Quote:
Shorter than Sonic Attack's Shout (single target, same range, same damage, longer activation than Exe by 0.10s), and I don't hear anyone complaining about that...
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Originally Posted by _Elektro_
This is for two reasons: 1) it is a ridiculously long animation.
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Quote:
People do complain about it some, but I haven't found Sonic to be very popular for Blasters (at least on the boards), even with its -res. And that -res makes up for the longer duration a bit.|
Originally Posted by JD_Gumby
Shorter than Sonic Attack's Shout (single target, same range, same damage, longer activation than Exe by 0.10s), and I don't hear anyone complaining about that...
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I usually include Shout in any analysis of the heavy blasts, mostly to note Executioner's Shot isn't that far off from where others sit: it's not like it's on its own in duration by a second or more.
Elektro, a chain is a chain, so you try to cycle through it for the best DPS performance. Your post kind of points out why I dislike chains, though, as the game (especially on teams or for Blasters soloing), things are fluid enough that it isn't worth cycling through the same attacks in the same order. But I'm not a numbers guy, so that's part of why I think like that.
At any rate, I would think of Piercing Rounds more as an opener than anything else... it's easier to line up two targets that way (though you can do it mid-fight... I've gotten fairly good at pulling back suddenly when two foes are running at me and tagging them both with it). Your other attacks are more of the meat and potatoes that will get you through after using it.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
Quote:
For ranged single target, you probably are going to go with Pistols -> Dual Wield -> Pistols -> (Executioner's or Piercing), and drop one of the Pistols if you have insane recharge. Pretty much like other Blasters except you can swap in Piercing every other time for -resist. If you also use melee, it will depend on how long you want to risk being in melee range and how much redraw you can stand... I'd consider replacing Executioner's with your best melee attack (or two) and using pistol attacks for the rest of the chain so there's only one redraw.|
Originally Posted by JD_Gumby
No good at making chains, but I'm betting that it's basically whatever you want - except for Empty Clips ('cos of its low damage compared to its 2.5s activation time; but it still has its uses since it's AoE).
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For AoE, just fire off all your AoEs, including Empty Clips. DPA on AoE attacks is irrelevant unless you have a nonstop AoE chain (which you likely won't)... hitting several targets more than makes up for long animations as far as total damage goes.
Cascade, level 50 Blaster (NRG/NRG since before it was cool)
Mechmeister, level 50 Bots / Traps MM
FAR too many non-50 alts to name
[u]Arcs[u]
The Scavenger Hunt: 187076
The Instant Lair Delivery Service: 206636
Quote:
I guess what I'm saying is... with DP, I don't believe in a strict chain. A lot of scrappers think this way because you want power 1-2-3 cycling constantly. |
Originally Posted by Grey Pilgrim
Elektro, a chain is a chain, so you try to cycle through it for the best DPS performance. Your post kind of points out why I dislike chains, though, as the game (especially on teams or for Blasters soloing), things are fluid enough that it isn't worth cycling through the same attacks in the same order. But I'm not a numbers guy, so that's part of why I think like that.
At any rate, I would think of Piercing Rounds more as an opener than anything else... it's easier to line up two targets that way (though you can do it mid-fight... I've gotten fairly good at pulling back suddenly when two foes are running at me and tagging them both with it). Your other attacks are more of the meat and potatoes that will get you through after using it. |
With DP it is VERY situational. Example:
One LT. with some nasty holds/sleeps/state effects/etc. I will start with Suppressive Fire. He's probably locked down for the fight. I'm finding with my Musculature Alpha slotted, I can probably get away with something like this: Suppressive-Piercing-Pistols-Executioner.
In nearly every situation I'm finding a well calculated combo works period. But it comes from experience, and knowing your opponent. Also the 'chain' is different teaming/solo. For scrappers this often doesn't matter.
Most often, I like to know when a target is low enough in resist, and/or health to finish with Piercing-Executioner. But usually we're talking a boss or Lt.
To be honest if I were to ditch one attack from my primary, it would be Executioner. But I won't... I keep things for theme as well as effectiveness which can be quite a juggling act sometimes, but I still love the powerset.
Nekron: Beam Rifle / Poison Corruptor and Slayer of Evil!! (Exalted)
Intergalaktic: Fire / Time Corruptor (Exalted)
Fearsome Stare -> Tar Patch -> Empty Clips (with -RES proc) -> Bullet Rain -> run in and hit HOB -> Profit!
Wait, wrong forum ....
Hmmm very nice... but I have the advantage of...
Hold on while I thin of something!
Nekron: Beam Rifle / Poison Corruptor and Slayer of Evil!! (Exalted)
Intergalaktic: Fire / Time Corruptor (Exalted)
Quote:
Doing more damage without debuffs than the Dark/DP Defender does with Tar Patch? |
Originally Posted by _Elektro_
Hmmm very nice... but I have the advantage of...
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Cascade, level 50 Blaster (NRG/NRG since before it was cool)
Mechmeister, level 50 Bots / Traps MM
FAR too many non-50 alts to name
[u]Arcs[u]
The Scavenger Hunt: 187076
The Instant Lair Delivery Service: 206636
Quote:
Corrupter lol.
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Originally Posted by StrykerX
Doing more damage without debuffs than the Dark/DP Defender does with Tar Patch?
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Quote:
Ah, then the Blaster only does more damage most of the time. |
Originally Posted by Granite Agent
Corrupter lol.
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Cascade, level 50 Blaster (NRG/NRG since before it was cool)
Mechmeister, level 50 Bots / Traps MM
FAR too many non-50 alts to name
[u]Arcs[u]
The Scavenger Hunt: 187076
The Instant Lair Delivery Service: 206636
I actually had a dual pistols, that was just under psi blasters for dmg. If you have money, you can make dual pistols into a destroyer of worlds. I havent read all posts here but i can assure you that its not difficult, provided you have the right IOs to make dual pistols viable in pvp, or pve. I understand most people slot their builds cheaply because pvp IOs and purples are so inflated in prices. But if you want your toon to compete at its absolute best, sometimes they are necessary. I'd be more than willing to email you a pvp and a pve build for dual pistols. mind you mine was /em so i would've had more dmg from the start thanks to build up...but i could easily bridge the gap
Well build wise I think I'm ok. I have thoroughly enjoyed the toon.
I fizzling a little bit in the post 50 game. I need to get on a strike force and get the rare alpha's rolling.
So far I have 2 builds I'm juggling. One is based on fighting, and is really survivable. One is based on aid self and can really hang in there too. But... I am on the fence right now. I am 2 seconds away from perma hasten, so my AOE cycle is really good.
I'm almost convinced to stick out the damage alpha.
Nekron: Beam Rifle / Poison Corruptor and Slayer of Evil!! (Exalted)
Intergalaktic: Fire / Time Corruptor (Exalted)
If i can make one suggestion for you dp blaster you should put the devastation chance for hold in you single target attacks. I have this in my dp/em and my dp/fire blasters and it works wonders, especially if a troller or domi is having issues with holding or if another dp has suppressive fire. Also, this can be stacked with the mastery holds. Me and my pals who have DP toons all use this and we can hold AV's. Oh, also call to justice and teleport work well too. Pop call and build up and tp into a mob then nuke and everything dies, well almost everything. Well, its just a thought good luck on your DP blaster.
Semi-threadjack:
Since we are talking about Dual Pistols, I wonder if you folks could take a look at a build I've made and give me your thoughts on it. Comments and suggestions much appreciated! Thanks in advance. 
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.91
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Infinite Ammo: Level 50 Technology Blaster
Primary Power Set: Dual Pistols
Secondary Power Set: Energy Manipulation
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery
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Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
Remember kids, crack is whack!
Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
I will be using the Spiritual Alpha boost with that build.
Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
Remember kids, crack is whack!
Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
Quote:
I'd slot two Adjusted Targeting in Build Up (rech and to-hit/rech). I'd swap the Piercing Rounds and Bullet Rain slotting (I'd rather have the Ragnarok's in the power that hits 16 targets instead of 3).|
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards
Since we are talking about Dual Pistols, I wonder if you folks could take a look at a build I've made and give me your thoughts on it. Comments and suggestions much appreciated! Thanks in advance.
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I'd consider 2 slotting Hasten. I'd weigh the Enzymes (and the soft cap) vs. the extra regen and hps you could get if you went with LotGs, but I team mostly, so odds are high I'd be capped even though I was "only" getting to ~44% solo.
Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
Quote:
Don't worry about thread jacking... that's why I made this thread... jack away. |
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards
I will be using the Spiritual Alpha boost with that build.
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I really like the build. I realized early on I would have to make a decision to either go the Scorpions' armour route, or go the opposite direction.
So we've gone opposite directions. I really think you can go one of three ways. But without muddying the waters, if I go my non-heal build then I get 47% S/L restists, and 27% S/L defense.
My build is 2 seconds away from perma hasten, and I did not go Spiritual. I can get HoB up nearly every mob. What point am I trying to make?
Well you are going the spiritual route, and have a lot of recharge built into your build on top of it. (I have only one set of purples).
So I think what you'll find is you can use a lot of those slots for other things. My opener is usually I super speed in, fire of HoB, and slowly back out, firing off any number of variations. For me, the closer you can get Build Up and HoB to fire off, the better.
When you do this, you get a 10% boost in defense. So this is why I steered away from the cap and went heavier resist + heal.
I think what you're doing is fine, but probably less friendly to soloing. Right now I would say my play time is split right in half between solo and group. I typically solo at +1 x2 or x3.
I think your build is going to do really well in a team. So if I were going your direction... I would probably strip back on some of the +recharge.
I personally would not slot up Build Up for anymore defense. One recharge is fine, you already have it firing up sooner than HoB.
The same 'might' be said for Hasten. I don't know the numbers on that one, but my Hasten is 3 slotted WITHOUT taking Spirtual and like I said, it's 2 seconds from perma, which is nothing... with Spiritual, you might find you have some extra slots on your hand. This gives you extra room for at least one more slot in Suppressive Fire for Basilisk's. (the 5% status resist) I wouldn't tweak too much though. But if you find yourself wanting to pump up an area, I think it's safe to steal from +recharge.
I really like the build though. If you have the Glad+3 that's awesome. (I pretty much wrote that off.
)My global recharge is 168.8 to your 147? So I think once you reach incarnate you will probably have recharge slots open up a bit.
Great build though. Like the toon too. I have two costumes that turned out a bit similar, One is very 'Neo-like' and the second is more 'techy' looking (my avatar).
Have fun with it!
Nekron: Beam Rifle / Poison Corruptor and Slayer of Evil!! (Exalted)
Intergalaktic: Fire / Time Corruptor (Exalted)
Quote:
not true. I know players that go w/o swap ammo and do very well on the harder missions. especially the Apext F.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
It goes without saying that you will use incendiary ammo 100% of the time.
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Bull. I've done well enough against EBs and AVs and some really good players in PvP with my DP/Traps. And many of my kills in Arena and the PvP zones were archers. I just shoot the bowstring :P
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Silverado
Dual Pistols is a mediocre set, but only when compared to other powersets.
You can make a Pistolero who can hold his own just fine against critters, but it's always gonna pale in comparison to say, an archer. |
Quote:
Well, PvP means nothing because powers don't work the same way there. They actually base damage off animation time, so Dual Pistols will be a very hard hitting set in PvP against targets without a lot of Lethal resists. Also, I don't remember Blasters getting Traps so I suspect you were on a Corruptor... compare a DP Blaster with an Archery Blaster and you'll see the archer is pretty much superior at everything except looking cool. |
Originally Posted by NYCPulpWriter
Bull. I've done well enough against EBs and AVs and some really good players in PvP with my DP/Traps. And many of my kills in Arena and the PvP zones were archers. I just shoot the bowstring :P
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Not to say Dual Pistols sucks, but Archery is one of the better sets and DP is just middle of the road. The only way for DP to hope to match Archery is with such extreme recharge that you can use BU + Hail of Bullets every spawn, and very few people will have that.
Cascade, level 50 Blaster (NRG/NRG since before it was cool)
Mechmeister, level 50 Bots / Traps MM
FAR too many non-50 alts to name
[u]Arcs[u]
The Scavenger Hunt: 187076
The Instant Lair Delivery Service: 206636
Thanks for taking a look at my build! The reason why I have Hasten 3 slotted (at the ED wall, so to speak) is because when I finally get the Very Rare Spiritual boost the Recharge Enhancement value of Hasten will be 130%, or essentially 30% extra Global Recharge for any powers I have at the ED wall.
Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
Remember kids, crack is whack!
Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
Quote:
Right, but if you only two slot Hasten, you only lose ~7% recharge reduction in Hasten. I think Hasten with 3 slots and the very rare is 131% and with 2 slots and the very rare it is 124%? At the levels of recharge in your build that is ~1 second faster on Hasten's recharge. To me, that one slot is not worth a mere 1 second improvement. I'd rather use it elsewhere.|
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards
Thanks for taking a look at my build! The reason why I have Hasten 3 slotted (at the ED wall, so to speak) is because when I finally get the Very Rare Spiritual boost the Recharge Enhancement value of Hasten will be 130%, or essentially 30% extra Global Recharge for any powers I have at the ED wall.
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You should not be weighing 30% extra recharge vs. 0%. But rather 31% vs. 24%. Is the 7% worth it? If you think it is, go for it.
Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
agreed. It's a personal decision, but I agree, and I understood what Assbackwards was going for.. but a second or two for a slot? Like I said, I'm 2 seconds away from perma hasten without using Spiritual Alpha so I just think it's a large investment for little return.
Some people really do prefer to overload an angle on their build as much as possible. I understand that though... like I said it's personal.
I am finding as time goes on.. now that I've done Statesman TF twice, I'm just finding that I really like my heal.
I was considering going the *** backwards route, with lots more def, but even playing +3 missions... one small purple + HoB gets me to soft cap, or there abouts.... Yet, we still get hit. It's always going to be a threat. And the conclusion I'm coming to is the Aid Self with just one interrupt (I have 5 Doctored Wounds for recharge) is indespensible.
I keep trying to convince myself to get rid of it, but a 400 ish hit point heal that is quick enough to heal between dots is really hard to drop. I've been on great teams where I"m monitoring my defense and it's way over cap.... I still get hit, and hit hard. I do have 40% smashing Lethal resist, so maybe that's why the heal works?
I don't know but I would keep it in mind and try it out.. pistols just seems to have us at arms reach a lot of the time. I am currently remaking my build to re-include Aid Self.
Nekron: Beam Rifle / Poison Corruptor and Slayer of Evil!! (Exalted)
Intergalaktic: Fire / Time Corruptor (Exalted)
I have a DP/Devices and DP/MM blaster and have no problems. DP is a little different, kind of like brawling with ranged attacks, but that's what everyone wanted was a Dual Pistol Scrapper. That's exactly what they got, as a Blaster of course.
Quixotik
"I did not say this. I am not here." -Guild Navigator
HNNNNGGGGGG.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.92
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Infinite Ammo: Level 50 Technology Blaster
Primary Power Set: Dual Pistols
Secondary Power Set: Energy Manipulation
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Leadership
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery
Code:With the Spiritual Core Paragon in her build, Infinite Ammo can just use Executioner's Shot ad nauseum. From what I see of the numbers, it's the best possible single target attack chain she could use.| Copy & Paste this data into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build | |-------------------------------------------------------------------| |MxDz;1489;723;1446;HEX;| |78DA65935B4F134114C767BB45A4B440417AA5A517EED0858288D718158C10480A1| |8DF4CB3C2DA6E527637BD24F266E237D0449FBC7E0535FA45BCC4F815BCBCFB50CF| |9EFF1436E926ED6FE6CC39FF39E7CCCCCEA3F5A0108FAF0B2574ABA6371AE59BF4D| |F34EA81BBC641D5B26B76E538B4693D342DB369646E1C1DD9BD4288A4742AEFE956| |C538D4D65B7AAD5C321B4DBBD6C877D6F65B8E63D79BDA8665D42BC7E51DDD329D5| |64D6F9AB615DEB4AA46DDB09A5A67102CD9764DDB3674C7B42A219EDC362BD526CD| |023CDB770CE370B0E37568D41B55D3896F38E681D6D970473F30E8CF1D1FC728CB0| |2FDE243427EED1EF1925014675E01AF1967DF006F1981778C237112A58A12212702| |BB8CE01E23B3CF4890BA22D515A80F407D00EA43501F82FA30D49314A5CA28F53D5| |63E30CE7D043E31229F19C5273E176314D5C39BB5DB291AF74A855E2844A0108342| |0C0A092824A060D3A40F514ADF3CAF04810889F5435BF48F2AAE294AA690740EFD4| |0063F1916D906657306D19C349A934673D268CE382519964986D19C2C9A934573B2| |684E1ECDC9A3390AED3B8228DFC81D424A6436812D864A0EA3C8B567344D8369319| |D03F28C425471FD0AAB5C47715975E1A7A828A27CD135825F15139253A8384DF9C6| |655DF12F3E5763F62BF08DB1F89D9121BFA4AC2BB98CCEAC3026561953178035C6E| |C454E204709A4640229747D1A5804B2243B2E65C72F71E8DC65E00A7095B1700D68| |7194C3AD46D2391C461E873181C358C4618469FB496CAF4CCABA8BA8FB1F6D3C233| |39B914B0B9205B80C53F43C7611F359DC513269D2A4C12B46A625798B96E035E63F| |79484224D8B4ED3515D854F29F3C23A1C86EB85EF2B647DC9B8FE576CCF30AA21E7| |B29E05686F17DCF58F78C1F78C67DA76FB0FD8BEC8ACC5B4146BFBDA61936FD3935| |29CA16DF34DF3DAEFBEFE98AAA3CE5D3F13D63F89F032F184BDECADBF489B92E4BB| |1CB72BECBB2D265D9A517539495FD0708DDEEE6| |-------------------------------------------------------------------|
Hail of Bullets every 31.84s!
Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
Remember kids, crack is whack!
Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
The problem with that chain is anything following executioner's shot IMO is a bad idea. Executioner's shot is the finisher of any combo in my playing experience.
This is for two reasons: 1) it is a ridiculously long animation. So calling anything part of a combo that follows it is almost an oxymoron. It just takes too bloody long. And 2) it is such a short ranged shot that if it isn't the finishing shot, you had best follow up with something that gets you some space, fast. Power Thrust is AMAZING for this. I have knocked back +4 bosses on a regular basis with it. It's just great for this reason alone.
I think the attack chain question is something that is really dependent on knowing your opponent with Dual Pistols. That's just my take on it.
Nekron: Beam Rifle / Poison Corruptor and Slayer of Evil!! (Exalted)
Intergalaktic: Fire / Time Corruptor (Exalted)