If it takes endmod enhancements (or is a player-cast incarnate ability, e.g. judgment), alpha agility functions for it. If it does not take endmod enhancements (e.g. lore pets), it doesn't not.
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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Any Lore pets with end drain (if there are any? not sure) should be buffed by Agility, just like their damage is buffed my Musculature, I would think.
I guess what I am asking is more subtle. Do End Mod enhancements put in those powers affect the abilities to drain, or do they just reduce the end cost to cast the power? Basically, I am asking about the exact interaction between the alpha and the powers, and if that effect is the same as putting an end mod in the power.
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End REDUCTION enhancements lower the end cost of those powers. End MOD enhancements affect how much they drain/save/give back to you.|
Originally Posted by Blue_Centurion
I guess what I am asking is more subtle. Do End Mod enhancements put in those powers affect the abilities to drain, or do they just reduce the end cost to cast the power? Basically, I am asking about the exact interaction between the alpha and the powers, and if that effect is the same as putting an end mod in the power.
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As such, the Agility Alpha Incarnate Ability will affect how much these powers drain.
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Yes it effects the endurance drain. I use it on my Elec/SD brute, but I have to tell you, IMO endurance drain in PvE is pretty much useless.
You get slightly better results with end drain and recovery debuffing.
Who do I have to *&^% around here to get more Targeted AoE recipes added?
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Right, got it now thanks. (especially for the patience lol) Been grinding and plotting and didnt quite realize the obvious distinction. And yes about the question on effectiveness in PvE. Now that my understanding of the nature of the effect is cleared up I need to decide if it is worth it.
If you want to make a sapper, you probably have the wrong AT. While elec melee will drain some endurance...well, frankly the enemies will be dead long before their blue bar goes down.
I was noticing this "the whole group dies real fast" effect myself. I am coming off of a long line of mostly SS/Invul brutes. The difference is,....significant.
I was wondering if facing EBs or AVs (or GMs or Pylons or random bldg I want to solo...)or other super hard targets the End Drain secondary effect would be worth pursuing.
I can't speak for every thing, but AVs in particular have a scaling resistance to all sorts of debuffs, including Recovery and End Drain.
A level 1 AV has 60% resistance, a level 50 has 85% resistance, and a level 54 has 87%. Normally this isn't a huge problem for debuffs since every little bit counts, but with end drain it only really matters once they're at or very close to 0. Can't say if it works that well outside of say, an Elec/ controller or dominator, but I can't imagine it being very effective with electric melee.
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fixt, and this.
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Originally Posted by EnigmaBlack
endurance drain in PvE is useless.
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Votes seem to be coming in loud and clear. Thanks for helping me understand the incarnate abilities. And thank you for helping me to keep the build focused on the time honored "Kill them quick, Slick" method of play. I still haven't quite decided how to incarnate him, but this line of thought appears to be at a logical conclusion.
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Originally Posted by EnigmaBlack
IMO endurance drain in PvE is pretty much useless.
You get slightly better results with end drain and recovery debuffing. |
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Originally Posted by DreadShinobi
fixt, and this.
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Or you could have just spammed your single target hold since it was just an EB >_>
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Originally Posted by Stone Daemon
I wouldn't call it completely useless in PvE. Maybe not worth it, but not useless. I was able to solo an EB on my elec/sonic troller simply by walking up to it and draining it's endurance. Keeping it perma flatlined helped me kill it safely (at a glacial pace). It's a fun idea on paper, if not quite as useful as other tactics.
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Back before Elec Armor had a self heal, "kill 'em quick" was the only way to play unless you wanted to do hit and run. |
Originally Posted by Blue_Centurion
And thank you for helping me to keep the build focused on the time honored "Kill them quick, Slick" method of play.
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As a side note, I had always thought it was funny that the Devs pulled Ice Armor from Brutes in COV Beta because the slows were hindering Fury generation. Meanwhile on my Elec Armor Brute, out of desperation, I developed a play style where I would do everything I could to keep the enemies from being able to attack because they could pretty much auto-hit me and I was getting shredded.
Anyway, I do slot some end mods in my powers and I find that sapping does help with longer fights.
Teams are the number one killer of soloists.
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I would like to point out that before Energize, I spent several years playing - and playing with - electric armor characters that never used any hit-and-run tactic.|
Originally Posted by SerialBeggar
Back before Elec Armor had a self heal, "kill 'em quick" was the only way to play unless you wanted to do hit and run.
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My fiance hasn't even respec'd his Elec Armor Brute into Energize yet (she didn't have Conserve Power prior to the change) because she doesn't need it. She can stand toe to toe with pretty close to anything outside of an incarnate trial and not even bat an eyelash.
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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You'd think so, but as I recall, that fight didn't work out like that for whatever reason. It's odd.
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Originally Posted by DreadShinobi
Or you could have just spammed your single target hold since it was just an EB >_>
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Storm Elementals use Electric Blast attacks, including Short Circuit.
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Originally Posted by Hopeling
Any Lore pets with end drain (if there are any? not sure) should be buffed by Agility, just like their damage is buffed my Musculature, I would think.
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Before Energize, every elec brute ran aid self (well, they should have) and with it elec brutes really didn't have such gaping survivability issues. |
Originally Posted by SerialBeggar
Back before Elec Armor had a self heal, "kill 'em quick" was the only way to play unless you wanted to do hit and run.
As a side note, I had always thought it was funny that the Devs pulled Ice Armor from Brutes in COV Beta because the slows were hindering Fury generation. Meanwhile on my Elec Armor Brute, out of desperation, I developed a play style where I would do everything I could to keep the enemies from being able to attack because they could pretty much auto-hit me and I was getting shredded. Anyway, I do slot some end mods in my powers and I find that sapping does help with longer fights. |
My 2nd 50 was an EM/Elec brute, and even with the added damage from ET, Aid Self was more than enough to keep me alive.
I'm going for a pretty high end build here, which is why I am doing so much research. But at 33 I am almost (soooo close) tanking most of the stuff. Even diving into fresh spawns on the Manti last night when the team wasnt quite done with the last one. But again, lots and lots of I/Os. Lots of S/L Defense. I would compare the survivability favorably with the SS/Invul Brute that is similarly I/Od and around the same level. I figure that the Elec Armor Scrapper will be a little mushier in high end 50 lvl mobs. Time will tell.
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Elec Armor performs way better on brutes.
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Originally Posted by Blue_Centurion
I'm going for a pretty high end build here, which is why I am doing so much research. But at 33 I am almost (soooo close) tanking most of the stuff. Even diving into fresh spawns on the Manti last night when the team wasnt quite done with the last one. But again, lots and lots of I/Os. Lots of S/L Defense. I would compare the survivability favorably with the SS/Invul Brute that is similarly I/Od and around the same level. I figure that the Elec Armor Scrapper will be a little mushier in high end 50 lvl mobs. Time will tell.
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Yeah, for most elec sets I don't consider end drain drain to be a main focus of my strategy... that said, when two or more elec characters team up, it can turn into a beautiful thing; Like the BAF where myself, another elec blaster and an elec troller kept both AVs drained
As for the Alpha... Go for it anyway, If all the other boosts it gives line up with what you want, consider the End Mod a nice little bonus. (Plus, it also affects things like Stamina, meaning you might consider freeing up a slot that would otherwise be spent there)
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I had Aid Self and to use it, I had to retreat to a safe spot, thus hit and run. I had 0% defense, so there was no way to use it in the middle of a fight. That's why I delved into sapping to open up enough of a pause in the fight to heal up.
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Originally Posted by DreadShinobi
Before Energize, every elec brute ran aid self (well, they should have) and with it elec brutes really didn't have such gaping survivability issues.
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Teams are the number one killer of soloists.
A possible viable alternative here would be the Musculature Radial Paragon
- it includes End Mod, along with the always useful Damage, reasonably useful Defense Debuff and To Hit Debuff, and even the marginally useful Run Speed and Immob buffs - your mileage may vary, but it's hard to go wrong with Musculature on a damage dealing character
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In general Musculature is best for Scrappers, Dominators, and Blasters. For other ATs alphas that have either rchg or end are typically better. Brutes are a huge example of this because of their low base damage and fury, Musculature does very little for them, however Spiritual or Agility can be great for saving slots and improving dps or cardiac so you don't have to focus slotting towards +end and +recovery.|
Originally Posted by Mistress Rue
A possible viable alternative here would be the Musculature Radial Paragon
- it includes End Mod, along with the always useful Damage, reasonably useful Defense Debuff and To Hit Debuff, and even the marginally useful Run Speed and Immob buffs - your mileage may vary, but it's hard to go wrong with Musculature on a damage dealing character |
Since OP is a scrapper, Musculature is definitely a good option. However I'd say you could go either Core or Radial and it would work. The 12% higher dmg on the core side can easily keep pace with the radial side even for an elec/elec scrapper. What makes musculature great is the damage, the other things it enhances are pretty minor in comparison.
I am looking at possibly taking an Elec/Elec/Mu and building a Supper Sapper. Does anyone knows if the Endurance Modification for Alpha Agility works to enhance the endurance draining powers of:
Elec Melee/Electric Armor Scrapper
Charged Brawl: Foe End drain, 10% chance self End boost
Havoc Punch: Foe End drain, 10% chance self End boost
Jacob's Ladder: Foe End drain
Thunder Strike: Foe End drain
Chain Induction: Foe End drain
Lightning Field: Foe End drain
Energize: Self End discount
Power Sink: Foe End Drain, Self End Boost
Mu Mastery
Mu Bolts: Foe End drain, 30% chance self End boost
Electric Shackles: Foe End drain, 30% chance self End boost
Ball Lightning: Foe End drain
Summon Adept: Does this boost the Mu pet's drain?
Judgement: Ion, Radial Final Judgement; Foe -Recovery, Foe -Endurance
Lore: Are there any Lore pets with Endurance drain, and if so would they be buffed by Agility Alpha?
Thanks for any help.