Black Scorpion's Guide to Farewell Posts
By
Angry_Citizen,
Posted on: 2012-10-16 17:56 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Thanks for the info. If this is going to be an 'ask a dev technical stuff' thread, two other things have always interested me. When Issue 2 launched, players were given a bunch of badges as soon as they logged in, which meant the game had been gathering data for a long time, probably since launch. My question is, in addition to the stuff you got badges for, what other information was datamined? Missions taken? Inspirations used? Blind invites received? Times jumped?
Second, something I was wondering since day one. Maybe it's my imagination, but it seems that when you use an inspiration in combat, and another drops seconds later, it's more likely to be of the exact type you used. Is there any mathematical truth to this, or just my whiskey-fueled ravings?
Once again, thanks to ALL the devs for a great time!!
Quote:
1. The badges system got its data from two general places - one was special "buckets" which didn't start being tracked until they were created by a badge, and the other was general character data which always existed. Badges given upon first login in I2 would have been possible for things like the story badges which were given out b/c a player had a specific souvenir clue (general character data) or reached a particular level (general character data) - but healing and kills were all "buckets" which were only established by the creation of badges which started counting them. Pretty much if we weren't actively storing something in the database, it wasn't countable. Even if a stat was possible to be automatically tracked (kills of a certain VG, for instance) it wasn't actually stored in the database unless a corresponding bucket existed, and the buckets were only made when a badge which examined that bucket was added to the game.|
Originally Posted by Interface
Thanks for the info. If this is going to be an 'ask a dev technical stuff' thread, two other things have always interested me. When Issue 2 launched, players were given a bunch of badges as soon as they logged in, which meant the game had been gathering data for a long time, probably since launch. My question is, in addition to the stuff you got badges for, what other information was datamined? Missions taken? Inspirations used? Blind invites received? Times jumped?
Second, something I was wondering since day one. Maybe it's my imagination, but it seems that when you use an inspiration in combat, and another drops seconds later, it's more likely to be of the exact type you used. Is there any mathematical truth to this, or just my whiskey-fueled ravings? Once again, thanks to ALL the devs for a great time!! |
There were many "layers" of datamining, some of which were more in use than others. There was a major project underway when everything shut down to fix/improve/retrofit the various layers into something more befitting what we needed. We did track number of missions completed on individual characters, and we had a general bucket for salvage earned/consumed across an entire server, as well as general stats for TF/Flashback completions, times, etc. Datamining tended to be put in as needed for new systems - Incarnate Trials got their own special logging, the Market got some other, and so on. Insp use, jumps, invites weren't tracked by any of those systems.
2. No, there was no code or data that could have caused this. I would hazard this might have been just happenstance and confirmation bias at work.
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Interesting about tracking the # of missions completed on individual characters (and now wondering what that data was for), and I'd always assumed there was lots of tracking for which TFs, arcs were popular and which weren't, etc. |
Originally Posted by Black Scorpion
1. There were many "layers" of datamining, some of which were more in use than others. There was a major project underway when everything shut down to fix/improve/retrofit the various layers into something more befitting what we needed. We did track number of missions completed on individual characters, and we had a general bucket for salvage earned/consumed across an entire server, as well as general stats for TF/Flashback completions, times, etc. Datamining tended to be put in as needed for new systems - Incarnate Trials got their own special logging, the Market got some other, and so on. Insp use, jumps, invites weren't tracked by any of those systems.
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I'm curious about and have been hypothesizing for a couple of years that the auctionhouse market was directly influenced by game design, probably as automatic or semi-automatic programming code, since I never could figure out why certain Common and Uncommon Invention Salvage items would go from plentiful and cheap to few and expensive with some regularity (looked like a 6-8 week cycle on some of these, e.g. Nevermeltng Ice, Titanium Shards, etc.)
I also never understood why one of my Field Crafter characters could make certain level 45 Common IOs (notably End Mod, End Red, Rech Red, Dam, ACC and a few others) price them for a nice profit at 116K INF and find in the next day or two these IOs were bought for 150K-500K. I figured ONLY NPCs (i.e. by game design) would overpay so consistently, which was entirely fine with me and a nice reward for earning the Field Crafter badge.
Can you confirm whether the auctionhouse market was solely player driven, as some have thought, or a hybrid of player action and game design, or what? Thanks!
aka @Kristoff von Gelmini, leader of small SG bases (Infinity/Victory/Virtue/Protector), member of The House of Tera (Justice) and various others (Champion/Infinity/Victory/Guardian/Freedom).
Was anything ever planed for the so called matrix room. Or was it ever used for anything?
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You answered your first question with your second one: Salvage fluctuated (at least in part) because of Field Crafter. When someone wants to get a lot of memorization badges quickly, they need a lot of salvage. The easiest place to get it is the Auction House. The nature of the bidding process means that someone buying up a lot of a single type of salvage will use up all the cheap stuff, causing spikes in price.|
Originally Posted by JohnRobey
I'm curious about and have been hypothesizing for a couple of years that the auctionhouse market was directly influenced by game design, probably as automatic or semi-automatic programming code, since I never could figure out why certain Common and Uncommon Invention Salvage items would go from plentiful and cheap to few and expensive with some regularity (looked like a 6-8 week cycle on some of these, e.g. Nevermeltng Ice, Titanium Shards, etc.)
I also never understood why one of my Field Crafter characters could make certain level 45 Common IOs (notably End Mod, End Red, Rech Red, Dam, ACC and a few others) price them for a nice profit at 116K INF and find in the next day or two these IOs were bought for 150K-500K. I figured ONLY NPCs (i.e. by game design) would overpay so consistently, which was entirely fine with me and a nice reward for earning the Field Crafter badge. Can you confirm whether the auctionhouse market was solely player driven, as some have thought, or a hybrid of player action and game design, or what? Thanks! |
Likewise, people crafting large amounts of certain enhancements - either for personal use of for resale - can cause similar spikes in Uncommon and Rare salvage.
The fact that the various types of salvage aren't balanced in their use - some are used in dozens of recipes, others in just a handful - also contributes to the flux and variation in prices.
As to the "overpaying" for common IOs, some people value their time far more than their Inf. When you can make 3-4 million/hour just off defeats (and some can do much more), PLUS significantly more by selling drops, it's easier to just drop 500,000 Inf on a common that to bid creep and try to save an insignificant amount.
I consider myself a low-end earner in the Market forum, and yet I still drop 500,000 to 1,000,000 each on level 25 and 50 common IOs (I don't use other levels, unless I'm crafting them myself out of salvage I have on hand).
I have no reason to believe that the system was automatically buying or selling anything (except maybe on Beta, but I'm pretty sure the system-created goods on Beta were manually generated). Activity that I've seen discussed in the Market forum, and that I've partaken in myself, explains all of the "oddities" I've seen to my satisfaction.
@Roderick
500k is slightly high, but not completely unreasonable for a common IO. I usually bought level 30-40s for around 250-300k. After getting /auctionhouse it became very simple to just leave standing bids for the ones I was going to need and then claim them in between missions.
If you add up the cost of replacing SOs every 5 levels, especially the higher level ones which get quite expensive, 500k isn't too bad, even more once you add the convenience factor.
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Thank you and Code Walker for replying to my query. Yeah, most of my characters earned a number of the level 25/30 crafting badges for the extra salvage, thereby memorizing these common IO recipes and usually I'd slot a # of these rather than buying and replacing SOs. It was more cost effective.
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Originally Posted by Roderick
You answered your first question with your second one: Salvage fluctuated (at least in part) because of Field Crafter. When someone wants to get a lot of memorization badges quickly, they need a lot of salvage. The easiest place to get it is the Auction House. The nature of the bidding process means that someone buying up a lot of a single type of salvage will use up all the cheap stuff, causing spikes in price.
Likewise, people crafting large amounts of certain enhancements - either for personal use of for resale - can cause similar spikes in Uncommon and Rare salvage. The fact that the various types of salvage aren't balanced in their use - some are used in dozens of recipes, others in just a handful - also contributes to the flux and variation in prices. As to the "overpaying" for common IOs, some people value their time far more than their Inf. When you can make 3-4 million/hour just off defeats (and some can do much more), PLUS significantly more by selling drops, it's easier to just drop 500,000 Inf on a common that to bid creep and try to save an insignificant amount. I consider myself a low-end earner in the Market forum, and yet I still drop 500,000 to 1,000,000 each on level 25 and 50 common IOs (I don't use other levels, unless I'm crafting them myself out of salvage I have on hand). I have no reason to believe that the system was automatically buying or selling anything (except maybe on Beta, but I'm pretty sure the system-created goods on Beta were manually generated). Activity that I've seen discussed in the Market forum, and that I've partaken in myself, explains all of the "oddities" I've seen to my satisfaction. |
aka @Kristoff von Gelmini, leader of small SG bases (Infinity/Victory/Virtue/Protector), member of The House of Tera (Justice) and various others (Champion/Infinity/Victory/Guardian/Freedom).
Thank you for all the work you've done on City of Heroes, Black Scorpion. And best of luck with your new job. 
@Nanas (on Defiant)
Overly melodramatic here, but live long and prosper. You helped make things better that they were when you came in. No more could have been asked. Good work, and good luck.
Were I a billionaire, I would buy Paragon and keep it alive.
Thank you Black Scorpion !
Thanks for all the info, Black Scorpion, and to you and the team, once more, a hearty thank you for everything that you put into the game, everything that you had planned, and best of luck going forward.
Hopefully not the end.