be to paint the map and kick them.

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Nonono.

The truly villainous approach would be to use him to paint the map, then TP foe him high into the air right above a large spawn, so that he takes falling damage and then gets crushed by the enemies. THEN you kick him.

Pinnacle - the Drunk Server. Good, friendly population on both sides, from what I've found.

And:

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I don't think I came up with a good, measured response back then. I'm far more likely to be analytical now.

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Wish granted, apparently.

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Ahh, the + should have given that away to me, and I don't think I've seen anyone take both. Since you've tried it, you don't have any issue with the snail pace of Hover. =T

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Hover actually moves at a decent clip now, especially once slotted.

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Yes, but do you slot for movement or defense or set bonuses or some combination? Seems wasteful to 6-slot hover of all things, but it could be reasonable (3 BotZs, 3 LotGs).

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Slotting BotZ in Hover can get you good speed as well as Ranged and AoE defense bonuses.

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This unrequited dev love needs to stop.

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This is a strawman argument, and really needs to stop. There is no unrequited Dev love here, no matter how much you'd love to foist it off on players that disagree with you.

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Their human, they make mistakes.

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And they have admitted to some mistakes before. We know that they make mistakes. However, that does not mean that the current Tanker situation is one of them.

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Fautline being one of those famous mistakes. And finally "fixing" Hollows after four years.

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The Hollows were great when they first came out. Sure, they had some problems, but the story in the zone tended to be better than the one outside of the zone at that level, so people still did the content. After four years of having the same content, however, less people were doing it. The minor inconveniences of the zone became more pronounced, so they 'fixed' them.

Faultline had a story to go along with it, the Devs just never had the resources to get to it. As soon as they had the resources, they finished the story for it. Hardly makes it a mistake. An incomplete zone meant to be completed? Sure. A mistake? Not really.

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Yes its an error, just because they don't admit to it doesnt make it any less a mistake.

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Please, show me where the mistake is and why. Don't use comics to justify it. Use actual game balance issues. Are Tankers hurting with the current setup? Is that because of a lack of damage, or because of a lack of a ranged attack in most of the secondaries. Show us exactly why and where Tankers are hurting. Bring some evidence, instead of just saying it's a mistake.

Just because you think it's a mistake doesn't make it a mistake.

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See passed the love for red names and use some objectivity.

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See PAST your own opinion and use some objectivity yourself. If you think that you have a case, bring some evidence to back yourself up.

Yes. Although it really depends on how fast you're going to defeat them, how long the recharge on the attacks are, and how many attacks they have.

However, Shiver is such a massive debuff that I'm pretty sure it will always be better than Defense.

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Ahh, the + should have given that away to me, and I don't think I've seen anyone take both. Since you've tried it, you don't have any issue with the snail pace of Hover. =T

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Hover actually moves at a decent clip now, especially once slotted.

Fake ones will have the countdown.

Real ones will just freeze in place, and then disappear without a countdown.

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Hmm, in my opinion Ice has the best Aura taunt...

I've never heard someone say DA holds that title.

Either way, any tank (save WP) can go without taunt, it's just a nice power to have sometimes.

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DA has three potential Taunt Auras. Ice Armor has two. However, most people playing Dark Armor Tankers only take one of the two status-effect auras (either Cloak of Fear or Oppressive Gloom). As such, in practice, it tends to drop back down to Ice Armor levels of aggro.

Even with those, though, and with the -range on Taunt, it can be a great tool to have. Will you need it? No, probably not. Might it be nice to have anyways? Yes, probably so.

First off, welcome to the forums!

Secondly, check out Lady_Jade's Power Suggestion Box, for a lot of fleshed-out powerset ideas.

Secondly, none of the below is meant to be flaming, just pointing out potential problems with ideas.

Secondly: Whips/Chains. The Devs have discussed these with us before. The engine has a very hard time handling these well. Static objects like an Axe or Sword are fine. But taking that static costume option, and making it work like a power animation becomes very tricky given the engine that we have.


Secondly: Animals. This has also been discussed before. You'll notice that there are no quadrupedal skeletons in the game. The Devs would need to make one. Actually, they'd need to make one for each type of animal that they put in the game. For instance, a cat walks differently than a dog, who walks differently from a bear. They would need to create unique skeletons for these MM pets, and apply powers to them. That's a decent amount more work than just creating a new MM set focused on humans/humanlike things.

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Well, then that's a different story comparing two actual powers.

Shiver on a Dominator gives, base, a 65% Recharge Debuff.

Weave, on the other hand, provides a 4.25% Defense Buff.


Against even-level creatures, using a single 4 second recharge attack, the Defense Buff from weave will lessen damage by about 8.5% on average.

The recharge debuff, on the other hand, will take that 4 second attack to 11.43 seconds. That is, recharge debuffs give a post-mitigation value basically equivalent to the actual recharge debuff value, against even-level enemies.


Now, let's take a +2 enemy, where effects work at 65% value (I think). Against this enemy, your Defense value still gives about 8.5% damage mitigation. Shiver, against this enemy, is providing a 42.25% Recharge debuff, and is therefore still better.

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Will that stack with my other sources of -Rehcarge; Artic Air and the like?

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Yes

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Up to a point. I think, and maybe wrong on this, that the Recharge floor is 25% (making powers take 4 times longer to recharge). Meaning that you can stack up to 75% Recharge debuff on the enemies before it stops stacking.

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This is why I don't like posting my ideas. I love CoH/V, my ideas don't reflect things I want changed because I don't like them, I just want to help contribute positive ideas to the game I've loved for 5 years.

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Then be prepared to defend your ideas. This is not a place to just get positive feedback. It's a testing ground for ideas. If the idea can't hold water (read: handle some criticism), then it might be a bad idea. If the idea can be defended, then it might be a good idea (not that this is always so, though). People will point of flaws in your ideas. If you think that your idea is still good after seeing the holes, either redesign your idea to mitigate the hole, or work around it somehow.

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Every other MMO has rain, and none of them obliterate your computer

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The weather idea is one of the few in your OP that the Devs have commented on directly. Basically, they want to do it 'right.' In order to do it right, with the game engine they have, it would be graphics-intensive. If it's graphics intensive, it could cause a lot of lag on lower-end machines. If it causes a lot of lag, they need to create a way to turn it off. If lag is bad, and a lot of people turn off the weather in order to play the game, then the Devs have just spent a lot of time on something that only a few people can see.

Now, this was a couple of years ago. Maybe the Devs have figured out a way around this, and maybe they haven't. Maybe we should be designing new features assuming that people have upgraded their computers since the game came out. But, there are a decent amount of people who still might have an older computer. So you've got to design ways for them to not be shut out of playing.


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GM idea

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As for this, there have been several times when GMs have attacked AP. These tend to be put out of the way, so as not to crush low-level players. I have seen entire swarms of level 1-5 characters try to take down a GM, to no avail. Why? Because they lack the quantity of powers needed to take down an enemy with that many HP and regen rates.

Now, I'm not totally against it, but considering that you can go to a zone at level 5 with a GM in it, so you're in GM-less zones for even less than 1% of your career fighting bad guys playing through the game.

Well, then that's a different story comparing two actual powers.

Shiver on a Dominator gives, base, a 65% Recharge Debuff.

Weave, on the other hand, provides a 4.25% Defense Buff.


Against even-level creatures, using a single 4 second recharge attack, the Defense Buff from weave will lessen damage by about 8.5% on average.

The recharge debuff, on the other hand, will take that 4 second attack to 11.43 seconds. That is, recharge debuffs give a post-mitigation value basically equivalent to the actual recharge debuff value, against even-level enemies.


Now, let's take a +2 enemy, where effects work at 65% value (I think). Against this enemy, your Defense value still gives about 8.5% damage mitigation. Shiver, against this enemy, is providing a 42.25% Recharge debuff, and is therefore still better.

You can do the missions, or you can hunt along the streets. The areas around the starting fort are filled with low-level enemies for you to fight. They won't be purple unless you go a decent ways away from the starting areas.

There are no sewers. The whole zone is a combination of normal-sized spawns and hazard-zone sized spawns (like those in the sewers).

Thinking that redside is exactly like blueside is going to lead to frustration.

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I've found that to be the case as well (resists vs defense in IO builds).

I guess the thinking is that no matter how much Defense you have (and the soft cap being easily reachable) the mobs still have a minimum chance to hit varying by level and tier as opposed to Resists that work the same way against all mobs independant of tier and level?

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I'm betting something along those lines, too. Basically, you don't want characters to be able to easily cap a bunch of resistance values and reach the soft cap of Defense at the same time. The Devs just gave us Defense over Resistance.

I kind think they went the wrong way on that, since Defense allows you to avoid secondary effects of attacks as well as the damage from the attack. But hey, since I have mainly played Defense-using characters, I'm not minding it.

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I've been wondering if most Shield Tankers don't take Tough/Weave

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I would say yes. I would actually say that most Tankers that don't come to the forums don't take Tough/Weave. Tough and Weave are for power gamers, even mild ones. Casual players probably don't care to fit them into a build, and would instead prefer powers from the primary/secondary.

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or if my secondary (Dark Melee) is largely responsible for the differences in the squishy factor?

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Depends on what secondary they have, but this could contribute, too. The self-heal, which Shield Defense lacks, combined with a secondary effect that stacks very, very nicely with a Defense build, can make a big difference.

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Is there an IO build aimed particularly at resists that is worthwhile? Or are resists too hard to raise via IO sets past a token level?

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First off, I don't know of a specific build for a Shield/DM aimed at increasing resistance values. I do know, however, that resistance values for IO set bonuses are ridiculously low. Especially when compared to Defense values. I'm not sure exactly why this was done, though I have my hypotheses, but raising Defense levels is much easier than raising resistance values by an appreciable amount.

The defense values will stack, and combining CJ and Hover gives you one more nice trait: no drift when stopping. While Hover's drift isn't that bad, CJ will completely stop it, allowing you to stop on a dime.

Since I've never tested it, does Shield Charge work while you're in the air? I think it does, I've just never seen it done.