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You're reading the words and missing the meaning. I will rephrase:|
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Because most people actually enjoy playing the game as it was intended. I know it sounds hard to believe, but given the choice, the majority of players are willing to pass up the chance to run endless monotonous AE farms and instead run the 6 year old story arcs they fell in love with when they first bought the game.
Who'd a guessed that people play this game for the content and not the phat lewt they could get by farming.  |
My question there is if 200 tickets = 1 merit is so horrible why is AE farming not considered the absolute best farming method now?
Better?
After reading the followup post:
Just wait until after Halloween, then people will be doing stuff that isn't trick-or-treating again. Problem solved.
My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
I still think this is a good idea for all sorts of occasions when you can't find a team but need merits.
lets put it this way, trials can be 1 player and can yield 1-8 merits, a single run of one AE mission disallows you to earn more than a certain number of tickets for the map (usually 1500 to 2000 tickets/200=7-10 merits) that's it, then you have to do another run. mind you that takes about 3 hours to solo on most tanks.
secondly, math; lets talk raw numbers, so you can use reward merits to buy a recipe worth 100 million inf, maybe even 200-300 million inf on a good day. thats costs 160-300 merits, thats alot of merits.. at the rate above, that would take a good tank (160 merits/10 per run x3 hours a run= 48 hours for 160 merits)
so at the rates of buying AE tickets above, 200 tickets per merit really isn't that appalling.
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you honestly do not know what you are talking about. if it is taking you 3 hours to run 1 mission with a tank, then you are doing it wrong. and giving out 10 merits for 1 mission is a very bad idea. plain and simple. this idea is something that is not needed.
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Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
I still think this is a good idea for all sorts of occasions when you can't find a team but need merits.
lets put it this way, trials can be 1 player and can yield 1-8 merits, a single run of one AE mission disallows you to earn more than a certain number of tickets for the map (usually 1500 to 2000 tickets/200=7-10 merits) that's it, then you have to do another run. mind you that takes about 3 hours to solo on most tanks. secondly, math; lets talk raw numbers, so you can use reward merits to buy a recipe worth 100 million inf, maybe even 200-300 million inf on a good day. thats costs 160-300 merits, thats alot of merits.. at the rate above, that would take a good tank (160 merits/10 per run x3 hours a run= 48 hours for 160 merits) so at the rates of buying AE tickets above, 200 tickets per merit really isn't that appalling. |
Simply no thank you. keep merits to tfs/sf's
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some missions are different sizes, and each map yields a different number of tickets, smaller maps take less time but yields alot less tickets, a good farm map takes about 2-3 hours to completely clear it and yields about 1500 tickets max.| you honestly do not know what you are talking about. if it is taking you 3 hours to run 1 mission with a tank, then you are doing it wrong. and giving out 10 merits for 1 mission is a very bad idea. plain and simple. this idea is something that is not needed. |
giving out 10 merits for one mission? it's not a bad Idea when that mission takes as long as a TF to solo.
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again, you have no idea what you are talking about. i can run a small map farm in 10 mins and get 1500 tickets. so, 7 merits in 10 mins is not in line with merit rewards at all. and again, if it is taking you 3 hours to clear a map with a tank, you are doing it with the wrong tank/build and map. also, do not try to compare what other AT's can do with a tank. your thread is fail. i will say again, this idea is not needed or wanted. please drop it.
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Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
some missions are different sizes, and each map yields a different number of tickets, smaller maps take less time but yields alot less tickets, a good farm map takes about 2-3 hours to completely clear it and yields about 1500 tickets max.
giving out 10 merits for one mission? it's not a bad Idea when that mission takes as long as a TF to solo. |
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I remember seeing a guy solo some crazy farms in 15 minutes or less. He was able to power level his lowbees to 50 in the same time that you had quoted (or less). I shudder to think how many tickets he was raking in, and if he was able to convert them to merits it would be lolmerits.
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Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
some missions are different sizes, and each map yields a different number of tickets, smaller maps take less time but yields alot less tickets, a good farm map takes about 2-3 hours to completely clear it and yields about 1500 tickets max.
giving out 10 merits for one mission? it's not a bad Idea when that mission takes as long as a TF to solo. |
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But realistically would that be any worse than the lolraresalvage or lolrandomreciperolls he was already getting? I agree that the time per merit would be out of whack with the TF/Story Arc rewards but the time-to-reward would be consistent with the time-to-reward already available with tickets.
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Originally Posted by PumBumbler
I remember seeing a guy solo some crazy farms in 15 minutes or less. He was able to power level his lowbees to 50 in the same time that you had quoted (or less). I shudder to think how many tickets he was raking in, and if he was able to convert them to merits it would be lolmerits.
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No. It would not be in line. At all. Leave the merits out of AE. They do not belong there at all.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
But realistically would that be any worse than the lolraresalvage or lolrandomreciperolls he was already getting? I agree that the time per merit would be out of whack with the TF/Story Arc rewards but the time-to-reward would be consistent with the time-to-reward already available with tickets.
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I would guess that this is exactly the reason why tickets were implemented in the first place. Using tickets allows them to firewall developer content from user content such that the reward merits etc won't get skewed by the ticket system. Bridging them directly would remove the firewall, which would take away any reason for the tickets raison d'etre.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
But realistically would that be any worse than the lolraresalvage or lolrandomreciperolls he was already getting? I agree that the time per merit would be out of whack with the TF/Story Arc rewards but the time-to-reward would be consistent with the time-to-reward already available with tickets.
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That is a fair point. But in that case I really think they need to look at re-balancing the ticket reward costs (or drop rates). You mentioned above taking 15 minutes to clear a farm map, 1500 tickets in 15 minutes means 100 tickets/minute.|
Originally Posted by PumBumbler
I would guess that this is exactly the reason why tickets were implemented in the first place. Using tickets allows them to firewall developer content from user content such that the reward merits etc won't get skewed by the ticket system. Bridging them directly would remove the firewall, which would take away any reason for the tickets raison d'etre.
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As I mentioned in a previous post 200 tickets has about the same buying power as 1 merit under the current market conditions (comparing either random recipe rolls or a direct buy LotG versus direct buy rare salvage) so under that analysis farming tickets is already providing a time-to-reward ratio in excess of the one intended for merits.
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you are the only one who is assuming that 200 tickets = 1 merit. i went back through the thread and checked. and i really do not see why you are trying to compare merits to tickets anyways, they are completely different. there is no reason for this to be allowed. and i do not see a fair exchange rate on them either.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
That is a fair point. But in that case I really think they need to look at re-balancing the ticket reward costs (or drop rates). You mentioned above taking 15 minutes to clear a farm map, 1500 tickets in 15 minutes means 100 tickets/minute.
As I mentioned in a previous post 200 tickets has about the same buying power as 1 merit under the current market conditions (comparing either random recipe rolls or a direct buy LotG versus direct buy rare salvage) so under that analysis farming tickets is already providing a time-to-reward ratio in excess of the one intended for merits. |
I don't know why some people are so apposed to this, if the rates are unfair come up with better rates, if you don't then your comments are only flaming this thread without reason.
further more the dev's have nerfed AE and many power sets, you just can't farm a AE map the same way anymore, it's harder and takes longer.
now then what this really comes down to is, one group of people wants this and another doesn't, so realistically the Dev's could put ti in, and those who want to use it can use it, and those that don't can avoid it.
also I just ran a flash back in ouro that yielded 33 merits and took me a little over an hour. lets put it this way there is no real speed per merit calculation that can be done. you just have to fire it somewhere down the middle.
honestly 540 tickets is the price of other rare salvage, maybe that should be the price of 1 reward merit, though I personally think thats a bit high for one merit.
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Here's the analysis I was referring to:|
Originally Posted by Sharker_Quint
you are the only one who is assuming that 200 tickets = 1 merit. i went back through the thread and checked. and i really do not see why you are trying to compare merits to tickets anyways, they are completely different. there is no reason for this to be allowed. and i do not see a fair exchange rate on them either.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
The general consensus I've seen from people in the market forum is that Gold rolls are already to expensive. Most people who farm tickets spend them on silver or bronze rolls instead (and my own experience supports this strategy). Similarly with merits it's generally considered that random rolls are, over time, more profitable than direct buys. By setting the price in the 200-300 range it means that the conversion is only beneficial to people who are planning direct buys (since with rolls you could spend fewer tickets directly) or using them to buy A-Merits (which are time limited anyway).
The time aspect is not a convincing argument to me. Let's say you farm up the 48,000 tickets necessary to direct buy a LotG 7.5% (using 200 tickets = 1 merit). With that amount you could already buy 88.9 pieces of rare salvage, 685.7 bronze rolls (level 30-34 or 35-39) or 13.7 gold rolls (level 30-34). Even taking the rare salvage option (a reliable but low profit item) and selling them for 1.6million each (in the middle of their standard 1-2million price range) you would get 140.8 million which is about what you'd get for the LotG 7.5%. If you converted the 48,000 tickets to merits and did direct rolls there you'd only get 12 rolls so that's clearly a loss as well. |
EDIT: If someone wants to provide a case demonstrating that current buying power of 200 tickets is significantly less than that of 1 merit please do so. I'm willing to concede PB's argument about cushioning and I think there is also a hoarding argument (i.e. leveling a character in the AE, and using the merit conversion to horde "random roll potential" for level 50 but I've yet to see an argument that the value of 200 tickets is significantly less than 1 merit other than the fact that it is easier to get 200 tickets than 1 merit.
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read my last post, 33 merits is easy going with the right flashback mission.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Here's the analysis I was referring to:
If you consider what you can buy with tickets versus what you can buy with merits (either using identical random rolls or the market value of popular direct buys) the conversion ratio of 200:1 is pretty solid. EDIT: If someone wants to provide a case demonstrating that current buying power of 200 tickets is significantly less than that of 1 merit please do so. I'm willing to concede PB's argument about cushioning and I think there is also a hoarding argument (i.e. leveling a character in the AE, and using the merit conversion to horde "random roll potential" for level 50 but I've yet to see an argument that the value of 200 tickets is significantly less than 1 merit other than the fact that it is easier to get 200 tickets than 1 merit. |
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why are we opposed to it? because there is no need for it. and the devs do not want everyone spending all their time in the AE. and again, it is not harder nor does it take longer to farm a map in AE. and i can only see 2 of you in this thread that want this, and a bunch of us that do not. and yes there is a merit/min calculation. it is 1 merit per 6 min. that is what an average player can earn. that is through extensive data mining. |
Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
I don't know why some people are so apposed to this, if the rates are unfair come up with better rates, if you don't then your comments are only flaming this thread without reason.
further more the dev's have nerfed AE and many power sets, you just can't farm a AE map the same way anymore, it's harder and takes longer. now then what this really comes down to is, one group of people wants this and another doesn't, so realistically the Dev's could put ti in, and those who want to use it can use it, and those that don't can avoid it. also I just ran a flash back in ouro that yielded 33 merits and took me a little over an hour. lets put it this way there is no real speed per merit calculation that can be done. you just have to fire it somewhere down the middle. honestly 540 tickets is the price of other rare salvage, maybe that should be the price of 1 reward merit, though I personally think thats a bit high for one merit. |
merits are a reward for completeing stry arcs/tf/sf's/gm's. tickets are rewards for doing AE missions. they are two different rewards for means of getting the things you want. leave it that way.
in fact, the only reason i can think of that you want this so bad is because you can not buy specific set recipes with tickets. well, to bad. there are always people running tf/sf's and you can speed run those to get the merits for the recipe you want. you can also run AE missions and get tickets to roll for the things you want. you can obtain tickets faster then merits in some cases so you have more chances of getting what you want. deal with it.
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the reason I want this so badly is cause I have a surplus of AE tickets, and find it hard to make 50 Reward Merits a day..
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Originally Posted by Sharker_Quint
why are we opposed to it? because there is no need for it. and the devs do not want everyone spending all their time in the AE. and again, it is not harder nor does it take longer to farm a map in AE. and i can only see 2 of you in this thread that want this, and a bunch of us that do not. and yes there is a merit/min calculation. it is 1 merit per 6 min. that is what an average player can earn. that is through extensive data mining.
merits are a reward for completeing stry arcs/tf/sf's/gm's. tickets are rewards for doing AE missions. they are two different rewards for means of getting the things you want. leave it that way. in fact, the only reason i can think of that you want this so bad is because you can not buy specific set recipes with tickets. well, to bad. there are always people running tf/sf's and you can speed run those to get the merits for the recipe you want. you can also run AE missions and get tickets to roll for the things you want. you can obtain tickets faster then merits in some cases so you have more chances of getting what you want. deal with it. |
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this is why it wouldnt be implemented because its 1 player requesting the devs to make a gamechanging modification to the game|
Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
the reason I want this so badly is cause I have a surplus of AE tickets, and find it hard to make 50 Reward Merits a day..
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while i would really like to be able to convert AE tickets to merits, if the devs did implement this i would not mind a high conversion amount (500 or even 1000 tickets per merit)
that is why i suggested such high conversion rates as the beginning of the thread because getting to the 1500 tickets on most maps is fairly easy and quick to do, especially for specialized farms like fire offense enemies vs a fire armor brute with capped fire resists
one of the main reasons i dont do a lot of stuff in AE is because you cant get purple recipes from AE unless your doing a dev choice with normal rewards
while it is a change that would interest me, i highly doubt it will happen at all or if it does happen the conversion ratio would be extremely high
right now the gold rolls only seem overpriced because you cant make 8000+ tickets on a single map anymore like we could before the map ticket cap was implemented
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so if you have a surplus of tickets, go roll them or buy rare salvage with them and sell everything. in fact i couldn't see a conversion rate unless it was about 5000-7000 tickets per merit. that way no one is sitting in AE like they were when AE was first introduced. the devs actually want people playing the original content of the game.
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Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
the reason I want this so badly is cause I have a surplus of AE tickets, and find it hard to make 50 Reward Merits a day..
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Yet you can apparently make the 20 million inf a day to convert those merits?
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Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
the reason I want this so badly is cause I have a surplus of AE tickets, and find it hard to make 50 Reward Merits a day..
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My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
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1 itf and a lady grey tf and theres your 50....
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Originally Posted by JoshexDirad
the reason I want this so badly is cause I have a surplus of AE tickets, and find it hard to make 50 Reward Merits a day..
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selling rare salvage yes easily.
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Originally Posted by Megajoule
Yet you can apparently make the 20 million inf a day to convert those merits?
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If I had to guess I'd say it's because most players remember these posts|
Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
You're reading the words and missing the meaning. I will rephrase:
My question there is if 200 tickets = 1 merit is so horrible why is AE farming not considered the absolute best farming method now? Better? |
Abusing Mission Architect
Follow Up: Abusing Mission Architect
And the GM's have followed thru and enforced what Positron posted back then.
Then there's the huge negative reputation that AE babies earned. Many people simply don't want to associate with that type of player so they avoid the AE or only use it when solo or with their friends.
Why go thru all that hassle when there are regular missions available that can be farmed to our hearts content without ever suffering the wrath of the GM's or AE babies. And it seems like with every new addition to the game the devs are adding more contacts with repeatable missions that can be farmed.
Newpaper/Radio missions
Mayhem/Safeguards
Ouroboros Flashback missions
Marcus Valerius - Cimerora
Borea - RWZ
There are other contacts as well but I can't remember all their names or which factions they are on.
There's also the TF's, Trials, Raids, GM's, and I think the missions in the PvP zones can be farmed.
Farmers have plenty of choices available without having to resort to farming the AE.
/unsigned.
Actually when Merits were first introduced Castle wanted to do something similar to this.