Patron vs. Epic pool choice
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2012-06-27 23:06 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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For what it's worth I'd much rather that they add more Ancillary Power Pools rather than trying to even it out adding another another set of unlockable Epic Pools.|
Originally Posted by Agent White
APP basically are neutral pools.
And someone asked about "Hero Patron" pools at the coffee talk and they've said patron pools are really complex to do and they have other ideas they're going to run with. Basically it's kind of hinted that they've got plans for pools, both regular and epic. |
I'd also like to see Patron Pools either unlocked automatically or have a heroside arc added to unlock them (where we steal power from Arachnos) but I'm not going to hold my breath for that.
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meh. At any given time, I can't guess what alignment most of my brothers characters are - it seems all of the squishy ones (defs, corrs, trollers, blasters, etc) absolutely MUST have the Scorpion Shield.|
Originally Posted by Ukaserex
Well, I'm bothered by this desire to have scorpion shield on other toons
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Originally Posted by Mazey
I'm fairly sure that you don't have to do that last part.
The requirement for getting alignment merits from the SSAs is that your most recently completed morality mission is a Hero one, which you satisfy while switching from Rogue to Hero. |
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Originally Posted by Ukaserex
I can verify and promise you that any character that switches alignment - if they hope to select an alignment merit (hero or villain) they will indeed need to do the extra 10 tips and morality to be able to select it.
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I have a feeling that's what they're doing, just adding more APPs. Which would be great, I'd love to see like a defense shield for corrupters/defenders.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
For what it's worth I'd much rather that they add more Ancillary Power Pools rather than trying to even it out adding another another set of unlockable Epic Pools.
I'd also like to see Patron Pools either unlocked automatically or have a heroside arc added to unlock them (where we steal power from Arachnos) but I'm not going to hold my breath for that. |
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For anyone who even dips a toe into min/maxing (which is all I've done so far), it makes things pretty easy. It's hard to say no to.
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Originally Posted by Ironblade
it seems all of the squishy ones (defs, corrs, trollers, blasters, etc) absolutely MUST have the Scorpion Shield.
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I have a character who herds big rooms of 52s around made possible in part by the glorious resistance of Shark Skin.
I really wish they would make a easy way of getting them. I find that most of the PPP are better at least for my play style. I have done all the patron arcs so many times, that I only switch if its a ALT that I really want to keep.
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I have no strong feelings for this, one way or the other.
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Originally Posted by Kirsten
Neutral "Training Pools"
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
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Originally Posted by AzureSkyCiel
I have no strong feelings for this, one way or the other.
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you could start as a villain and skip half of those tip missions
I've had to do this for all of my trollers and corruptors because I'm in love with Scorpion Shield. And I've had to do it with my heroic SoA of course (three of them so far).
It's annoying, but it's just something I'm resigned to. My latest beam/rad corruptor Jennie Nova is currently about to turn rogue after picking up patron pools and scorpion shield... she was hero a week or so ago. She's level 44, I usually wait to level 50 and do it but I decided to make the jump a little earlier this time.
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Yes, but then you'd be starting as a villain...
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Originally Posted by dugfromthearth
you could start as a villain and skip half of those tip missions
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I tend to do the same even if I'm not planning on using a PPP just so I have them unlocked if I change my mind. I also tend to run Mortimer Kal while I'm switched for the extra Notice of the Well at level 50.
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Originally Posted by Organica
I've had to do this for all of my trollers and corruptors because I'm in love with Scorpion Shield. And I've had to do it with my heroic SoA of course (three of them so far).
It's annoying, but it's just something I'm resigned to. My latest beam/rad corruptor Jennie Nova is currently about to turn rogue after picking up patron pools and scorpion shield... she was hero a week or so ago. She's level 44, I usually wait to level 50 and do it but I decided to make the jump a little earlier this time. |
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And have easy access to Invader. And get to run Mortimer Kal. And... heeeey, wait a minute!
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Originally Posted by Grendar
Yes, but then you'd be starting as a villain...
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One of the design considerations for the power pools was to make them more-or-less equivalent, so that you got pretty much the same set of powers unlocked regardless of which patron you picked. This was supposed to make the choice of patron a role-playing decision, rather than a minmax character-optimisation choice. We can see how well that worked out.
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Originally Posted by Iannis
Patron Pools were just a bad idea that were rikti monkied into the game. I think their thinking was that the Epic pools had been TOO good, so they wanted to NOT overpower Villains as they had done for Heroes, and then tying the unlock into getting handcuffed to serving a Patron since you were using their 'Signature' abilities. Even with the betrayal and surpassing your Patron in each arc it still just further threw your villain's essential lack of self-determination and power compared to the developer's Characters in your face, which everybody complained level 1-40 was too full of...rrr.
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-- Bruce Leverett, Register Allocation in Optimizing Compilers
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But then I'd have to play a lot more missions as a villain. That would just be ....not good. I don't like red side. Too many roaches and spiders and bugs. I still don't know how they came up with the idea that bugs are the symbol of villainy. Snakes, I can understand. Even still, the idea of roaming through the isles with all the ugly spiders is not my idea of a good time. |
Originally Posted by dugfromthearth
you could start as a villain and skip half of those tip missions
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If I could unlock it at level 20, that would be something to consider - but to play on redside for 35 levels? Nah, don't see that happening. My base, my IOs, my salvage - all are on blue side. That'd be even worse.
"Most people that have no idea what they are doing have no idea that they don't know what they are doing." - John Cleese
@Ukase
Guy makes some good (to me at least) points. Just about all of my 40odd toons are red, or rogue. With only a few Full Heroes.
Another + I'd give blue..is the ease of getting Geas (aka Fon) compared to at LEAST 10 mayhems. Yes..I know you have to do 8 mayhems for invader anyway but not everyone enjoys them. Not to mention..arsons are not always in them, and do NOT apply to the entire team, making them much much easier to get solo.
Back to the patron powers though..I would actually go the other way..and GIVE blueside missions and arcs, before they can access the Ancillary Pool. The patron arcs are some of the coolest in game, and they are quite old. If Blue missions were added in a similar style, and kept up with the high standard of the newer content..
On the flip side..WHY oh why are villains forced to FINISH the entire patron arc (its huge) before we can start an RSF? Yet Bluesiders were not even forced to do the logical mirror arc, in Maria, and save States before you could do his TF.
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Who? Never heard of him.
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Originally Posted by MisterD
Yet Bluesiders were not even forced to do the logical mirror arc, in Maria, and save States before you could do his TF.
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I would argue that completing Maria Jenkins's arc is shorter and faster than unlocking the Lord Recluse Strike Force.
Oh it is, much faster. Not to mention the Avs are part of an accolade, with only the first part of 3 in the patron arcs gives anything (besides the rsf unlock).
How about making the heroes finish Crimson's arc then? 
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Crimson's arc ends?
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Originally Posted by MisterD
Oh it is, much faster. Not to mention the Avs are part of an accolade, with only the frist part of 3 in the patron arcs gives anything (besides the rsf unlock).
How about making the heroes finish Crimson's arc then? |
Well White..the arc does NOT end actually. It just stops after you take your own life, after being sapped for the 100th time.
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yeah that sounds about my experience.
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Originally Posted by MisterD
Well White..the arc does NOT end actually. It just stops after you take your own life, after being sapped for the 100th time.
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I will freely admit I haven't read every post in the thread, so this may have already been mentioned.
There's a fix for this.
Let the Freedom Phalanx (except Penny- She doesn't have a handle on her own powers all the way) give players access to some hero side Patron Pools that are similar to the villain side ones.
I'd really like to see this. Been a long time coming if you ask me. 
"I play characters. I have to have a very strong visual appearance, backstory, name, etc. to get involved with a character, otherwise I simply won't play it very long. I'm not an RPer by any stretch of the imagination, but character concept is very important for me."- Back Alley Brawler
I couldn't agree more.
You mean..a fix that gives Heroes access to patrons for NO work at all, while vills still have to do the arc? (assuming here..you didnt say anything else) Yeah that is SO fair. Given that it has been..a long time coming, as you say, lets fix it to the other direction..heroes HAVE to do an arc to get either patron or ancillary powers..redside gets em for free. There..fixed..after all..heroes got their powers 'free' for how long?
The requirement for getting alignment merits from the SSAs is that your most recently completed morality mission is a Hero one, which you satisfy while switching from Rogue to Hero.
Another way to look at it is, the last time you ran a hero or villain morality mission, did you get any Merits (reward or alignment)? If so, you can choose alignment merits from SSAs.
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