Yeah, it's always a shame when a blatant exploit gets removed.
Not that I pretend to agree with or understand why we should have to wait 30 seconds to log out, but that's clearly the intended behavior.
De minimis non curat Lex Luthor.
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Which means you're probably not the type who seeks out exploits, so that's good. |
Originally Posted by Bosstone
Not that I pretend to agree with or understand why we should have to wait 30 seconds to log out, but that's clearly the intended behavior.
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Logging out immediately in MMOs is always abused in PvP and could be used to avoid XP debt in PvE. The first time this issue was ever addressed was around 1996 during the Beta (maybe Alpha) for the world's first MMORPG.
I don't PvP (much) in City of Heroes, but I have felt irritation elsewhere caused by a sore loser who instantly logs after starting a fight and then realizing he isn't capable of winning. If I can't escape using normal (or legally creative) methods, I take my defeat like a good sport.
@Captain-Electric � Detective Marvel � The Sapien Spider � Moravec Man � The Old Norseman
Dark-Eyes � Doctor Serpentine � Stonecaster � Skymaiden � The Blue Jaguar
Guide to Altitis � A Comic for New Players � The Lore Project � Intro to extraterrestrials in CoH
I'm sorry. Exploit? Aren't we setting the bar a little low?
Thought for the day:
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."
=][=
PvP in this game is a joke and debt in PvE is an even bigger joke.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
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Massively underdeveloped PvP and Care Bear-like debt (which is largely your community's fault) aside, it is still a developer's job to foresee and plug those holes.
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Originally Posted by DarkGob
PvP in this game is a joke and debt in PvE is an even bigger joke.
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@Captain-Electric � Detective Marvel � The Sapien Spider � Moravec Man � The Old Norseman
Dark-Eyes � Doctor Serpentine � Stonecaster � Skymaiden � The Blue Jaguar
Guide to Altitis � A Comic for New Players � The Lore Project � Intro to extraterrestrials in CoH
Some kind of instant logout would be a nice feature. Tie it to a Day Job location, or the Rest power, or something, if necessary to prevent exploitative behavior. More annoying to me than the 30 second timer, though, is the "Press any key to cancel". Are you sure you want to log out? Really double positive? I think you might have pressed that by accident. Here, I'll cancel it if you take any action at all, just in case.
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I remember my first MMORPG had sleeping bags that you could use the camping skill with to insta-log out in the wilderness. The drawback was that you had to waste a whole skill selection on this one-trick pony.|
Originally Posted by Hopeling
Some kind of instant logout would be a nice feature. Tie it to a Day Job location, or the Rest power, or something, if necessary to prevent exploitative behavior.
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In City of Heroes, some kind of inherent power that you could activate OUT OF COMBAT would be nice. But if it takes more than a few minutes to code, I think we all know there will never be sufficient demand to justify developer time being spent on a power like that.
@Captain-Electric � Detective Marvel � The Sapien Spider � Moravec Man � The Old Norseman
Dark-Eyes � Doctor Serpentine � Stonecaster � Skymaiden � The Blue Jaguar
Guide to Altitis � A Comic for New Players � The Lore Project � Intro to extraterrestrials in CoH
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Any unintended behavior that's used to bypass intended behavior is an exploit. It's not a very big or harmful exploit, but it was one. The loophole got closed, it was fun while it lasted.
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Originally Posted by Slaunyeh
I'm sorry. Exploit? Aren't we setting the bar a little low?
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De minimis non curat Lex Luthor.
I miss the buycoh command too, I often find it quicker to quit and restart the client than to wait for it to logout...
Octavian Vanguard
@ohmsEU and @ohms 2
Badging character: Bimble on the Union server, Badgehunter.com and City Info Tracker.
You can log to the desktop without the countdown, which is apparently working as intended. Ergo logging out sans countdown is hardly an exploit.
Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
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Originally Posted by Tenzhi
You can log to the desktop without the countdown, which is apparently working as intended. Ergo logging out sans countdown is hardly an exploit.
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I thought that while you can exit without the countdown instantly, the character stays in the CoH world for the whole 30 secs even if you chose to close the game instantly.
@Damz Find me on the global channel Union Chat. One of the best "chat channels" ingame!
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Come on. Like anyone plays PvP any more, and like anyone cares about debt in PvE.
| Logging out immediately in MMOs is always abused in PvP and could be used to avoid XP debt in PvE. |
Doom.
Yep.
This is really doom.
Hey, I care about debt! If I'm not careful about accumulating enough debt, I might have to die on purpose several times just to get that badge for the accolade.
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Emphasis mine. All I can ask is:|
Originally Posted by Captain-Electric
Massively underdeveloped PvP and Care Bear-like debt (which is largely your community's fault) aside, it is still a developer's job to foresee and plug those holes.
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????????
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
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Wow, outdated PvP insults AND a broad slander against the entire community. I hadn't seen something quite this bad before.
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Originally Posted by Captain-Electric
Massively underdeveloped PvP and Care Bear-like debt (which is largely your community's fault) aside, it is still a developer's job to foresee and plug those holes.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Yes, this is correct. Although for most people, it takes about 30 seconds for the game to shut down and restart and then log back in, so they never notice when switching characters - it just feels faster, because they're doing something rather than sitting there waiting for the countdown (some folks with very high level, bleeding-edge rigs may actually be marginally faster).
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Originally Posted by EU_Damz
I thought that while you can exit without the countdown instantly, the character stays in the CoH world for the whole 30 secs even if you chose to close the game instantly.
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Prophecy & Dreams | Prophecy & Dreams Discussion
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Unbidden | Star Patrol | Real World Hero
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You character still counts down. You're just not there to see it.|
Originally Posted by Tenzhi
You can log to the desktop without the countdown, which is apparently working as intended. Ergo logging out sans countdown is hardly an exploit.
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The countdown is primarely there to prevent serverload issues. Logging in and out is relatively server intensive, the countdown is there to prevent people from repeatedly exiting and entering the game quickly.
At least, that's the reason in other games, so I'm going to assume the same here.
@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
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You can quit to the desktop, but your character remains logging out. You can restart the client and then try to log in, which will actually insta-log-out your character and override the countdown, but you would need to be able to start your NCsoft Launcher, have it connect, start City of Heroes, have that connect and then have it load AND THEN quickly type in your password, all in under 30 seconds for it to be any form of a benefit. Even if your machine can do all this in 30 seconds, I'd wager a bet it's not going to gain you more than a handful of seconds.|
Originally Posted by Tenzhi
You can log to the desktop without the countdown, which is apparently working as intended. Ergo logging out sans countdown is hardly an exploit.
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By contrast, logging out straight to the log in screen means you can type in your password and insta-log-out your character within the span of 5-10 seconds, which is significantly faster.
Remember - every time a character of yours is logged in when you try to connect, that character will be taken offline IMMEDIATELY irrespective of what it is doing or where it is.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I believe the reason for the 30-second delay was due to a PvE exploit more in COH than a PvP exploit.
What was going on was that folks could instantly log out to avoid death. Pulled too many mobs? Wanted to avoid XP debt? Log out and your character insta-disappears. Although this could obviously be used in PvP situations, as well. If I recall correctly, it was implemented around Issue 1 or Issue 2.
The 30-second timer was implemented in this game (and exists in many other on-line games), partly because of this behavior.
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The problem is, there's no mechanic built into CoH to determine "out of combat" vs "in combat". And I'd wager it'd take a LOT of re-writing core code to put one in. Totally not worth it just to save people 30 seconds.
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Originally Posted by Captain-Electric
I remember my first MMORPG had sleeping bags that you could use the camping skill with to insta-log out in the wilderness. The drawback was that you had to waste a whole skill selection on this one-trick pony.
In City of Heroes, some kind of inherent power that you could activate OUT OF COMBAT would be nice. But if it takes more than a few minutes to code, I think we all know there will never be sufficient demand to justify developer time being spent on a power like that. |
Virtue Server
Avatar art by Daggerpoint
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This is obviously incorrect because there is a dayjob badge that increases out-of-combat recovery and another that increases out-of-combat regeneration.
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Originally Posted by Tyger42
The problem is, there's no mechanic built into CoH to determine "out of combat" vs "in combat". And I'd wager it'd take a LOT of re-writing core code to put one in. Totally not worth it just to save people 30 seconds.
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Paragon Wiki: http://www.paragonwiki.com
City Info Terminal: http://cit.cohtitan.com
Mids Hero Designer: http://www.cohplanner.com
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Originally Posted by Dispari
I don't know why Dink thinks she's not as sexy as Jay was. In 5 posts she's already upstaged his entire career.
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And you can't slot or unslot Incarnate powers while in combat.
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Originally Posted by Aggelakis
This is obviously incorrect because there is a dayjob badge that increases out-of-combat recovery and another that increases out-of-combat regeneration.
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"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...
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Originally Posted by Aggelakis
This is obviously incorrect because there is a dayjob badge that increases out-of-combat recovery and another that increases out-of-combat regeneration.
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Originally Posted by DarkGob
And you can't slot or unslot Incarnate powers while in combat.
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Virtue Server
Avatar art by Daggerpoint
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If it can take just 1 second less it renders null the notion that bypassing the countdown is any sort of exploit.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
You can quit to the desktop, but your character remains logging out. You can restart the client and then try to log in, which will actually insta-log-out your character and override the countdown, but you would need to be able to start your NCsoft Launcher, have it connect, start City of Heroes, have that connect and then have it load AND THEN quickly type in your password, all in under 30 seconds for it to be any form of a benefit. Even if your machine can do all this in 30 seconds, I'd wager a bet it's not going to gain you more than a handful of seconds.
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Goodbye may seem forever
Farewell is like the end
But in my heart's the memory
And there you'll always be
-- The Fox and the Hound
It seems the /buycoh command has been disabled entirely, as the game no longer recognizes it as a valid command.
For those who don't know, this command would open up a dialog box asking the player if they want to buy the game. Clicking yes would open the NCSoft store in the player's web browser while simultaneously logging them out of the game instantly (no countdown). This used to be a quick trick for switching characters quickly.
I guess it makes sense that it would be removed now that the game is F2P, but it's still kind of disappointing that this trick no longer works.
"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...