Good PvP topic I stumbled across in the suggestions thread.

funnily he is from yours.

Dahje's are natives of Virtue. We sure do know how to breed them!

lolwut?

lol

Me? Mad at you? rofl.

@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."

That would have been my second guess.

Why is eugenics such a bad idea again?

OH MAH GAWD TERRORIST!! PRAISE DEMOCRACY! PEE VEH PEE EQUALlTY FAH AWL!

Go to freedom if you are looking to learn and become a competitive PvPer.

If you're more of a casual PvP baddo, jump on the shortbus to virtue. We're all bad here.

Hey Sterling, PvP on Justice has been more or less dead since I11-I12 when many people moved to Freedom. Almost all of those that remained went to Freedom after I13 (free transfers helped), so these days you're lucky if there's one busy night a week in Justice RV while the other zones are almost always empty.

@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."

True Indeed, they do not fully. They do however provide a foundation on which to build upon or base "Success/Failure" on. If you have a desire to change something for PvP for a particular AT... I promise that emphasizing these decripstions' contradictions will help more so than random PvP wants and hopes based on emotions or what you see currently.

Um. Yes I can. Devs don't tell us what or how to play... Other players do. Once they convince us that they know what they're talking about. Bad players fall for anything they say. Even good Players recommend out of a biased and skewed perception that is far too often based on lolserious arena PvP, where players have the luxury of actually Picking who they want to PvP with.

Despite the reduction in effectiveness all ATs still retain their niche. Example: Defenders are weaker than most as offensive PvPers, yet they do indeed still provde the highest numbers for support, and yes they can easily be made farm targets if no one is willing to look after their heavily sought HP bar. This is easily comparable to PvE. Sonic/ and Cold/ for example offer DR'ed buffs far below those cataloged Pre-I13, but those DR'ed buffs are higher than any Troller or Corr can acheive. In a team, keeping your defender alive can be critical once you realize how to get the most out of it's specific purpose.... ignoring a particular defender's purpose is comparable to noobs that can only survive with a healzor at their side in PvE.

Scrappers and Blasters and Stalkers retain their primary roles in PvP to the "T." Their appeal to PvP newbs and PvP noobs is no different than in PvE either. The appeal stems from a basic independancy to get a kill. Obviously the promotion and advertising of these ATs and their designed roles attract bad players to take the easy route... since the easy route atm is anythng that leads to an easy kill, more rep, and/or more dropped IOs.

You all can read these descriptions the same as me... I want to avod another TL: DR post. so I will elaborate on other ATs if prompted.
The overall point is that stenghths and weaknesses weren't erased but forgotten or ignored... even made to seem non-existent in order to justify a "uselessnes" label by the community.


Think closely about building a TF/SF at 3am in the morning.... Sure you got peeps that want to join.... but what do you Need??? More Aggro control? You need more damage? Perhaps more CC or heals... Maybe some -Regen or some other form of debuffing. Maybe even someone that can rez??? You may consider all of the above to be pointless in PvP considering the current ruleset but these roles are not useless. They are simply used less... In the absence of these roles we've created replacement/stacked roles to fill the part.

In PvP... just like in PvE... A smart leader will recognize a team's weaknesses and recruit accordinlgly, or to the best of their ability given what may be out there. (Zone PvP) They will adapt to what has become the team's strongest liabilty or strength and coach/lead the team accordingly. "Not -so -Smart" leaders seem to wait for copy/paste builds they've ben told are effective... these peeps usually quit or whine when their crutch fails to show up.

These (I13) changes helped by revealing to the community EXACTLY what each set could not make up for on it's own. This should of been a sign to seek out the set/set combos that would eliminate weaknesses and stregthen strengths within each powerst spoke of... but that didn't happen. Blind and Blatant avoidance of certain sets occurred and was encouraged. This phenomenon was not helpful to vets or newbies... nor was it 100% necessary post I13.

Simple.

I13 helped by making the Sets you speak of needed/required more for the survival of sets that require the unique attibutes from each set. If you truly build for slows they will work; Sacrafices to other aspects of PvP must be made though to make this purpose possible. If all else fails, then stacking what slows you have with another who has the same desired purpose takes priority.

WTF cares what was asked for. Your $15 dollars/Month goes to the people who make the game... deal with it or dwell on it I always say... live in the past or look towards the furtue is another way to put it.

Fact is that the introduction of IOs in I9 allowed many players to ignore the dependancies they had come to rely on... and I13 reinforced this menatlity. Personally, I feel this is more obvious on Blueside, but I've never felpt forcd by the devs to do anything.

The statement reffered to is based on Forum behavior and given advice. When a system is intoduced with the purpose of offering enjoyable PVP to the masses.... and the powers that influence actually encourage the playerbase to do the exact opposite... What can be said about the new system? How can change occur when it is quite obvious that adaptaon never occured.

I don't think anyone approved of all the changes...

Change is not matter of time nor need. It is a matter of "What it will take" for that change to occur. <--- Real Shi*T.

I won't go down that road.

To sum it up for you though.... Devs saw money in making PvP more appealing to PvErs... they looked for and sought ideas to get them (PvErs) involved.... made the mistake of asking too mny Serious PvPers what would work. ignored then and based changes on what would really help... and watched as disgruntled PvPers raged about how the changes didn;t helpthem get better. Close enogh I'm sure.



Nice edit: who are you talking about???

As pointed out earlier. You are confused and therefore likely to be a Robot.... dependant on another to tell you what to feel and think and say. I have yet to PvP with my /DP defender in RV. If possible... please encourage this poor Trapster you pseak of to holla at me via @Dahjee Global. It is obvious to me.. that he/she is doing it wrong.


TL;DR you say.....?

Perhaps it's better that way. Then again... you all asked for it, so keep it OP related and respond accoridingky if possible.

... or provide the standard "I hate Dahjee" post to cover for an inabilty to prove me wrong.

@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."

This is the most wrong thing you have ever posted. Ever. It is scary how little you actually know about what happened and why. And what that the true effects were exactly the opposite of what they wanted. And if you had been in i13 beta you would know a good many of the voices around here now that talk and are listened to and respected were there fighting in vain. If they had actually listened to the list that pvpers poured countless man hours into they would have been better off. Instead they pulled ideas at random given by pvErs and used them.


You can probably search around and still find the defining moment of pvp2.0 were we told very specfically that pvPers were not the 'segement' they were concerned about with the changed.



Edit: oh and how did that work out for them, ignoring the pvpers? we lost pvpers and never really gained new blood. Well played devs, well played.

Hmm may have to level up a toon on one or both of those servers. I'm probably somewhere between wanting to be competitive and being a "baddo" :-) PVP is something I like to do in other games on occasion, as a change of pace. Never have been a primarily PVP focused kind of guy.

Unfortunately, just about every redname PvP-related post when I13 hit open beta (right around when the post you're referring to happened... mid-November I believe) has been eaten by the forum monster, except those posts made by Castle in the I13 PvP changes thread, such as one which can be summarized by:

(The joke here is that getting kills with the I13 ruleset is so much easier than before, it's not even funny. Actually it kind of is, in a sad way.)

@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."

Well, welcome back to this ****-hole of a PvP system. d;D

If you decide to roll a toon for virtue, head on over to the virtue server thread. We are hosting weekend Role-Play picnics in RV heroside (They have benches scattered all around RV which make it a great area to role-play a picnic). If you are into ERP, Xanatos will be hosting some erotic scenes in Arena for an orgy of six to eight, events are always BYOKY (Bring Your Own KY). I do believe there's also an official ERPvP channel you can join as well.

Remember when considering a concept to RolePlay, Futa and Cat-girls are always well recieved and will most likely get you the most arena invites.

Yeah we've been down this road before. This is the part where you reinforce my points fully. Due to the fact that your statement reflects the fact that it is much harder now to protect, support, and simply keep someone alive in PvP. I mean if it's that much easier to get a kill... it's that much harder to keep someone alive right? Remember when the player community conviced everyone that defenders are usless and shouldn't be played....?

Happened for me... happens for othes too...

It's so funny to me that the person speaking of I13 and ideas of how it can work well is harmful to new players... and the general sentiment about I13 being bad is more helpful.

Yeah yeah blah blah.... no need to relive the moment. Forgive me I was drunk when I posted that last night... but I do feel I summed things up quite well. I was in I13 Beta. I know very well about the tales and tears of PvP 2.0.

From I can tell... players did the opposite of what the devs designed it for.

Dev: "We want the new system to include more variation of sets and ATs... we will desgin PvP 2.0 wth this in mind"

Uber l33t Player Rep to the community: "Um lets find FoTMs anyway and ignore variation! They didn't force us to think so lets not! Look at MIds... it says X/Y is soooo powerful!!! DuDe play that and only that!"

Stop blaming Devs and I13. Take some Fing responsibilty for this mess.

OMG Cool! Did Mac just introduce another excuse for his robots to hide behind when dealing with me? Why Yes he did!... This one is much better than the K/D ratio excuse introduced weeks ago... and almost as good as the flying Ar/Dev stuff he introduced months ago... I hope this one can stick. His minions are getting tired.

Wait. Lets see how many Robots will follow this new trend....

Oh my! Here's one now!


Pleae explain how I am trolling? I'm not really sure what counts. I always assumed it was posting stuff that un related to the OP with the hopes of angering the people in it or something... Correct me if I'm wrong.

[Edit:] lol I'm a verb. That is awesome.