You are right in part.
And you should get 550 pp monthly.
I dont think there is a reason for T9 vet players to continue as VIP.
You can buy 1200 pp montly and still a better deal than suscription.
incarnates.
If you want use of the Incarnate System (Alpha included) then you have to subscribe.
There is no way to access Incarnate Content outside of being VIP.
However, if the Incarnate stuff doesn't float your boat, then I agree with what you're saying.
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Twitter: @ZFLikesNachos Save City of Heroes (Titan Network) [Successful "The Really Hard Way" runs: 4] [Click ^]
There are a couple reasons:
- Incarnates
- Access to the VIP stuff without having to pay to unlock it
- The monthly stipend to buy new stuff without spending (more) money
If none of those matter, then premium is probably what you want.
Didn't VIP's get all the darkity-dark-dark powersets that came out for I22 for free? That may not be the sets you wanted, but they are new powersets.
Personally, I'm here for as VIP for access to my alts
You mentioned all the various characters you have and the different ways you play them - you may not be able to do so if you drop to Premium.
If you don't want Incarnates, and you are Tier 9, and you don't want ooodles of alts without having to pay for extra slots, you may be right that Premium is the way to go.
P.S. - as a long-time superhero comic book geek, I have to add "Long Live the Legion!"
Altoholic - but a Blaster at Heart!
Originally Posted by SpyralPegacyon
"You gave us a world where we could fly. I can't thank you enough for that."
I hadn't really considered the incarnates, but as to the other stuff...you can unlock it all with points.
I tried premium at first...I had 22 character slots. The $15 would buy more...permanently.
Even signature arcs are able to be bought.
So...aside from incarnates and SG creation/rent, I see no point.
Btw...when I was premium before, my incarnate powers worked for some reason.
I still think the 50% discount for VIPers is the solution.
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Ooo-raaa!
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Originally Posted by Ad Astra
P.S. - as a long-time superhero comic book geek, I have to add "Long Live the Legion!" |
I'm VIP right now mostly to check out the new Incarnate stuff (DA is VIP only, right?), as well as get badges for my main.
As soon as the badges top out, I'm going to seriously consider dropping to premium for a while, at least until another Christmas discount subscription rate rolls around.
Also, another point against VIP...the inability to take advantage of discounted items normally included in a VIP subscription.
For example...a discount on unlocking masterminds (which I would have access to anyway)...in case a person ever needs to go f2p later.
I'm considering just letting my lapse in payment continue. I haven't really found anything that excites me like Incarnates did in CoH.
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
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As a T9 player, who's been both VIP and Premium, I can say this:|
Originally Posted by Angelxman81
You are right in part.
And you should get 550 pp monthly. I dont think there is a reason for T9 vet players to continue as VIP. |
It depends on what you like and what you value.
If you want to stretch points as far as possible, saving on some costume sets and power sets, VIP helps - yes, there are still some power sets you would need to buy to play, but that's a personal choice.
If you don't want to pay extra (or specifically) for points, VIP helps.
If you like Incarnates, VIP's the only thing available for you.
If you're a serious altaholic (like me,) VIP is a better deal, IMHO - even with all the character slots I'd picked up, I still had characters on other servers I wanted to revisit... but, while they were in the 12 "free" slots, I didn't have server (or spare global) slots to unlock them. VIP's great there (though they need an "Unlock all characters on this server" button.)
SSAs... I don't know, I don't mind going through them as part of a subscription, but I don't know that I'd be satisfied with purchase if I'd bought them with points.
If none of that applies to you, Premium's the way to go. Pick up points as needed for the occasionally interesting powerset, IO yourself out, let someone else lead the SG and pay rent, ignore the Incarnate trials, and have fun.
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I'm taking that to mean you don't find Incarnates or Incarnate content exciting anymore. Otherwise I'm kind of confused by that statement.
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Originally Posted by Santorican
I haven't really found anything that excites me like Incarnates did in CoH.
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MA Arcs: Yarmouth 1509 and 58812
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Not sure if you're just trying to decide whether to keep your sub or are advocating for more VIP perks. If the former, only you can decide if the VIP perks are worth the monthly fee to rent them.|
Originally Posted by American_Angel
I hadn't really considered the incarnates, but as to the other stuff...you can unlock it all with points.
I tried premium at first...I had 22 character slots. The $15 would buy more...permanently. Even signature arcs are able to be bought. So...aside from incarnates and SG creation/rent, I see no point. |
If you're fine without those perks, then something to consider: Freedom is live for about 6 months now. If you've been here throughout that time, sum up all the points you used, not acquired from purchase or stipend, but actually used in the store. Then compare with points you would've gotten in 6 months if you used that $15/mo budget on points instead of a sub.
Can't verify in-game right now but going by the wiki, you would have close to 8,000 points by now that you can use instead of 2,400 from only your stipend and still be within a $15/mo game budget
[edit: 3,300 points from 6months of stipend since you're a t9 VIP]
8,000 points can get you 25 character slots to add to your existing 22, still less than what you unlock with a sub so it depends on whether you can use that many in 6 months. Less slots if you use some of those points for other things of course. If you have alts that you don't really use much, instead of unlocking that alt, you can use the server slot token to unlock an empty slot to make a new character.
Though i'm not sure but i think VIPs can unlock up to 48 slots per server and premiums can unlock only 36. (need in-game verification)
If you mostly use your base for decorating/rp and teleports, you'll be fine as a premium. You will have to remove all rent items though and many of them are used for aesthetic design.
If you're fine with doing what you've been doing for the first 6 years of CoX's history, which is mostly make new alt, get to 50, make new alt...then premium is beneficial. But new content is usually what keeps people and not sure how many of their future content will be incarnate related.
If the market keeps going the way it is now, I don't think VIP will be worth it unless you really need extra character slots and can't live without a +1 level shift. People with a lot of veteran points really get the shaft on VIP because they are basically paying for content they are already getting for free, and then when a new power set comes along they are expected to buy it at the free player market price. VIP should get a discount on market items and possibly more than 400 points per month, 600 would be ideal with current prices. Right now it's like $10 subscription cost so you can have a +1 and some extra character slots. Access to the beta server with the free merits/market is the real prize for a VIP, I am surprised more people don't play on the beta server full time.
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It's a fair question. I don't necessarily expect everyone to agree with me that VIP is a better deal, but there are at least some good reasons to be VIP.|
Originally Posted by American_Angel
< why subscribe as vip? >
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I, too, have t9 filled out, so I would be giving up as few features as possible by going premium. For the sake of argument, let's also pretend I do not care at all about any of the VIP-exclusive features, and just compare the things points can buy.
I bought the 12+2 subscription deal at Christmas. That was... what, $150? I don't recall the exact number, I'd have to check my bank statement, but it was around there, and that's a nice easy number to compare because it's a $100 bundle and a $50 bundle, for a total of 14200 points. But the subscription gets me 7700 points from stipends. So already, Premium's advantage is reduced to 6500 points.
I'm also only going to look at the Freedom server, because I don't play elsewhere often enough to be worth mentioning. I would lose 10 character slots on Freedom by going Premium. Even buying those 5 at a time and with this week's sale would cost 2400 points. This cuts Premium's advantage to 4100 points.
Then, I'd have to buy Time Manipulation and Dark Control, since I like and play both. 2500 points left.
Then, I'd have to buy all 6 SSA arcs, since again I like them and they're very useful for gathering alignment merits. 2400 points, unless there's a bundle deal on them now, I'm not sure. At this point, Premium's advantage has basically disappeared just trying to get back the features I would have lost by dropping from VIP.
How about VIP costume sets? I'm not using Olympian Guard much, at least not yet, but I'm using almost every piece of Imperial Defense on at least one character I play regularly. So that's at least 400 points.
I'd have to pay extra to retain access to my Widow. That's 1200 points.
I'd lose my VIP salvage/recipe storage bonuses. Getting that back would be about 2400 points.
I might be forgetting some other things, but as Premium I'd end up paying several thousand points (around $50ish extra) just to keep all the stuff I already have. Buying more features for the same money is out of the question. And I haven't even counted the features my sub includes that I personally don't really care about (First Ward, Kheldians, etc).
This is all before we even consider that the VIP sub gets 2 extra reward tokens in that time, and has the option to spend them on t9 vip costumes, not to mention Incarnate powers and content, the Exalted server, SG creation and rent, and any other power sets/costumes/etc that will come with my subscription over the next year!
Of course, each person's list of VIP features they care to retain will be different. If yours is shorter than mine, and/or if you're buying VIP by the month instead of with the multi-month deals, you may find that Premium gives you more of what you want. And hey, that's fine, that's the point of being able to downgrade to Premium. VIP definitely has advantages, but how much you value those vs the other things you could spend points on is totally subjective.
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I would think premium's true advantage (if disregarding the vip exlusives) is not really the points you buy/spend but at some point in time you would likely have enough to eventually stop paying money and keep those things you bought during the same time a VIP would be paying their sub. And if that VIP ever decides to cancel, they'll be in the same situation as the premium, unless they never stop paying.|
Originally Posted by Hopeling
At this point, Premium's advantage has basically disappeared just trying to get back the features I would have lost by dropping from VIP.
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Actually forgot about the reward token, thanks for reminding me. Some additional info to consider:
Premiums get 1 token for every 1200 points bought not dollars spent to buy the points. If you buy the $15 point bundle which gives a 120 extra bonus points on top of the 1200, those count towards the reward token award. So if one buys the $15 point bundle every month for a year, you'll get 15,840 points which will qualify you for 13 reward tokens for that year.
For premiums who are already T9, accumulating reward tokens doesn't do much. At minimum, premiums will have to stop buying the $15 pt bundle for a month and use that money towards a month subscription. You should (theoretically, considering the state of reward token award system) still get a reward token for that month. During that month as a VIP, you can use your accumulated reward tokens to claim the T9 VIP items. Once claimed, you do not lose them when you go back to premium. At least so far.
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22 slots? That's not nearly enough. Let's see, I'd need to spend... carry the 2... wow that's a lot of points.
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Originally Posted by American_Angel
I tried premium at first...I had 22 character slots. The $15 would buy more...permanently.
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I go premium when I feel like punishing the devs for decisions I disagree with. I'd rather be running DA arcs, but oh well.
Developer decisions around here are like Texas weather, though. Don't like 'em? Wait around long enough and things'll change, usually to an acceptable level.
Be well, people of CoH.
It's definitely a question worth asking oneself and the answer is not so quick and simple for everyone, based on their preferences and such (no duh, E-K).
I think my biggest complaint right now is not getting the Reward Tokens for prepaid time. It's not entirely related to the VIP or Premium debate... but it is one aspect of disappointment as a VIP that makes me not really feel like a "VIP".
The thing is, this is because I'm still shy of Tier 9. I'm not going to put enough money into the market just to get all those reward tokens, but I'd put it into my subscription.
I also would like to see a discount for VIPs, but I am not convinced they should do that... I just don't feel great about being a VIP as things stand right now. I think I prefer it to being Premium, but not by much.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
As I understand it your only benefits as a VIP over a Premium Tier 9 player are:
~550 Points for "free".
~Access to Incarnate content and abilities.
~Ability to pay for the upkeep on your SG base.
~Additional award token per month which can be used to purchase the repeatable rewards.
Ultimately, you have to decide as an individual whether or not being VIP or being premium is the best way to go.
Personally, I'm a VIP because of two reasons. The first one is the price point is actually very worthwhile when you subscribe during the holiday stea-- er, I mean, deal. Subscribing that way, the average monthly cost is just over $10, which is exceptional in my opinion.
The second one, and I know a bunch of people won't feel this way but oh well, I do, is showing loyalty to the game, its developers, and its publisher. I think they do a great job--much moreso than most game companies. I want them to keep doing so for a long, long time, and I know that to do so, they have to have a continuous stream of income.
I know this sounds corny, but I'd feel a bit guilty about enjoying the game as much as I do without shelling out something for it. That's how I roll. I'm also the guy who shelled out for shareware back in the day, even for (especially for) software that you could use indefinitely for "free" without nag screens and such. Even paying the bare minimum subscription fee I can get away with by taking advantage of the holiday deal, I still spend probably way more than my fair share in the Paragon Market. Not because I'm such an über-powergamer (if you saw me play, you'd know), but because I want to say, "Hey, this is cool, nice job!" And more selfishly, "Keep making more stuff!"
Now don't get me wrong, I don't feel like I throw money foolishly at the game. I do take advantage of any discounts I can get (like the aforementioned holiday discount, and sales on the market). On the other hand, I also spend what some might consider a crazy amount on hosting the Titan Network sites, which I'm doing semi-selfishly for the purpose of learning and hanging out with cool smart people, and some of which is offset by very cool people making donations.
At any rate, I can't imagine canceling my VIP subscription anytime soon. Yeah, the Incarnate stuff is nice, as well as the store stipend and Paragon Tokens and the bonus access to stuff I'd otherwise have to pay for. I really do feel that is reason enough to subscribe. If you don't, fair enough. But this is also a seven-plus-year hobby I've invested in that I like quite a bit, and that counts for a lot, too.
We've been saving Paragon City for eight and a half years. It's time to do it one more time.
(If you love this game as much as I do, please read that post.)
Kind of similar to TonyV.
Cost reasons: I am on the 14 months for the price of 12 option so averaging $10 or so per month, I get 550 points, 1 token.
$10 barely buys 2 breakfasts any more and is almost what a matinee costs to see. I cannot beat the hours of fun per dollar the game gives me so I have no problems paying for the game.
Practical reasons: paying base rent, Incarnate stuff
Non-essential reasons: VIP access to powersets and such that I'd have to otherwise buy to unlock
I just don't see any gain for me in dropping from VIP to Premium.
Now if I couldn't afford the year long sub and had to pay month to month and if money were that tight I'd probably come up with some way to subscribe every other month or 4 weeks on and 6 weeks off so I could at least keep my SG base lights on.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
Premium won't allow me to have 80+ alts on one server. Unless I want to manage 40+ accounts. >.>
Heck, they won't even let me have 80+ alts for a single VIP subscription! Those bastards!
Anyway I've actually set up a couple of premium accounts on the side, and two totally freebie ones, just to see how things compare. Life as a premium isn't all that bad. But I likes my alts and incarnate stuff too much.
my lil RWZ Challenge vid
Also - 12 slots per server. With Freedom, they made the max slots per server 48, 36 of which you can earn/purchase.
Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net
Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
I have played this game since pre-launch beta with the exception of a few financially motivated breaks. I am tier 9. Just to make it clear here are my reasons for playing so long:
A) Comic book geek
I grew up. On Marvel and DC, and I remember games like Freedom Force and The Superhero League of Hoboken. CoH was the bomb and I was a part of the community from just after the announcement of the game...way back in the original forums.
B) Baser on board...
...the one thing that has kept me playing the game has been base-building. But we are a largely ignored community, so I have been tempted many a time to move on.
C) I have a weird view on farming. It took me two years to get my first 50. I did it the right way, did all the missions I was able to do, and I even took the time to get the invention badges. In short, I learned the game in detail.
Since than, I farm SOME of my toons to certain levels...like 25-30. I actually use to hate hitting 50 because a goon use to become useless at 50.
I also have toons I call "slowbies"...toons I turn off exp gain on until they clear all available missions at various levels...so I play on both sides of the fence.
SO THE REASONFOR THIS POST
Lately, I find myself wondering why I am a VIP Subscriber. I am tier 9. Most of the old content is unlocked. I get 400 point to spend in the market as a VIP...monthly. They show up at the END of my subscription month for some reason.
This month I spent a extra $15 on points to spend...and I unlocked more content than I've had access to as a VIP.
So I pose this question..why should I pay $15 per month to be a VIP and still not have access to things like Beast Mastery, Titan Weapons and various costume pieces when I can use that monthly amount to buy permanent access with over 1200 points I would gain monthly???
It makes more sense at present to NOT be VIP.
But, there is a possible solution...give VIPs a 50% discount in the store. That way, our messely 400 points would be enough to buy things like Beast Mastery. It would still give reason to remain VIP.
Cause I have to say...Premium is looking mighty good to me right now.