I'm sick of the WoW clones.
By
Angry_Angel,
Posted on: 2012-11-25 09:59 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Doubt it. If anything, they took it from Xbox.
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Originally Posted by Hercules
From CoH, they stole the concept of badges and called them achievements.
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My new Youtube Channel with CoH info
You might know me as FlintEastwood now on Freedom
If PvP is removed, balancing becomes a whole lot easier. This game should never have adopted PvP. It really went downhill since it was implemented (IMO). You can't have super fun OP abilities that make you feel like a real superhero because of pvp balance. Don't get me wrong I love PvP but it shouldn't have touched this game at all and if it is to be implemented it needs to be done in a way where gear isn't the prime factor influencing your success, rather skill instead.
Much like you see in Left 4 Dead, there are no stats or gear or any of that bullcrap it all boils down to teamwork and how good you are in a stressful situation.
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The problem with that is that of all the MMOs, CoH must be pretty near the top of the list when it comes to required PvP - heroes vs villains is like the classic match-up |
Originally Posted by Bin Man
This game should never have adopted PvP.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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If you are going to copy something, and in this context thus likely be competing against it, it would seemingly make very little sense to copy the unassailable giant. Better off establishing a relatively steady niche, I'd say.
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Originally Posted by I Burnt The Toast
Because if you are going to copy something it makes more sense to copy something that 10+ million people subscribe to after 8 years and not something that has approx 50,000 subscribers after 8 years.
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Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
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Try telling that to shareholders who see anything less than trying for ALL of the pie as a form of treason.
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Originally Posted by Tenzhi
If you are going to copy something, and in this context thus likely be competing against it, it would seemingly make very little sense to copy the unassailable giant. Better off establishing a relatively steady niche, I'd say.
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Oh I agree, I just think that due to the sheer amount of choice of abilities the balancing act becomes 90% of the Dev time if they decided to focus on PvP. Fortunately they didn't and we got loads of other cool things instead.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
The problem with that is that of all the MMOs, CoH must be pretty near the top of the list when it comes to required PvP - heroes vs villains is like the classic match-up
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Yep. Sad truth. PvP balance sucks a LOT of the cool out of games, and wastes TONS of time that could be put to better use. Just imagine, EVERY single new powerset introduced taking months, possibly years, to balance out with all the others. No. I've reached a point now where I'm almost convinced that PvE and PvP don't belong in the same game. Not because those types of players can't get along, but because those types of gameplay mechanics can't.|
Originally Posted by Bin Man
Oh I agree, I just think that due to the sheer amount of choice of abilities the balancing act becomes 90% of the Dev time if they decided to focus on PvP. Fortunately they didn't and we got loads of other cool things instead.
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In order to balance PvP in CoX, we probably would've had to do away with the intricate AT's and powersets altogether, going with a much more basic class system ripped off of WoW.
Tim gets it ^^
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They aren't doing so hot for the same reasons that CoH is closing down. The MMOG are no longer at the top of the chain food.
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Originally Posted by DarkBlaster_NA
Question, Do you always have to be a complete killjoy? Every post i see from your end just has to be made to be against this game.
And i didn't ask about WoW, I asked about WoW clones, Guess what? They aren't doing so hot. |
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Balance is the name of the game, in CoH villains and heroes had different classes and some of the villains ones... do you remember stalkers...the ultimate hero killers, not to mention the masterminds?|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
The problem with that is that of all the MMOs, CoH must be pretty near the top of the list when it comes to required PvP - heroes vs villains is like the classic match-up
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PvP has not a great future when one of the sides has clearly the advantage and in fact CoH PvP has died out some years ago even if recently they tried to give the same classes to both the sides
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Originally Posted by Thunder Knight
You'll note that nothing in the original post talked about setting.
Why haven't there been any games that copied WoW's setting while taking the aspects of CoH that made it fun to play? I'd play a WoW-alike if it had the ability to make my character look exactly the way I want it to (and not buried under ten levels of gear), dozens of possible power combinations for the same class (and I don't mean the difference between one build spec and another, but the difference between Inv/ and SR/ Tankers or Storm/ and Empathy/ Defenders), or if it had Mez powers that let me entirely shut down bosses (like Controllers and Dominators), the ability to have a large crowd of powerful and controllable summons (like Masterminds), and/or the ability to take on huge groups of enemies solo, regardless of the window dressing. Why haven't any games copied those aspects of CoH (which you can do while still setting it in a Generic Fantasy Realm Of Elves And Orcs), rather than copying WoW's "everyone must look alike", and "Mezzes are useless", and "all members of a classes play the same as all other members of that class", and "One hero can take on one regular enemy, if you want to fight a boss you need a full group" aspects? |
Rift did it (or close enough). They have a WoW clone setting but they managed to get (to a much higher degree than every other fantasy MMO out there) build versatility for different classes and a decent gear appearance customization, not close to CoH but as I said, far better than pretty much any other fantasy MMO out there.
On top of that, they keep the raiding mechanics so theorically, it should be appealing to pretty much any MMO player... unfortunately, the game seems to be struggling so I guess we who enjoy such kind of gaming are a tiny minority.-
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There's a lot of truth in that. I think part of the reason I can't get on with CO is because in concept it's about as close to CoH as we're going to get, but the implementation of that concept is about as different as it's going to get. When I play it I can't help but think "This isn't CoH". I think that's also why I've plumped for TSW. It's got elements of super powers in a contemporary setting, but it still is nothing really like CoH.|
Originally Posted by BrandX
Because you'd find something else to complain about with the game.
Want a game that isn't a WoW clone? Check out TERA. Fun game! Different game mechanics! It's only downside is teaming on normal quests. :/ But, I'm sure all the nice things about it would be overlooked. Basically, what I'm saying is, you probably wouldn't behappy with any game except CoH. As a CoH vet, I know I look at every MMO and compare it to CoH. Of course, as a CoH vet, I looked at some things other MMOs did and went "Why cant we have that in CoH?" |
As for TERA, I did have a look at it but couldn't get past what appeared to be overly cutesy graphics. Call me fickle :P
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My issue with CO is that the setting is a bit too much of the cliched comicbook superhero thing for me. It's not as bad about being horribly campy (like a bad knockoff of The Tick, without the irony) as it was at launch, but it's still got a pretty high cheese factor. That's pure poison for an immersion junkie like me. I enjoy the game from a pure gameplay standpoint (I like the combat system a fair bit better than the one in CoH), but the game just doesn't "grab" me, even on my second attempt. My three month sub runs out in a week or so...haven't logged on in a month.|
Originally Posted by SteelRat
There's a lot of truth in that. I think part of the reason I can't get on with CO is because in concept it's about as close to CoH as we're going to get, but the implementation of that concept is about as different as it's going to get. When I play it I can't help but think "This isn't CoH". I think that's also why I've plumped for TSW. It's got elements of super powers in a contemporary setting, but it still is nothing really like CoH.
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TSW, on the other hand, works perfectly for me, despite the combat system being meh at best. I don't care so much about the "super powers" aspect (I'd have preferred that to be toned down enormously, in fact), but the story writing, contextual setting, and so much more about the game is simply brilliant. Immersion heaven...
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| As for TERA, I did have a look at it but couldn't get past what appeared to be overly cutesy graphics. Call me fickle :P |
"And in this moment, I will not run.
It is my place to stand.
We few shall carry hope
Within our bloodied hands."
While most of your complaints hold water and I'd love to see more MMOs break the mold (although, most MMOs that come out now do break the mold in some way. theyre not a complete 180, because anything too far from the mold doesn't sell)
actually...no..that's it. the reason there aren't too many INNOVATIVE and "FUN" mmos is because "people" don't want those. you may think gamers are desperate for an oasis of innovation in a sea of grinding for loot, but people like doing that.
I mean, we live in a world where the Call of Duty and Battlefield franchises not only coexist with equal huge fanbases, but release a new copy of the game every year that's always the most sold game of the year, every year.
But that aside, the one thing that sticks out
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Originally Posted by DarkBlaster_NA
Why can't any game be innovative and focus less on balance and more on FUN?
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Because if things weren't balanced then everyone would play the strongest class or whatever system you're running. You need balance so people run every class equally, or that people aren't punished for picking a ****** underperforming class.
heres looking at you electric blast
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Yeah, I know where you're coming from. I like fantastic, but I'd still like to believe it. Overly cartoony graphics detract from the believability, and whilst the super-hero genre is guilty of being a little cheesey and over the top almost by definition, CoH does manage to keep that cheese with its feet on the ground most of the time. I've often thought CO is almost a parody of itself.|
Originally Posted by Dollhouse
My issue with CO is that the setting is a bit too much of the cliched comicbook superhero thing for me. It's not as bad about being horribly campy (like a bad knockoff of The Tick, without the irony) as it was at launch, but it's still got a pretty high cheese factor. That's pure poison for an immersion junkie like me. I enjoy the game from a pure gameplay standpoint (I like the combat system a fair bit better than the one in CoH), but the game just doesn't "grab" me, even on my second attempt. My three month sub runs out in a week or so...haven't logged on in a month.
TSW, on the other hand, works perfectly for me, despite the combat system being meh at best. I don't care so much about the "super powers" aspect (I'd have preferred that to be toned down enormously, in fact), but the story writing, contextual setting, and so much more about the game is simply brilliant. Immersion heaven... Likewise. The Elin in particular were vomit-inducing. Mind you, the rather cartoonish graphics aren't a bad match with the over-the-top combat animations, absurdly outsized weapons, and other elements of that portion of the high fantasy genre that isn't even trying for any kind of realism. Doesn't work at all for me, though, so despite being interested in the combat system, I never even considered trying the game. |
TSW shares that same "fantastic but believable" feel to it that COH has.
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