Incarnate system
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2011-03-31 04:43 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
A lot of people shun Nerve because accuracy/tohit is arguably the easiest thing to get (and a lot of people take Spiritual because recharge is the hardest) and you're very rarely bumping up against ED with it; there are lots of powers that buff ToHit and you can hit the softcap for most mobs pretty quickly. That said, you could always strip out some of your accuracy enhancements and replace them with EndReds to help with your Endurance issues.
Remember that whatever you pick, you're not stuck with it. If you want you can get all 8 Tier 4 Alpha enhancements, it just takes a lot of shards and a lot of notices to get there 
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I would highly recommend you consider their primary benefit only and take whatever secondary enhancements there are as extras. The +% applies only to a powers base effect and the extra defence or resistance is going to be very marginal.
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This is what I was wondering. Accuracy is important to my holds..or it is to me. The enhanced accuracy, buffing my shields more and making my holds stronger all appeal to me, and by dropping my accuracy upgrades and replaceing them with end redux and or reds or recharges seems viable to me, although I would prolly omit the reds ad focus on recahrge/end redux in my shields and my attacks and holds to gain the benefit.|
Originally Posted by The_Spad_EU
A lot of people shun Nerve because accuracy/tohit is arguably the easiest thing to get (and a lot of people take Spiritual because recharge is the hardest) and you're very rarely bumping up against ED with it; there are lots of powers that buff ToHit and you can hit the softcap for most mobs pretty quickly. That said, you could always strip out some of your accuracy enhancements and replace them with EndReds to help with your Endurance issues.
Remember that whatever you pick, you're not stuck with it. If you want you can get all 8 Tier 4 Alpha enhancements, it just takes a lot of shards and a lot of notices to get there |
Nerve would allow my bubbles to still remain effective. Spiritual was my next thought after going through the list of things.
But since the toon is defense oriented, nerver just stood out. Even with maneuvers, which seems to drain me of end a lot. I could focus more end redux, and the defense bonus would stll apply making it viable and less taxing.
I dunno. I just find the whole thing confusing, but I will tell you this. Many of my powers have Accuracy enhancers which I need to help them land, sacrificing perhaps something that could be of more value.
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That was my concern. I was concerned that my shields, which are already pretty darn good, might gain a boost, but not enough to warrent taking nerve. But the accuracy and the Hold power might. Thats where I sort of see it stand out.|
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
I would highly recommend you consider their primary benefit only and take whatever secondary enhancements there are as extras. The +% applies only to a powers base effect and the extra defence or resistance is going to be very marginal.
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Ill have to look at all the benefits again. I know or feel that damage is not my main goal. Nor do I think it needs to be. Grav has some damage, but I have not taken any damaging effects in FF at all. Just pure defense.
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Not necessarily.|
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
I would highly recommend you consider their primary benefit only and take whatever secondary enhancements there are as extras. The +% applies only to a powers base effect and the extra defence or resistance is going to be very marginal.
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My Super Reflexes scrapper specifically took Nerve to boost defenses. Since the closer you are to the cap, the more the lower % point is worth, even marginal gains were great.
The nice thing about the Incarnate powers, you're not locked in. You can always build up a secondary build, and see what works best for the situation.
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If you dont plan on getting IOs then nerve (partial core revamp is what i would get) would be a good choice.
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The value of Nerve depends a lot on your build and slotting. Ideally you want to be able to get a 95% to hit chance against level 54s with your own resources and for some builds Nerve is extremely useful (you can go for a lower to hit chance and hope you're on a team with people who have Tactics but I don't like relying on that sort of thing).
Assuming that you have a level shift then your base to hit value against level 54s is 48%. With no to hit bonuses that means you need +98% accuracy enhancement/bonus to max your to hit chance (as a controller you actually need more in Crushing Field and Gravity Distortion Field since they have a lower inherent accuracy). Now most SO builds only put 1 or maybe 2 accuracy SOs in their attacks so Nerve is definitely useful for them.
However, if you have Tactics and it's slotted up that gives you a +15% to hit bonus (for a Controller). At that point you only need +51% accuracy so the value of a Nerve enhancement drops significantly. You could potentially unslot all accuracy enhancements (except for CF and GDF as mentioned above) and rely on the Nerve to provide most of your accuracy but in general I think at that point you'll find the other abilities more useful.
Of course the Nerve enhancement is even less useful on an IO'd build since they tend to pick up a bunch of accuracy bonuses incidentally.
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Based on what you've said, I would highly recommend Cardiac, the endurance reduction alpha. I'm not sure what you mean by, "it does not benefit my powers as much as others". Every power you use consumes endurance, be they click or toggle, and they all benefit from Cardiac.|
Originally Posted by Nyx
I have no idea which incarnate aplha I should go for.
Endurance gets eaten quick when I run my toggles. Which are Maneuvers, Dispursion Bubble and Flame Armor. But I am not sure that warrents me taking the regen alpha, considdering it does not benefit my powers as much as others. |
None of the toggles you listed above are optional, they're all important to the survival of you and your team. Being able to use them and all the rest of your powers without endurance problems will almost certainly prove more beneficial than any of the other alpha options. If you haven't yet experienced life without endurance issues, you may be surprised how much you've been holding back. At least that's been my experience.
Also, once your end problems are dealt with, you might be able to move slots around to help other roles.
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On my dom, I have the nerve, spiritual, and cardiac. By far, cardiac is the most noticeable. I went form depending on domination for a full blue bar to never dropping below half on endurance use. I don't have many toggles and I did not slot my attacks for end reduxm, so I expected the dependence on Domination. I didn't think cardiac wouild do as much as it did, though. And the Nerve is useful as everyone else with alphas now fight at higher levels because of their "50 (+1)" status. Nerve is very useful if you are playing the mostly support rolls. The few times you may want to attack, you don't want them to be misses. If you are semi-fine now, I would not substitute with the alpha, I would enhance and be able to trade alphas in and out. If a team is high, switch to your nerve. If the are taxing your controls, switch to cardiac to save endurance. Shuffling is ok, but relying on the alpha is going to limit you on a versitile system.
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Originally Posted by Nyx
Ok. Yay! I have two 50's now that have done the work to get their incarnate slot.
Only one I am focusing on at the moment is my Grav/FF/Fire. I have no idea which incarnate aplha I should go for. Endurance gets eaten quick when I run my toggles. Which are Maneuvers, Dispursion Bubble and Flame Armor. But I am not sure that warrents me taking the regen alpha, considdering it does not benefit my powers as much as others. My first instinc is Nerve. More FF defense, and Holding power as a buff. Damage is fine the way it is. Im not hired for my damage potential really although I do offer fine damage, just not as much as others. But Im a controller. We know that will always be the case. Im just very new. And I don't want to make a poor decision, especially when my altitis has been cured by my controller. So I really want to focus on her a lot. So, perhaps I could get a few suggestion. Even though I have read that excellent incarnate guide, I find myself really confused by the whole thing. |
If you have end issues, Cardiac is the best option. Once I get to IOs my primary obstacles are A) making sure I have enough endurance to do the things I want to do, B) everything else. It won't matter how good your buffs/debuffs are, how much damage you do, how often your powers recharge, or if you can hit the enemies consistently if you don't have the endurance to do any of those things.
Plus, Cardiac gives +range which is great. It will also increase the RES in your Fire Shield (and Tough if you have it).
I have Cardiac on my Plant/Earth/Fire Dom. It allows her to spam rains and patches like nobody's business, and run a leadership toggle with nothing but a global slotted in it. It also makes her cones more potent and allows her to stand farther away from the action when necessary.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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I did decide to go Cardiac. Mainly because running Manuevers, Dispursion bubble, and Fire Armor were really taxing me out. Now I can safely toggle and be happy. I specced out of tuff and Weave only because I am FF and well my defenses are pretty solid on it's own.
However Cardiac allows me to spam more attacks and such, which I find really helpfull considdering my controls are solid, it allows me to focus on my offense more, not just relying on my defense. Which I am enjoying. I feel better than a Dom now!
Speaking from my own perspective ahead of any other factors, I would pick Cardiac, followed by Spiritual in second place. I hate having to stop and wait for my blue bar to fill up again while the team keeps moving.
Too many alts to list.
Ok. Yay! I have two 50's now that have done the work to get their incarnate slot.
Only one I am focusing on at the moment is my Grav/FF/Fire.
I have no idea which incarnate aplha I should go for.
Endurance gets eaten quick when I run my toggles. Which are Maneuvers, Dispursion Bubble and Flame Armor. But I am not sure that warrents me taking the regen alpha, considdering it does not benefit my powers as much as others.
My first instinc is Nerve. More FF defense, and Holding power as a buff.
Damage is fine the way it is. Im not hired for my damage potential really although I do offer fine damage, just not as much as others. But Im a controller. We know that will always be the case.
Im just very new. And I don't want to make a poor decision, especially when my altitis has been cured by my controller. So I really want to focus on her a lot.
So, perhaps I could get a few suggestion. Even though I have read that excellent incarnate guide, I find myself really confused by the whole thing.