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Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Shakes head.
The market is a place where you are meant to be taken advantage of. If the developers didn't want it to work that way they could fix it by adding 3 numbers and a couple of links. . The Devs pretty obviously want the market to be a spot where some players get screwed and others get to laugh at it. Edit Lol saw the obvious to solution (to anyone that has ever used a real market) was already posted. |
How can you be taken advantage of in the market? You post an item for sale at a certain price, and it sells.
You post a bid for a certain price and it fills.
Either way you get what you wanted, unless of course some nasty player actually offers more than you put your sale price in for, then you have to take MORE influence than you wanted. what a rip.
I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Thomas Jefferson
I think what the OP is trying to do is just lock out flippers from making a profit from their action. In simple terms, items that are "dropped" by defeating an enemy are flagged as such and can be sold on the market for any price. Items that are traded, purchased on the market, or by merits or tickets, can be placed on the market but with a cap on the sell price.
A Luck Charm dropped from a CoT mage can be placed on the market for anywhere between 1 inf and 2,000,000,000 inf. Say you bought it from the market for the low price of 10,000 inf. You can now put it on the market, but are limited by the "new price cap" of, say, 250 inf.
Should this go into effect, no more profit from flipping. The effect on the rest of the market in this situation would be the big question that others would have to figure out. I'm just starting out as an ebil marketeer, and haven't really gotten that good at it yet.
I don't want to see this happen. I like flipping.
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No one would resell things on the market. All you have to do is purchase all the cheap price capped stuff up and delete it* and then list your freshly farmed drops for what ever exorbitant price you want.|
Originally Posted by Mr_Wilkinson
I think what the OP is trying to do is just lock out flippers from making a profit from their action. In simple terms, items that are "dropped" by defeating an enemy are flagged as such and can be sold on the market for any price. Items that are traded, purchased on the market, or by merits or tickets, can be placed on the market but with a cap on the sell price.
A Luck Charm dropped from a CoT mage can be placed on the market for anywhere between 1 inf and 2,000,000,000 inf. Say you bought it from the market for the low price of 10,000 inf. You can now put it on the market, but are limited by the "new price cap" of, say, 250 inf. Should this go into effect, no more profit from flipping. The effect on the rest of the market in this situation would be the big question that others would have to figure out. I'm just starting out as an ebil marketeer, and haven't really gotten that good at it yet. I don't want to see this happen. I like flipping. |
* Instead of deleting, price capped non-fresh drop items would be traded by tells/spam broadcasts on the "real black market" that would form. That would be a flippers dream come true. Purchase any and all 250 inf resale capped items from the market then undersell the "freely sellable, fresh drops" by 10% and make a virtual killing.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
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It's not that flipping doesn't exist or isn't a problem Guffy. It's the possiblity that the proposed cure may be worse than the ailment. As far as we know there are no Devs with a background in economics, they have computer programmers, software engineers, and graphic artists in plenty but no economists.|
Originally Posted by Guffy
You might be a little late on this issue as it seems there is no flipping problem, the economics of this game are fine and you do your fellow player a favour when you hold items that they might want in the future for a massive profit (not that anyone has admitted that).
Aside from that I like your idea better.  |
For some of us it's almost as scary as trusting our real life economics on people that aren't economists but are rather, politicians that specialize in kissing hands and shaking babies.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
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To be fair, most of them tend to be lawyers. Still doesn't make them any better at regulating an economy, but it's something. |
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
For some of us it's almost as scary as trusting our real life economics on people that aren't economists but are rather, politicians that specialize in kissing hands and shaking babies.
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The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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Regulating markets is just as much of a republican thing. Republicans do not stand for less regulation, just kinds or regulation that benefit different groups.
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Originally Posted by Godlike_NA
Regulating an open market? What are you... a democrat? Sayeth the DC Flipping Lobby, leave the flippers be.
I'm Godlike and I approved this message. |
A game is not supposed to be some kind of... place where people enjoy themselves!
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You are overlooking the fact that because that person decided to turn a profit on the item in question it is available to be bought. If no one were to flip anything, the market most likely wouldn't have much excess inventory waiting to be sold and you would have to wait for all of your bids to go through. When I am crafting and need salvage it is normal for me to overpay to get it, I can accept the fact that someone else is profiting from my overpayment. If something is selling on average for 2000, I usually put my bids up at 8k to 15k to ensure I get what I want when I want it. Yes I do also sometimes flip on my lowbies because it is a good method for building up a bankroll early on. The real money is in being an honest merchant/craftsman though; buy the recipe, craft it and put that up for sale. I've made approximately 22 billion in profits from crafting and that number is climbing even as I type this.
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Originally Posted by Guffy
You might be a little late on this issue as it seems there is no flipping problem, the economics of this game are fine and you do your fellow player a favour when you hold items that they might want in the future for a massive profit (not that anyone has admitted that).
Aside from that I like your idea better. |
Debt is temporary, prestige is forever
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Like citizens?
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Originally Posted by ChaosExMachina
Regulating markets is just as much of a republican thing. Republicans do not stand for less regulation, just kinds or regulation that benefit different groups.
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I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
Thomas Jefferson
If you want to really mess with flippers, do this:
Find the low price on say, a piece of rare salvage and put in bids 100,000-200,000 above it. Get yourself like 80 of them, if not more. As you get them, begin selling them for just enough to break even on the whole thing.
Do this for a few days, and you'll move flippers off of the item until the price becomes less stable. If they knew what you were doing, they'd hate you.
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How much Inf for you to never say that again?
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Originally Posted by MrQuizzles
If you want to really mess with flippers, do this:
Find the low price on say, a piece of rare salvage and put in bids 100,000-200,000 above it. Get yourself like 80 of them, if not more. As you get them, begin selling them for just enough to break even on the whole thing. Do this for a few days, and you'll move flippers off of the item until the price becomes less stable. If they knew what you were doing, they'd hate you. |
Originally Posted by MrQuizzles 
If you want to really mess with flippers, do this:
Find the low price on say, a piece of rare salvage and put in bids 100,000-200,000 above it. Get yourself like 80 of them, if not more. As you get them, begin selling them for just enough to break even on the whole thing.
Do this for a few days, and you'll move flippers off of the item until the price becomes less stable. If they knew what you were doing, they'd hate you.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
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Alas there are an endless supply of idiots who must have their items NAO! so they can get back to levelling to 50 as fast as possible in AE.
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Originally Posted by Godlike_NA
For every jerk that does this, there are atleast 7 normal people feeding more of <insert resource name> in to the market at reasonable prices. If you want those, leave an open bid out and be patient, then you keep your money for yourself. Don't want to feed the flippers? DON'T PAY THEIR OUTRAGEOUS PRICES! The market will fix itself once they get bored and run out of idiots to overpay. Nuff said.
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Better to just make it 1 merit plus a set amount of Inf. to buy a rare. For example, if you set Pagean Soil to 500,000 and a merit at the vendor, you could either buy one at the going rate (800,000 to 1,000,000 right now) or knuckle up and run a 15-minute arc to get it for 500,000. Less salvage flipping at least, and presumably more stability between recipe and enhancement price, reducing another kind of flipping.
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You rock
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Originally Posted by COTCaveHater
1. There is no morality with respect to the in-game market. We do not think one player "killing" another player in PvP is immoral, so therefore one player "ripping off" another is not immoral. It is just a game, and the market can be avoided just like PvP zones.
2. Some players enjoy flipping and some enjoy farming. Reducing the ability of these players to participate in the activities they enjoy does not mean that they will suddenly turn into awesome teamies. If you think these flippers and farmers are evil greedy players why do you want to push them into your PUGs? 3. All scarcity in the game is put there artificially by the devs. If you want prices to go down, or availability of certain items to go up, the devs need to change the drop rates. Player behaviour won't do it, because if items are dropping more (or less) frequently than the devs want, they will adjust the game, just as they have done for activities that earn xp more quickly than they want. 4. CoX is five years old. It should be no surprise to anyone that there is a hard core of players that farm/flip etc. It should be no surprise to anyone that it is harder to team than five years ago. New content that attracts new players is what is needed in the game. Meddling with drop/market mechanics is a waste of dev time because it does not bring new players into the game. 5. If buying up all the salvage and then dribbling it back on to the market was profitable, I'd sure as heck do it, but it simply is not profitable. Sure, you can buy 100 items and sell 10 for twice as much as you bought, but you aren't profiting, you are just stockpiling unsaleable items. Trust me on this, I bought all the Luck Charms (see my sig). 6. The way the game is designed, flippers are actually renting out their time, inf and auction slots. I spam bids across multiple recipe levels and relist any I purchase. Another player who does not have the slots or inf or patience to do this can then buy the items I relist. |
Restrict the re-selling of items on the markets. Having a ‘cap’ per type of item or something else isn’t something I’ve devised yet (mere detail, at this point in time).
In order to identify an item as being ‘re-sold’ as opposed to just ‘sold’ is the detail I think I can help with. Give all toons the following new capabilities:-
Rename the current salvage type ‘Invention’ to ‘Dropped Invention Salvage’ (a crud name I know – but again ‘detail’ – focus please!)
Create a new salvage type ‘Traded Invention Salvage’
Do something similar with both Enhancements and Recipes.
Meaning that your ‘storable’ items can, in general terms, be stored in 6 places rather than the current 3.
TBC - in next post.
Shakes head.
The market is a place where you are meant to be taken advantage of. If the developers didn't want it to work that way they could fix it by adding 3 numbers and a couple of links.
The numbers.
Weekly Hi Price/Lo Price/Prior Days volume on the items. The links ? On recipes the prices of components and the crafted price, on crafted items the price of the recipe and the components.
The Devs pretty obviously want the market to be a spot where some players get screwed and others get to laugh at it.
Edit Lol saw the obvious to solution (to anyone that has ever used a real market) was already posted.