[ QUOTE ]
Congrats to everyone!
If the leader for PvP iz SRS BZNS could send me a PM with forum names for the 5 team members, I'll get started on issuing the prizes.
I'll let you know what those prizes are tomorrow 
.
[/ QUOTE ]
A little late, but here's the prize list (one of each for each team member):
* In-game title (Decision on temporary or permanent TBA)
* Forum title (permanent)
* Guaranteed Aion Exclusive Preview Event access (details will be announced later)
* PPD costume power codes
* Signed CoV CE Art Books
[ QUOTE ]
Given the time and how far over we'd already run, that wasn't really viable.
[/ QUOTE ]
But removing a team from the event for committing a "crime" that other teams had is excessive.
On the subject of Pain Domination
While yes, it means the Master Mind will be geared towards a support role with having the empathy style buffs it will still have the huge damage mitigation that body guard mode offers
Still in theory having more HP than a tank. I'm surprised MM's got Pain Dom in the first place.
CoH PvP SG = SuperUnion - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
CoV PvP VG = Disruption - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
Global = @Rent & @Rent.
Playgroup are all **** - Global Handle
[ QUOTE ]
I'm surprised MM's got Pain Dom in the first place.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hero's get Empathy over two AT's. Villain's needed to for parity and that leaves just Corr's and MM's.
A 20 minute replay isn't a lot of time considering how much time people were waiting around.
A team leader cannot be expected to inform all 3 judges as the leaders should just communicate with 1 judge. No point in telling all 3, all 3 asking the other team leader what they think, then the other team leader telling all 3 judges their decision, then all 3 judges telling the first team leader their decision. 1 Judge communicates with the team leaders and the other judges.
If questions need to be asked and points raised then the judge who was originally informed should have performed their role correctly.
@Sweet Chilli
Doesnt really matter at the end of the day.
We still would of won 
[ QUOTE ]
If questions need to be asked and points raised then the judge who was originally informed should have performed their role correctly.
[/ QUOTE ]
Informed of what? That they were using two subs or that they hadn't told or asked the other team and could the judge please do it for them?
All the late and disorganised teams involved created a lot of extra work.
I think the organisers and judges did as well as they could considering the circumstances. They worked hard to try and make everyone happy and not exclude teams that were having serious trouble with players throughout the comp, like FoTM...
[ QUOTE ]
But removing a team from the event for committing a "crime" that other teams had is excessive.
[/ QUOTE ]
For clarity: in all other cases of 2 subs being used, the opponent team was asked before the match and gave their permission. The judges were also notified and gave permission once confirmation from the opposing captain was received. FotM did not seek permission from MME, and they did not explicitly confirm to the match judge before that match that they would be using 2 subs and had been given permission by their opponents. That is why they got the DQ.
[ QUOTE ]
A team leader cannot be expected to inform all 3 judges as the leaders should just communicate with 1 judge. No point in telling all 3, all 3 asking the other team leader what they think, then the other team leader telling all 3 judges their decision, then all 3 judges telling the first team leader their decision. 1 Judge communicates with the team leaders and the other judges.
If questions need to be asked and points raised then the judge who was originally informed should have performed their role correctly.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure you've understood what I said correctly: I never said they needed to tell all of the judges. They needed to tell the opposing team captain and the judge allocated for that specific match. They definitely did not tell MME explicitly, and as far as I'm aware they did not confirm with any of the judges prior to that specific match (their earlier request for a previous match was not applicable for the MME match).
To be honest I personally feel that the team that we, as judges, should be apologising to is PPK. For any sort of future Pentad event I run officially I will not allow a team to play a match without a full 5 team members, and for any unofficial event I assist with I will strongly recommend that rule be followed as well. It hadn't crossed my mind that in some circumstances playing a character short could become an advantage.
The problem with relying on the captian of team 1 to speak to the captian of team 2 is that at the end of the day, team 1 captain has no proof of what was said and the team 2 captain has no proof of what was said. If messages are relayed through the judges then that judge can verify what was said by team captian 1 and team captain 2, with the added benefit that the judges themselves are aware of all communication.
@Sweet Chilli
I'm going to let my original point die now, not that i've changed my opinion mind. I just think it's had enough debate now.
[ QUOTE ]
For any sort of future Pentad event I run officially I will not allow a team to play a match without a full 5 team members, and for any unofficial event I assist with I will strongly recommend that rule be followed as well. It hadn't crossed my mind that in some circumstances playing a character short could become an advantage.
[/ QUOTE ]
I agree that this would be a good idea but how would you get round no-shows GR? More subs allowed for example?
Didn't PPK win all their matches by a land slide though bar the last match which they had to drop out of?
CoH PvP SG = SuperUnion - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
CoV PvP VG = Disruption - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
Global = @Rent & @Rent.
Playgroup are all **** - Global Handle
[ QUOTE ]
It hadn't crossed my mind that in some circumstances playing a character short could become an advantage.
[/ QUOTE ]
Under what circumstances could having 4 not 5 be an advantanage? Genuine question.
[ QUOTE ]
Under what circumstances could having 4 not 5 be an advantanage? Genuine question.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hypothetically, dropping a character that the opposition may have been planning to target *might* pose an advantage in some situations.
Rent - I think GR posted something a few posts up about kill handicaps to deal with no shows for up to two subs. More than two and it's not really the same team anymore I guess.
Indeed he did, my bad. I even quoted a part of the same post 
CoH PvP SG = SuperUnion - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
CoV PvP VG = Disruption - Co-Leader - Union/Freedom
Global = @Rent & @Rent.
Playgroup are all **** - Global Handle
[ QUOTE ]
Hypothetically, dropping a character that the opposition may have been planning to target *might* pose an advantage in some situations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Cheers, didnt think of that
[ QUOTE ]
It's certainly been a learning experience for all of those involved with running the event, and I have a few rules-related areas I can see need to be tightened up and a few thoughts on better methods. One of the ideas I had during the event, to help with both scheduling and smaller rules breaches, was to implement a handicap penalty. Initially the idea arose simply to ensure matches ran smoothly. We had several cases where matches were started with incorrect settings. For a similar event in future I would suggest that if a team leader incorrectly lists a game and the game needs a restart as a result, the team that made the mistake be issued a 5 kill handicap. A similar system could be used for teams that arrive late for scheduled matches (5 kill handicap added for every 10 minutes, or part thereof, late). We could even have done this for teams requiring subs: 5 kill handicap for the first sub, 10 kill for the second (cumulative with the first, so 15 total).
[/ QUOTE ]
I definately learnt alot from X4. Things i can take forwards and use next time i plan to run another simular stlye event. But not for a while yet i want to see how the Devs are going to develope PvP first and see what happens. As well as taking a long deserved break from the game.
Never fear tho i shall return.
[ QUOTE ]
Doesnt really matter at the end of the day.
We still would of won
[/ QUOTE ]
VINDICATE FTFW! LOVE YOU GUYS!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Doesnt really matter at the end of the day.
We still would of won
[/ QUOTE ]
VINDICATE FTFW! LOVE YOU GUYS!
[/ QUOTE ]
aah, manly love.
SingStar:
"Extremists LOVE to fish to get us annoyed so we break the forum rules."
CRACK68:
"The origin of life wasn't planned either, should all life be declared a bug and wiped out?"
Lionsbane:
"You know me.Ever the realist"
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Doesnt really matter at the end of the day.
We still would of won
[/ QUOTE ]
VINDICATE FTFW! LOVE YOU GUYS!
[/ QUOTE ]
aah, manly love.
[/ QUOTE ]
Mo' like man love.
Hey - it wasn't me who messed up the organisation of this thing, which lets face it, was absolutely terrible and lead to the current mess 
@Sweet Chilli
Any press is good press. People still talking about it proves it was a success. Mess maybe. I know i enjoyed it and i know others did too...
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Doesnt really matter at the end of the day.
We still would of won
[/ QUOTE ]
VINDICATE FTFW! LOVE YOU GUYS!
[/ QUOTE ]
<3
thePhilosopher Martial Arts/Regen/Fire Scrapper
theRegulator Empathy/Energy/Soul Defender
Total Inertia Ice Blast/Kinetics/Psy Corruptor
Total Inferno Ice Blast/Thermal/Leviathan Corruptor
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Doesnt really matter at the end of the day.
We still would of won
[/ QUOTE ]
VINDICATE FTFW! LOVE YOU GUYS!
[/ QUOTE ]
<3
[/ QUOTE ]
@Rooks
"You should come inside the box... Then you'll know what I mean."
LOL
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Doesnt really matter at the end of the day.
We still would of won
[/ QUOTE ]
VINDICATE FTFW! LOVE YOU GUYS!
[/ QUOTE ]
aah, manly love.
[/ QUOTE ]
Mo' like man love.
[/ QUOTE ]
Oh I enjoyed it too. I love a good mess.
@Sweet Chilli
I enjoyed it and I'm looking forward to the changes that I13 will bring. Please don't leave it too long till another tournie.
[ QUOTE ]
I still think a forcing a rematch would've been a more reasonable action. As you've said yourself, loads of little rule breaks took place but those teams weren't DQ'd. It's not like FoTM tried to sneak these subs in, is it?
[/ QUOTE ]
Given the time and how far over we'd already run, that wasn't really viable.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Brute<->Tank, Scrapper<->Stalker, Controller<->Dominator, Corrupter/Mastermind<->Blaster, Mastermind/Corrupter<->Defender (last two are debatable).
[/ QUOTE ]
Totally disagree, i think KS's counter parts would still be spot on.
A stalker can't be compared to anything other than a blaster, yes it's melee but hidden spike damage is far grater than a scrapper. That getting changed puts the rest out of sync too.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's difficult to say, really. With MM's getting access to Pain Domination they move more towards the support roles. It's not something I'd personally decide on until after we see what impact the new powersets have within specific Archetypes. I see what you're saying re: the Stalker, however ... both Blaster's and Stalker's fill the "Glass Cannon" roles. I agree that the X4 equivalents were right for the game as it stands currently ... I just feel that a re-assessment may be warranted once Issue 13 has been released.
______________
Sweet Chilli - I see and understand what you're saying, however at the end of the day (per my previous post) allowing 2 subs was not an official rule. We unofficially sanctioned it on the proviso that both team captains agreed and that the team captains notified the judge assigned for the match before it started. That didn't happen, so regardless of what one judge was told quite some time earlier in the evening FotM failed to seek and obtain a clear acceptance for running two subs before starting that specific match.
It was imperfectly handled all around. That's what we call a learning experience, and is one of the areas I was thinking about when I mentioned that I'd personally be looking at specific rules for improvement for any future event.