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In theory, that aggro should go onto the brickier members, since they generate more of it. This'll also let the Stalker use the AS debuff mid-battle.
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Originally Posted by Smiling_Joe
The idea is to make stalkers more desirable on teams. Shedding aggro like water off a duck's back is okay, provided you're not sending that aggro over to your teamed squishies.
The quickest way stalkers get booted from teams is by abandoning their team in the name of "scouting." But only SLIGHTLY LESS OFFENSIVE are the stalkers who get teammates killed through consistently poor use of placate in big fights. Giving it an AoE -taunt effect WITH THE INTENTION of sending that aggro to the rest of your team is just asking to have stalkers shunned in the future. |
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
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The tanks would love you for making the mobs forget all their work.
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Originally Posted by trendee
To this end, what if placate just made an entity drop its entire aggro/hate table. (and went back to "out of combat" mode)
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What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
Just some quick notes on the last few posts here:
First, I don't think there's as much room for trim on the Assassin's Strike animations as a whole as you'd originally think - just look at Kinetic Melee for an example of one that's fairly fluid and busy all the way up to the end, Broadsword doesn't have much stationary time if I'm remembering it right, and neither does Fist of Annihilation. Since they're supposed to be identical in all but damage type, you can only trim to the longest one, so there's still going to be dead time in the horse stances (DM, EM, MA's original), the other blades (Katana, Dual Blades), and the amateur proctology exam ones (Claws, Spines, Electric) - and those all have their own varying amounts of dead time that could be trimmed as well. It won't end up much shorter without entirely new animations for each set's Assassin's Strike so that they all have the same one - which I personally would find boring.
Second, regarding making Stalkers "more desirable for teams". While that's a possible side-product of a buff, the issue I'm bringing up in this thread is less about teams and more about individual performance, whether solo or teamed. A Stalker Placating and getting someone killed can happen, but honestly I've seen a lot more bad Masterminds kill people than bad Stalkers. With that said, I'd rather that the buffs not necessarily tie into Placate - although that's more of a performance concern than my worrying about it killing people.
Third, as for the random chance to Placate being tacked onto attacks - I agree that it would often simply end up being an extra way of saying "more criticals outside of hidden status". However, there are those chances where it'd save you a few seconds of waiting before you move on, and dropping back into hidden status has other features you could link it to. So if I were to support this I'd rather it just set the kMeter value for "hidden status" instead of Placating, and make a couple of tweaks to take advantage of that.
For example, Hide's extra defense (3.75% to all but AoE, 37.5% to AoE - this is on top of the 1.875% to all that's always up) suppresses for 8 seconds when attacking, when damaged, or when you click a glowie. If, instead of a suppression timer, it just checked the kMeter for stealth (so, "if Hidden" vs "oh, it hasn't been 8 seconds yet") you could have Placate and/or a "random hidden" effect apply additional defense. If you want to almost guarantee that you'll get at least one critical out of it, you can bump the decimal place over on the defense to all but AoE, effectively turning Placate - or a random "drop into Hidden" - into a better version of Shadow Meld (which is why I find this part unlikely).
So, if this is so silly numerically, why do I mention it? Because a decimal shift like that would help resistance and heal sets use the Hidden status more effectively by pushing them right to the soft cap - they're less likely to be hit, so more able to utilize that critical, hopefully with Assassin's Strike since it's a very good DPA attack from hidden status (as in, 2.21 damage scale/sec of arcanatime, which is higher than Blaze) - and the excess on defense sets is simply overkill in most situations anyway. Placate already actively sets the kMeter value to 1 (to drop into Hidden status), so having it as a random effect of an attack could simply be a percentage chance of it happening per single-target attack. Plus having a random "drop to hidden" would affect the next hit to provide a critical, and the defense boost would simulate Sam's "nobody can see me to hit me, so I can move freely to select the next target" desired style of play.
The problem with it is that it'll likely also just end up being a random critical on the next available attack (rather than the one you're using at the moment) if you're trying to maintain a solid DPS chain - you likely will have things queued already and won't notice that you dropped into hidden status until it already came and went. Being able to leverage it would provide a lot of survivability to Stalkers as a whole, as well - it would provide an incentive for careful power selection and watching what happens to your target rather than random button mashing.
If something like this - simply setting the kMeter to 1 - were to happen instead of the random criticals, but at the same rate, how would you feel about it?
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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I think this is a bad way to think about things. Stalkers have shields, mez protection, self-heals and all of that - it seems to me to be pretty fanciful to give them tools that foist aggro on other teammates. There are squishier people than stalkers, and not every team has a scrapper, tank, or brute - and they shouldn't feel like they should.
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Originally Posted by SkarmoryThePG
In theory, that aggro should go onto the brickier members, since they generate more of it. This'll also let the Stalker use the AS debuff mid-battle.
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...I like the idea of switching Hide's defenses to the Hidden status. Maybe make Hide give better defenses immediately after Hiding?|
Originally Posted by Siolfir
*snip*
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And, mm. How about this:
[Edit]AHEM. Treat this as a summary of Siolfir's excellent suggestion.
-Hiding provides a short-term defense boost.
-OR Hide can't be interrupted for 2-4 seconds by incoming fire
-REMOVAL of random crits
-INSTEAD you have a random chance to Hide, which you can leverage into a crit wherever you want.
There should be some DISTINCT way of giving the player feedback that "the attack you're about to throw out will hide you. Make use of it". A sound. A flash. SOMETHING.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
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I agree - but once again, foisting off aggro wasn't one of the concerns I had. If the person playing the Stalker has a clue (yes, I know, this is a big if) they can rather quickly attract attention if they need to. They hit fairly hard, have a reasonably high threat modifier, and being at melee range they're usually going to be closer to what that Corruptor/Blaster/Defender is attracting. |
Originally Posted by Talen Lee
I think this is a bad way to think about things. Stalkers have shields, mez protection, self-heals and all of that - it seems to me to be pretty fanciful to give them tools that foist aggro on other teammates. There are squishier people than stalkers, and not every team has a scrapper, tank, or brute - and they shouldn't feel like they should.
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Note that I don't mention Controllers or Dominators, who can handle their own aggro via hard controls; the other melee ATs, who can handle it better than a Stalker; MMs, who have pets; or EATs, who all have their own version of shields and/or mez protection.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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>.>|
Originally Posted by SkarmoryThePG
...I like the idea of switching Hide's defenses to the Hidden status. Maybe make Hide give better defenses immediately after Hiding?
And, mm. How about this: -Hiding provides a short-term defense boost. -OR Hide can't be interrupted for 2-4 seconds by incoming fire -REMOVAL of random crits -INSTEAD you have a random chance to Hide, which you can leverage into a crit wherever you want. There should be some DISTINCT way of giving the player feedback that "the attack you're about to throw out will hide you. Make use of it". A sound. A flash. SOMETHING. |
<.<
So, basically, what I just said in the last half of that wall of text?
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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*squint*
I don't see you mentioning the removal of crits.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
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Last sentence in the post, all by itself. |
Originally Posted by SkarmoryThePG
*squint*
I don't see you mentioning the removal of crits. |
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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Well played, good sir/madam.|
Originally Posted by Siolfir
Last sentence in the post, all by itself.
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Still. I emphasize the importance of letting the player know he's about to rehide ASAP. As soon as the attack starts might be almost too late for quick attacks, seriously.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
True - like I said in the post, it'd probably end up just being a random crit after someone has too many attacks queued and realizes after the fact that they messed up. It has frustration potential, which is generally considered a bad thing. But it does have the benefit of rewarding better play (or at least, rewarding not random attack-button-mashing, which is the standard approach for most ATs).
And I'm not really pushing for that over anything else at the moment as much as trying to come up with a proposal that would fit a slightly different playstyle that revolves more around the "Hide gimmick", to show an alternative for someone like Samuel_Tow who would be adverse to a higher damage modifier which could create a more Scrapper-like feel. I think a simpler solution would work for the majority of Stalker players, which is why I asked what people thought about it.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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Well, I for one like it on the basis that it simplifies the AT. Instead of "you crit from hide, or randomly", you only ever crit from hide. Simple, pithy, effective.
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
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Originally Posted by Siolfir
True - like I said in the post, it'd probably end up just being a random crit after someone has too many attacks queued and realizes after the fact that they messed up. It has frustration potential, which is generally considered a bad thing. But it does have the benefit of rewarding better play (or at least, rewarding not random attack-button-mashing, which is the standard approach for most ATs).
And I'm not really pushing for that over anything else at the moment as much as trying to come up with a proposal that would fit a slightly different playstyle that revolves more around the "Hide gimmick", to show an alternative for someone like Samuel_Tow who would be adverse to a higher damage modifier which could create a more Scrapper-like feel. I think a simpler solution would work for the majority of Stalker players, which is why I asked what people thought about it. |
I would consider it a nerf, because they are many situations where you cannot hide (damage auras, Caltrops).
And we would do EVEN WORSE DPS in teams than we do now.
Not good, and honestly not going to happen. Complex changes are pipedreams.
When something good happens to me, I can never enjoy it....
I am always too busy looking for the inevitable punchline...
BEHOLD THE POWER OF CHEESE!
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And here's the other side of the coin - it can be a nerf (versus just being different) based on how you currently play.|
Originally Posted by Test_Rat
I would consider it a nerf, because they are many situations where you cannot hide (damage auras, Caltrops).
And we would do EVEN WORSE DPS in teams than we do now. Not good, and honestly not going to happen. Complex changes are pipedreams. |
While true that any autohit damage will negate the whole effect and a bad roll can cause problems, with damage auras you should be at or near the soft cap for AoE (Hide's base AoE defense when unsuppressed is 39.375%) and unlikely to get hit during the time it takes to use the attack.
The team DPS would be variable - I was suggesting it happen at the same as the critical rate that currently exists, but I also considered it a huge survivability boost as well if the defense numbers were tweaked - in that case, with hidden defense being pretty much at the soft cap and Placate available, you pretty much only die when you want to. You couldn't hold aggro like a Tanker, but you could likely outsurvive them fairly easily.
Also, being able to pick from the "best available recharged" critical rather than having them be randomly distributed could be a positive effect - as mentioned in my post earlier, if you can leverage Assassin's Strike's critical effectively it has better DPA than Blaze. But you'd have to notice that a better attack was there, and have it recharged, before just mashing "next button in pre-calculated attack chain sequence". Note that I don't say this meaning to imply that's what you do - but it's how many do. And that's not meant as a criticism, either; I personally don't even bother pre-calculating the attack chain sequence, I just mash the buttons on most of my melee characters (although I do tend to try to hit the attacks that I know are the higher DPA first).
As for complex changes... There are already checks for powers in place to see if you're Hidden. There is already a scaling random chance for "something" to happen for Stalker criticals. There is already a power that sets the kMeter (ie, Hidden status) to 1. The rest of it would be adjusting the unsuppressed defense numbers in Hide. I don't think that it requires any new tech to perform, so while a semi-drastic change to the AT it doesn't seem overly complex when looked at through the eyes of "this already exists here, and it's used there". It would require going through every single Stalker attack and every version of Hide to change the power information, though.
Now, is this the change that I'd necessarily go with? Probably not - it's definitely not the "safe choice", and likely not the most popular (either among Stalker players or other melee AT players). To be perfectly honest about it, right now I'd rather just go with the damage increases talked about on the first page. But it's an idea up for grabs, to see how the reactions fall.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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Thus my suggestion of Placate Hide being unbreakable
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Originally Posted by Test_Rat
I would consider it a nerf, because they are many situations where you cannot hide (damage auras, Caltrops).
And we would do EVEN WORSE DPS in teams than we do now. Not good, and honestly not going to happen. Complex changes are pipedreams. |
What shall claim a Sky Kings' Ransom?
PPD & Resistance Epic Archetypes
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You can't have your cake and eat it too. You can't use the metric of stalkers not doing enough damage when compared with scrappers and brutes and then say you're mainly interested in the buff for soloing. If you're going to rationalize a buff based on comparisons of a stalker's performance with other archetypes, then you're going to have to accept that any buff you may or may not get will have to take those archetypes into consideration in a teamed environment.|
Originally Posted by Siolfir
Second, regarding making Stalkers "more desirable for teams". While that's a possible side-product of a buff, the issue I'm bringing up in this thread is less about teams and more about individual performance, whether solo or teamed. A Stalker Placating and getting someone killed can happen, but honestly I've seen a lot more bad Masterminds kill people than bad Stalkers. With that said, I'd rather that the buffs not necessarily tie into Placate - although that's more of a performance concern than my worrying about it killing people.
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OTOH, what if hidden status were given the Fiery Embrace treatment? If a stalker crits from hide, then bonus damage of a thematic type (say, psionic or negative energy) is also granted to the attack. Instead of a DoT like Fiery Embrace's burning, it would be burst. This would tie in any damage buffs to what a stalker's main job is: to assassinate from hiding.
However, it may not be possible to tie the bonus damage to hidden status specifically (verses an active Hide toggle with hidden status broken) in the same way as Fiery Embrace. In that case, it could be done through the assassin strike's fear effect. If I remember correctly, this is nothing more than a pbaoe tohit debuff power with a chance to fear that is given to the victim of the AS. Add a self-affecting burst of damage to that power, essentially giving bonus damage in a less resisted form to an AS delivered from hide.
The point could be made that the "power" isn't granted to the victim if he/she dies, but then again, who cares about extra damage not being dealt to a corpse? The argument could be made that this is just a fancy way to give a damage buff that could just as easily be attained by a simple damage modifier increase, but I'd point out two things: 1) this suggestion makes a bigger damage buff more likely, since it is balanced by being tied to hidden status and Assassin Strike, and 2) this suggestion is easier to combine with other suggestions (like the one to remove the dead time from assassin strike).
The Scrappers' Guide to Dark Melee | Kheldian Binds and Strategies
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How is it "having my cake and eating it too"?|
Originally Posted by Smiling_Joe
You can't have your cake and eat it too. You can't use the metric of stalkers not doing enough damage when compared with scrappers and brutes and then say you're mainly interested in the buff for soloing. If you're going to rationalize a buff based on comparisons of a stalker's performance with other archetypes, then you're going to have to accept that any buff you may or may not get will have to take those archetypes into consideration in a teamed environment.
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The metric of Stalkers not doing enough damage was related to their survivability - the same "metric" that resulted in the Brute changes that produced a more steady, but typically lower, Fury level. Brutes had more hit points, a higher hit point (and resistance) cap, and once they built up enough Fury they were doing more damage than (most) Scrappers.
Well, Scrappers have more hit points, a higher hit point cap, unless the Stalker is teamed with multiple other people who are within range to boost the scaling critical the Scrapper is going to do more damage to a single target, and even with the scaling criticals there is a good chance (not a certainty, though) that simply due to higher AoE potential the Scrapper is going to do more damage on a team.
I didn't say I was mostly interested in the buff for soloing, I said that any buff should address it, and thus should address individual performance - whether that individual performance is while the Stalker is soloing, or whether that individual performance is while on a team. It even says that in the part you quoted.
It's not like Stalkers act as force multipliers and can improve everyone's else performance by a factor much greater than their own contribution, so a higher individual performance means that they provide a better contribution to the team.
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Originally Posted by PleaseRecycle
it has gone from unconscionable to downright appalling that we have no way of measuring our characters' wetness.
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Originally Posted by Brillig
It's hard to beat the entertainment value of Whackjob Wednesdays.
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I don't know about you guys but I think my Stalker survives relatively well especially on a team. Unless I do something stupid, my Stalkers seem to naturally attract less attention especially if there's Dominator or Brute on the team. Brute causes more aggro through taunt while Dominator causes more aggro through controls. Or maybe Stalker's damage output is inferior so aggro is less? lol
I don't think Stalker needs HP increase. If I want a "sturdy" AT, I wouldn't pick Stalker in the first place. I think Stalker's defense is decent enough. A buffed Stalker can survive just as well as most melee ATs. Sometimes a Corruptor just doesn't know who to buff!!! Their focus is all on Brutes.
I think the most basic or easiest buff is to just increase the Team Critical % to LARGE. In fact, I don't even think they need to put a cap on size but it's just me.
Another thing they can do is to get rid of Interruptable on AS in PvE. It's already taking long enough and it sucks even more if it gets interrupted somehow like by an aoe or debuff.
And they can speed up the animation time on Placate and possibly reduce the recharge on it. I like the idea of receiving some kind of buffs right after Placate.
I think the Stalker problem lies in some of the "power sets" that don't have good AoE. Teaming in this game is all about AoE damage and stacking Buffs/Debuffs which Stalker in general is lacking. I think Spines/Dual Blade/Claw/Electricity Melee Stalkers are fine but Martial Arts needs serious help.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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None of the changes for brutes directly endangered other members of the team. The suggested change for stalkers I was addressing - namely, the chance for random aoe placates - does endanger the team, and if you're going to measure performance based on other archetypes, then it's probably a good idea not to ask for changes that are directly detrimental in that regard.|
Originally Posted by Siolfir
How is it "having my cake and eating it too"?
The metric of Stalkers not doing enough damage was related to their survivability - the same "metric" that resulted in the Brute changes that produced a more steady, but typically lower, Fury level. Brutes had more hit points, a higher hit point (and resistance) cap, and once they built up enough Fury they were doing more damage than (most) Scrappers. Well, Scrappers have more hit points, a higher hit point cap, unless the Stalker is teamed with multiple other people who are within range to boost the scaling critical the Scrapper is going to do more damage to a single target, and even with the scaling criticals there is a good chance (not a certainty, though) that simply due to higher AoE potential the Scrapper is going to do more damage on a team. I didn't say I was mostly interested in the buff for soloing, I said that any buff should address it, and thus should address individual performance - whether that individual performance is while the Stalker is soloing, or whether that individual performance is while on a team. It even says that in the part you quoted. It's not like Stalkers act as force multipliers and can improve everyone's else performance by a factor much greater than their own contribution, so a higher individual performance means that they provide a better contribution to the team. |
You likely haven't seen a stalker's placate in the middle of a battle directly kill another team mate very often because stalkers can currently control who and when they placate. The first and only time I incorrectly used placate on a team resulted in a squishy being killed by my intended victim, and I never used it wrong again. Giving stalkers a random aoe placate every time they crit (I believe that was the suggestion) is taking that control away.
I'm all for suggestions that improve a stalker's performance (although like Jibikao I'm not completely convinced much - if anything - needs to be done), so long as they don't negatively affect the team dynamic. My main point was with regard to that one suggestion and the perceived attitude that its downsides didn't matter because we're talking about individual performance.
If that was my misperception I apologize, but I still maintain that - as any changes made do not happen in a vacuum - it would be wise to suggest them in a broader context than individual performance.
The Scrappers' Guide to Dark Melee | Kheldian Binds and Strategies
I like the idea of the re-hide being much quicker than it currently is after you break line of sight with all hostiles.
I would also suggest making the hide power an inherent and adding a power to each secondary that:
1. Does no damage
2. Doesn't break hide
3. Doesn't draw aggro
4. Has a longish recharge
5. Is some kind of debuff or control
I'd like to see stalkers be able to sneak around and do something (not game breaking but something) while staying hidden.
*Wonders if post was completely over looked ....*
>_>
<_<
HEY!. . . . This guy had a great Idea, I think!
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Also, adding to previous comments, the aspect of adding an uninteruptable status for assassin strike after placate would be nice too. But only in PVE, that would be too powerful in PvP. Maybe have like 5 or 10 seconds of Uninterupstable Assassins Strike Status after Placate before it switches back into an Interuptable Status again. In all Honesty, I do not have a hard time with my stalkers when it comes to survivability. Its all in the play style and the player of the character. I mean, for example, my nephew has made and played the exact same build of Stalkers as me on his account (I told him how to make it) and he cant do half the crazy things I can do on my Stalker simply because the experience is not there and the know how of how to properly use the AT and its tools.I dont want an HP Cap Increase because I die a lot and need more HP with Dull Pain. I just want it to be a little more on par with other Melee AT's. Maybe even an HP Increase to about 1400-1500 would be nice too. |
Originally Posted by The_Nezz
Having played Stalkers since CoV Beta, I am pretty happy with how they are right now except for two things.
One, the Stalker HP Cap. On my Regen Stalker with Accolades and IO Sets, I am currently at hp cap of 1606. That leaves my Dull Pain pretty much a second heal that is insanelt long to recharge XD An increase to at least 2000 would be wonderful. Two, Changes to Assassin Strike. When in an intense battle where you have no chance to stealth or even pull off an Assassin Strike without interruptions (while Solo or in a team) I propose that when you ARE NOT stealthed or under stealth status from Placate that Assassin Strike IS NOT interuptable. When you are stealthed its status could be set back to interuptable. In the heat of a fight right now a Stalker has pretty much no access to a whole power. Change those two and I think they would be pretty nice for me at least. |
*now for Personal Opinion and Rant to the whole AT's Situation*
The fact of the matter is, people dont look at the intended use of the AT's Red Side. We compare them to Hero AT's and play them accordingly. Brutes are our Tanks (whether intended play or not), Stalkers are our Scrappers (whether inteded play or not), Doms are our controllers (whether intended play or not), Corruptors are our Blaster/Defenders (Whether intended play or not) and Master minds.... they are thier own wierd AT on thier own XD lol... they are NOT our Tanks Villain Side lol... You dont wait for the MM to run into battle first with Body Guard Mode on when there are Brutes on the team
... So the changes to the AT's need to be made based on how they are played imo. The players have already made it clear on how they are used in a team. I know I sure as heck can play my Stalkers like Scrappers with my IO Sets and Power Pools. So lets Buff/change them accordingly.
"We knew that the current PvP community wasn't likely to react well to the changes as they wern't who we were making changes for, so it's understandable that there is continuing complaints from that segment." - Lighthouse; i13 PvP Forums October-08 The only person honest enough to tell us the truth. You will be missed, Lighthouse :-(
@Nezz - Guardian For Life!!! @_o...
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This is generally never a good argument to make when you want something. "Some people do X with Y, and that's how I want it, so obviously that's how it should have been all along."|
Originally Posted by The_Nezz
The players have already made it clear on how they are used in a team. I know I sure as heck can play my Stalkers like Scrappers with my IO Sets and Power Pools. So lets Buff/change them accordingly.
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I'm not saying I don't agree with everything you said. I completely agree with you that Stalkers could use an increase to base HP as well as their HP cap--they are, after all, melee fighters; they should still be the squishiest, but they do run a tad too squishy on teams right now.
I'm also starting to think that maybe Stalkers should actually have a higher base damage than Scrappers. Currently, Stalkers do about 89% of the damage for an equivalent Scrapper attack (based off of Katana/Ninja Blade base numbers) except for the Tier 9, which does 85% as much base damage. All these powers have equal endurance costs. Since Stalkers are supposed to be the single-target damage masters, why not have them actually do slightly more base damage than a Scrapper (no more than 5-10%, max) on their single-target attacks and adjust the penalty equally and negatively on their AoE powers to compensate for the buff?
Furthermore, I'd propose a slight adjustment to the "Demoralized" power that sometimes accompanies Assassin's Strike: change it from a 25% chance at a Mag 5 Fear to a 75% chance of a Mag 1 Fear and a 25% chance of a Mag 4 Fear. This has the Stalker unleashing more soft control, at least enough to stop a swarm of minions, that will increase his or her benefit on a team.
Main Hero: Chad Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1396 Badges
Main Villain: Evil Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1193 Badges
Mission Architect arcs: Doctor Brainstorm's An Experiment Gone Awry, Arc ID 2093
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
it's NEVER too late to pad your /ignore list!
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Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man
This is generally never a good argument to make when you want something. "Some people do X with Y, and that's how I want it, so obviously that's how it should have been all along."
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While I understand what you mean, its not like im saying, "People play Blasters like Scrappers some times, so Blasters (Blappers) need to be buffed more like Scrappers with HP and other attributes." I am willing to bet my account that its not just "some" in this case of Villain AT Use. Its most likely everyone.
"We knew that the current PvP community wasn't likely to react well to the changes as they wern't who we were making changes for, so it's understandable that there is continuing complaints from that segment." - Lighthouse; i13 PvP Forums October-08 The only person honest enough to tell us the truth. You will be missed, Lighthouse :-(
@Nezz - Guardian For Life!!! @_o...
Quote:
Make it a Mag 2 fear, Mag 1 wont do anything to anyone.|
Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man
This is generally never a good argument to make when you want something. "Some people do X with Y, and that's how I want it, so obviously that's how it should have been all along."
I'm not saying I don't agree with everything you said. I completely agree with you that Stalkers could use an increase to base HP as well as their HP cap--they are, after all, melee fighters; they should still be the squishiest, but they do run a tad too squishy on teams right now. I'm also starting to think that maybe Stalkers should actually have a higher base damage than Scrappers. Currently, Stalkers do about 89% of the damage for an equivalent Scrapper attack (based off of Katana/Ninja Blade base numbers) except for the Tier 9, which does 85% as much base damage. All these powers have equal endurance costs. Since Stalkers are supposed to be the single-target damage masters, why not have them actually do slightly more base damage than a Scrapper (no more than 5-10%, max) on their single-target attacks and adjust the penalty equally and negatively on their AoE powers to compensate for the buff? Furthermore, I'd propose a slight adjustment to the "Demoralized" power that sometimes accompanies Assassin's Strike: change it from a 25% chance at a Mag 5 Fear to a 75% chance of a Mag 1 Fear and a 25% chance of a Mag 4 Fear. This has the Stalker unleashing more soft control, at least enough to stop a swarm of minions, that will increase his or her benefit on a team. |
Also part of the reason Stalkers dont contribute on teams is the severe lack of AoE on them.
Look at some of the most successful PvE sets for Stalkers: Elec and Spines. They both have access to powerful AoE that assists the team and helps them move faster. Single Target damage is not ever needed on a team, and hardly wanted after maybe level 12.
The fact that stalkers get gimped sets that remove the *only* AoE option because the Devs want to shoehorn them in as weaker ST scrappers just serves to cripple the entire AT as a whole.
Theres a reason that everything a Stalker can do, a Scrapper can do better.
The quickest way stalkers get booted from teams is by abandoning their team in the name of "scouting." But only SLIGHTLY LESS OFFENSIVE are the stalkers who get teammates killed through consistently poor use of placate in big fights. Giving it an AoE -taunt effect WITH THE INTENTION of sending that aggro to the rest of your team is just asking to have stalkers shunned in the future.