Nature this Affinity
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2012-08-14 04:51 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
Honestly a lot of it depends on what you want Personally I LOVE Defenders so I'd go for one over a Controller in a heartbeat. On the other hand there are plenty of other people who feel the opposite.
For the specific combo of NA/Elec Defender it's not going to be a damage machine but it probably isn't awful. The main issue is that NA is intended as a mid-range support set standing a bit outside melee range whereas Elec Defenders really want to be in close to maximize the endurance drain from Short Circuit. In theory you could use Entangling Aura to help out there but like Choking Cloud it's not that great a power.
[QUOTE=StupidlySmart;4343323]( i know defenders have better numbers,/QUOTE]
According to MIDS controllers offer a higher endurance discount then defenders.
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Yep for some reason lost in the mists of time Endurance Discount powers use the Stun attribute scalars to determine their strength. Since Controllers get stronger mez attributes than Defenders they also get stronger Endurance Discount powers.|
Originally Posted by RevolverMike
According to MIDS controllers offer a higher endurance discount then defenders.
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And no, that doesn't make any sense to me either. Endurance restoration and Endurance Recovery powers do not scale for different ATs so I'd expect Endurance Discount powers to do the same.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Yep for some reason lost in the mists of time Endurance Discount powers use the Stun attribute scalars to determine their strength. Since Controllers get stronger mez attributes than Defenders they also get stronger Endurance Discount powers.
And no, that doesn't make any sense to me either. Endurance restoration and Endurance Recovery powers do not scale for different ATs so I'd expect Endurance Discount powers to do the same. |
I plan to make a Necro/Nature mastermind, actually. But my second choice would be a controller.
I'm leaning towards a Nature/Dark defender myself.
As mentioned earlier, Nature is a mid ranged set, due to the cone heal. Dark Blast is also a cone oriented set with Tenebrous Tentacles and Night Fall (As much as I hate Night Fall's ridiculously narrow cone), so I figure they'd go pretty well together.
@Oathbound & @Oathbound Too
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Controllers also get larger values from powerboost type powers. This is balanced by the fact that the base values you are boosting tend to be less, but the actual boost value for Power Boost and Power Buildup is higher.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Yep for some reason lost in the mists of time Endurance Discount powers use the Stun attribute scalars to determine their strength. Since Controllers get stronger mez attributes than Defenders they also get stronger Endurance Discount powers.
And no, that doesn't make any sense to me either. Endurance restoration and Endurance Recovery powers do not scale for different ATs so I'd expect Endurance Discount powers to do the same. |
For thematic reasons I have already decided to make a Nature/Water Blast on Guardian and have already reserved the name. I just need to decide if I want defender or a corrupter and which will give a greater level of enjoyment.
For those who have tried the set on beta, which one would you recommend and why?
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I personally wouldn't play Nature as a secondary (unless it was on a controller). It's one of those jack of all trades, master of none sets so I think the values would be too low for my tastes as a secondary set.|
Originally Posted by Revanchist
For thematic reasons I have already decided to make a Nature/Water Blast on Guardian and have already reserved the name. I just need to decide if I want defender or a corrupter and which will give a greater level of enjoyment.
For those who have tried the set on beta, which one would you recommend and why? |
But on that note, Water Blast's damage is pretty bad on defenders. It depends what you want to get out of the toon. I'm planning on making a nature/water defender as well
because for me it's all about the support and utility.
I'm planning on rolling a Demon/Nature MM. Grow, little demon plants, grow!
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
Yeah so now i am thinking Nature/Rad def..... i would do rad/nature corr, but i KNOW the values arent as good... the dillema i am in is i try to mix up all my AT's... so currrently from a mm,corr,def,troller stand point this is what i got...
MM: lvl 41 Beast/Time, 39 Demon//Sonic
Corr: 41 Fire/kin
Def: 39 sonic/water, 35 traps/sonic
troller: 50 ill/dark, 50 fire/rad
So, as you can see the corr is what i am lacking, but if natures not good as a corr then i wont bother,,,, do you guys think rad on a defender has enough a** to be able to solo? my sonic/water can solo a little but mostly as a support/utility toon, since i think sonic brings alot to the table.... i would do another MM but find them boring most times....all depends on my mood i guess....
Thoughts? and i will just see any other ideas people have that can get the ole gerbil running the wheel in my head!
Defenders get a 30% damage enhancement solo, so you should be alright. I'm just not sure how good Nature/ is solo, though, but it should be fine for damage (at least as much as Sonic is).
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
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Originally Posted by Oathbound
I'm leaning towards a Nature/Dark defender myself.
As mentioned earlier, Nature is a mid ranged set, due to the cone heal. Dark Blast is also a cone oriented set with Tenebrous Tentacles and Night Fall (As much as I hate Night Fall's ridiculously narrow cone), so I figure they'd go pretty well together. |
Same here. It seemed like a good pairing with all the -To Hit and -DMG flying around.
NA brings nothing but green number spam and mediocre buffs on long cooldowns to a team. Make it a concept toon if you plan on keeping it. Your concept will dictate the archetype.
If you're looking for something that plays like nature without being bad, roll thermal instead. If you're looking for something that solos well, brute.
If you're banking on nature being buffed eventually, I'd lean toward nature/rad defender if you can't do IOs, rad/nature corruptor if you can. Defender's in a better position to shut down enemies with -tohit, +defense, and +resist powers without IOs. Corruptor makes up the difference with IOs plus gets crits and no teaming penalty.
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Now that's just not true. An AOE autohit -tohit debuff that can easily be enhanced to -30% and is up for every fight - that's nothing to scoff at. And you can keep a hard target permanently at -60% damage. Wild Bastion is an underwhelming +res buff, but it's easy to perma and can give about +200% regeneration at all times. With proper slotting and bonuses, Overgrowth doesn't have that much downtime and that's +82.5% damage to your team. It's quite a good buffing set, there are many worse support sets and I would put it on the same level as thermal actually.
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Originally Posted by Rigel_Kent
NA brings nothing but green number spam and mediocre buffs on long cooldowns to a team. Make it a concept toon if you plan on keeping it. Your concept will dictate the archetype.
If you're looking for something that plays like nature without being bad, roll thermal instead. If you're looking for something that solos well, brute. If you're banking on nature being buffed eventually, I'd lean toward nature/rad defender if you can't do IOs, rad/nature corruptor if you can. Defender's in a better position to shut down enemies with -tohit, +defense, and +resist powers without IOs. Corruptor makes up the difference with IOs plus gets crits and no teaming penalty. |
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That's absurd. Nature is, if anything, above average.
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Originally Posted by Rigel_Kent
NA brings nothing but green number spam and mediocre buffs on long cooldowns to a team. Make it a concept toon if you plan on keeping it. Your concept will dictate the archetype.
If you're looking for something that plays like nature without being bad, roll thermal instead. If you're looking for something that solos well, brute. If you're banking on nature being buffed eventually, I'd lean toward nature/rad defender if you can't do IOs, rad/nature corruptor if you can. Defender's in a better position to shut down enemies with -tohit, +defense, and +resist powers without IOs. Corruptor makes up the difference with IOs plus gets crits and no teaming penalty. |
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Yeah after playing around a bit with it on beta my opinion is that it's an ok set but not one that I would enjoy playing numbers-wise.|
Originally Posted by Mad Grim
That's absurd. Nature is, if anything, above average.
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I was hoping for something that was primarily about mitigating damage through a mix of resistance and absorb with some healing and debuffs thrown in for flavor. Instead it feels more like a cross between Empathy and Dark. That's not inherently bad but it's also not something I'm hugely interested in playing.
Controller for me. I'll be going earth/nature, mostly because I already have enough plants and that earth pretty nice. Earth will allow me to be in or out of the mob and not have to worry about my position affecting my control factor so I can be where ever the nature buffs currently work best.
I'm personally not a fan of 3 PBAoE buffs that each take about 60secs to recharge, at least I think I'm not. Maybe I'll be presently surprised, but I definitely think it will be fun as a whole and should serve as a great addition to the team environment.
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As to the OP
Of the ones you listed, Plant/NA would be super effective. Since you already have 2 controllers though, while another wouldn't hurt, the Corrupter wouldn't be too bad either.
Issue 24 PPM Calculator // The Great Makeover: The Vindicators
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What would you change? Have you mentioned it in the feedback thread? Have you discussed it with Hawk & Synapse? etc
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Originally Posted by Rigel_Kent
NA brings nothing but green number spam and mediocre buffs on long cooldowns to a team. Make it a concept toon if you plan on keeping it. Your concept will dictate the archetype.
If you're looking for something that plays like nature without being bad, roll thermal instead. If you're looking for something that solos well, brute. If you're banking on nature being buffed eventually, I'd lean toward nature/rad defender if you can't do IOs, rad/nature corruptor if you can. Defender's in a better position to shut down enemies with -tohit, +defense, and +resist powers without IOs. Corruptor makes up the difference with IOs plus gets crits and no teaming penalty. |
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I dabbled with NA defender last night on beta. My opinion of the set is incomplete at this time, but what my first gut reaction, my first impression was: this is like poison only - a whole lot better! The tier one debuff is like envenom and weaken together. Neurotoxic breath animation for a cone heal (cone heal? that's unique for sure). I get the feel it's going to be more clicky like kinetic, less toggle auras like radiation. It's also more mobile than traps. My curiosity has risen.
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
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That's my plan as well, I have a toon (Little Devil Fairy) who is a half demon and half fairy outcast. She currently is a Demon/Poison but Demon/Nature works SOOO much better! |
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
I'm planning on rolling a Demon/Nature MM. Grow, little demon plants, grow!
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And with the heals, absorbs and buffs it should be easy-ish to keep your pets alive which is a bonus
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
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Perma Overgrowth is achievable and looks cool-ish. The problem is that endurance balance is something that nearly everyone build on their own they dont "wait" for you to help them. Of course its amazing while leveling but it will be far from perma while leveling.
All in all I'd say its comparable to Pain Dom with -regen and super flashy pretty graphics.
I've made 2 so far; a heroic Water/Nature Corr named Marsh Mistress, a magic user. And a Praetorian Necro/Nature named The Verdant Legion; Neuron dumped some "failed" regeneration serum he was working on in a field outside the city, it permeated the soil and found a dead body; and the result was a half reanimated man, half supercharged vegetation thing capable of infesting more corpses with its plants to reanimate them as well.
Arc #40529 : The Furies of the Earth
Made Nature/water defender, same as on beta. So far it does good both solo and in team. Planing to make controller also, but not sure what primary - plant, earth or maybe even fire.
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Enjoying my Earth/Nature on incarnate trials and other content over various levels!
Issue 24 PPM Calculator // The Great Makeover: The Vindicators
Just curious for those that beta tested NA....couple quick questions, in hopes and theory the set will come out today or next tuesday....
Just trying to decide which benfits more from the set... ( i know defenders have better numbers, what i mean is in playability and practicality and FUN)...
I was thinking of either rolling a Plant/NA troller or NA/Elec defender... anyone find more fun on one AT or the other, or was corruptors better? thanks, just trying to get ideas so i dont do what i did with water blast and level 2 toons to 30 hate them delete them then finally get a third toon with water that i love (sonic/water def, go figure!) lol..cheers!