Nope, this is currently broken and annoying.
Unfortunately for... everyone. Pet AI behavior is set as a universal pattern. There's no specific ways to make a pet prefer ranged or melee or what ever.
Ever since demon summoning introduced the pet's "shoot them then punch them" AI behavior, all the pets have been doing it. This is wonderful for Demons, and zombies and the like... hell for everybody else.
They REALLY need to find a way to give different pets different AI groups so they act properly.
Celtech Main Site
My DA Profile
They need to make Pet AI a little more unique with the way they cycle attacks. An update a while back made it so that Critters tried to cycle through ALL of their attacks. Since Pet AI is tied to the Critter AI in this way, ranged pets are tempted to run in and make good use of their melee moves (and by good use I mean horribly insufferable).
Yes, we are all waiting for this incredibly annoying ai bug to be fixed. For a very long time now too, I might add.
Today, I was fighting with Deathsurge, quite a long fight... and I noticed my protector bots didn't charge in the whole time. Everyone else did, and, even with softcapped defense predictably died eventually (T1 pets still die in one hit from many things).
But it was interesting to notice the protector bots did behave. I might have noticed similar behavior with Mercs Medic, but I haven't done much with that MM lately.. you have to play quite a bit to get a 'useable' sample of data anyway so this falls into meaningless anecdote.
Now if all my pets didn't hurl themselves into dangers way, I tell ya, that'd be just swell as hell. Well, look on the bright side... with the recent i-shift for pets, it means the Devs don't hate MM's so maybe this will eventually go away 
Quote:
What we need is would be three more /petcom commands like:|
Originally Posted by Bookkeeper_Jay
They need to make Pet AI a little more unique with the way they cycle attacks. An update a while back made it so that Critters tried to cycle through ALL of their attacks. Since Pet AI is tied to the Critter AI in this way, ranged pets are tempted to run in and make good use of their melee moves (and by good use I mean horribly insufferable).
|
petcom_all rangeonly
petcom_all meleeonly
petcom_all allattacks
So you can have it whatever way you want.
Quote:
Or make the current "go to" and "stay" commands really mean something right now if the pets want to move in /chase they will do so and then return to their assigned location when the targe is dead "Unacceptable"
|
Originally Posted by Robert_B
What we need is would be three more /petcom commands like:
petcom_all rangeonly petcom_all meleeonly petcom_all allattacks So you can have it whatever way you want. |
Thing is, since they were so quick to acknowledge and correct the MM issues with the trials it has me questioning if this is an actual 'bug' or is WAI.
To my knowledge, I've never seen a redname comment about it ever.
More than likely, it's left in to ensure we aren't overpowered. Honestly, MM's are very formidable even while suffering the bug. It's just now with the +4 mobs that it's starting to weaken us thus the proposed level shift for pets.
When you think about it. If we had that level of control over the pets we could break the game. Even more so with Incarnate powers.
This is why I doubt it'll ever really go away.
I could be wrong, feel free to point out a dev statement that it's being looked at. I'd like to be able to play my bots/storm without the little buggers turning into scrappers. I just don't think it's a bug like everyone else.
Maestro Mavius - Infinity
Capt. Biohazrd - PCSAR
Talsor Tech - Talsorian Guard
Keep Calm & Chive On!
Quote:
My only issue with this is that it is EVERY pet. My Phantasm loves melee range for no reason, which makes it worse than it should be, since now it doesn't stay at a decent range for the Cone attack.
|
Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
Thing is, since they were so quick to acknowledge and correct the MM issues with the trials it has me questioning if this is an actual 'bug' or is WAI.
To my knowledge, I've never seen a redname comment about it ever. More than likely, it's left in to ensure we aren't overpowered. Honestly, MM's are very formidable even while suffering the bug. It's just now with the +4 mobs that it's starting to weaken us thus the proposed level shift for pets. When you think about it. If we had that level of control over the pets we could break the game. Even more so with Incarnate powers. This is why I doubt it'll ever really go away. I could be wrong, feel free to point out a dev statement that it's being looked at. I'd like to be able to play my bots/storm without the little buggers turning into scrappers. I just don't think it's a bug like everyone else. |
50s: Yumi Eryuha-Arch/Energy, Mirria-Thugs/Dark, Meyami Kitsuna-Claws/SR, Celesta Seusen-SS/Invuln, Lady Mirriella-Illusion/Empathy
Arc 503982 "Dimension Xi Epsilon 22-10" Part one of a multi-part arc.
Quote:
How would we be overpowered? cause our pets act a little less stupid and don't rush in and die? The mobs can still just walk up to our pets and smash them, rather what this does is force us to stop them attacking (when using a command to have them follow us to get back to where we want them), there are other ways to reduce the power of our pets without making them act this way.|
Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
Thing is, since they were so quick to acknowledge and correct the MM issues with the trials it has me questioning if this is an actual 'bug' or is WAI.
To my knowledge, I've never seen a redname comment about it ever. More than likely, it's left in to ensure we aren't overpowered. Honestly, MM's are very formidable even while suffering the bug. It's just now with the +4 mobs that it's starting to weaken us thus the proposed level shift for pets. When you think about it. If we had that level of control over the pets we could break the game. Even more so with Incarnate powers. This is why I doubt it'll ever really go away. I could be wrong, feel free to point out a dev statement that it's being looked at. I'd like to be able to play my bots/storm without the little buggers turning into scrappers. I just don't think it's a bug like everyone else. |
My guess is, as others have pointed out, they changed pet behavior with the introduction of /demons and messed them all up and haven't taken the time to fix it, it can be done it's not impossible, remember customizing out effects colour was "impossible" too.
I doubt this is WAI at all, the whole point of a MM is that we can control our pets, unlike, say a controller...
Indeed, this new 'must enter melee' bug came around with the release of Demon's. I do recall a post by a redname saying they had to tweak the code so Demons would work.
Thing is, before the change for Demons, MM's still suffered a similar bug. Only instead of charging into melee, this bug made melee pets stick at range. Been that way as long as I can recall. I had to create a specific bind for my Grave Knights so they would actually use swords instead of spamming gloom at point blank range...
The new bug fixed that problem for my Necro but in return broke my poor little robots. I'd rather have it the way it was before honestly.
I'm not saying I feel like we'd be overpowered, I'm saying I think that's the Dev's viewpoint because they've never acknowledged it's a bug. Though I can see their reasoning. I know my MM's are the most powerful toons I have in game atm and if I could lock my pets in a certain location and then go to town...
I'm seeing my MM running around like mad so Protean follows me constantly while my bots blast him from every corner of the room kinda being their reason for leaving it.
Demon's broke more than the Ai though. MM's had a list of issues for a bit after that. Though the drop dead when dismissed bug did prove useful for soul extraction purposes, it was still a bug. In fact, they fixed numerous MM issues after Demon's yet have never mentioned the Ai being wonky as a bug. That's where my theory comes from.
Maestro Mavius - Infinity
Capt. Biohazrd - PCSAR
Talsor Tech - Talsorian Guard
Keep Calm & Chive On!
My mercs still play pretty much the same before the arrival of demons.
I just say we should add two more attack commands. Attack at Melee and Attack at Range. Then everyone is happy.
I would be anyway...
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by DoctorWhat
I just say we should add two more attack commands. Attack at Melee and Attack at Range. Then everyone is happy.
I would be anyway... |
Not that simple.
Quote:
Actually it is. There is code that has your pets attack at range (we know this works cause our bots do it), There is code that has your pets attack at Melee range (and move to the target if they are too far), your talking about disabling PART of the code depending on a setting, it's doable, everything is doable, it's just a matter of someone else's timetable (ie the devs) as to if/when this gets fixed, and nothing else, when they say it's impossible what they are saying is that "we are not going to devote the time to fix it". |
Originally Posted by Bookkeeper_Jay
Not that simple.
|
Remember, colouring our powers was impossible too and they listed a ton of reasons why, then CO come out and boom it happens.
Oh, and before anyone asks, Fortran, COBOL, pascal, turbo pascal, Basic, Qbasic, Visual basic, VBA, C, C++, these are the languages I have programmed in for the last 20+ years so I have an idea of what I am talking about and I've heard enough bull from Dev's and their fanboi apologists to see it for what it is.
Quote:
IE: It CAN be done. It's just a question of how much time it takes to do it.
|
Originally Posted by Robert_B
Actually it is. There is code that has your pets attack at range (we know this works cause our bots do it), There is code that has your pets attack at Melee range (and move to the target if they are too far), your talking about disabling PART of the code depending on a setting, it's doable, everything is doable, it's just a matter of someone else's timetable (ie the devs) as to if/when this gets fixed, and nothing else, when they say it's impossible what they are saying is that "we are not going to devote the time to fix it".
Remember, colouring our powers was impossible too and they listed a ton of reasons why, then CO come out and boom it happens. Oh, and before anyone asks, Fortran, COBOL, pascal, turbo pascal, Basic, Qbasic, Visual basic, VBA, C, C++, these are the languages I have programmed in for the last 20+ years so I have an idea of what I am talking about and I've heard enough bull from Dev's and their fanboi apologists to see it for what it is. |
Quote:
Sure, but someone was lazy making the ai code, if it was done properly it wouldn't be the irritating player-infuriating problem it is now. Pet ai was always lazy rubbish in this game. Games that played on apple ii machines had better ai.|
Originally Posted by DoctorWhat
IE: It CAN be done. It's just a question of how much time it takes to do it.
|
They should do the right thing and just fix it once and for all. Its not like this game is going anywhere after all.
Quote:
How would you like to see it fixed?|
Originally Posted by Lewisite
Sure, but someone was lazy making the ai code, if it was done properly it wouldn't be the irritating player-infuriating problem it is now. Pet ai was always lazy rubbish in this game. Games that played on apple ii machines had better ai.
They should do the right thing and just fix it once and for all. Its not like this game is going anywhere after all. |
Personally, I would like to be able to right-click on a minion and a menu would pop up with all their powers and radio buttons for priority (ie. High, Low, Off) and have the "Pet goto/Pet stay" force the pets to stay rooted to that spot (or have a max range that the MM can move away before they follow) and assuming that the melee attacks are off then the pets would not have any reason to move (unless you do).
Just doing those two things would help a lot (I know I know, JUST)
I have a thread on here requesting a Ranged/All/Melee toggle per pet. This would remove certain powers from the pets attack chain. I have seen it suggested that the Devs want us this way, and I have to disagree. This is like having every 4th attack from a tank disperse your mob. Thats how much of a problem it causes. I also noticed that NONE of the Devs have MM characters. Maybe if one of them did, it might enlighten them.
Quote:
Yeah, thats exactly correct. Just let us decide what the pets do. Good examples of where this would be useful is when you want to disable attacks with knock backs so the brutes and tanks don't whine. Some people hate assault bot flamer. Etc. You've hit the nail on the head right there.|
Originally Posted by Robert_B
How would you like to see it fixed?
Personally, I would like to be able to right-click on a minion and a menu would pop up with all their powers and radio buttons for priority (ie. High, Low, Off) and have the "Pet goto/Pet stay" force the pets to stay rooted to that spot (or have a max range that the MM can move away before they follow) and assuming that the melee attacks are off then the pets would not have any reason to move (unless you do). Just doing those two things would help a lot (I know I know, JUST) |
The goto/stay root is just common sense.
Should have been like this from day one.
Quote:
LOL yes, let one of them watch their pets Leroy Jenkins the entire idf on a lambda. Or insist on brawling the Reichsman. That would probably help this problem a lot.
|
Originally Posted by Price_NA
I have a thread on here requesting a Ranged/All/Melee toggle per pet. This would remove certain powers from the pets attack chain. I have seen it suggested that the Devs want us this way, and I have to disagree. This is like having every 4th attack from a tank disperse your mob. Thats how much of a problem it causes. I also noticed that NONE of the Devs have MM characters. Maybe if one of them did, it might enlighten them.
|
Quote:
Except there isn't different code for those two actions. The code says "use these attacks as they recharge, if you're not in range, move into range." The only check is "are you in range?" There is no "Is this a ranged attack? Can I move back and still fire?" All they do is attack and move into range. There are not separate AI strings for ranged and melee attacks.|
Originally Posted by Robert_B
Actually it is. There is code that has your pets attack at range (we know this works cause our bots do it), There is code that has your pets attack at Melee range (and move to the target if they are too far)
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Robert_B
Remember, colouring our powers was impossible too and they listed a ton of reasons why, then CO come out and boom it happens.
|
Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
Everything Dark Armor | The Softcap
don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
Quote:
Umm, you add them my friend, you make it sound as if they can't add anything to the code, like it was written by a higher intelligence or a Super(I would say)Villan but they can do whatever they want to it, so, using good ole Pseudocode :|
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
Except there isn't different code for those two actions. The code says "use these attacks as they recharge, if you're not in range, move into range." The only check is "are you in range?" There is no "Is this a ranged attack? Can I move back and still fire?" All they do is attack and move into range. There are not separate AI strings for ranged and melee attacks.
|
Attack One Recharged
If UseThisPower = True
Call Check_Range
Use AttackOne
Else
SkipAttack
End
Attack Two Recharged
If UseThisPower = True
Call Check_Range
Use AttackTwo
Else
SkipAttack
End
ect. ect.
Check_Range would move them into range to use a power (like brawl) if necessary but is overridden by the Stay or Goto command, so if you put your pet too far away it does nothing, I'd rather have that then what we have now and if the user sets it to skip the attack it would skip the power, they can do this, they just don't feel it's necessary, it's not impossible, it's actually very doable with some effort on their part.
Whatever the code is they can change it to fix this behavior if they want to, it's just up to someone up the food chain to make it a priority, it has NOTHING to do with the tech, it's changeable. When I wrote Point-Of-Sale software, customers wanted some crazy stuff, but I had to make it happen.
But as long as people are sasitifed with complete crap about "how things can't be done" or "The code doesn't exist" they'll just keep stringing us along, and having a cheering section that believes this crap just makes it easier.
Quote:
A fact is that very few gamers are programmers. People tend to believe whatever they are told, especially about computers it seems. The internal workings of a piece of code are essentially mystery to most people.|
Originally Posted by Robert_B
Whatever the code is they can change it to fix this behavior if they want to, it's just up to someone up the food chain to make it a priority, it has NOTHING to do with the tech, it's changeable. When I wrote Point-Of-Sale software, customers wanted some crazy stuff, but I had to make it happen.
But as long as people are sasitifed with complete crap about "how things can't be done" or "The code doesn't exist" they'll just keep stringing us along, and having a cheering section that believes this crap just makes it easier. |
I'll always remember back in Quake 1, the old Reaper bot for that was pretty amazing. It "knew" how to navigate maps, and how to use each weapon and the optimal range for each of them. That was 97ish -- and thats just one example out of many. The AI in CoX is incredibly simple, and very bad. You didn't notice too much before masterminds came along and your interaction with the mobs was very limited...
Quote:
They should tweek the AI for MM's and give what we have now to controllers, it would make them happy atleast.
|
Originally Posted by Lewisite
The AI in CoX is incredibly simple, and very bad. You didn't notice too much before masterminds came along and your interaction with the mobs was very limited...
|
Is there a command which allows me to have my thug pets only attack at range? I have tried some of the standard commands but they always end up moving in. This is mainly for incarnate trials where they are squishier than in regular missions.