Problem Team Members

Just as there are different archetypes, there are different kinds of people playing those archetypes. People will have varying levels of overall game play experience and skill, archetype experience and skill, risk aversion (habitual cautiousness on one end and constantly pushing the limit on the other end), seriousness/playfulness attitude, chattiness, and so on. You can take the same 8 characters and 8 different people will play those characters in a completely different way, both individually and as a team, depending on who they are.

Unless you always play with the same group of friends and SG members, you're going to experience a wide range of players with different types of play, skilled or unskilled, cautious or daring, attentive or not attentive to details, and so on. It comes with the turf. I think in some ways it tests you even more as a player (and a person) than if you're playing with people you already know. It's a test of your patience, your willingness to communicate and give suggestions, as well as a test of how well you can play your character under less than ideal circumstances.

In almost a year, I've never kicked anyone from a team, although there have been a few times it crossed my mind or a teammate's mind. I have been on TF's before where initially it looked like it was going to be impossible to accomplish it given the way a player or some players were playing. But as many times as not, people adjust to each other, particularly when they do chat and give suggestions to each other and when things are actually done right we get a morale boost from a successful battle or mission, when things start to click. Sometimes players don't even realize what other AT's are on the team (not looking it up, which I try to make a habit of doing, but can't claim to always do) until they've experienced a few battles with their team mates and then adjust their tactics and play style accordingly.

And I would never presume to know best what another player's role is. They know themselves best as a player and their character's capabilities. Maybe their build is designed for a slightly unorthodox 'role' or an alternate 'role' more typical of a another archetype. True, sometimes a player doesn't know better and has built up some bad play habits that will take some effort for them to change. People are like that - creatures of habit - so I also wouldn't assume that they would change their play habits even after they react positively to suggestions on how to improve them.

In short - at least from the way I see it, having played with many different varieties of pick up teams - grin and bear it. Sometimes I've had the most fun with a gaggle of inexperienced players, even it meant I had to be that much quicker on my feet and test my own character's limits in situations where there is less than ideal individual or team play.

Sometimes a 'problem' can be an opportunity.

I have a level 50 Broadsword/Shield Scrapper softcapped to all 3 positions. There are few situations in which I will hold back. When I do, I feel I'm not doing what I should be doing, and that is laying waste to whatever is in my way. When I'm in scrapperlock mode, you're under no obligation to keep me alive. If I faceplant, I didn't do it bringing whatever aggro I had back to the rest of the team. I laugh and hit the hospital button.

I also have 2 level 50 Fire/Kinetics Controllers that I've played up to 50. One thing that ruins my having fun is someone demanding that I sit back and buffbot with Speed Boost and Increase Density. I'm typically too busy controlling the mobs with my primary and using those other wonderful Kinetics powers (Fulcrum Shift anybody?) to play buffbot to the point that neither of those powers are in my builds.

Lastly, since this is the Tankers forum, I will mention that I have 3 Tankers, 1 that I leveled exclusively on PuGs (Stone/Stone) and 2 that have either been soloed or played with friends/coalies (WP/SS and Ice/SS). My play style for my Tanks is to keep what I can annoyed at me so it doesn't turn my teammates into mush. I don't herd or sit around until the last minion is dead.

I've played with really good PuGs where we've done radio missions for hours on end, and really horrible PuGs where we've barely entered the door and the entire team bails for any number of excuses. I've teamed with some really great players, and really bad players. I've had the displeasure of teaming with some terrible team leaders, who happened to be playing a Tanker. They would bark orders and demand that everybody do what they say when they say how they say. He was the Tanker and we were to be grateful simply for his presence.

My point is, I have played with many different players, each with their own play style and abilities, or inabilities in some cases. I learned very quickly to deal with both the good and bad, and that egos need to be checked at the door. The only assumption I make of the players of this game is that we all pay for our subscriptions to do one thing: have fun.

If we stop having fun, it's time to move on.

My usual issue comes from Controllers splashing their AOE Immobilize everywhere when everything is scattered everywhere.

There are obviously many points of view on this topic, but I thought I'd address one in particular that may (or may not) solve some of your "problems":

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doctor_Xaxan ...Usually when this happens, I'm still trying to mop up the last boss or two of a mob, and half the team has followed the adventurous fire/kin down another hallway (usually to their deaths).

The tank really has no business helping to mop up the last boss or two on a halfway decent team. The tank should just soak the alpha, establish initial aggro, get a tight grouping for AoEs, then determine when the battle is well in hand and go onto the next group. Too often though, I find the tank(s) staying til the last mob (that's a single unit, btw) is dead, making sure every little squishy is "protected" before going onto the next spawn, making the team wait pointlessly, or more often having another player initiate the action. In actually, those squishies are more than capable of looking out for themselves and the tank's (usually) inferior DPS isn't helping out the mopping up process in any significant way.

When not tanking myself, I'll always let the tank lead at first, but if I think they're not pushing the pace enough, I'll often go ahead a bit and set up my own fights, esp if I'm on a scrapper or controller. If the team complains, I'll rein it back, but I'll likely be looking for a new team after the mission (or TF) is done. Fact is, a tank isn't particularly needed (nor are scrappers or controllers or any other one AT in the game) to roll through missions and even TFs. What the tank usually does better than the scrapper or controller is controlling the aggro--not just taking the hits, but grouping the mobs to where you want them, provided you have time.

When I tank, I stick around for the alpha, and maybe one more volley, but once I see most of the minions dead, unless there's a particularly nasty mob (really tough boss or worse), I'm going to the next spawn to get it ready for the AoEs. This isn't just to not "waste my time" with leftovers, or even particularly push the pace for faster kills (tho that's nice too, and staves off wanderlust), but I want a few extra seconds to organize the next spawn to get tight on me before any caltrops or AoE immobs are laid down, and I want that time w/o making the team wait for me to "herd" or whatever (which promotes wanderlust).

Of course you have to judge the capabilities of your team--sometimes, you do need to stick around til the bitter end, esp on lower level teams (or just bad ones). Hell, sometimes, you might not be able to survive very long on your own and depend on the team to buff/debuff/kill fast enough for your own survival. But on higher level, competent teams, the tank really needs to push the pace more than what I usually see, esp in PUGs. Again, this isn't just some hardcore, steamroll-everything manifesto, but the reason a lot of ppl run ahead is because they're impatient, waiting on an overcautious tank. Yes, you'll still find scappers & Fire/Kins and whatever going off on their own, being generally poor teammates, but you're going to be very unhappy in life if you expect never to run into bad players.